About Lilina

[Mekkah]

No, 20/20 is absolutely worthless. Again, the statement I was making with this topic was that Lilina is garbage in HM ranked. That means no abuse of any kind. 20/20 units shouldn't fight in ranked due to EXP rank issues, and 20/20 units shouldn't really exist anyway or you prolly failed EXP rank.

[Seph]

Oh, I didn't realise that. Yes, in HM ranked, Lilina is garbage, since she will never reach 20/20. I did mention it here, perhaps you should read it:

But in a ranked run, I would agree that 20/15 is the best way, but there is too much of a little difference with 20/20 so that can be used anyway.

For characters in general.. Lilina will like 20/10.

Edited December 14, 2008 by Julius

[Reikken]

Anima is really accurate, so skill isn't that much of a problem.

The main thing that kills her is speed.

It's accurate, but bosses have so much avoid that you need more than just an accurate weapon.

[Dr. Tarrasque]

It's accurate, but bosses have so much avoid that you need more than just an accurate weapon.

He's right.

Skip to 5:42.

Take note that this is Lugh (better SKL than Lilina) AND that he's got weapon triangle advantage on this boss.

[Reikken]

Gel does have massive spd, so he's not like other bosses, but his tile he's on has avoid on the low end (20 instead of 30).

Edited December 14, 2008 by Reikken

[Seph]

It's accurate, but bosses have so much avoid that you need more than just an accurate weapon.

You're right on that, but you are mistaken overall.

Bosses don't matter compared to normal enemies.

Normal enemies are much, much more common than bosses therefore, they are more important. What matters is hitting the normal enemies.

http://serenesforest.net/fe6/boss_stat.html

Most of the bosses are ones with classes which have little ability to dodge (I know those are normal mode but when I look at it, most are things like Bandits, Generals, Druids and Shamans). She can hit every single General, Mamkute, Bandit, Wyvern Lord, Druid and so on.

I have already shown that Lilina's hit has little difference with someone like Rutger's.

Efficiency is usually connected deeply with killing normal enemies.. boss slaying is not as important.

Edited December 15, 2008 by Julius

[Reikken]

Actually:

Lugh: Boss Slayer

Lilina: Boss Slay- oh, wait, she missed!

Anima is really accurate, so skill isn't that much of a problem.

The main thing that kills her is speed.

[Seph]

Um, I was talking about Lilina in general.

You can see that here:

The main thing that kills her is speed.

That's kind of stupid to say as a boss slayer, because Lilina can attack from a distance.

Edited December 15, 2008 by Julius

[Reikken]

....wtf? What does speed have to do with attacking from a distance?

Anyway, so you were not talking about bosses? Then lolwut @ quoting someone and then talking about something completely different, not even addressing the quote at all. That makes perfect sense.

[Seph]

....wtf? What does speed have to do with attacking from a distance?

I'm surprised you weren't able to figure it out, it's actually quite simple, at least in my opinion.

When attacking from a distance, you won't get hit by the boss (they usually carry two weapons and one is close range) so you don't have to worry about evading.

Anyway, so you were not talking about bosses? Then lolwut @ quoting someone and then talking about something completely different, not even addressing the quote at all. That makes perfect sense.

Talking about something completely different? I said IN GENERAL. That means everything, including boss slaying. Completely different my foot.

[Lord Raven]

Speed is even more about how fast you attack than how much you evade. lol

[Seph]

Speed is even more about how fast you attack than how much you evade. lol

What I said nevertheless had roots in speed so I don't see the problem since I was able to answer in a clear manner.

You have other boss slayers anyway so not doubling shouldn't be too much of a problem. And besides Lilina may be doubling the Generals and so on.

Edited December 15, 2008 by Julius

[Rei Rei]

Well, what Lilina is bad, Lugh is good, and what Lilina is good, Lugh is bad, most of the times.

Use them both in Normal Mode, but stick with Lugh in Hard Mode.

[Zeldafreak007]

Well, what Lilina is bad, Lugh is good, and what Lilina is good, Lugh is bad, most of the times.

Use them both in Normal Mode, but stick with Lugh in Hard Mode.

