Lord Tier List

[BerserkStaff]

i just accept marth visiting villages as the way of playing. no point in thinking otherwise lol. the only chapter i remember marth opening chests to be a benefit is chapter 16 where xane copies marth to open chests with julian.

i still think though that compared to ephraim and chrom, when he fights it justs seems more necessary overall than the latter two

Edited June 14, 2016 by BerserkStaff

[Caliban of Sycorax]

In lategame when Dragons are commonplace, Marth with a Wyrmslayer is one of your top killers because he reliably isn't doubled by them. He does a lot more lategame combat than Ephraim and Chrom, agreed.

I haven't played Awakening so I will not comment on Chrom, but I feel that Ephraim's overall usefulness still surpasses Marth's. FE8's only more reliable combat unit is Seth, and Ephraim with growth will surpass him. He gains a mount upon promotion as well as the ridiculously broken Siegmund (not that it matters much, Regenleif is also broken) which gives him an extra +5 STR and effectiveness against the most common enemy in lategame. Marth isn't consistently fighting Dragons until Chapter 22, but Ephraim is fighting Monsters in Chapters 18, 20, and Final, where that is all you encounter.

[Troykv]

You guys should be joking about FE10 Ike. He soon will cap Str, Skl and Def and you'll have plenty BEXP to raise or cap Spd, buff lck and res. There's also 2-2 Talisman which is a nice use for him. What number of sages do you have in Part 3? 3-P has some that can be killed by him, laguz, Titania or whoever you want because sages suck there. You also have plenty of healing options and once he gets Ragnell in 3-11 he's automatically one of the best units in the game, so I don't see any viable complaints about him.

Edit: also FE9 Ike sucks because he needs to rely on dodges or chips and get kills because he doesn't have the base power to ORKO and gets 3 or 4HKO at earlygame, so he's never going to be better than FE10 Ike.

Exactly, they just prefer FE9!Ike for nostalgic reasons.

FE10!Ike is a complete monster even if you don't feed it with BExp to fix his Res/Lck problems. Only look that base stats, the speed is high enough to compensate his bad speed growth.

Ike is just so good that makes me sick xDU (Specially when he overshadow other characters, and the characters that overshadow him are complete game-breakers).

[Caliban of Sycorax]

I actually just hate Ike in general. I do prefer FE10!Ike but when you have Mastery Skills that kill everything that blinks in one hit, it's much harder to judge units individually.

[BerserkStaff]

pretty sure it takes a long time for ephraim to surpass seth bc seth has similar growths. okay ephraim is probably contributing more than fe12 marth so i'll move ephraim one up

Edited June 14, 2016 by BerserkStaff

[Quintessence]

I actually just hate Ike in general. I do prefer FE10!Ike but when you have Mastery Skills that kill everything that blinks in one hit, it's much harder to judge units individually.

Imo Aether is an insignificant buff for Ike since:

1) Ragnell is enough for him to solo maps and be a sustainable unit.

2) The enemies he would like to Aether (Black Knight and Deghinsea) have Nihil.

Which makes Aether pretty much irrelevant unless you're short of killing a THWOMP by Part 4.

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

Honestly I didn't consider the points supports and reclassing which was a mistake by myself afterwards.

Furthermore that I didn't separate male and female Robin. Unquestionable F > M because of Galeforce.

My reason that he's "only" decent is that he gets more exp., can use melee and range weapons but is hard to use in the beginning on higher dfficulties (chapter 2 +3 in lunatic (+)). But I guess it's not a weakness of him but rather a flaw of FE13's difficulty design.

Well, fair point about the difficulty. I was ranking based on Hard Mode, so different parameters will naturally yield different results. And Galeforce is great, no question, so I can see that as Female Robin being superior, but it's worth keeping in mind that it takes quite a while (Lv. 15 promoted, plus a reclass, means at least 9 + 19 + 14 = 42 levels) to actually get it.

i said in my first post that i don't include marth fe12 visiting villages or else he'd be top tier

also i don't consider lucina a lord because she comes halfway through the game, or avatar/chris/morgan because it's pretty obvious they'd be at the top of the tier and they aren't exactly lords

I noticed a comment about villages in your original, but I was a bit confused by the wording, so thank you for clarifying. Of course, visiting villages would also be a boon to fe11 Marth, were it considered. Which it isn't. So...

