burgerkong
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Posts posted by burgerkong
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On my other walkthough, I took the time to think about the pairing and I feel confident with my choices. Here are the following:
FeMU x Priam!Morgan -
Because I'm fucking bias, and I want my FeMU's son to be the next Radiant Hero!!!Sully x Vaike!Kjelle - Probably one of the most popular pairing choice (I think?), though tbh I never bother using her in the past, and I'll probably never gonna bother idk... : /
Panne x Frederick!Yarne - For Aegis/Pavise mainly, plus having Frederick would save me the trouble of grinding Panne since she can't pass down Wyvern lines for some reason...smh
Nowi x Donnel!Nah - Galeforce, Sol, and Armshifted +Dragonstone, I don't see why not.
Are these for Apotheosis? I'm assuming they are, but if not then these are fine.
For Apotheosis though:
FeMU x Priam isn't optimal of course, but it's fine. Priam doesn't grant any Speed, so I'd really recommend a +Spd/-Def MU so that Morgan can run more classes flexibly.
Vaike!Kjelle isn't too popular anymore due to lack of Galeforce. She was hyped up for Armsthrift & PavGis, neither of which is very good for Apotheosis. Her best bet is probably Axefaire Hero paired up with a Galeboy, similarly to Vaike!Nah.
Fred!Yarne is a waste unfortunately. Yarne is optimally going to be a dedicated Support unit, so stuff like PavGis is useless on him. All he wants is a father that gives him +Hit, which Virion gladly gives him.
Donnel!Nah is pretty much the worst Galeforce unit in the game due to Donnel & Nowi's terrible modifiers & class selection. She lacks a good offensive proc & Manakete is just not a good class for Apotheosis due to lack of Braves and low class caps. As Levant stated, Dragonstones are buyable and non-forgeable, so the convenience of Armsthrift is of little relevance.
Again, this is all assuming Apotheosis, otherwise you can really run whatever you want :P
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Want is a strong word? Is it, though? Even considering nearly every child unit possible can take apo relatively well, there's no reason to go in with Ricken!Brady as a great knight. Mods mean as much or more than classes for gen 2 because most units get everything they want either from the start or with a relatively simple pairing.
That's not strictly true though. Yes, a fair few children are pretty much unscrewable (Morgan, Cynthia, Brady, Severa), but the others still have classes/skills they want out of certain pairings.
Classes / skills are for sure the most important. Even if his mods are godly, no one's gonna argue that someone like Lon'qu!Yarne is a good Yarne. Mods do allow you to hit certain thresholds you wouldn't otherwise be able to hit to increase consistency (Dual Strike%, doubling thresholds, etc.).
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Well, I wouldn't really consider Vaike!Owain really bad, I mean Vaike's mod would make Owain a decent physical unit. Though in the end, he pales in comparison with others...I just wish there's more options for physical... : (
Relative to the other children, he's pretty goddamn awful :(
Vaike!Owain
+2 Str | +1 Mag | +1 Skl | +2 Spd | +2 Lck | 0 Def | 0 Res
Maiden!Lucina
+2 Str | +1 Mag | +2 Skl | +2 Spd | +2 Lck | 0 Def | 0 Res
Yeahhh ... he has worse mods than Maiden!Lucina LOL and no one's calling her a "decent physical unit"
Combined with a lack of offensive proc & terrible class overlap you have the worst Owain possible imo
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Thanks for all the maths, Yoshi. Anything beyond +7 is waste, then?
Technically no, it does give you more flexibility. For example, a Wyvern Lord with +8 Speed could run with a Paladin partner and still hit 75 Speed thanks to the extra point of Speed. Berserkers are popular as dedicated Supports though.
However, say you already have a class in mind for the character. If they hit 50 Speed in their desired class before Limit Breaker, Rallies, etc., they're guaranteed to hit 75 Speed regardless of Pair Up. It's at that point that any extra Speed becomes overkill.
After a certain point it becomes impractical or outright impossible for slower classes though. The extreme example would be the +15 Speed mod would be required to allow Generals to achieve 75 Speed with a +0 Speed Pair Up, but that's impossible (+11 is technically possible by going +Speed & marrying Lon'qu!Yarne, but it's a crappy pairing for Yarne).
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Helswath Berserkers have 64 speed, right? Then you only need 60 speed to avoid being doubled by them.
So even without DLCs, tonics + rally spectrum + rally heart + generic pair-up gives 2+4+4+3 = +13 speed.
