Geriba

I disagree with most of these assumptions. While the first ever "morph" was created during Nergal's stay in Arcadia (and it was so primitive I'm not sure it would've even counted), Renault's friend was the first morph created after Nergal had put his new plan into motion. There's nothing to suggest that Renault was out of his mind when he murdered Lucius' parents. On the contrary, it ties in both with his mercenary profession and with the guilt that he later develops, so deep that he seeks to become a bishop. And clearly Renault hasn't been a bishop for very long; why else would his magic stat be so low?

The distinction is that Renault's friend was the first morph, while Kishuna was the first morph with emotions. I'd like to think they're the same, but the in-game evidence just isn't there.

Could you expand on this "1 tile" thing? I'm not familiar with it myself. EDIT: And at times, though I don't know if it's repeatable, mounted units who receive items after attacking can move again.

Probably not. This is definitely more in line with their experimental Kid A/Amnesiac efforts, although I've heard it compared to an "In Rainbows Disc 3" (which is a bit more traditional alt.rock). That said, I bet you'd like certain songs on that album. Here's a slow-paced one for you: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yds1LwTX1SU EDIT: And this is my personal favorite one! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdWEijL4zZk

So Radiohead released their new album a day early, and it is sweet. Give it a listen everybody, then post back with thoughts!

"Normally" wouldn't have been able to get away with? There is no "normally"; debating, for all its flaws, is the best system we have of evaluating characters.

Why are you so awesome?

I am simply expressing my complete rejection of the idea that debates are "useless." On the contrary, they are very helpful in gauging the degree by which a certain character excels over another, as well as detailing the ways in which this is the case. Further, an exhaustive analysis and comparison can bring to light points of perspective that might have otherwise gone unnoticed.

Oh okay dondon, nice job. So are you claiming that Eliwood and Lyn should stay in their respective places? Because unless that's what you're advocating, you'd need to formulate a position on how they should move and by what degree. Red's absolutely right: the issue is one of magnitude, and even if Eliwood > Lyn seems pretty clear, figuring out how wide the gap really is can only be a helpful tool. As for "what's been keeping me," 20 hours of college classes have been. Sorry.

I don't know if you noticed the [Ranked] tag, but just as a heads up, I would never endorse that strategy on an Efficiency playthrough.

In preparation for a debate with Red, I booted up a new HHM file. As I was playing along, I tested and re-tested some novel approaches to complete maps, and it got me thinking: why not try to compile them in a single topic? Perhaps there aren't enough out there to justify something like this, but I at least wanted to give it a shot. Chapter 11: Guaranteed 6-Turn Completion (with a good level up!) [Ranked/Efficiency] From what I understand, most people take the southern route on both ranked and efficiency playthroughs. This is because, due to the way RNs are set up on a fresh file, a few timely RN burns will give Hector some lucky dodges and blows and allow him to reach Wire by turn six. However, the same is possible of the western route, and it isn't hindered by the poor level-up Hector gets from the south. Proceed along the west route as usual, but when Matthew opens the door, have Hector burn two RNs before proceeding and equip the hand axe. He'll dodge both the soldier and the archer, which will allow him to defeat Wire; the level-up gains are HP, strength, speed, and luck. Very nice! Chapter 13: Crossing the Rubicon [Efficiency] There are a number of ways to complete this chapter on an efficiency playthrough, but dondon's five-turn completion had Marcus take the south and the rest of the group take the west. It is also possible, however, to complete all chapter objectives (visit both villages, shop around, recruit Guy) via a unique path with Hector. On turn 1, have him place himself two squares away from the southern river tile: have Dorcas rescue him, then have Lowen re-rescue him and drop him off on the river. Next, have Oswin rescue Lowen. This is essential, as the following turn, Oswin will give Lowen to Hector. Marcus proceeds to destroy the south, and Dorcas, Oswin, Eliwood, and Rebecca tackle the western village. There are a couple quirks to the strategy one needs to adhere to- put Eliwood in the way of the PK on turn one to maximize Hector movement, for example, or not immediately dropping off Lowen when you have the chance- but this is the general framework. Chapter 14: Marcus Charges the North [Ranked] Everyone and their mother uses Marcus to secure the southern village (and Priscilla) on this chapter, but I'm not sure that's the optimal way. If he goes north and visits the village, he'll have himself a nice iron blade. He can weaken the mercenary for an easy kill with Erk, but more interesting is how this can lead to a quick and painless Erik kill: placing Marcus on the forest tile, he leaves Erik with 3 HP after a double with the iron blade (at base level), and Erk at base with thunder does three damage to him. This means that Erk can essentially get a free ~130 experience, and it helps ease the burden of the group charging the center. Upon killing Erik, of course, have Marcus rescue Erk and flee- you don't want too consume too much experience with Marcus! Feel free to share yours.

