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Riku

Choosing the Best Class for Leo (Week Four)

Which is the best class for Leo?  

73 members have voted

  1. 1. Optimization Poll: Which is the optimal class for Leo?

    • Adventurer
      0
    • Berserker
      0
    • Bow Knight
      0
    • Brave Hero
      0
    • Butler
      1
    • Dark Knight
      39
    • Exorcist
      2
    • Falcon Warrior
      1
    • General
      0
    • Golden-Kite Warrior
      0
    • Great Knight
      0
    • Holy Bowman
      1
    • Mountain Priest
      0
    • Paladin
      0
    • Revenant Knight
      1
    • Sorcerer
      12
    • Strategist
      7
    • Trueblade
      1
    • Weapon Master
      0
    • Wyvern Lord
      1
    • I don't really know.
      7
  2. 2. Practicality Poll (Nohr): Which is the most practical class for Leo in the Nohr campaign?

    • Adventurer
      0
    • Berserker
      0
    • Bow Knight
      0
    • Brave Hero
      0
    • Butler
      1
    • Dark Knight
      53
    • Falcon Warrior
      1
    • General
      0
    • Golden-Kite Warrior
      0
    • Great Knight
      0
    • Holy Bowman
      0
    • Paladin
      0
    • Revenant Knight
      5
    • Sorcerer
      5
    • Strategist
      4
    • Trueblade
      1
    • Weapon Master
      0
    • Wyvern Lord
      1
    • I'm going to bench Leo.
      2
  3. 3. Preference Poll: Which class do you like the best for Leo?

    • Adventurer
      0
    • Berserker
      0
    • Bowman
      0
    • Bow Knight
      0
    • Brave Hero
      0
    • Butler
      3
    • Cavalier
      0
    • Dark Knight
      45
    • Dark Mage
      0
    • Exorcist
      0
    • Falcon Warrior
      0
    • Fighter
      0
    • General
      1
    • Golden-Kite Warrior
      0
    • Great Knight
      1
    • Holy Bowman
      0
    • Knight
      0
    • Mercenary
      0
    • Mountain Priest
      0
    • Outlaw
      0
    • Paladin
      0
    • Pegasus Warrior
      0
    • Priest
      0
    • Revenant Knight
      6
    • Rod Knight
      0
    • Samurai
      0
    • Sorcerer
      7
    • Strategist
      4
    • Trueblade
      1
    • Weapon Master
      0
    • Wyvern Lord
      0
    • Wyvern Rider
      1
    • He's fine in any class.
      4
  4. 4. Optional Poll: Which character would you like to vote on next week?

    • Ryoma
      1
    • Hinoka
      5
    • Camilla
      10
    • Elise
      7
    • Kaze
      5
    • Nishiki
      2
    • Rinkah
      3
    • Nyx
      5
    • Mozume
      4
    • Takumi
      11
    • Jakob
      3
    • Benoit
      1
    • Gold Digger
      12
    • I don't really care.
      4
  5. 5. DLC Poll: Which DLC class do you like the best for Leo?

    • Ballistician
      3
    • Dark Falcon
      17
    • Dread Fighter
      2
    • Grandmaster
      15
    • Lodestar
      11
    • Vanguard
      1
    • I don't plan on using DLC classes.
      7


Recommended Posts

For the fourth week, we’re going to vote and discuss on the best for Leo, the ambitious dark mage. I think he looks pretty stunning in his original outfit, but it’s still interesting to imagine other options for him.

Ah Leo, the best unit of all…! No, what are you talking about? I’m not biased. Anyhow, given his natural affinity towards Mag and his personal tome, it’s probably a good idea to keep him in a magical class… but who knows? Maybe he has a niche talent that’s better exploited in a physical class.

The format for this post is similar as that of last week: The following spoiler tags will mostly contain information regarding Leo. I’m actually a bit behind schedule (sorry!), so I’ll be uploading the rest of the information (inc. Predicted Stats) throughout the weekend. As there’s quite a bit of information, I wouldn’t suggest reading all of it, but only looking through what you deem necessary. I’d advocate the use of Ctrl+f to target specific information. If you already know the necessary information, there’s no need to go through it; this information is here simply for your convenience.

(Also, I’m only human. If there are any mistakes within the information, please tell me so that I may correct it.)

Without further ado: Which is the best class for Leo?

[spoiler=Information Regarding the Marriage/Buddy Seals]

I’m not going to go over the really general information, since I’m pretty sure most of you know about it already. But if you have no idea what these seals are, check out the items page or this post. Anyhow…

  • Nishiki, Flannel, Azura, and Mozume provide access to their secondary class trees, as their starting class trees are unique to them (and in some cases, their children)

(The credit for the following bullet points go to Astrophys, who I copied the wording from, and the other SF members on the Marriage Seals post that clarified this issue.)

