Howcome FE8 has no official tier list?

[Anouleth]

Thieving requires no training. Flier utility does.

Clearly, you've never watched one of dondon's vids.

No, it doesn't. 8 Mov and flying comes with Syrene.

I think you might think that having 8 Mov isn't saying much when your durability is poor...?

Well, if so, Rennac's durability is even worse than Syrene's. And not to mention he has to go through a few enemies before reaching chests.

Syrene is useful from the chapter she begins, and up to the end. She ferries the lords or any other character so they could reach a place faster. Then in Ch 18, flying is really useful since, you have to kill Gorgon Eggs before they hatch.

She's pretty useless in Chapter 19, but you only need like three people for that map.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Anouleth

[Junkhead]

Clearly, you've never watched one of dondon's vids.

She's pretty useless in Chapter 19, but you only need like three people for that map.

That's not even necesary to tell fliers are useful, ha.

Right. It's all based on Warp-skipping, right? But if you want a really fast clear, I think you must make your way through a few enemies at first, since Druid's are no jokes.

And she can be put to some work in Ch 20 and maybe 21. Eirika needs to get to the throne fast.

[Thor Odinson]

She's pretty useless in Chapter 19, but you only need like three people for that map.

Two, actually. Seth and Eirika.

Though this was on my SethEi run, so replace Eirika with someone with 7-8 move, and is better trained than her and it should do as well.

Mind, Seth got the Leg ring(FFF FE4) Swiftsole in that one.

Might go down to one after I see how my Sethsolo goes.

Fliers are awesome in C20, and C21 you'd want to avoid the Dracozombies if you want anything resembling efficiency.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Luminescent Blade

[Anouleth]

Two, actually. Seth and Eirika.

Though this was on my SethEi run, so replace Eirika with someone with 7-8 move, and is better trained than her and it should do as well.

Might go down to one after I see how my Sethsolo goes.

Fliers are awesome in C20, and C21 you'd want to avoid the Dracozombies if you want anything resembling efficiency.

Seth can't do it on his own, I think. He takes too long. He's not quite at the level of being able to walk through enemies.

In any case, even if he can do it on his own, it's not very fast. You ideally need a Warp user and possibly a Torch User (you can't warp to hidden tiles).

But yeah, fliers are the cat's pajamas in Chapter 20 and Endgame. Not so much for avoiding Dracozombies (although it helps), but for not having to go all the way around.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Anouleth

[Thor Odinson]

My Sethsolo will not have anything even resembling efficiency, especially not in that chapter. I mean, if it's his solo, he'll probably be at L20 for a while, with all statboosters except one robe (for Eirika) and possibly one Shield (also for Eirika) if he gets DEF blessed.

I think on my SethEi run I got something of a 3 or 4 turn clear on that. Eirika got the Riev kill because Seth hit -/20 in C16.

I love Audhulma.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Luminescent Blade

[Randoman]

I hope this isn't bringing the thread off topic, but why is Lute considered to be better than Artur? Doesn't Artur has better con and better promotion options (especially Bishop with C staves which makes for good utility and slayer, while both of Lute's choices have big drawbacks. Mage Knight has low caps while Sage leaves her with low con)? And it's not like anima magic using enemies are as plentiful in FE8 as in other FEs, so Artur isn't plagued by WTD intensely.

[Thor Odinson]

I think it's because Mage Knight gets a horse, and 25 Mag is sufficient even in HM (Seth's 25 STR was sufficient and enemies have much lower Res than Def on average), and Lute's low con coupled with MK makes her great for rescue-dropping.

Though I personally think that Artur>Lute since bishop gets C staves right on promotion, which is extremely useful as well.

Lute has great mag as Sage, and will do well offensively, but probably won't ever reach the staff level for Physic.

If she had the staff level for it she'd be the best for it, but she doesn't.

Edit: Oops, forgot about her supports.