So even a 47 speed character (example: Dark Flier or Sage with +5 speed modifier [like Sumia!Lucina] or a 40 speed class with Speed +2 and the same +5 modifier) can at least avoid being doubled by the Berskerer (and double a bunch of the foes who have 55 speed).
Whoops I'm stupid lulz
Forget what 65 Speed doubles then :(
EDIT: Oh its the Invincisorc (Wave 3 boss?)
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What are the important thresholds that need to be met for apo? I'm seeing 69 and 75 for speed, and str/mag are supplemented by DS agg/skills. Speed threshold would end up being like 65 w/ sage pairup or 66 if S rank. So with rallies and tonics can't most things hit the speed thresholds?
75 Speed is to double Anna & the 2 Nightmare Snipers (Wave 2 boss and Wave 5) all of whom have 70 Speed
69 Speed is to double the beefy Helswath Berserkers
66 is to avoid being doubled by Anna / Nightmare Sniper
65 is EDIT: to double something or other
There's obviously more, but I generally don't go any lower than 65, and try to achieve 69 at least if possible
For Avatar!Nah with +Mag/-Def asset flaw as a Dark Flier, her Speed ends up as:
42 (base Dark Flier Speed cap) + 1 (mods) + 10 (Limit Breaker) + 10 (rallies) + 2 (tonics) + 3 (Sage Pair Up) = 68 Speed, you're 1 off the 69 threshold to double Helswath Berserkers.
Running AS+2 is an option, but Valkyrie naturally has 1 more Speed and gives you more skill slots to run what you want.
Hit is also fairly important, especially for the Support units since they don't get the +15 hit from S-Support bonus.
Anna for example has 157 avoid on her throne, Helswath Berserker has 148 avoid on his throne, etc. These are the highest in Apo I think
Remember that you can't stack tonics (+2 is the highest you get from them).
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Thanks for the help fam
So what about them being paired together? I feel like I have all magical guys and all physical girls. I'm not even sure how to pair them among each other. Gerome or Yarne will take Lucina, and then the other can be with one of the wyverns (Kjelle/Severa), and then Morgan can go physical or magical without a problem, but then all my other boys are sages (except Inigo may be a dread fighter but you get the idea). Then I only have Cynthia and Noire as Dark Fliers to accommodate them and the other two will be stuck with physical partners
Edit: Wait new idea. You said both wyvern lords would like berserkers as pair ups. So then I could do something like this
Dark Flier(?)!Lucina x Sage!Laurent (I think that's what class she should be for VVDS+)
Wyvern!Severa/Kjelle x Berserker!Gerome/Yarne
Sage!Owain x Dark Flier!Cynthia
Sage!Brady x Dark Flier!Noire
This seems solid, then Morgan could be a Wyvern (I believe with Virion and +Spd he could still hit 75) and he could be with Nah, however, that leave Inigo on his own and I'm not sure how to deal with that.
EDIT: Was late to the party LOL but I'll leave this here anyways
Because you married 1st gen, one of the kids is gonna be forever alone. That's just an unfortunate fact. Gerome will just have to sit it out, which is unfortunate. In that case, give Henry to Brady I guess, since Gerome's not going to be doing anything?
Lucina can certainly run Dark Flier, but Sniper x Sage is still pretty good too, and Sumia!Lucina is fast enough that she hits 69 Speed (doubling up to Helswath Berserkers) with a Sage partner.
If you want to run Dark Flier Lucina, I'd honestly recommend giving her Brady and giving Laurent to Noire, since Noire's performance as the Support is going to be worse due to lacking Tomefaire.
Everything else is great :D
With regards to the Wyvern Lord x Berserker thing, it's because Wyvern Lords have lower SPD caps, so the extra +8 SPD granted by Berserkers is pretty handy, and the damage output is insane thanks to Berserkers' +10 STR and both class' high STR caps.
Assuming Severa is running AS+2, she'll hit 75 Speed (43 base + 2 (AS+2) + 10 (Limit Breaker) + 10 (rallies) + 2 (tonics) + 8 (Pair Up) = 75), allowing her to double everything in Apotheosis. DS% will be a little low, but realistically you still kill most things even if you whiff one.
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FeMU x Virion (Sue me) for speed/skill mods and he really won't be needed elsewhere
FeMU x Virion actually isn't a bad choice due to his base classes & mods. He's one of the better 1st gen Males for Apotheosis thanks to having 2 of the best -faires and Hit+20. If you're OK going Magical, +Mag/-Def are good for both FeMU & Virion @Sage, and allows Morgan to do.