  • If there is no primary class tree overlap between the characters, the simplest case scenario plays out: They both get each other’s primary class trees.

  • If the characters share each other’s primary class trees, they get each other’s secondary class trees.

  • If a spouse’s (or buddy’s) primary class tree is the same as the character’s secondary class tree, the character does not receive any new class tree.

    • There are certain exceptions to the last rule, but they mainly involve the Avatar.

If you’re still confused, let me use Leo as an example to try and clarify matters!

  • Let’s say Leo marries Azura. Azura’s secondary class tree is Pegasus Warrior, so Leo would receive the Pegasus Warrior tree.

  • Let’s say Leo marries Berka. There is no primary class tree overlap between the two characters, so Leo would receive the Wyvern Rider tree.

  • Let’s say Leo marries Nyx. Both of these characters’ primary class tree is Dark Knight. Thus, Leo would receive Nyx’s secondary class tree-- Outlaw. (The vice versa would apply, in which Nyx would receive the Rod Knight tree.)

  • Let’s say Leo marries Felicia. Leo’s secondary class tree is Rod Knight, and Felicia’s primary class tree is Rod Knight. Although Felicia also has the Mercenary tree, Leo does not receive this; he receives no new class trees from Felicia.

If you have any questions, shoot me a PM or leave a reply on the original post. The Marriage Seals post did a pretty good job of explaining the complexities, so feel free to check out that thread if you’re still confused.

[spoiler=Rules, Notices, & Clarifications]

Rules

  • Please be respectful! This is a huge given, but I still see people break it all the time. Don’t be arrogant-- your opinion is important, but hardly the end-all-- and please don’t be a troll.

  • I don’t want these polls to serve only for people who have played the game. Therefore, please be careful with spoilers. As we’re discussing classes, I’m assuming that most people are fine with gameplay spoilers. However, this does not guarantee that people are fine with story spoilers as well, so if you must bring them up, make sure to tag them as spoilers.

    • If you’re tagging story spoilers, leave an explanation. Many people may assume that you simply tagged it as a spoiler because it was a long post, or because it was related to gameplay. Clarify what exactly you’re tagging-- it doesn’t take that many words.

Notices

  • In the optional poll, Elise placed second and Nyx placed third. As such, Elise will receive three additional votes, and Nyx will receive one.

  • Xander and Tsukuyomi only received one vote, and as such, were eliminated from this week’s optional poll. As it has been proven that the forum does not wish to discuss them at the current moment, they have a waiting period of two weeks before they will be re-entered into the optional poll. As the victor, Leo has also been removed from this week’s optional poll.

  • Takumi and Jakob have been re-entered into the optional poll. If it is demonstrated once again that the forum is not interested in these characters, they will have a waiting period of four weeks before they will be re-entered into the optional poll.

  • Benoit and Charlotte have been added into the optional poll.

Clarification

  • If you’re confused as to what this post is all about, refer to the original post. It is currently Week Four. Week Three polls concerned Felicia, Week Two polls concerned Silas, and Week One polls concerned Azura.

  • We are discussing the end class for Leo. You are free to consider reclassing options along the way (just make sure to factor in the cost of reclassing for the Practicality polls), but your vote should be based on your predicted end class.

  • We’re ignoring DLC classes; those are OP on any character. If we go through with post-release (for NA/Europe) polls, I plan to have polls regarding which characters should receive the DLC classes.

  • Children will not be introduced until the localized game is released, or we have gone through all of the first-generation characters.

  • We’re ignoring any class options the Avatar may give to Leo, as it introduces too many new variables.

  • There will not be Practicality polls for the Invisible Kingdom campaign, as there’s no space on the polls for it.

  • I limited the Optimization/Practicality poll options to the promoted classes. I figured that in order to use Leo efficiently, he should be at a promoted class than at a base class.

[spoiler=Possible Classes]

  • Classes in black are ones Leo can achieve in either the Nohr or in the Invisible Kingdom campaign.

  • Classes in blue are ones Leo can only achieve in the Invisible Kingdom campaign.