With all due respect, THIS.

[Mekkah]

Even on Normal Mode, I'd rather use neither or just Lugh.

[Reikken]

Indeed. Everyone sucks less on normal mode than on hard, but Lilina is still worse than most of the other character options.

[PuffPuff]

As the game goes on, she doubles some Knights and Mamkutes and all, but pretty much little else. She has to wait for 16x to promote, since promo items are scarce and everyone and their mom wants a Guiding Ring (there's two of them before this, and there's Lugh, Ellen, Saul, Clarine, perhaps even Ray who want one). Her defensive parameters stay rock bottom - her Avo becomes okay, but never reliable (bleh Spd + okay luck + 15 avo from A Gonzales/C Roy = bleh), she still gets 2HKOed by everything, still gets doubled by fast stuff such as Myrmidons, etc.

More of a hinder than a help to me.

That's your problem. That is why that you get a crappy Lilina. You promote her too late. Give her the first Guidence Ring and you will get more time to catch her up.

I've tried Lilina in a rank run but she pisses all over it.

She's alright in unranked, and I try to go for her A support with Roy.

Yes..I admit. By babying her..she will rape your tactics ranking.

I liked using her in my first run, but I must admit she's pretty bad as a unit. Her massive magic is good with staves, though.

Yes, she only needs a Heal staff to be a good enough healer.

I find she is pretty awful early game, but the best sage late-game. I used both Lugh and Lilina last PT.

Lugh was doing great in the first chapters, taking out hordes of enemies and DA'ing everybody. His magic and resistence however are sub-par for a mage. Res is important in this game because of all the enemy stave users, and his magic, while fine for most units, wasn't doing much against the tougher bosses. Lilina however, eventually gained enough magic to kill without DA'ing, and was dealing huge damage to the late-game bosses.

Against Zephial, Lugh did a paltry 9 damage, while Lilina did 22, with a 15 crit rate from Roy support. Lilina made my final team, and Lugh didn't. Though Lugh is probably better for longer, Lilina is a massive boon lategame.

Yes..that is why you would want to use her. She can avoid Sleep and Berserk late in the game except in Chapter 22, because the Bishops Magic is capped.

Anima is really accurate, so skill isn't that much of a problem.

The main thing that kills her is speed.

Even though that she averages 20.3 in it when your done levelling her 20/20. This can easily be done by giving her the first Guidence Ring. That's what I do in all of my playthroughs, and that she always turned out great for me. Great in the HM as well..you bet.

I use Lillina in all my ranked runs. ^_^

Though she's mediocre, I really do think Lillina is underrated. She does aid EXP well and is alright after promotion. One-rounding Dragon Masters is pretty decent. ^_^

Ah, someone that is actually making sense here.

Besides, Lilina isn't too hard to baby if you're careful. And I'd think that babying her would be good for your Experience ranking since you're maximizing the amount of experience earned by the people. And also, Roy/Lilina support is one of the fastest supports in the game, and it gives pretty good bonuses as well.

That you should do in a ranked run, yes.

You haven't seen my Lilina, have you?

From Gfaqs:

zeldafreak007

Posted 12/12/2008 7:01:27 AM

message detail Goddammit.

Lilina: 20/20

HP: 41

MAG: 30*

SKL: 22

SPD: 25*

LUK: 30*

DEF: 13

RES: 25*

Lugh: 20/20 *Cries*

HP: 37

MAG: 18 WTF

SKL: 23

SPD: 24

LUK: 17

DEF: 10

RES: 21

Hugh: 20/20

HP: 49

MAG: 22

SKL: 20

SPD: 22

LUCK: 18

DEF: 17

RES: 21

Now you guys see?

---

Lyn, meanwhile, should have been able to use the bow of crapitude from the land of the grass rats. ~Lu Aza

Uh huh. That is why that you should use her. Your Lilina got blessed, but mine always had around 18-20 speed in the end.

But even with Live/Heal, Lilina can heals decently. That 30 MGC of her is overkill for healing you know.

Unless you are thinking to use her as STAFF user instead (like for Sleep/Silence/etc.).