Alternatively +Spd is solid if you want Morgan to be very fast, allowing him to run a variety of different classes.
Libra x Olivia (OMG I LOVE INIGO'S HAIR IN THIS PAIRING) Dread Fighter or Sage
Lon'qu x Cordelia - I have no idea what to do with this pairing but I just know it's good
Gaius x Sully - either paladin or Wyvern Lord
Donnel x Tharja -Probably sniper?
Gregor x Miriel - Sorc or Sage!Laurent
I don't know where to go with Brady but I know he's pretty good already so eh
Libra!Inigo can run physical if you want as well; his Str mod is still positive and just 1 less than his Mag. I'd recommend Sage for the damage output though, since you won't have room for 2 -faires and will just use Tomes for the most part anyways.
Lon'qu!Cordelia, as OwnagePuffs mentioned, mainly uses her incredible Speed mod to run Wyvern Lord with AS+2 and a Berserker Pair Up and still hit 75 Speed, or Hero with AS+2 to hit 75 Speed with any 0 Speed Pair Up.
As for Gaius!Kjelle, she can run the same set as Lon'qu!Severa with Wyvern Lord (requires AS+2), or can achieve 75 Speed without the AS+2 as Paladin, but still requires the Berserker Pair Up. Paladin is lower damage, but is nice for the +2 Spd Pair Up bonuses if you're running her with a Galeforce partner.
Donnel!Noire is kind of slow, so keep in mind she'll only hit 41 Speed as a Sniper. It's certainly still great (Galeforce, and you can go Armsthrift Sniper with Double Bow and other shenanigans), but you'll have to settle for a +Spd Pair Up without hitting 75 Speed, which is certainly still fine.
I'd recommend just running Sage with Laurent. Sage's superior offensive stat caps generally outweigh dark magic access. If you want to run VVDS+ with Lucina, Sage''s lower defense make it easier to set up (though if that's the case Lucina probably wouldn't be running Sniper).
Brady will just take whoever is leftover, this is kind of where marrying Virion bites you in the butt :P Kellam is prolly his best option left
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Keeping in mind that my FeMU is +Def -Lck and I very much don't want to give Chrom the avatar, where should her classes go? Since it's all a matter of mods, is there anything that even wants defense?
For Apotheosis, nope. Defense isn't that useful unfortunately, given how hard the enemies hit and how much offense is emphasized over defense. Tanking is certainly doable, but in general your goal is killing enemies in a single turn rather than fighting it out over multiple.
FeMU will want to marry 2nd gen if not with Chrom. I have no clue who you'd want to give her to, but probably someone with a nice Speed modifier to make up for MU's poor one.
Going with the assumption that I were to optimize for Nah and by extension Morgan from the start of a run, which would be the best asset and flaw to take? As a defensive character is it best to accentuate that, or mitigate the weaknesses in offense and speed as much as possible? With MaMU added to the list of fathers capable of proxy passing pegasus knight through fighter(?) class conversion you can round out all 3 that would need a specific father for GF.
It's hard to wrap my head around it all without a solid end goal, really. Trying to optimize for Apo. without even having the DLC yet (lel) is tricky. Kind of feeling like the powerful magic units would support as sages or DF, physical units as Berserkers, with rallies and staffers for movement and Sniper pairs for tricky enemies. Which child in which roles is a toughie, because a lot of them can do a lot of things. Offensive child core seems obvious, with any males that can't get GF getting aggressor and sitting in the back.
That means that pairs that maximize classes might be more important in the long run than mods, unless a child has everything already (Cynthia/Brady) and only needs maybe one thing to be optimal for a specific role. With Donnel!Kjelle, MaMU!Nah, and Gaius!Noire I can get three extra GF users, but at the cost of somewhat iffy mods on Kjelle. I guess I'll have to give it another look over.
Going for MU X Nowi is fine, since it turns Nah (arguably the worst child for Apotheosis) into a great one by virtue of MU's classes. As I stated above, Defense is mostly worthless, so unfortunately you're going to want to go +Speed Asset to patch up Morgan & Nah's otherwise bad Speed modifiers. +Mag is an option, but they'd be limited to Valkyrie (Dark Flier misses out on 69 Speed threshold with Sages).
You honestly don't really need an end goal, at least for me personally. I usually have in mind a few new pairings that I want to try, then I theorycraft the rest and do it. Knowing the cookie-cutter builds (i.e. DF x Sage, Sniper x Berserker, Males with Aggressor + -faire, etc.) helps make this process easier.