Base Classes (4H, 8N, 12T)

  • Bowman

  • Cavalier

  • Dark Mage

  • Fighter

  • Knight

  • Mercenary

  • Outlaw

  • Pegasus Warrior

  • Priest

  • Rod Knight

  • Samurai

  • Wyvern Rider

Promoted Classes (7H, 13N, 20T)

  • Adventurer

  • Berserker

  • Bow Knight

  • Brave Hero

  • Butler

  • Dark Knight

  • Exorcist

  • Falcon Warrior

  • General

  • Golden-Kite Warrior

  • Great Knight

  • Holy Bowman

  • Mountain Priest

  • Paladin

  • Revenant Knight

  • Sorcerer

  • Strategist

  • Trueblade

  • Weapon Master

  • Wyvern Lord

[spoiler=Expansion of Possible Classes]

Primary Base Class: Dark Mage

Primary Promoted Class: Dark Knight, Sorcerer

Secondary Base Class: Rod Knight

Secondary Promoted Class: Butler, Strategist

Marriage Seal Classes: These are organized alphabetically based on the localized names of the characters. I listed the Hoshido characters first, the Nohr characters second, and the shared characters last.

As Leo is a Nohr exclusive character, he can only marry the Hoshido characters in the Invisible Kingdom campaign.

  • Hinoka: Pegasus Warrior -> Falcon Warrior, Golden-Kite Warrior

  • Sakura: Priest -> Exorcist, Mountain Priest

  • Berka: Wyvern Rider -> Revenant Knight, Wyvern Lord

  • Charlotte: Fighter -> Berserker, Brave Hero

  • Effie: Knight -> General, Great Knight

  • Luna: Mercenary -> Bow Knight, Brave Hero

  • Nyx: Outlaw -> Adventurer, Bow Knight

  • Pieri: Cavalier -> Great Knight, Paladin

  • Azura: Pegasus Warrior -> Falcon Warrior, Golden-Kite Warrior

  • Felicia: n/a

  • Mozume: Bowman -> Golden-Kite Warrior, Holy Bowman

Buddy Seal Classes: These are organized alphabetically based on the localized names of the characters. I listed the Hoshido characters first, the Nohr characters second, and the shared characters last.

As Leo is a Nohr exclusive character, he can only buddy the Hoshido characters in the Invisible Kingdom campaign.

  • Takumi: Bowman -> Golden-Kite Warrior, Holy Bowman

  • Odin: Samurai -> Trueblade, Weapon Master

  • Xander: Cavalier -> Great Knight, Paladin

  • Zero: Outlaw -> Adventurer, Bow Knight

[spoiler=Basic Information (inc. Profile, Recruitment Conditions, Base Stats)]

Profile

Leo is a prince of Nohr. He is the wielder of the legendary weapon, Brunnhilde. He’s a genius who can handle most tasks flawlessly, as well as bear devastating magic. When facing enemies, he displays a ruthless side, but he’s surprisingly caring. He was born on June 30th, and is the biggest fan of tomatoes.

Recruitment Conditions

Leo joins in Chapter 14 in the Nohr campaign, and at the start of Turn 2 of Chapter 17 in the Invisible Kingdom campaign.

Base Stats

Level: 2

HP: 34

Str: 14

Mag: 20

Skl: 14

Spd: 15

Lck: 15

Def: 16

Res: 20

Mov: 8

[spoiler=Maximum Stats]

Leo adds -2 Str, +2 Mag, -2 Spd, and +2 Res.

Maximum stats based on Leo’s possible classes will be uploaded soon!

[spoiler=Growth Rates]

Natural Growth Rates

HP: 45

Str: 25

Mag: 55

Skl: 35

Spd: 45

Lck: 45

Def: 30

Res: 45

Growth rates based on Leo’s possible classes will be uploaded soon!

[spoiler=Pair Up Bonuses]

Natural Pair Up Bonuses

C Support: +1 Mag

B Support: +1 Mag, +1 Res

A Support: +1 Mag, +1 Spd, +1 Res

S Support: +2 Mag, +1 Spd, +1 Lck, +1 Res

Pair up bonuses based on Leo’s possible classes will be uploaded soon!

[spoiler=Possible Skills]

(Credit goes to the SF staff, as all of this was taken from the main website.)

Personal Skill: Cold-Blooded: When enemy’s HP is not full, damage +3 and damage received -1 during the battle.

Skills are organized alphabetically based on the classes. Within the classes, skills are listed in the order of achievement (e.g. a GK earns Luna at Lvl. 5 and Diamond Strike at Lvl. 15, so Luna is listed before Diamond Strike).

Base class skills are listed before promoted class skills. Descriptions of skills Leo can acquire through his primary and secondary class trees are listed below.

Description of all the skills are located on the skills pages.

  • Classes in black are ones Leo can achieve in either the Nohr or in the Invisible Kingdom campaign.

  • Classes in blue are ones Leo can only achieve in the Invisible Kingdom campaign.

