Dr. Tarrasque Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 You see, that is where it baffles me. If I do what you just said, wouldn't I be keeping Julian out, and isn't that a major reason why Rickard is so much lower than him? Julian's position is mostly based on his combat ability. Rickard sucks at combat... BADLY and we all knows this. Those in the underground tier are just that worthless. The same reason you're saying why Rickard shouldn't be used applies to those on the underground tier... but even worse because you're probably better off with generics and you don't get generic thieves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 Julian is actually capable of combat, and is tiered based on that much more than thief utility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tehnikhil Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Ooooooooooooooooh... I had it all wrong for awhile now XD. Thank you for explaining this for me and clearing it up for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candlejack Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Julian is actually a very competent fighter. Better than Navarre, I'd say. 30 Julian with Mercurius is damn good- 30 SPD cap, 25 DEF cap, and 25 SKL caps are nice. That and Thief's luck, he can use Devil Sword. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dat Nick Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 why pother addressing his def cap? He's never going to reach it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 Lol, stat caps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candlejack Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 :D Yeah, spur of the moment thing. At least you could level Julian up to a good level without favoritism and/or babying. Besides, he's 3 points off from his STR cap and reaches everything else at a respectable level... save DEF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dat Nick Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 At least you could level Julian up to a good level without favoritism and/or babying. ....i lol'd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tehnikhil Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Another question that will probably lead to an argument: Why is it that Dolph>Palla/Catria? I mean, I know that Dolph has potential, but from what it seems like, Palla/Catria have super potential. Both are underleveled and come pretty late, but it seems as though Palla/Catria end up as incredibly strong units. They are kinda like Lilina as they are leaning towards being Ninos, but not exactly. Dolph seems a little less useful, but that is just me. Really, I probably won't argue hard since I have never seriously used any of the 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) They all require babying, but Dolph ends up having better "soloability". Better answer: PM Colonel M about it. Edited October 30, 2009 by FE3 Player Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candlejack Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 At least you could level Julian up to a good level without favoritism and/or babying. ....i lol'd At least you get better results than Est. Or every other character below him and POSSIBLY Marth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackbird Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Lol, I ignore the thread for the day, and I miss some random tier sabotage. I think stat caps matter for some classes. For example, Dracoknight, Paladins, and Mages are incapable of doubling Heroes, other Dracos, and Manaketes endgame because the classes in question simply don't have a high enough Speed cap. Any class with a Speed cap lower than 27 gets doubled by Medeus. Shiida's Speed cap might matter, because she's always going to reach it (lol). These are niche scenarios, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 What part of banned suggestion don't you understand, Blackbird? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candlejack Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Mission complete: Get stat caps on banned. Now for Sniper!Arran... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackbird Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 What part of banned suggestion don't you understand, Blackbird? I understand -why- it's banned. It's not a strong argument to value a character based on "how well growths fit caps". I think the heavy-handed approach of banning discussion entirely precludes other areas of useful tier discussion. Maximum stats -are- relevant to endgame play, because numerous enemies cap Spd, and this affects which classes are capable of doubling (and several characters cap Speed no matter what class they are in). Unless you think clearing the latter chapters of the game with Falcoknights or Unpromoted classes is efficient. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 The actual stat matters, not the caps. Putting even the slightest weight on stat caps in a game where it hardly matters will cause people to say stupid things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Chainey, I did prove before that Mage!Shiida has durability issues early on. By C10 anything with around 24 Atk or more is going to KO her. This includes... Armors, definitely. Some Archers hit that high. Cavs definitely. Most promoted units definitely. Yeah, quite an amount. She doesn't really escape this rut until she promotes into a Sage. Then again when I was arguing Oguma up we were tossing Shiida's Wing Spear utility and her Mage class back and forth. Also, stat caps do have a little importance, but not a major one. For example, the DragoKnights missing out on other Dracos, but in return they're still capable of flying and can take more than two Brave shots (well, the vast majority of the good ones that you're using). For Dolph: Hunter->General @ Level 10. Need I say more? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dat Nick Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 The actual stat matters, not the caps. Putting even the slightest weight on stat caps in a game where it hardly matters will cause people to say stupid things. That's not entirely true. Ramming a low stat cap can be a problem [Dracos's 23 AS JUST misses doubling C22 Pegs] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Francis York Morgan Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) I don't really consider class caps a problem for the high tiers. And it's more a problem of even doubling in general for those lower than that. Blackbird only listed class A classes so I'm just refuting these atm. Merric has excalibur. Yawn. I don't think I need to stress how important staves are on 24 so even though he and sheeda don't double or do any damage to the mage wyverns they are still useful. Granted this applies to everyone in class A but were better off bringing along generic bishops/sages than them just for the free staves and not having to waste a promo item for them to continue sucking. Merric has a bit of a speed problem on the final chapter since he is around level 20/15 going into it. That puts him at 22 AS (I chose to round up since it's close enough) with cleric as the route. A speedwing is neccessary but it is only to ensure he doubles those fricking heroes. One enemy type. I doubt it's worth it since excalibur has a decent chance of one rounding and many units are 2 rounding them and taking a ass load of damage in return so he is pulling his weight since he is doing it at a range and can heal as a side note. Caeda can just reclass to sniper for 21/22 and if she can get to B rank by then in bows (just 30 shots) she can easily one round with a silver thanks to her uber speed. It should give her the durability to survive a counter at a range. Brave's no but those forged jav's are a definite yes. Same as merric for 24. Caeda does double the 21 AS heroes though. To bad there is an occasional 22 AS hero. Hardin, Abel, Cain all can reclass to sniper for 21/22 once again just gotta get B ranks and they have good enough speed stats to double. On 24 all 3 can go swordmaster and double with wyrmslayers for the epic win without putting any time whatsoever into swordmaster as a class. This applies on the final chapter of course to. Katua might be able do this thanks to that high speed growth although that depends on her level and weapon ranks for silver bows might be a problem depending on when she promotes. Everyone else in class A has speed problems so it's iffy on who can do this and who can't. Edit: Caeda was assumed as a mage/sage buildup after peg until wingspear runs out. Edited October 30, 2009 by Lancelot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candlejack Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Can we ban Hunter-> General? People use that for everybody. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dat Nick Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 And it's more a problem of even doubling in general for those lower than that. I'm referring to characters who actually do ram the cap, like Shiida/Catria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tehnikhil Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 What is so special about hunter!General? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 I put stat caps under banned suggestions because people have found stupid things to say about them more than people can find relevant things about them. We don't need to go back to GFAQs 2003. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Tarrasque Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 What is so special about hunter!General? It's useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Francis York Morgan Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) And it's more a problem of even doubling in general for those lower than that. I'm referring to characters who actually do ram the cap, like Shiida/Catria. Ramming the cap early is not a problem but a question. If we switched either of them into sniper after they both capped it on chapter 21 as draco's they would jump up to 25 AS and be able to double the 20 AS pegs and have effective might on them. Whether or not the tier player chooses to switch classes to continue leveling that speed stat is the question. Depending on his strategy that map he might prefer flight more instead of blicking easily. And like hell we are gonna ban Hunter!General. Edit: And I completely agree with chainey on stat caps. Edited October 30, 2009 by Lancelot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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