And yes, classes >> mods. Keep in mind though that Speed mods are somewhat important, and that you don't need to run every child, since you need the space for Chrom, rallybots, staffbots, etc.
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Well, the pairings you have (save Stahl x Sully) are actually fantastic so far. Ricken X Lissa, Sumia X Chrom, Lon'qu X Cordelia and Donnel X Nowi are actually, respectively, some of the best in the game in their own ways. You could have done far, FAR worse -- trust me.
These are fine for the most part, BUT Nowi X Donnel is pretty poor in terms of Apotheosis. Despite having Galeforce, Nah has no offensive procs and a terrible Speed modifier, which makes her basically the worst Galeforce user in the entire game.
I might also recommend Frederick or Vaike X Cherche (take your pick) for a good physical support Gerome, as well as Henry X Maribelle to get Brady the Sorcerer class.
Gerome wants +Hit skills, since his optimal role is as a dedicated Support unit. Frederick only gives him active skills like PavGis & Luna, which are cool but won't be used if Gerome's being used in Apotheosis. Vaike gives him a godly Strength modifier, but no +Hit skills. The extra Strength ends up being mostly superfluous after factoring in Limit Breaker, Aggressor, etc.
Henry X Gerome would actually be preferable in this case for the Dark Mage auras, since Brady's fine with anyone who doesn't kill his mods.
Sage > Sorcerer for Apotheosis. The extra defensive stats are pretty useless and actually make Vantage-Vengeance harder to set up, if that's your goal. Vengeance access for Brady is nice though.
Panne can go with anyone because Yarne is unsalvageable. Honestly, just take your pick from those remaining -- it won't save him, anyway.
Endgame, is that you ?
Anyways, Yarne's definitely not useless, since his mods are superior to Gerome's for the most part, so physical hard Support.
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There's nothing that's 100% necessary. If you have a pair that you like for some other reason than gameplay, we can make it work.
Yeah just to clarify, Chrom X Olivia is still great, as are Cynthia X Henry. You can definitely use them, I like running different pairings to prevent the game from getting stale.
I was just trying to highlight why Chrom X Sumia is so good.
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One of my favorite pairings is HenryXSumia, and I understand ChromXOlivia is good. Is dual aether good enough to forsake both of those pairs?
Henry x Sumia is solid, but loses out on the Sniper & Paladin flexibility that Chrom offers in addition to Aether. All she really gets out of the deal is Hexathema and a slightly better Mag mod, which is certainly still an improvement.
Chrom x Olivia is good for Chrom!Inigo, but Olivia!Lucina basically gets Swordfaire, Assassin, and lower Speed mods compared to Sumia!Lucina. Those Speed mods make a difference when it comes to classes like Sniper, Paladin, etc.
Sumia!Lucina & Chrom!Cynthia are just incredibly flexible and great in almost any of their relevant Apotheosis classes, so it's easy to work them into any pairing they might be needed. Need a Dark Flier for a Sage? You got it. Need a solid Lead Sniper? Also great. Need a Paladin for a double Galeforce pair? Go for it.
Chrom x Sumia also takes advantage of Chrom as the best 1st gen Male outside of possibly Avatar. Dual Strike+, in conjunction with Bowfaire & Aggressor, is really just that good. Olivia's utility as a Dancer is squandered if you use her in an offensive pair, and her lack of proc is unfortunate as well.
Basically Chrom x Sumia 2gud
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Most of Apo's really dangerous bosses have 2 range and low Res, so a Sniper lets you hit them from out of their range (Longbows) and the Sage support hits their weak Res without hitting Aegis+ for massive damage.
Weapon uses generally aren't a problem since you can carry five of them (100 Celica's Gale uses? You won't burn through that in a hurry) and can restock from Chrom whenever you want. Honestly AT is more of a convenience (so you don't have to go get a ton of new weapons after every clear) than it is a necessity to keep from getting stuck.
Keep in mind that Avatar isn't going to have an S support with Cordelia (that 10 DS makes a really big difference), and that Ignis does nothing in the back.
So I've altered my team for apotheosis based on what Czar and Thwomp King said.
Awww jeez, the THWOMP thing feels like a distant memory.
Might run FE6 sometime (already did the stat calcs for it) if I can muster the willpower & time to do it, but my current summer student job is pretty draining due to the long-ass hours
~I switched Gregor with Severa because I just would like it better and it would help a lot. Severa is the daughter of Vaike, she's a hero, and has skills (LB, GF, AT, Luna, and Axefaire).