As for Lucina, I think we're talking a bit about the discrepancy between "Lord" as a class, and "Lord" as a gameplay and story role. While Lucina's class is Lord, I would agree that she doesn't bear the same significance as her father, or Ephraim, or Lyn, etc. (she's (almost?) never a forced-deploy, her falling in battle isn't a Game Over). Meanwhile, Micaiah (for example) doesn't bear the "Lord" title in any of her classes, but there's no question that she's the (or at least, a) main character of Radiant Dawn. And while characters like Chris and Robin are significant to gameplay, supports, and story, I personally don't treat them as "Lords", but rather as their own thing ("Avatacticians").

[Caliban of Sycorax]

pretty sure it takes a long time for ephraim to surpass seth bc seth has similar growths. okay ephraim is probably contributing more than fe12 marth so i'll move ephraim one up

Seth's Growths: HP 90% STR 50% SKL 45% SPD 45% LCK 25% DEF 40% RES 30%

Ephraim's Growths: HP 80% STR 55% SKL 55% SPD 45% LCK 50% DEF 35% RES 25%

So overall Ephraim has better offensive growths while Seth has better defensive growths, with them having tied speed growths. Offensively Ephraim will match base Seth at Level 14/15 unpromoted, and his defenses will not be that far behind, minus Resistance which he will always be far behind. Assuming Ephraim mode is played, by Chapter 15 he will probably hit Level 20 unpromoted since there are plenty of enemies for him to kill, and with several Rout maps in his route he doesn't necessarily compete for combat with horses because there are a lot of enemies to kill. If you want you could always rescue-drop Ephraim into the middle of a bunch of enemies and watch him go to town. FE8's enemies are also easy cannon fodder even on Hard Mode, so Ephraim will have no trouble. While the infamous Chapter 11 exists, Ephraim is lucky enough to have great units like Duessel, Cormag, and Seth by his side. He could also form a nice Support chain with these guys--Ephraim supports Duessel, who supports Cormag, who supports Seth. These are some of your best Ephraim route units, so it's likely they will all see lots of combat. Ephraim doubles HM!Vigarde at Level 15 on average, and with Regeneif's 3x effectiveness he is doing 20(x2) damage to Vigarde with ~7 Crit at that level, aka he 2RKOs him while taking 22 damage at a ~67 hit rate with NO supports. So, not the best of odds for survival, BUT it proves Ephraim is not a pushover and he is easily one of the best combat units in FE8.

[BerserkStaff]

dude chill lol i never said he was bad. i know he's one of the best combat units. i was just saying that it takes a while for ephraim to be as good as seth. seth has 7 chapters all to himself and still kills many enemies even when ephraim joins which is why it takes a while for ephraim to catch up to him. supports are nearly nonexistent in gba fire emblems unless youre wasting so many turns. but even after ephraim promotes there's a chance he might not even catch up to seth bc chapter 16 you're warping seth over the wall to kill orsin with a horseslayer and then he probably decimates nearly everyone around him in the next enemy phase or two. chapter 17 is warp bosskiller (seth or ephraim but probably seth bc ephraim just promoted) to kill lyon asap, chapter 18 okay ephraim levels up alot here with his high move and killing gorgon eggs. chapter 19 is warpskipped, chapter 20 is warpskipping 3/4ths of the chapter. and final chapter both seth and ephraim sees action. and the thing is even after ephraim promotes, seth can still be possibly stronger than ephraim because you get statboosters in the beginning of the game and often times you have no one to throw it at and people tend to just throw it at seth because why not and therefore he's still potentially stronger than ephraim. but no i completely agree that ephraim is a phenomenal unit lololol

also i think the differences between their growths are so minimal because they're both powerful already

Edited June 14, 2016 by BerserkStaff

[Caliban of Sycorax]

dude chill lol i never said he was bad. i know he's one of the best combat units. i was just saying that it takes a while for ephraim to be as good as seth. seth has 7 chapters all to himself and still kills many enemies even when ephraim joins which is why it takes a while for ephraim to catch up to him. supports are nearly nonexistent in gba fire emblems unless youre wasting so many turns. but even after ephraim promotes there's a chance he might not even catch up to seth bc chapter 16 you're warping seth over the wall to kill orsin with a horseslayer and then he probably decimates nearly everyone around him in the next enemy phase or two. chapter 17 is warp bosskiller (seth or ephraim but probably seth bc ephraim just promoted) to kill lyon asap, chapter 18 okay ephraim levels up alot here with his high move and killing gorgon eggs. chapter 19 is warpskipped, chapter 20 is warpskipping 3/4ths of the chapter. and final chapter both seth and ephraim sees action. and the thing is even after ephraim promotes, seth can still be possibly stronger than ephraim because you get statboosters in the beginning of the game and often times you have no one to throw it at and people tend to just throw it at seth because why not and therefore he's still potentially stronger than ephraim. but no i completely agree that ephraim is a phenomenal unit lololol

also i think the differences between their growths are so minimal because they're both powerful already