Base Class Skills

  • Bowman: Skill +2, Prescient Victory

  • Cavalier: Open Assault, Rescue

  • Dark Mage: Bind, Devilish Wind

  • Fighter: HP +5, Roundhouse

  • Knight: Defence +2, Confined Defence

  • Mercenary: Stubbornness, Patient Assurance

  • Outlaw: Locktouch, Movement +1

  • Pegasus Warrior: Swallow Strike, Eastern Heart

  • Priest: Miracle, Rally Luck

  • Rod Knight: Resistance +2, Distinguished Son

  • Samurai: Flowing Strike, Vantage

  • Wyvern Rider: Strength +2, Cut Through

Promoted Class Skills

  • Adventurer: Lucky Seven, Pass

  • Berserker: Rally Strength, Axefaire

  • Bow Knight: Rally Skill, Kunaibreaker

  • Brave Hero: Sol, Axebreaker

  • Butler: Servant’s Joy, Tomebreaker

  • Dark Knight: Magic Seal, Lifetaker

  • Exorcist: Rally Magic, Tomefaire

  • Falcon Warrior: Rally Speed, Mirror Strike

  • General: Defensive Formation, Pavise

  • Golden-Kite Warrior: Soar, Sun God

  • Great Knight: Luna, Diamond Strike

  • Holy Bowman: Raven Strike, Bowfaire

  • Mountain Priest: Magic Counter, Renewal

  • Paladin: Defender, Aegis

  • Revenant Knight: Deadly Breath, Overbearing

  • Sorcerer: Vengeance, Bowbreaker

  • Strategist: Rally Resistance, Battle Command

  • Trueblade: Astra, Swordfaire

  • Weapon Master: Strength Seal, Line of Death

  • Wyvern Lord: Rally Defence, Swordbreaker

Bind: When the user is fighting adjacent to an enemy, enemy’s Avoid -20.

Devilish Wind: Enemies within a 2-tile radius receive 2 extra damage from magical attacks.

Magic Seal: After battle, enemy’s Magic -6 until the next Turn.

Lifetaker: When the user triggers the battle, the user recovers 50% HP after defeating the enemy.

Vengeance: Skill * 1.5% chance of adding half the user’s (Max HP - Current HP) as damage.

Bowbreaker: Hit Rate and Avoid +50 when the enemy is equipped with a Bow.

Resistance +2: Resistance +2.

Distinguished Son: Female allies within a 2-tile radius receive 2 less damage during battles.

Servant’s Joy: When healing an ally, the user recovers the same amount of HP.

Tomebreaker: Hit Rate and Avoid +50 when the enemy is equipped with a Tome.

Rally Resistance: Resistance +4 to all allies within a 2-tile radius for one Turn when the “Rally” command is used.

Battle Command: Allies within a 2-tile radius deal 2 extra damage and receive 2 less damage during battles.

[spoiler=Summary]

I can’t really say the results are all that surprising. Here are the results:

Optimal Class

  1. Dark Knight (59.32%)

  2. Sorcerer (11.86%)

  3. Strategist (10.17%)

Most Practical Class (Nohr)

  1. Dark Knight (76.27%)

  2. Revenant Knight (8.47%)

  3. Sorcerer/Strategist (5.08%)

Preferred Class

  1. Dark Knight (67.80%)

  2. Revenant Knight (8.47%)

  3. Sorcerer (6.78%)

DLC Class

  1. Dark Falcon/Grandmaster (26.19%)

  2. Lodestar (23.81%)

  3. Unavailable (9.52%)

Upcoming Character

  1. Charlotte (16.95%)

  2. Takumi (15.25%)

  3. Camilla (13.56%) [8 votes]/Elise (8.47%) [5+3 votes]

(Elise received three additional votes from placing second last week.)

With this, the next character we are going to be discussing will be Charlotte!

Since Ryoma received only one vote and Benoit received none, they will not be included in the roster for next week’s poll. Takumi will receive three extra votes, and Camilla and Elise will each receive one extra vote for next week’s poll.

Forum Discussion

  • Dark Knight Leo

    • Leo’s growths and caps are the best as a Dark Knight. Although Leo has high Mag, he also has decent Str. Therefore, he suits a hybrid class.

    • While Dark Knight has decent Def that allows Leo to tank some hits, it has rather low Spd. Granted, Leo can fix this problem by getting Defensive Formation, but he would have to marry Effie for it.

    • Leo can use his personal tome as a Dark Knight.

    • Dark Knight grants Leo high mobility.