She can use it across the screen. That is if you put her Rod level to B. It can easily be done in a ranked run..that is if you promote her first. You should be able to get her Rod level that high by Chapter 21 in a ranked run.

kthx

It's just that Lugh can't kill a damn Mamkute without Aircalibur or Forblaze that pisses me off.

Yes..that is one of the reasons why that he is trash. He can't damage anything until at the point in the game that you are just ready to finish it. He averages at 23.2 in Mag at 20/20. But even at 20/10 it is only at 19.2 upon average. Lilina would have already maxed out in Mag upon average by 20/10.

Oh, I didn't realise that. Yes, in HM ranked, Lilina is garbage, since she will never reach 20/20. I did mention it here, perhaps you should read it:

For characters in general.. Lilina will like 20/10.

She will get that high..that is if you give her the first Guidence Ring..plz you can possibly promote her by the end of Chapter 12X.

[Dr. Tarrasque]

1. That's your problem. That is why that you get a crappy Lilina. You promote her too late. Give her the first Guidence Ring and you will get more time to catch her up.

2. Yes, she only needs a Heal staff to be a good enough healer.

3. Yes..that is why you would want to use her. She can avoid Sleep and Berserk late in the game except in Chapter 22, because the Bishops Magic is capped.

4. Even though that she averages 20.3 in it when your done levelling her 20/20. This can easily be done by giving her the first Guidence Ring. That's what I do in all of my playthroughs, and that she always turned out great for me. Great in the HM as well..you bet.

5. Ah, someone that is actually making sense here.

6. That you should do in a ranked run, yes.

7. Uh huh. That is why that you should use her. Your Lilina got blessed, but mine always had around 18-20 speed in the end.

She can use it across the screen. That is if you put her Rod level to B. It can easily be done in a ranked run..that is if you promote her first. You should be able to get her Rod level that high by Chapter 21 in a ranked run.

8. Yes..that is one of the reasons why that he is trash. He can't damage anything until at the point in the game that you are just ready to finish it. He averages at 23.2 in Mag at 20/20. But even at 20/10 it is only at 19.2 upon average. Lilina would have already maxed out in Mag upon average by 20/10.

9. She will get that high..that is if you give her the first Guidence Ring..plz you can possibly promote her by the end of Chapter 12X.

1. Promoting her earlier means a crappier Lilina since she'll end with less speed when she'll need it -_-

2. Valid. She does heal the most with a regular staff and her range would be quite huge with the status staves... good luck reaching that without arena abuse though.

3. That's a stupid reason to, you can easily get around this by just bringing more Restore staff users and that won't do much against you since your other units will still manage to score great EXP anyway.

4. The first guiding ring should not go to Lilina. She comes too late for it and other people want it too. By the time you get Lilina to 20/0, you should have a second guiding ring, assuming your playing normally and not arena abusing.

5. In FE7 maybe but not in FE6. EXP rank is nothing difficult, I've A ranked that thing without trying on every playthrough of mine. FYI, Lugh easily 1-rounds Dragon Masters and can take on a large number of them in chapter 21 with good use of the terrain. Lilina can't since her avoid and durability are lower. She can deal lots of damage true but it's better to use some1 you can just send to fight a group of enemies without worry.

6. Again, no1 needs babying to help your EXP rank, it's easy to rank it without even trying. If you're babying Lilina early, you're making her leech EXP from your other units and that could hurt your combat rank later.

7. That goes for just about any character >_>. If Ray got blessed like that all the time, I'd use him without question. If Sorcerer Caesar in FEDS always ended up better than Merric, I'd use him too.

8. Lugh's damage output is often better than Lilina's since she can actually double. Lugh more than makes up for his magic stat through better durability and speed than Lilina and a low magic stat isn't as awful as you think. You're mostly attacking RES and that's the stat most enemies are low on so your damage output with Magic will often surpass or tie with physical units (probably not so much in this game though).

9. She'll only reach it if you arena or overuse her. There's no way she'll reach level 20 mage by the end of 12x without having her leach a large sum of EXP.

Edited December 26, 2008 by Levin

[PuffPuff]

1. Promoting her earlier means a crappier Lilina since she'll end with less speed when she'll need it -_-

No, you can have her at LV20 by the end of Chapter 12. But I will admit that she will need alot of handholding in order to get that high in time.