~I switched Vaike with my avatar (+speed -luck). He's going with Cordelia and he's a dread fighter with LB, ignis, AT, Aggressor, and probably AS+2.
Vaike!Severa is fine running those skills. It's worthwhile to consider Hex over Armsthrift to buff both Severa's & Yarne's Hit for consistency purposes, but AT is fine if you're lazy like I am :)
As for the Cordelia x Vaike pairing, I'd recommend just running Vaike. The 10% drop in Dual Strike chance is very considerable.
Alright, now the questions. They all deal with Owain, Laurent, Brady, and Noire.
~Would you mind explaining Sniper x Sage? I mean don't me wrong, I love the idea (snipers are one of my favorite classes), but can you just explain why it's better than Dark Flier or Falcoknight?
~I'm kinda nervous about weapon uses for Owain, Brady and Laurent. Celica's Gale doesn't have many uses and I'm shaky about running out during the level. Would sorcerer be a better idea for waste with 30 uses? I feel like it would be but I don't know.
TBH, I'm not 100% convinced that Snipers > Dark Fliers, since the additional mobility and use of Magic is pretty hefty advantages in Dark Fliers' favour. Longbows are convenient for avoiding Counter/counterattack damage, but stuff like Helswath Berserkers won't 1HKO (though you are forced to heal due to being at <10 HP), and Nightmare Sniper can be killed at 1-range. Not to mention that they won't necessarily kill against the beefier opponents.
They're certainly better than Falcon Knights with Sages though, since Falco's don't have 2-3 range access, lower damage output, and suffer WTD.
Celica's Gale should have no problems in terms of durability. Waste is way more inaccurate and a LOT less consistent, and Sages > Sorcerers for the additional Speed, Skill, & Magic. Staff access is neat too.
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Remember how I said I would never, ever, come back here? I LIED
So, apotheosis team is all up in here. Just want to see if I'm doing this right (YES I AM USING THE OLD META SUE ME I LIKE IT AND I JUST WANT TO BEAT THE LEVEL NOT ABSOLUTELY MAKE A JOKE OUT OF IT)
So a couple things.
-Most builds are pretty standard
-I'm thinking about changing one of my dark fliers to a falcon knight for extra staves, should I, and if so, which one?
-The two berserkers together are just a funny thing I'd like to try because Gregor and Yarne are two of my favorite characters, so I'd like to keep them there, but if they completely ruin my team, I'd be willing to do something about them.
-Everyone except for Gregor/Yarne is paired to their spouse; Yarne's spouse is Vaike!Severa
-Again, I'm not going for crushing the level until it never sees the light of day, I'm going for simply beating it without having the worst challenge of my life
-Because of this, I'm mostly looking for skill and class advice because I can never seem to decide what to do about those
So that's all I have to say (I think), so please if you have time look over my builds and help a guy out
Well, if you're using Limit Breaker & forged Braves, then Apotheosis IS gonna be a joke unless you make a terrible misplay :P
As Czar touched upon, most VV setups you see involve DS+ (i.e. Chrom or Lucina) to guarantee 100% DS. Magical pairs usually have ~94-95% DS, so there's a real chance of whiffing on a Dual Strike or two and ending up getting hit, which will be death if you're low enough HP to abuse Vengeance.
Vaike!Severa & Gregor!Yarne as a pair is SOOO much better than having Yarne paired with Gregor, which will have pretty terrible DS% chance and poor mobility due to 6 Mov & no Galeforce.
I'd also MAYBE recommend dropping a pair for more Staffbots, since right now you have 1 (Lissa) + Olivia. Lissa's not that great due to lacking Dark Mage auras, but she'll do if you're too lazy to Logbook abuse & train up a Spotpass character.
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I'm almost through the main story for my 2nd Lunatic playthrough and am looking for a good father for Noire for postgame/DLC. Because I am undecided on whether I should make her a sniper/bow knight or a sorceror, I'd like input on who the best father is for either role. So far, the fathers that have been taken are:
Donnel
Gregor
Vaike
Stahl
Frederick
Henry (not married; planning to pair w/ Cherche)
Note that Sorcerer isn't that good for Apotheosis specifically; since offense is so much more important than defense, Sage is superior in every practical way (even at running Vantage-Vengeance).
Anyways, out of the fathers still available:
- Gaius: Great mods & Galeforce, even Vantage if you want to run VV. Noire doesn't really need much else (Tomefaire would be nice :P), he's by far your best option.