  • Great Knight Leo

    • Leo has decent Str, and Great Knight builds up on that. He can also use Mag oriented weapons, such as Bolt Axe and Levin Sword.

    • Great Knight helps Leo’s Def, and gives him decent Res, which makes him a usable tank.

    • However, Great Knight is definitely not Leo’s recommended class. It still seems like a fun option, though.

  • Holy Bowman Leo

    • As a Holy Bowman, Leo can use the Shining Bow (a weapon that uses Mag), which has 13 Mt and can double. Due to his growths, he has better Res than other potential Holy Bowmans.

    • Leo has the flexibility that not many bow users do. He can use the Mighty Bow, get his Str halved, and then simply switch over to the Shining Bow.

      • Leo can also do this as an Adventurer, though.

  • Revenant Knight Leo

    • Although Leo has high Mag, he also has decent Str. Therefore, he suits a hybrid class.

    • Leo’s growth rates struggle in Str, Skl, and Def. The Revenant Knight gives him 15% Str, and 10% Skl and Def. It also gives him 15% Mag to make his Mag even stronger.

    • Leo can use his personal tome as a Revenant Knight. However, as a Revenant Knight, Leo will have to grind for the Axe weapon rank. This can be impractical in a non-grinding Nohr playthrough.

      • Also, the weapon rank limit on tomes is B, and given Leo’s high Mag, this can be a bit of a waste. However, he still has access to his personal weapon, which only requires rank E.

    • Revenant Knights grant Leo high mobility and flight.

    • Revenant Knight gives Leo Deadly Breath, which reduces the HP of nearby enemies. This works well with his personal skill, which triggers when an enemy is not at full HP.

    • To be a Revenant Knight, Leo would have to marry either Berka. Berka would lower Leo's Spd cap to -3. Also, she doesn't do much for Foleo’s Mag cap, and Felicia or Nyx may be better marriage candidates.

      • However, Foleo doesn’t need to focus too heavily on Spd if he’s a support unit. Also, Foleo can A+ support with Ignis for Defensive Formation.

  • Sorcerer Leo

    • Although Leo has higher than average Str growth as a Mag-oriented unit, his Str is still fairly weak. Additionally, he has a -2 Str cap, which can reflect poorly on an optimized unit that uses Str.

    • Leo can hit hard as a Sorcerer (37 Mag), and he has better Spd and Res in this class.

    • Sorcerer allows Leo to go up to an S rank with tomes, and he can maximize his attack power.

    • Leo can use the Nosferatu tome as a Sorcerer. Even with the nerf, this tome is fairly powerful. However, he can also use this tome in other classes, as it’s simply a D rank tome.

      • Despite its nerf, Leo is actually a suitable candidate for Nosferatu. First, he’s fairly slow, so he won’t be doubling too much in the first place (and not at all if he married Effie for Defensive Formation). Second, he has decent HP and Def and doesn’t rely on dodge tanking, so the Avoid -20 doesn’t hurt him as much.

  • Strategist Leo

    • In a Lunatic runthrough, Leo could serve as a healer. If he stays as a Dark Knight for a while before reclassing, his Def may be high enough to allow him to be a front line healer.

    • Even though the weapon rank limit on tomes is B, he can still access his personal weapon. Additionally, his high Mag allows him to do some fancy staffwork.
Edited by Riku

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Honestly... He is so optimized for Dark Knight it is insane. Best growths for him? Dark Knight. Best Caps for him? Dark Knight. Best Look for him? Dark Knight(alright, maybe this one is preference).

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The poll's first question still says Felicia~

Whoops! I guess Find and Replace failed me, ahaha. Thanks for the catch!

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Where is the Lodestar preference option for my DKB Blarth?

We’re ignoring DLC classes; those are OP on any character. If we go through with post-release (for NA/Europe) polls, I plan to have polls regarding which characters should receive the DLC classes.

I left it out of the polls to maintain some balance. DLC classes, because most of them are unlocked through paying, tend to be stronger than the other classes (e.g. most people would argue that Witch is better than Sorcerer). It would defeat the purpose of the weekly polls if the DLC classes ended up dominating the results, ahaha...

You're still free to share your opinions on how a character (in this case, Leo) may perform as a DLC class, but I will not be editing the polls to put in that option.

Edited by Riku

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I left it out of the polls to maintain some balance. DLC classes, because most of them are unlocked through paying, tend to be stronger than the other classes (e.g. most people would argue that Witch is better than Sorcerer). It would defeat the purpose of the weekly polls if the DLC classes ended up dominating the results, ahaha...

You're still free to share your opinions on how a character (in this case, Leo) may perform as a DLC class, but I will not be editing the polls to put in that option.