I really wasn't trying to argue much, I was just supporting the claim that Ephraim is an amazing unit, and I just wanted the Seth comparison to show how the two stack up. The whole Vigarde thing was just to add to Ephraim's greatness, anyone with enough levels can kill him. Seth can double HM!Vigarde at Level 8, and his strength is much higher.

[SSbardock84]

These all sound very opinionated to me.

[Gradivus.]

Most of them make sense, I'd only really question Eliwood < Roy (and by extension, Eliwood < Lyn), and it's weird to make an extra tier for FE11 Marth rather than putting him right below or right above Roy.

Edited July 10, 2016 by Gradivus.

[OliKad]

Wait. FE5 Leaf is considered high-tier?

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha...

[ruadath]

Wait. FE5 Leaf is considered high-tier?

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha...

Yes, I'm confused about this as well. He's a pretty decent lol, but I wouldn't put him in the same rank as Ike or just below Sigurd.

Most of them make sense, I'd only really question Eliwood < Roy (and by extension, Eliwood < Lyn), and it's weird to make an extra tier for FE11 Marth rather than putting him right below or right above Roy.

I agree here. I think Eliwood is pretty underrated in FE7, and his usefulness really shines on the Hector Modes when you haven't done LHM first.

Edited July 10, 2016 by ruadath

[OliKad]

Yes, I'm confused about this as well. He's a pretty decent lol, but I wouldn't put him in the same rank as Ike or just below Sigurd.

I agree here. I think Eliwood is pretty underrated in FE7, and his usefulness really shines on the Hector Modes when you haven't done LHM first.

I also agree, though I still think that Lyn and Hector are overall better units. But Eliwood is still good...

[Caliban of Sycorax]

Eliwood is just average whereas Hector is great. He's not much better than Lyn, though, and he does get a horse on promotion, which can be quite early on Hector Mode if he promotes first. Durandal is a pretty shitty weapon, but then again so is Sol Katti. Roy is just plain bad, and his forced late promotion makes him worse. Even in Eliwood Mode he still has at least a few chapters to gain promoted levels and catch up including Chapter 28 in which he's forced to solo 1/3 of the map.

[ChibiToastExplosion]

Wolf Beil is great.

FTFY

Roy is just plain bad, and his forced late promotion makes him worse.

And Hector gets a pass for this why?

---

Hector is a great character and a good unit. But he's not some demi-god. He, like Roy, is benched for a 3rd of the game simply because of horrendous promotion time, and is a lunker with low move. He's not as frail, I guess, but good positioning makes Roy pretty sturdy too.

Hector is better than Roy, yes. People love to point out all of Roy's flaws and they go completely ignored for Hector, who shares the many of them. It irritates me to no end. The flaws that make Roy 'garbage tier' are the same ones that keep Hector from being anything other than average. Roy's game is harder and Hector's story softballs you lancers left and right to make Hector look better than he would in even Eliwood's mode (or axe-hell FE6).

[Rezzy]

FTFY

And Hector gets a pass for this why?

---

Hector is a great character and a good unit. But he's not some demi-god. He, like Roy, is benched for a 3rd of the game simply because of horrendous promotion time, and is a lunker with low move. He's not as frail, I guess, but good positioning makes Roy pretty sturdy too.

Hector is better than Roy, yes. People love to point out all of Roy's flaws and they go completely ignored for Hector, who shares the many of them. It irritates me to no end. The flaws that make Roy 'garbage tier' are the same ones that keep Hector from being anything other than average. Roy's game is harder and Hector's story softballs you lancers left and right to make Hector look better than he would in even Eliwood's mode (or axe-hell FE6).

The main lord in FE7 promotes pretty late, only getting a 1-2 chapter availability over Roy, but they also get their nonmain lord route, in which case they can promote a lot earlier, making them seem better, since 50% of the time, they get a lot better promoted availability. Hector's good compared to the other units in his game, as opposed to Roy, who's below average in his own game, unless he's using his plot sword.