- Libra / Ricken / Virion: All 3 grant Tomefaire and good magical mods, and that's pretty much it. Ricken & Virion are both very popular fathers, so keep this in mind for your other pairings.
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Kellam!Inigo is also not too shabby in a vacuum.
This. That +0 Spd mod is pretty sad, but he can still run generic Maleforce Sage (Galeforce, Agg, TF, Luna) and hit 69 Speed with a Dark Flier / Valk Pair Up, or Swordfaire Assassin if he's going physical.
Also, just as a reminder, do -breakers work as a Support? I feel like I've asked this before, but I don't remember and haven't really used any breakers on my units since.
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Quickly looking over, Ricken!Inigo and Lon'qu!Brady will perform well so two of your Galeboys are solid. On the female side you've got Noire as a very strong AT Double Bow user with decent Spd and no GF, so if you pair the Galeboys with her and Morgan you'll have a team of 4 pairs. Cynthia is also around, and you've got a decently strong Yarne who can support her (or support Morgan so Cynthia can have Inigo, maybe). Yarne's SF Assassin will be strong and a possible 100% DS candidate, and his Berserker is still good. Since you want at least one more, Severa should be serviceable, hitting 69 Spd as a Dark Flier with a Dread Fighter support and no All+2 (she needs All+2 to hit it with a Sage support, which is a testament to Kellam's slowness), and having Luna/Tomefaire to back it up. She does have room for All+2 if you want it, though. Marrying her, your best bet is Laurent, who still makes a good Sage with Stahl on him. If you want to go DF instead, he's got a neutral Str mod and both Swordfaire and Axefaire, so he won't smell at it too badly.
I... Don't really want to use more than that, unless you were to bring DF Cordelia and Sage Kellam in as a parent pair (they'll be stronger than any of the remaining children, and actually stronger than Severa too (DF 69 Spd with no All+2 and a Sage support)...). You're out of Galegirls and the only Galeboy left is Owain, who has no proc and would be pretty weak. Maybe he could make something work with GK Nah... Maybe... Nope, she's got no physical Faires.
Interesting. My pairings wound up being:
PAIR 1
Sumia @Dark Flier [Galeforce | Tomefaire | Luna | AS+2]
Chrom @Bow Knight [Dual Strike+ | Aggressor | Bowfaire | Hit+20]
100% DS, 75 Speed
PAIR 2
Sumia!Lucina @Dark Flier [Galeforce | Dual Strike+ | Luna | Aether]
Avatar(+Mag) @Sage [Aggressor | Tomefaire | Hit+20 | Anathema]
100% DS, 69 Speed
PAIR 3
Sumia!Lucina!Morgan @Valkyrie [Galeforce | Tomefaire | Ignis | Aether]
Lon’qu!Brady @Sage [Galeforce | Aggressor | Tomefaire | Luna]
75 Speed both ways
PAIR 4
Chrom!Cynthia @Dark Flier [Galeforce | Tomefaire | Luna | Aether]
Stahl!Laurent @Sage [Aggressor | Tomefaire | Hit+20 | Anathema]
PAIR 5
Kellam!Severa @Falcon Knight [Galeforce | Lancefaire | Luna | Hex]
Gregor!Owain @Berserker [Dual Support+ | Aggressor | Axefaire | AS+2] *yep, no Galeforce
75 Speed
PAIR 6
Vaike!Noire @Sniper [AS+2 | Bowfaire | Luna | Armsthrift]
Ricken!Inigo @Sage [Galeforce | Aggressor | Tomefaire | Luna]
69 Speed both ways
PAIR 7
Virion!Kjelle @Sniper [AS+2 | Luna | Astra | Bowfaire]
Gaius!Yarne @Assassin [AS+2 | Aggressor | Swordfaire | Lancebreaker / Str+2]
100% DS, 75 Speed
The Kjelle X Yarne thing is pretty gimmicky as a non-GF 100% DS pairing. Your pairings are probably more efficient, especially since I'm incorporating a non-GF Owain :P
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So, this thread has been inactive for a while, and I've been sitting bored out of my mind at my current place of work (menial scanning & faxing for a student summer job).
I decided to do an RNG pairing run for theorycrafting just for fun. I'm looking for feedback on class selection & child pairing suggestions based on these pairings :)
I decided to make things easier for myself (at least for this first attempt) and have Male Avatar marry Sumia!Lucina, meaning Sumia!Lucina & Chrom!Cynthia are already set in stone.