I don't care how he performs as a Lodestar, I just want to make him the true Hero-Prince Blarth! Although he would appreciate Speed Drain.

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I think it's pretty difficult to argue any class is better for Leo than Dark Knight, and I did vote for Dark Knight for most of the answers, but I'd like to make a secondary case for Revenant Knight. So I'm going to argue for Revenant Knight even though I voted for Dark Knight, if that makes sense.

Due to his personal tome, you really want to keep Leo as something that can use tomes. He has crazy MAG, but he also has pretty good STR, so if you're not using him in a hybrid class you feel like you're wasting him. His "weaknesses," such as they are, are 25% STR, 35% SKL, and 30% DEF. So ideally, here, we're looking for something that will cover his SKL and DEF while still giving him access to Tomes.

Enter Revenant Knight. At the penalty of slightly lowered max stats across the board, you get 15% STR and MAG and 10% SKL and DEF to pull up Leo's growths where he needs them, as well as an A-rank physical weapon. Admittedly, it's axes and not swords, so Leo will have to build the rank on them--impractical in a non-grinding Nohr playthrough--and it also comes with only a B in Tomes instead of an A. However, Brynhildr is E-rank and Leo doesn't really need any other Tome, so the B-Tomes isn't too crushing, and as compensation Leo gets flight, which is a powerful tool.

Again, I do think Dark Knight is probably better overall. But Revenant Knight looks like a solid secondary option worth considering.

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I don't care how he performs as a Lodestar, I just want to make him the true Hero-Prince Blarth! Although he would appreciate Speed Drain.

I'm just really skeptical about inserting DLC classes into the polls, I apologize. I did put up another poll concerning them, though, if that would serve as a reasonable compromise.

I think it's pretty difficult to argue any class is better for Leo than Dark Knight, and I did vote for Dark Knight for most of the answers, but I'd like to make a secondary case for Revenant Knight. So I'm going to argue for Revenant Knight even though I voted for Dark Knight, if that makes sense.

Due to his personal tome, you really want to keep Leo as something that can use tomes. He has crazy MAG, but he also has pretty good STR, so if you're not using him in a hybrid class you feel like you're wasting him. His "weaknesses," such as they are, are 25% STR, 35% SKL, and 30% DEF. So ideally, here, we're looking for something that will cover his SKL and DEF while still giving him access to Tomes.

Enter Revenant Knight. At the penalty of slightly lowered max stats across the board, you get 15% STR and MAG and 10% SKL and DEF to pull up Leo's growths where he needs them, as well as an A-rank physical weapon. Admittedly, it's axes and not swords, so Leo will have to build the rank on them--impractical in a non-grinding Nohr playthrough--and it also comes with only a B in Tomes instead of an A. However, Brynhildr is E-rank and Leo doesn't really need any other Tome, so the B-Tomes isn't too crushing, and as compensation Leo gets flight, which is a powerful tool.

Again, I do think Dark Knight is probably better overall. But Revenant Knight looks like a solid secondary option worth considering.

Ahh, I was wondering why people were voting for Revenant Knight. That makes a lot of sense.

Edited by Riku

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I don't think it's worth worrying about his str. He may have a higher than average str growth for a magic unit, but it still isn't very good and he has a -2 to his cap. I've been tossing up between sorcerer and dark knight, sorc hits harder with 37 mag compared to DK's 33, and is a little faster and better able to take magic hits, but DK has more skill and higher def, plus movement. Sorc has a higher tome rank too, which'll boost his attack further via weapon rank bonus. I think I'll vote sorc for optimization due to it's higher ability to actually kill things, but dark knight for practicality for it's higher physical defence and movement range.

I'd recommend going through revenant knight for the deadly breath skill though, that way every time he attacks something every enemy near him will lose a bit of health and trigger his personal ability, although don't send him in alone because he isn't that tough in any of the classes you're likely to put him in. Part of me wants to give him defensive formation to help with his low speed, but the only way to get it would be to marry Effie (or a knight!Kamui).

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Hm... His only option (aside from Avatar, but... well...) for going Revenant Knight would be to marry Berka. While Leo would benefit from going through Revenant Knight at least once, wouldn't that harm Foleo's stats in the long run, in terms of Speed? Or does Leo have so many good things going for him that you may opt to optimize him instead of his child, and keep Foleo around in a support class (since Foleo's magic isn't hurt by any negative modifiers or anything)?

EDIT: Or maybe Foleo getting access to Deadly Breath will somehow compensate for that ridiculously low speed, or... ?

(I want to make both Leo and Foleo into members of my unit, once I get the game.)