Edited July 13, 2016 by Rezzy

[ChibiToastExplosion]

The main lord in FE7 promotes pretty late, only getting a 1-2 chapter availability over Roy, but they also get their nonmain lord route, in which case they can promote a lot earlier, making them seem better, since 50% of the time, they get a lot better promoted availability. Hector's good compared to the other units in his game, as opposed to Roy, who's below average in his own game, unless he's using his plot sword.

On this site especially, whenever FE7 is talked about I automatically assume it is HHM. Or at least Hector's story.

Roy, believe it or not, has some of the best growths in the game. 6, however, is known for RNG screwing everybody and everything, and so it's a little more noticeable. Fully trained Roy (yes, you have to use him a ton as soon as he promotes - same for Hector/Eliwood) is pretty decent even without the SoS. Is he the best unit in the game? No, and few Lords are - Hector included.

Hector has direct competition just from OsWIN, and on his tale he's below average just because he can't promote. If Roy had a prf weapon half as good as the Wolf Beil, the gap would be even narrower.

This is not to say Hector is bad. In my eyes, neither is Roy - he's just in a harder game.

[Troykv]

On this site especially, whenever FE7 is talked about I automatically assume it is HHM. Or at least Hector's story.

Roy, believe it or not, has some of the best growths in the game. 6, however, is known for RNG screwing everybody and everything, and so it's a little more noticeable. Fully trained Roy (yes, you have to use him a ton as soon as he promotes - same for Hector/Eliwood) is pretty decent even without the SoS. Is he the best unit in the game? No, and few Lords are - Hector included.

Hector has direct competition just from OsWIN, and on his tale he's below average just because he can't promote. If Roy had a prf weapon half as good as the Wolf Beil, the gap would be even narrower.

This is not to say Hector is bad. In my eyes, neither is Roy - he's just in a harder game.

Yes, Roy has the best growths from the normal units (only Chad/Cath, Fa and Karel has better growth than Roy).

All the Roy's growth are good for his game standars.

80% HP is decent enough

40% STR also is a completely decent Strenght growth.

50% SKL is good enough to assure hits with Swords.

40% SPD is meh... But enough to avoid double attacks from speedy enemies if Roy is trained.

60% LCK is great... Roy is practically unvulnerable to Troll Critics.

25% DEF isn't something special but it's enough to survive some hits.

30% RES is great for a Physical Unit (in fact, his Resistence Growth is the best from non-magical/Karel units).

[Rezzy]

Roy's got okay growths, but his only real significant win over Hector is in Speed with 5%. Even that is counteracted by Roy's awful Con that makes anything heavier than an Iron Sword weigh him down.

Even in HHM, Hector gets 2 more chapters of availability than Roy. It's still lousy, but better.

[Lord Raven]

This is not to say Hector is bad. In my eyes, neither is Roy - he's just in a harder game.

roy is kinda bad

he has like a silver weapon in one chapter (chapter 5) and the western isles maps to be passable and that's it

and of course chapters 23/24 (though Binding Blade doesn't have effective damage against Wyverns rip). Roy is in a harder game sure but we already know FE7 Roy - he is known as Eliwood. And Eliwood blows.

All Roy really has is those last two chapters because of his +3 weapon rank on promotion, otherwise being on equal terms but one being in a tougher game is inherently inferior, especially since so many units will have much better combat than Roy in the mid teens, as well as having much better mobility and durability. And they can promote. I'm pretty sure chapter 21 Wyverns one shot or similar to Roy on average.

Roy, believe it or not, has some of the best growths in the game. 6, however, is known for RNG screwing everybody and everything, and so it's a little more noticeable. Fully trained Roy (yes, you have to use him a ton as soon as he promotes - same for Hector/Eliwood) is pretty decent even without the SoS. Is he the best unit in the game? No, and few Lords are - Hector included.

He has the best growth total sure... but his base stats are lacking, his weapon variety is lacking, his movement is lacking, and his str/spd/defensive growths are pretty lacking as well. So are the bases. Hector's bases and growths are much better relative to his own game - namely in HP/Str/Def and his Speed is 35% but it's passable in FE7. I'd also like to note that Hector would be much better than Roy in FE6 even with a Chapter 21 promotion due to having axes and durability, as well as the Wolf Beil.

Hector has direct competition just from OsWIN, and on his tale he's below average just because he can't promote. If Roy had a prf weapon half as good as the Wolf Beil, the gap would be even narrower.

