Advance Wars

[bethany81707]

My birthday rolled around recently, and I've got a little money that I might be interested in getting a few more titles. One of those, I'm interested in being an Advance Wars game. Problem is, I'm not altogether sure which to get first. Ultimately, my favoured ones are Black Hole Rising or Dark Conflict, with the original somewhere in there (Dual Strike doesn't interest me). Does anyone here happen to have any suggestions?

(Who knows- I might spring for all three. Depends on what I'm looking at...)

[Zera]

If you don't own Days of Ruin / Dark Conflict, that's the one I recommend. It has the Anti-Tank, an awesome unit that defies explanation, as well as the beefiest level editor. And it's just Really Nice. I have a couple other suggestions, but I need to know what consoles you own.

[Interdimensional Observer]

Why not Dual Strike? It's the most packed game of the cheery trio.

You've already played the original I can tell. Black Hole Rising is the sequel with new COs, a rebalancing of the old ones, a new tank unit, new campaign, and basically more and better of the the same. The difficulty is less than the original's though.

Dark Conflict/Days of Ruin gives you 50 save slots for the design room, which is pretty sweet (but still not enough). There has been a total rebalance of the units, and several interesting new ones. The plot is serious, nothing incredible, but good (the European version Dark Conflict has a less funny script if you care about humor that much). The new CO system was a good move after Dual Strike got CO Power crazy. Fog of War is at the closest its ever been to perfect and fun (it's almost there). The campaign mode is far easier than the original's and doesn't have an Advanced version (but it is still harder than Dual Strike's) and the War Room challenge battles have been replaced by Trial Maps. I've been waiting for a sequel to come.

 

I'd say Dark Conflict, unless you want to play it safe.

[BrightBow]

Considering all that Wars World stuff in your signature, doesn't that mean you have played at least one of the GBA games or Dual Strike already?

Anyway, I would say that with Dark Conflict and Black Hole Rising being so massively different in tone, it really depends on the person in question for what they prefer. They are both good games to be sure. I would be a lot more careful to recommend AW1 and I'd definitely not recommend Dual Strike.

But in terms of mechanics I prefer Dark Conflict because you have to actually work to increase your Co gauge, so it doesn't really have that annoying rubber band thing with the Co Powers that tends to unnecessarily drag out maps.

Edited May 16, 2017 by BrightBow

[bethany81707]

I haven't personally played any Advance Wars titles, but I have seen their plots- just like Fire Emblem. Tellius and Genealogy are inaccessible to me, but I still love them and discuss them here.

On the note of accessibility, I'm pretty sure all four titles are on the Wii U VC, so accessibility is not an issue.

My main goal, thusly, is to choose a good game purely on gameplay merits.

[Interdimensional Observer]

The original can probably be ruled out as your first choice.

Dual Strike has even more content than Dark Conflict (outside of the Design Room), but isn't as refined as the latter.

Black Hole Rising is overall more strategic than Dual Strike, but lacks as much content, and has less than Dark Conflict.

My entry point was Black Hole Rising, but I never got much beyond the Orange Star campaign. Dual Strike was where I really sank my teeth into things, and it's pretty easy so it isn't a bad starting point. Dark Conflict you'll appreciate more when you see what came before it, and but it's very good even without prior experience, if a bit challenging in the campaign.

I'd go with Dark Conflict if I had to choose just one. (By the way, Forsythe(NA)/Carter's theme sounds very Fire Emblem-like.)

Edited May 17, 2017 by Interdimensional Observer

[DragonLord]

Definitely Dark Conflict. Very well balanced and has so much content with the additional maps and the map designer.

[Sire]

I highly reccomend Days of Ruin / Dark Conflict. It has the best gameplay (and an okay story) out of all the Advance Wars titles. However, it does differ from the traditional Advance Wars formula with it's COs and their powers. Also, the art direction is different as well (and it took a lot of getting used to initially since I played the others.) [Trivia: Depending on what version one purchases, the English script will be different. Days of Ruin was localized for NA while Dark Conflict for EU, and both translations took their own liberties with the dialogue. Essentially, one can get two separate versions fo the same story.]