Edited by Folt

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Well, there are a couple different ways to look at it.

On the one hand, Leo in no way needs Revenant Knight. He has everything he needs in his base classes and Dark Knight is basically ideal for him. The skills are good, but Leo can easily get enough useful skills out of his default classes to fill his slots. So there's no real need to go Revenant Knight.

On the other hand, if you did really want to go Revenant Knight, Belka's not the worst choice for Foleo's mother. She'll increase his SKL--one of the stats he has trouble with--and she actually has some MAG growth to pass down, unlike some candidates. She doesn't penalize his max MAG and she gives him some good help with DEF, which he greatly appreciates, and she'll also pass Revenant Knight to him, which is nifty. (More Deadly Breath!)

Of course, on the first hand again, Leo already hits Foleo's max SPD by -2 and Belka decreases it by another -2. It's true that -4 max SPD is a pretty big disadvantage.

But to counter by returning to the second hand, FEFates seems more lenient about SPD than possibly any previous FE game. For one thing, Foleo doesn't need to worry about SPD if he's serving a Battle Command/ Rally/ Staffbot support role. It also makes little difference if he's glued to somebody else as a support unit. There's also Defensive Formation, which he can easily get by buddying to Ignis. Furthermore, there are spells like Odin's Black-tome and Rainbow Sage's Ink Painting that are very powerful but prevent double attacks, period, so Foleo's SPD is irrelevant for wielding them. SKL, however, is important to make sure that one hit connects, and Belka helps Foleo out with that. So that's good.

So, if getting Revenant Knight on Leo is important to you, then you can rest assured that Belka!Foleo is not going to be crippled in terms of usefulness. However, Leo doesn't need it, so you might prefer having Foleo get stats from Felicia or Nyx instead. You can go either way; both seem viable. At least, I think they do.

Edited by Luninareph

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Mmm, I see. Works for me then.

I had actually forgot about Foleo being able to A+ support with Ignis, thus allowing him to gain Defensive Formation in any of his playthroughs and make his Speed disadvantage a somewhat moot point. I might try marrying Leo to Elfie on one playthrough and take him through enough levels to get Defensive Formation, then keep that Leo around so I can have my other Leos just buy the skill.

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If The Nosforatu tome returns then by far Sorcerer is the best choice for him, which should allow him to hit harder and more often than a dark knight version.

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So, uh... had this huge thing typed out, nearly finished, and poof. So, that's a thing. I will not be retyping it (I'm mobile atm) but will do a short rundown. I chose Revenant Knight for practicality, Strategist for best (healing for Lunatic,) and Great Knight for my preference. Clearly GK is kinda, uh, not something Leo should ever class into, which is why I like it. Looove putting characters into classes they don't belong. I think he'd do well because Bolt Axe, Levin Sword, A rank Lances with great strength growth. Decent resistance with great defense and mobility. By no means great or optimal, but fun and doable.

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So, uh... had this huge thing typed out, nearly finished, and poof. So, that's a thing. I will not be retyping it (I'm mobile atm) but will do a short rundown. I chose Revenant Knight for practicality, Strategist for best (healing for Lunatic,) and Great Knight for my preference. Clearly GK is kinda, uh, not something Leo should ever class into, which is why I like it. Looove putting characters into classes they don't belong. I think he'd do well because Bolt Axe, Levin Sword, A rank Lances with great strength growth. Decent resistance with great defense and mobility. By no means great or optimal, but fun and doable.

HAHAHA, I love it XD I also enjoy classing units into classes they're not supposed to be: in my games, you will definitely become a mage unless you are a small, pretty, fragile little girl, in which case you will become a ravening axe-wielding berserker and cut everything to death. I hope you rewrite your giant post about Leo-as-Great-Knight sometime, I'd love to see it :)

If The Nosforatu tome returns then by far Sorcerer is the best choice for him, which should allow him to hit harder and more often than a dark knight version.

Nosferatu does return, but you are aware of how hard they hit it with the nerf bat, right? It can't double attack, it can't crit, and it reduces your AVO by 20. (All of which combined still manages just to bring it down to "the same level as everything else," which kinda goes to show how broken it used to be.) By all means Leo is a great candidate to use it, since he actually has okay HP and DEF and doesn't rely on evade-tanking to stay alive, but it's not the be-all end-all anymore considering how hard its offensive power got cut.

