Defensive Builds

[DevilinXIII]

So I recently pulled a +Hp/-Spd Effie...and was a little disappointed her Boon wasn't +Atk, but then it got me thinking, most of the builds out there are for offense. I get that 90% of game play you're on the offensive, hence why most of the builds are made for the attacking phase, but for teams that are built for the enemy phase or even defending in the coliseum, natures like the Effie I pulled may be better suited then?

In any case, I've found that natures with bane's that are -Def /-Res will always be better than -Hp in terms of offensive builds. And vice versa boon's that are +Hp will always be better than +Def/+Res for defensive build.

What do you guys think? Thanks.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

-HP vs -DEF is most likely because one is -5 the other is -3

Assuming it took 2 hits for the character to die, HP seems to reduce higher damage in the short run. At least thats what i get from it

For offensive build -def/res is taken to take stats advantage by reducing surplus on that that feels uneeded. I feel that way on say Eliwood with -Res for example

 

I don't think build that are purely defensive does work/exist in this game, I guess technically the standard Armor with Quick Riposte build is defensive and relies on enemy phase reaction, but the main goal is still to get a kill through counter attacking, and +ATK boon is still a huge boon to that end

[DevilinXIII]

I make the differentiation between -Def and -Hp in that I believe while having either allows the same damage to be taken equally from physical attacks...but having -Hp puts you at a disadvantage from Res attacks vs having -Def. So I feel while on offensive it's better to have either -Def or -Res rather than -Hp (because it won't differentiate who you're fighting between physical or magical as long as you're not losing points in Hp)....i apologize if that sounds confusing

Best example i can think of is my +Spd/-Hp Setsuna will die against some mages, while a +Spd/-Def can survive them,
Similarly how my +Spd/-Hp Setsuna will die against some archers/melee, while a +Spd/-Res can survive them

But I agree on defensive builds not really being reliable in this game...after all most of this game is played on the attacking phase

[DevilinXIII]

Possible builds may include:

Weapon: Silver Lance+

Assist: Reciprocal Aid

Special: Escutcheon, Noontime/Sol (to replenish Hp)

Passive A: Defiant Def, Distant Counter

Passive B: Wary Fighter

Passive C: Threaten Atk

[Ice Dragon]

24 minutes ago, DevilinXIII said:

And vice versa boon's that are +Hp will always be better than +Def/+Res for defensive build.

That's definitely not the case.

Because we already have an example, I'm going to use it. Effie has 47/50/53 HP and 29/33/36 Def.

Let's say we have three enemies with effective Atk of 36 (45 with weapon triangle disadvantage), 45, and 60. With +HP, Effie is taking 3/12/27 damage and will take 18/5/2 hits to kill. With +Def, Effie is taking 0/9/24 damage and will take infinite/6/3 hits to kill.

Taking +HP adds to both your physical and magical bulk, but the problem is that it effectively only mitigates that amount of damage once. On the other hand +Def and +Res add only to one side of your bulk, but that damage mitigation is applied to every hit. Additionally, the higher your base Def/Res, the bigger of a difference +Def/+Res will make.

 

On the other hand, with offensive builds, there is a rhyme and reason for using -Def and -Res instead of -HP. Melee range attackers will take counterattack hits from other melee range attackers when attacking, and the vast majority of those units are physical. Because of this, -Res is preferred because it doesn't affect the damage taken from the majority of enemies that will be counterattacking you.

It's trickier for ranged attackers because bows are physical and magic is magical; you have decide which you prefer more bulk in and take the penalty in the other stat. For example, Robin is commonly used to soak up hits from bow-users and prefers -Res instead of -Def, but Julia is commonly used to soak up hits from blue mages and prefers -Def instead of -Res.

 

18 minutes ago, JSND said:

-HP vs -DEF is most likely because one is -5 the other is -3

Nature penalties are always 3 or 4 depending on the stat's growth. HP doesn't get any special treatment except for the passive A skill that gives +5 at max level instead of +3. You're probably thinking of that.

 

18 minutes ago, JSND said:

I don't think build that are purely defensive does work/exist in this game, I guess technically the standard Armor with Quick Riposte build is defensive and relies on enemy phase reaction, but the main goal is still to get a kill through counter attacking, and +ATK boon is still a huge boon to that end

Defensive builds are entirely possible. The reason why Draug, Gwendolyn, and Sheena use +Atk is because their defensive stats are already top-of-the-line, but their Atk is low. On the other hand, Effie's Atk is sky high, but she has lower defensive stats, so she can afford to run +Res instead of +Atk.

Edited April 4, 2017 by Ice Dragon

[eclipse]

. . .and two issues.

1. Don't post twice in a row.  Use the Edit button to append stuff to your most recent post.
2. Short questions like this belong in the "Ask a FE Heroes Question" thread, hence why I'm locking this.