He's above average in his own tale despite not being able to promote until Chapter 28 or 29... by virtue of having very solid hp/str/def.

Hector is way better than Roy, and it helps Hector's case a lot that there are a few rout maps and long seize missions following him, whereas Roy just has Chapter 23/24 and nothing else.

Edited July 15, 2016 by Lord Raven

[ChibiToastExplosion]

roy is kinda bad

The argument has never been that Roy is great. It's that Hector is also not as great as he's hyped up to be, especially since he shares so many traits with Roy.

I'm pretty sure chapter 21 Wyverns one shot or similar to Roy on average.

Uh, no? I recently played HM and no, they couldn't. Unless your Roy is that consistently RNG screwed. It also helps that if your Roy is struggling that bad, the game gives you these strange things called "Seraph Robes" and "Dracoshields". Don't tell me other units can use them better, because if your Roy is that bad, then in this run he NEEDS them. It's called playing the overall game.

PEMN. But each run is individual and that shouldn't be discounted, so if you need to use something, use something.

he has like a silver weapon in one chapter (chapter 5) and the western isles maps to be passable and that's it

Even on hard I have NEVER had to give Roy a Silver Weapon to make him passable on chapter 5, and definitely not in axe-land. I'm not turtling and I'm not LTC, either.

He has the best growth total sure... but his base stats are lacking, his weapon variety is lacking, his movement is lacking, and his str/spd/defensive growths are pretty lacking as well. So are the bases. Hector's bases and growths are much better relative to his own game - namely in HP/Str/Def and his Speed is 35% but it's passable in FE7. I'd also like to note that Hector would be much better than Roy in FE6 even with a Chapter 21 promotion due to having axes and durability, as well as the Wolf Beil.

Have we played the same game?

With BB having VERY slow weapon growth rates, having only one weapon isn't that big of a deal since only one is going to be highly ranked in all likelyhood. Also his one weapon is SWORDS, and swords are hands down the best weapon type in the BB.

And his movement? Are you going to tell me that Hector having even LESS move than Roy helps his case then?

And you're arguing in favor of AXES in FE 6? Are we playing the same game? Those garbage hit rates wouldn't pass. Hector would be like a slower Gonzales with a bit more defense and without the critical bonus. Without being able to attack twice (because Gonzo is so much faster) on those harder enemies, you would REALLY start to notice those hit rates. Gonzo is just so strong and fast that he can work DESPITE being axe-locked. Hector couldn't counter that.

--

I know we've gone in to this before, but once again my argument is not that Roy is top tier. It's that Hector is made to look like some FE deity by the fanbase while Roy is used as a whipping boy, despite sharing many traits. ALL of the Elibian Lords aren't that great when it comes to it.

[Lord Raven]

The argument has never been that Roy is great. It's that Hector is also not as great as he's hyped up to be, especially since he shares so many traits with Roy.

his only trait he shares in common with hector is the fact that he can seize

Uh, no? I recently played HM and no, they couldn't. Unless your Roy is that consistently RNG screwed. It also helps that if your Roy is struggling that bad, the game gives you these strange things called "Seraph Robes" and "Dracoshields". Don't tell me other units can use them better, because if your Roy is that bad, then in this run he NEEDS them. It's called playing the overall game.

PEMN. But each run is individual and that shouldn't be discounted, so if you need to use something, use something.

Alright so first off

Many of those wyvern lords have max str and silver lances, putting them at 40 atk, 41 after WTA

Roy's 20/0 HP/Defense is roughly 33/10... this puts him at nearly OHKO territory, and this is assuming he hit level 20! And that's 33.2/9.7 HP/Def, not a hard 33/9, but he still gets pretty close to OHKO'd if you assume his averages. Angelic Robe/Dracoshield won't stop him from getting killed when two wyverns gang up on him, and considering he will average like 48 avoid with WTD (so 33 avoid) he has a very good chance of getting killed if there's two wyverns near him. That's how the math works out. I'm not even bringing personal experience into this.

Even on hard I have NEVER had to give Roy a Silver Weapon to make him passable on chapter 5, and definitely not in axe-land. I'm not turtling and I'm not LTC, either.

Rapier against cavalry is basically a Silver Weapon. It has 12 mt/15 mt depending on weapon triangle in Chapter 5. That's what I'm referring to.