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Majority votes :

Optimal : Dark Knight

Practicality (Nohr) : Dark Knight

Preference : Dark Knight

Next poll: Camilla, Elise, Kaze, Takumi, Gold Digger, Hinoka

Edited by Jayvee94

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HAHAHA, I love it XD I also enjoy classing units into classes they're not supposed to be: in my games, you will definitely become a mage unless you are a small, pretty, fragile little girl, in which case you will become a ravening axe-wielding berserker and cut everything to death. I hope you rewrite your giant post about Leo-as-Great-Knight sometime, I'd love to see it :)

Nosferatu does return, but you are aware of how hard they hit it with the nerf bat, right? It can't double attack, it can't crit, and it reduces your AVO by 20. (All of which combined still manages just to bring it down to "the same level as everything else," which kinda goes to show how broken it used to be.) By all means Leo is a great candidate to use it, since he actually has okay HP and DEF and doesn't rely on evade-tanking to stay alive, but it's not the be-all end-all anymore considering how hard its offensive power got cut.

In JRPGs with a customizable class system, I always try to make at least one girl into a purely physical attacker because JRPG girls tend to be primarily spellcasters as the norm (or otherwise have some kind of mystical power that lets them be fighter-mage hybrids) and at least one adult or close-to-adult boy into a spellcaster or fighter-mage hybrid since physical fighters are the norm for JRPG boys (and they don't tend to otherwise have physical powers, meanwhile the ones who don't tend to be children and possibly kid geniuses which is one JRPG trope that I really could do without).

Also, nice to hear that Nosferatu is at least a viable option (somewhat) since that (along with the GBA!Luna tome) is one of my favorite magic spells in FE.

Anyways, I voted Sorcerer in terms of best class (since Leo's strengths become optimized in Sorcerer), Dark Knight as the practical class (since that's what he starts out as and it will take you through Nohr, no prob) and Revenant Knight as the class I prefer for him (Axes + Magic combo and he gets to ride a fucking dragon, err, wyvern. I'd like to say though that Leo as a Dark Knight is already pretty high up there in terms of coolness so the preferance for Revenant Knight over Dark Knight isn't by a wide margin). As for the DLC class, I'd pick Grandmaster since both of Leo's weapons carry over to it and he gets some rather nice skills from it (IGNIS! Also the support skills if you want to take Leo through a support role).

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Voted Holy Bowman for optimized. May or may not be the most optimized class for Leo but he'd definitely be one of the best optimized Holy Bowman! Though, yeah, realistically it'd just be sorcerer to make use of his strengths--nohr has enough bow users even if none of them could mighty bow-> shining bow swap combo as well as he could save for maybe the feMU needed to let him do so in the first place.

Dark Knight is the most practical since he's good enough as one and doesn't need a seal.

In terms of preference I'm totally turning him into a General. Try wearing that backwards, nerd.

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Voted Holy Bowman for optimized. May or may not be the most optimized class for Leo but he'd definitely be one of the best optimized Holy Bowman! Though, yeah, realistically it'd just be sorcerer to make use of his strengths--nohr has enough bow users even if none of them could mighty bow-> shining bow swap combo as well as he could save for maybe the feMU needed to let him do so in the first place.

Dark Knight is the most practical since he's good enough as one and doesn't need a seal.

In terms of preference I'm totally turning him into a General. Try wearing that backwards, nerd.

Would you be willing to expand on how Leo would be the best Holy Bowman? I've seen a lot of people make Takumi, Kisaragi, and Mozume a Holy Bowman (and some even seem to do it with Sakura), but I've never heard of anyone reclassing Leo to a Holy Bowman. That sounds like an interesting concept.

And Leo as a General makes me crack up. I just imagine him reading his tome peacefully when all of a sudden Kamui marches up, steals his book, and orders him to jump into the heaviest armor. And then Leo walks around like an awkward penguin, because he's not comfortable in the armor, ahaha.

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The Shining Bow has 13mt, does magic damage and can double. Leo as a Holy Bowman has tons of magic and more resistance than the others thanks to his growths suited for DK. From my understanding of how the mighty bow works, he could use that from time to time, get his str halved and then switch to using the shining bow. None of the other bow candidates really have the magic for that. Ideally, you'd just level him as DK for 15 levels and then swap over to HB for end-game My Castle parties and such.

But, if we're just optimizing Leo Adventurer could do that same combo only better--Zero can already do it. And Sorc is probably still superior to either option for him. No other HB would be as good though which might be worth something; even reclassing Zero to HB wouldn't be as good as Leo's versatility/lack of cap-rammed yet still nearly capped stats.

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This is late, but the Summary has been posted. Thanks to everyone who participated in the polls and in the discussion! You're free to continue voting/discussing if you want, but this wraps up Week Four. The next set of polls will be posted sometime today.


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