My RNG'd pairings ended up looking like this:
- Chrom X Sumia
- MU X Lucina
- Cherche X Donnel
- Panne X Gaius
- Tharja X Vaike
- Cordelia X Kellam
- Nowi X Frederick
- Maribelle X Lon'qu
- Sully X Virion
- Miriel X Stahl
- Olivia X Ricken
- Lissa X Gregor
Unused: Henry, Libra
Basically I just RNG'd the child order excluding Lucina, Cynthia, & Morgan, then RNG'd their fathers one by one. And it wound up to be spectacularly terrible imo :P
Note that MU's Asset is still up in the air as well. I'd be looking for around ~6 pairings assuming that Chrom x Sumia will be used in Apotheosis.
I already have some ideas of class selection & pairings in mind, but looking for some suggestions! And to get this thread theorycrafting again :)
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Assuming Lucina takes 2 battles in the front and 1 in the back per turn and is always using braves, Aether still provides a greater increase in total average damage than Bowfaire (even though it can't proc in the back). It's always worth it to use Aether over a Faire unless Lucina is hard supporting a VV Avatar for a challenge run.
Oh does it? I didn't know that :\
Good to know then, sorry for the misinformation.
I'm currently running a MU(+Mag)!Lucina @Dark Flier x Virion!Laurent @Sage, and according to my calcs nothing in S.Apo survives them in spite of Lucina failing to double Anna and the Nightmare Snipers, which is pretty ludicrous.
So I'm just running TF & Deliverer (or Armsthrift if I'm lazy) in place of Luna-Aether procstack.
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Sumia!Lucina @ Sniper (GF/Aether/Luna/Bowfaire/LB)
Ricken!Owain!Morgan @ Sage (GF/Ignis/Aggressor/Tomefaire/LB)
Lucina wants DS+. 100% DS is great for consistency, and with Ricken!Owain!Morgan in the back with Agg+TF, you're basically guaranteed kills while Lucina is in the front.
You'll want to replace Aether for consistency, but replacing BF is an option too if you really wanna procstack (though her damage in the back role will be somewhat lacking).
Gaius!Kjelle @ Paladin (GF/Luna/Astra/Swordfaire or Lancefaire/LB)
Henry!Gerome @ Berserker (Axefaire/Hex or Dual Support +/Anathema/Aggressor/LB)
(May switch Gerome and Yarne around)
Virion!Severa @ Wyvern Lord (GF/Vengeance/Lancefaire/All Stats +2/LB)
Stahl!Yarne @ Berserker (Axefaire/Hit+20/Aggressor/LB/?) All Stats +2 maybe?
Gregor!Noire @ Sniper (Bowfaire/Anathema/Luna/Astra/LB) or (Bowfaire/Anathema/Vengeance/Armsthrift/LB)
Libra!Inigo @ Berserker (GF/Vengeance/Aggressor/Axefaire/LB)
I'll have to dabble with both Noire set ups and see which I Iike better.
Gerome will want Hex, and Yarne would just use AS+2. Hex & Anathema will push Gerome up to 243 hit, which grants 100% Hit on Anna amongst others, while Yarne just runs AS+2 for lack of anything better.
Kjelle & Severa both have the same Skill thanks to Severa's AS+2, so the only difference is that whichever pairing has Yarne will have 1% more DS chance, while Gerome grants a massive (but unnecessary) +25 Hit.
As for Noire, go ahead and dabble. I like the Vengeance set simply because it allows for Double Bow shenanigans that she wouldn't otherwise get with Gaius as her father for instance, but it's really personal preference.
One of these days I'll figure out how to do the Spoiler tag. Any other suggestions or glaring flaws to point out?
http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?app=forums&module=extras§ion=legends&do=bbcode
But looks good, you'll breeze through Apotheosis barring any terrible misplays :P
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Hmm, these are definitely some things to think about. As I stated, I'm leaning towards making Noire a Sniper, just not sure which skill set I should run. Severa and Kjelle should both hit 75 speed, so Noire hitting it is not a necessity for me. I would like her to reach the second speed threshold, though (which is what- 69 for Thronie?)
Yep it's 69, Noire is hitting that no problem with any +Speed pair up.
I never thought of making Inigo a Berserker. His skill set is pretty much set with the standard, so I'd have to make sure to add room for Hex or Anathema (is one better than the other?) on Noire. One thing though- if Inigo is going to need to be physical, would Frederick serve him better? I can easily swap out Libra for Frederick, since all the latter is doing is fathering a benched Nah so I can get the supports.