With BB having VERY slow weapon growth rates, having only one weapon isn't that big of a deal since only one is going to be highly ranked in all likelyhood. Also his one weapon is SWORDS, and swords are hands down the best weapon type in the BB.

This isn't FE4, Lances are better than swords. Swords have WTD against most enemies in this game - note the fact that Chapter 2 has soldiers near the starting point, as does Chapter 3. And then when you go to Sacae he's a sitting duck for the nomadic troopers that double him, and his defense isn't that high despite them having short bows. His other case is Sacae Pegasus Knights who are kind of a joke but they also have WTA against him.

And his movement? Are you going to tell me that Hector having even LESS move than Roy helps his case then?

Hector and Roy have the same movement until Chapter 22, and then after that you can pump your lord full of boots anyway. Both still need 15 movement/5 boots for certain things in Chapter 24.

And you're arguing in favor of AXES in FE 6? Are we playing the same game? Those garbage hit rates wouldn't pass. Hector would be like a slower Gonzales with a bit more defense and without the critical bonus. Without being able to attack twice (because Gonzo is so much faster) on those harder enemies, you would REALLY start to notice those hit rates. Gonzo is just so strong and fast that he can work DESPITE being axe-locked. Hector couldn't counter that.

An Iron Axe doesn't have a garbage hitrate nor does a wolf beil. Silver axe has 20 less hit than a Silver Sword, but it's all the same up against a Lance user, except the Axe will have much more might and Hector will have much more durability. Plus, Wolf Beil is better than Rapier. FE6 Wyverns are much scarier than you're giving them credit, too, and Hector's HP advantage would put him in better shape against random Bolting fuckers that nuke Roy pretty damn hard.

"A bit more defense" you mean a lot more right? Similar HP growth, over twice the defense growth (you know Hector's is 60% right) and Hector has like 8 or 9 base defense. This is not hard math. Hector has over twice the skill growth too, so let's not pretend Hector's accuracy issues will be as blatant as gonzales'.

I know we've gone in to this before, but once again my argument is not that Roy is top tier. It's that Hector is made to look like some FE deity by the fanbase while Roy is used as a whipping boy, despite sharing many traits. ALL of the Elibian Lords aren't that great when it comes to it.

Hector has very little in common with Roy, and not many of the prevailing opinions these days say Hector is amazing. Pretty sure Hector is considered a fairly solid unit that tapers until endgame, where he's still fairly solid at best after his promotion. Roy is a pretty bad unit with some niche in Chapter 5 and the western isles and the endgame. Please don't assume that I'm making a point that I'm not making. Roy is easily one of the worst lords in the series, and Hector is around average (and if I had to rank, he'd be a whole tier below FE9 Ike, but that's me saying shit without thinking).

[CT075]

Uh, no? I recently played HM and no, they couldn't.

instead of looking at personal experience, let's actually look at the average stats

level 20 roy, on average, has 33 HP/10 DEF. chapter 21 wyvern lords have 40 attack, plus weapon triangle advantage. i'll be generous and say Roy has a +3 defensive support, so he survives with 5 HP.

avoid? 15 speed and 18 luck is 48 avoid, against roughly 118 hit. i'm not super confident in roy's ability to fight these things, honestly.

if your Roy is that bad, then in this run he NEEDS them. It's called playing the overall game.

that is false

fire emblem, as a strategy game, is unintuitive in that it is inherently more useful to have a small group (in extreme cases, such as FE4, this can even mean a single unit) that is significantly stronger than the rest than it is to strive for "balance". many high-level plays of FE6 don't even have Roy seeing combat past the Western Isles

I'm not LTC

i think that's your problem

And his movement? Are you going to tell me that Hector having even LESS move than Roy helps his case then?

on average, fe6 maps are larger than fe7 maps. chapter 19B (Sacae), for example, is 32x32 tiles. the largest map in FE7 I can think of (victory or death) is 28x30. wrt "percentage of the map that can be crossed", they're actually even

I know we've gone in to this before, but once again my argument is not that Roy is top tier. It's that Hector is made to look like some FE deity by the fanbase while Roy is used as a whipping boy, despite sharing many traits. ALL of the Elibian Lords aren't that great when it comes to it.

i don't understand why arguing that "hector is in an easier game" is a valid argument. you could stick, i dunno, fe10 fiona into any of the GBA games and she would dominate them. units are evaluated and scaled to the context they're placed in. why should roy get a pass for "being in a harder game"?