For archers to be worth anything compared to units like, say, Dieck and Rutgar, wouldn't their stats need to be two to three times better than everyone else, to compensate for the Player Phase-only offense?

!!!!!!! Revenge: coming this weekend.

Wait for the debate between me and Red: coming this weekend!!

Ah, Tangerine... power-hungry mod.

I'd be down for helping out with the FE7 balance patch. Of course, I think there should be an all-around difficulty increase to accompany the balance.

I might flesh out this update later, but here are some more results to get things going. Chapter 18: 4 turns (Matthew was too slow to steal the Guiding Ring!) Chapter 19: 4 turns Chapter 20: 8 turns (Recruited Legault and got the Blue Gem, Luna, Member Card, GR, Barrier Staff, and Killer Bow. Really happy with how this went.) Chapter 21: 4 turns

Dark's a notorious cheater over at GameFAQs, and I had the unfortunate experience of doing a run against him. Needless to say, I got tired of the ridiculous luck and obscene stat growths rather quickly. People still take him semi-serious over there though, heh.

I honestly think you're misinterpreting my intention, dondon. I didn't mean to imply that your run was somehow "bad"; in fact, I'm impressed you came up with a four-turn for that map. It's just essential to point out how up to chance- or, more likely, RNG abuse- certain chapters are going to be on an efficiency playthrough. I'm not punching anybody... if anything, I'm holding out a had of congratulations while pointing out a necessary component of that success.

I think it's hilarious how you're getting so defensive. Apparently I "don't know how to do math," because I thought Oswin did 14 damage instead of 15, boo hoo. What would be .02% becomes 1%, yippee. The main point stands: the strategy requires not just luck, but a great deal of luck. And I can't imagine Oswin's strike against a hand-axe wielding brigand could be any higher than 60% or so, meaning that the overall rate is below 1%. What I want to hit home about is that we collectively need to let go of this assumption that RNG abuse is somehow a "bad thing." In fact, it's absolutely necessary for an optimal playthrough.

No, I'm not trying to "be funny." I'm pointing out how contingent your strategy is upon luck and RNG manipulation, even if it is the optimal one. Unlike other chapters (and this goes to your point, Narga), every single hit IS required here, as it's a route chapter and the number of viable PCs is sparse. Your point about the critical not being necessary is wrong, by the way: if the hit had been a regular one, even with a hit upon the PK, one enemy unit would still be left alive, requiring an extra turn. And it's not 1%, it's .02%. That's just absurdly unlikely without serious RNG abuse. On a lighter note, I've devised a way to do the River Route for Ch.13, even on a 0% growth playthrough, that accomplishes all of the objectives in 5 turns. That means saving both villages, recruiting Guy, and shopping. I might post it online if I can figure out how to record and comment on videos.

Unsubstantiated sarcasm, my favorite! ;)

After doing a comprehensive analysis of dondon's Chapter 12 run, I've got to conclude that he seriously underrepresented the sheer amount of luck involved with a successful four-turn completion. Hit True Hit 72 84.6 73 85.69 92 98.8 92 98.8 92 98.8 76 88.72 76 88.72 50* 50.5 30 18.3 50 then 90* 50.5 then 98.1 93x2 (one hits) ~100 74 86.74 75 87.75 77 89.65 60 68.4 2 (crit) 2 90 98.1 91 98.47 78 90.54 78 90.54 Those are all the hits that absolutely have to land. * -> dondon didn't make this clear, but the enemy PK and mercenary have no preference between attacking Hector versus Matthew (I'm assuming it's a 50/50 split). If the mercenary hits, the PK will always follow after; but even if the mercenary chooses Hector, the PK may still got for Matty. And the final odds are... *drumroll* TOTAL: .000186240495794 You're not reading that wrong: without any RNG abuse, the odds of a C.12 four-turn completion are about 2% in 1%, or .018%. That's something like one in ten thousand. In other words, dondon RNG abused (and all of you who wish to do a minimum-turn run need to).