Well, in my case Morgan's wife will be Sumia!Lucina @ Sniper, for dual strike shenanigans at longbow/double bow range. With the +3 Strength pair up, that should make Morgan's Strength 56. And as I just realized, putting Ignis on Morgan means that Strength pair up bonus will not go to waste. Ignis it is, then.
You'd probably run Anathema, since Noire won't benefit at all from Hex as a Sniper.
As for the Libra!Inigo vs. Fred!Inigo thing, there's a few major differences:
- Libra!Inigo has 2 more speed than Fred!Inigo, which makes a difference in classes with mid-low speed. In this instance, Fred!Inigo & Libra!Inigo @Berserker both hit the 69 Speed threshold for Helswath Berserkers with Noire @Sniper (Fred!Inigo hits 69 Spd, Libra!Inigo hits 71). BUT, if Inigo @Hero, then Fred!Inigo only hits 67 Speed, while Libra!Inigo hits 69.
- Vengeance vs. Luna, Vengeance results in overall higher damage output but requires some setup & calculations. This is mostly personal preference.
- Since Noire @ Sniper needs a +Spd Pair Up to hit 69 Spd, the only relevant class Fred!Inigo has over Libra!Inigo is Paladin. Note that Fred!Inigo only hits 65 Speed as a Paladin though.
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Ignis will typically outdamage Luna in Apo. You'll probably have around 55 Str, which is more than almost everything's Res.
Whoops wow I fail at math (or forgot to add one of the 10s from LB or rally).
I'll edit my prior post to double check, but Ricken!Owain!Morgan (+Mag) @Sage has 53 Str assuming he has a +0 Str Pair Up (i.e. Dark Flier).
30 (base) - 2 (mod) + 10 (LB) + 10 (rally) + 2 (tonic) + 3 (Pair Up) = 53 total Strength
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Hello, I would like to know the optimal father for Yarne. I want to have my MU marry him and I am planning for her to be +Strength and -Defence. Which father would be best for Yarne in this scenario?
Stahl & Virion are considered two of the most popular fathers for him, since they give him access to Archer and great physical mods overall.
Libra & Henry are other options for their +Hit Dark Mage aura skills, but their mods aren't the most compatible, particularly Libra's. Henry is in fairly high demand as well.
Lon'qu's mods are arguably better (higher Skill & Speed) but Yarne doesn't get anything noteworthy from Lon'qu class-wise.
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How is it poor? With stat boost from dragonstone ignis would add a lot of damage, and with sol, vantage will either hit massive damage or heal armsthrift because I hate rebuying and reforging and galeforce is a second attack how is that crappy?
So your saying to make it work I have to marry nowi to avatar?
...but you don't get to choose which you want, Sol or Ignis. Sol > Ignis in terms of skill activation priority, meaning a lot of the time you will heal unnecessarily, or you can get unlucky and miss a crucial heal and die. Not to mention that Armsthrift is worthless since you can't forge Dragonstones at all, so it's literally only for a tiny bit of convenience.
In terms of ingame stuff, it's impractical to get all these skills without excessive grinding, which is why Czar is suggesting you just run through Tactician --> Mercenary.
In terms of Apotheosis, Manakete damage output will always be inferior to practically every other unit outside of Taguels simply because they lack Brave weapons. Manaketes are definitely the 2nd worst class after Taguel for this reason. Dragonstone / Beaststone stat boost does not even come close to making up for attacking half as many times, and their stat caps are generally inferior to boot.
If you're just doing this for postgame stomping with excessive grinding, then you're really at liberty to run whatever you want. Manaketes are cool and all, but they're simply not that good unless you're gonna run them for fun, in which case it's all opinion and we can't really help.
And yes, no other father will give Nah access to all the skills you want.
The Pairing Thread
in Fire Emblem: Awakening
Posted · Edited by burgerkong
Kellam!Nah's pretty bad due to the crappy Speed mod, which is insufficient to run General very well (not to mention a lack of either -faire).
Libra!Nah would be better, but still pretty meh (run as a Sage I guess with Vengeance & Dark Mage auras?). I'd consider just ditching her if she doesn't have any other quality father options available, but she's certainly still usable.
Well in that case run whatever you want. If you're not doing Apotheosis challenge runs then you can run whatever you want, though "speedrunning" (LTC is probably what you mean) will generally involve Galeforce and access to high-mobility classes & skills.