2. Valid. She does heal the most with a regular staff and her range would be quite huge with the status staves... good luck reaching that without arena abuse though.

It can be done. It just won't happen until Chapter 21.

3. That's a stupid reason to, you can easily get around this by just bringing more Restore staff users and that won't do much against you since your other units will still manage to score great EXP anyway.

Well, it can be possible to avoid the status staves with a Barrier Staff on your magic users.

4. The first guiding ring should not go to Lilina. She comes too late for it and other people want it too. By the time you get Lilina to 20/0, you should have a second guiding ring, assuming your playing normally and not arena abusing.

She will need some handholding, but it's possible. ^_^

5. In FE7 maybe but not in FE6. EXP rank is nothing difficult, I've A ranked that thing without trying on every playthrough of mine. FYI, Lugh easily 1-rounds Dragon Masters and can take on a large number of them in chapter 21 with good use of the terrain. Lilina can't since her avoid and durability are lower. She can deal lots of damage true but it's better to use some1 you can just send to fight a group of enemies without worry.

Her high luck & terrain will have her prevail like all of the others.

6. Again, no1 needs babying to help your EXP rank, it's easy to rank it without even trying. If you're babying Lilina early, you're making her leech EXP from your other units and that could hurt your combat rank later.

It can't be helped. She does join underleveled, yes. Lugh may join earlier, but he doesn't grow any magic. He would have to spam with greater tomes to get any good until he grows enough magic. But it's even better for Lilina though.

7. That goes for just about any character >_>. If Ray got blessed like that all the time, I'd use him without question. If Sorcerer Caesar in FEDS always ended up better than Merric, I'd use him too.

^ This.

8. Lugh's damage output is often better than Lilina's since she can actually double. Lugh more than makes up for his magic stat through better durability and speed than Lilina and a low magic stat isn't as awful as you think. You're mostly attacking RES and that's the stat most enemies are low on so your damage output with Magic will often surpass or tie with physical units (probably not so much in this game though).

But he will have trouble in using Physic Staves. He will have less range than Lilina will. Though you can just have someone like Clarine do that job.

9. She'll only reach it if you arena or overuse her. There's no way she'll reach level 20 mage by the end of 12x without having her leach a large sum of EXP.

Yep. She will leech lots of EXP, but she is a character that is worth feeding all of that EXP too. She will become great. In the HM too, you bet.

[Mekkah]

Don't mind Lenneth (Ayanami), we've "debated" Lilina for 2318329 pages before on FEP, but it's pretty obvious he/she just ignores stuff everyone says and goes by own personal experience every time. Obviously Lilina is not reaching L20 before Ch12 unless you neglect everyone else. This thread is about _Lilina in Hard Mode Ranked_.

[PuffPuff]

Don't mind Lenneth (Ayanami), we've "debated" Lilina for 2318329 pages before on FEP, but it's pretty obvious he/she just ignores stuff everyone says and goes by own personal experience every time. Obviously Lilina is not reaching L20 before Ch12 unless you neglect everyone else. This thread is about _Lilina in Hard Mode Ranked_.

Right. She is just as good in the HM. Only that she will take more babying that usual to catch up with the others. If this is about a HM ranked run..then you got me there. She won't hardly be useable without enough protection throughout half of the game or so.

[Mekkah]

She's bad in unranked too. But you don't see that because you spoonfeed and shield Lilina in every damn chapter. You can do that with any character.

[dondon151]

This one playthrough I got Sophia to level 20 2 chapters after she joined.

[Zeldafreak007]

Can we settle it as:

Lilina is fantastic in Normal mode UNRANKED, ok in Ranked. She's good in HM UNRANKED, and not so much in HM ranked.

We good?

And to Dondon, what the hell does that have to do with anything. Sophia's stats are subpar regardless of her being an "Est" character.

Edited December 26, 2008 by Zeldafreak007

[Mekkah]

She's good in HM UNRANKED

She's only good if Wendy, Sophia, Bors, Cath and other such units are considered good. In which case all units are good.