Even though you say you are not interested in Dual Strike, I would put that game as my second recommendation as it more or less has everything from the first and second games aside from their respective campaigns and balance.

Now, for the first or second game, I personally prefer the first Advance Wars since the story missions seem to be more varied. Black Hole Rising seems to focus far more on standard "build an army from nothing and attack" - essentially being a glorified skirmish, but I never managed to finish the 2nd title.

So, in order of recommendation...
1. Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict (Most balanced out of all of them, has an excellent map editor compared to the previous.)
2. Dual Strike (Has the units and COs from 1 & 2, but also adds additional stuff. There is tons of content in here!)
3. Advance Wars (The original title. Goes back to the basics, but I like the charm of the original Advance Wars.)
4. Black Hole Rising (More of a matter of taste - I just don't care much for the glorified skirmish maps in the campaign.)

[Reality]

Days of Ruin - trumps the others gameplay wise. Different, and superior unit balance, especially as many of the added units are low-cost to medium cost, and hence will see use on many maps. Very good map design, but  However, if you count the war room maps of the other games (overlap between them) then it does have  the least content by a little bit. However, Days of Ruin basically gives quality over quality. The war room's are also a little awkward beccause of their seperate difficulty curve=  The trial maps are almost all clearly intended to be played post story, the war rooms had things like Moji Island, that seem like you could be playing them as level 3 of the story as well as clear post game content like Last Mission. It's almost like you are intended to be playing story mode and the war room in tandem.

Content of each game

Days of Ruin: 38 trial maps+ 28 story = 66 compared to AW 2: 28 story+28 hard mode story + 20 war room. =76 or compared to Dual Strike  28 story+28 hard mode+ 44 war room =100 

Granted that of the 44 war room maps in Dual Strike, some of them are practically unplayable without using cheese COs (Banker HIlls, the new 1 v 3 maps). Really it should be seen as having the 20 "classic" maps + maybe 12 good new ones. 

Original - Probably most difficult main campaign and interesting map design, but the AI is weaker- if it's parked a tank on your base it won't move it out of the way for his own infantry to capture it, + it's threat assessment and recruiting order can be manipulated easily or even accidentally (lol APCs). Some of its hardest levels are half due to the AI being given vision in fog of war though. 

Black Hole Rising- Retains some flaws from AW1. Slightly easier, but the second story is still relatively challenging beyond  mission 9. The 1 new unit is pretty important on large maps, but is usually not efficient on small maps *cough war room* and won't be used all that much if you want to get the S ranking for speed on the levels. Day to Day unit bonuses toned down since AW1, which makes CO powers slightly more important, although that's mostly seen in the war room where you can play "clean" or unleash the holy terror that is hachi/colin. Generally fundamental strategies are the most important tactics to use.

Dual Strike- Worst in series, but still a kind of good game, and certainly bursting with content. Biggest problems are CO powers. Not only do they charge faster in this game, but the powers are more powerful as well. They create rubber banding  in the sense that  they charge fastest for the team taking damage, and hence, if you can plan 1-2 turns where you take out half the enemies then you'll inadvertendly charge the AI up to do the same to you from outside your range! It kind of creates a stally mindset where you keep around big piles of damaged/cheap units to employ as a wall  at all times. It's kind of telling that the best casual strategy on most maps is to use new charather Sasha whose power is basically to prevent both players from using their powers. 

In summary- Days of Ruin is the way to go, followed by Black Hole Rising.

Dual Strike and the original can appear really good if you play them first, but their faults become much more obvious if they aren't your first game 

[BrightBow]

The campaign in Dual Strike is also designed in a way that really emphasizes the flaws of the game's mechanics. You are usually given control over no less then 3 different forces all with their own Co gauge, while your opponent has 1 large army. Due to the way Co powers work, this essentially means that your opponent charges their gauge 3 times as fast as you. Combine that with the fact that the gauge also charges twice as fast when taking damage and it results in a campaign that while being very easy, just ends up being frustrating as the AI keeps delaying it's inevitable demise by taking double turns in addition to other annoying Co Power effects.

Edited May 18, 2017 by BrightBow