Yeah, Lute has the edge on this one.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Luminescent Blade

[Junkhead]

Lute being a Mage Knight is excellent. She doesn't need an overkill 30 Mag cap to kill things. Enemies have crappy Res, so she's doing great with a mount and good Atk. Not to mention she may possibly end up suppoting Vanessa for great bonuses. Lute also gains a D in staves, which is great for healing. Artur doesn't really get to use imporant staves with his base C rank as a Bishop. And I think it's more likely for him to go through the Sage route, since Anima is his better choice against most enemies.

...Dammit. :(

Edited September 2, 2010 by The Leaving Song

[Galenforcer]

Lute has better support options than Artur. She has Vanessa(AnimaxAnima ftw) and to a lesser extent Ross. She also has better offense and avoid than Artur.

Edit: Crap, beaten to it.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Weegee

[Thor Odinson]

Bishop!Artur may be better for Eir route, and Sage is better for Eph, IIRC.

Haven't played Eph route in a while, though.

^ This has nothing to do with Artur v Lute. Just commenting on Artur's promotion paths.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Luminescent Blade

[Junkhead]

So yeah, there's the reason why Lute is better than Artur.

But I can see Artur roflstomping monsters as a Bishop. He'd be great if he gets promoted by the Monster Ship in Ch. 11.

[Thor Odinson]

An early promotion might not be a bad idea if you can get him to Lv10+ by then.

[Junkhead]

That's right. I'm just speaking from my drafting tourney, where I had him at lvl 20 by then. If he can reach at least 14 AS, he would 1RKO every monster except the boss. But then there's his non-existent durability...

[Thor Odinson]

Hide him behind Seth and then one round things? 8D Well, it's not like he's soloing maps, so as long as you don't make a mistake in placement I think his durability shouldn't matter too much.

[RNG Princess]

Rennac is good for chests but I think he belongs in either bottom, low or mid-low I think low fits him better since he's easier to fix than Bottom tier people he can wield a killer edge with no problem.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Queen_Elincia

[Salad Utensil]

Eirika should move to mid tier at least in her brother's route. She boosts some of the best offense (aside from Joshua and Seth) for the 1st eight chapters due to actually being able to double and use rapier on horses and is later easily competent with her own horse and prf weapon for the rest of the game, plus she supports ephraim if he has any more spaces open due to fast rate and same move. She can also instantly promote with her own promotion item that she has no competition from. The only resource she takes from the team is a deployment slot. Anyone want to challenge this?

Edit: also mid tier seems somewhat questionable for now since I can't see a tier difference between characters in upper mid and mid. I encourage that they should merge...for now.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Brighton

[BEST TRYNDAMERE PLAYER]

Tethys should be bottom of top in Eirika route and top of High in Ephraim route. Dancers are always very important units, even in the GBA games. Hell, even in FE5 despite having 10281038208 ballistae that one-shot your dancer yet she's still top-tier material despite not having canto or can re-move up to 4 units.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Joey

[Anouleth]

Bishop!Artur may be better for Eir route, and Sage is better for Eph, IIRC.

Haven't played Eph route in a while, though.

^ This has nothing to do with Artur v Lute. Just commenting on Artur's promotion paths.

Bishop is better for both due to C Staves.

So yeah, there's the reason why Lute is better than Artur.

But I can see Artur roflstomping monsters as a Bishop. He'd be great if he gets promoted by the Monster Ship in Ch. 11.

Most of the monsters are Revenants and Bonewalkers (which are kind of fail). You'd be best off pouring EXP into Vanessa so she can cover the Mogalls.

[Integrity]

I think Bishop is just better for Artur because you'll have Saleh and Lute already fighting for whatever the S Anima tome is, and they both use it better than he does as a Sage. Plus the whole monster damage bonus thing and C Staves - which, notably, means instant Restore.

Either way, though, I reiterate: Artur to the space below Lute on both routes. She's not a whole tier better.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Integrity

[Anouleth]

I think Bishop is just better for Artur because you'll have Saleh and Lute already fighting for whatever the S Anima tome is

Artur is unlikely to reach S Rank Anima, and the main selling point of Excalibur is bonus damage on monsters (which he gets from Bishop).

and they both use it better than he does as a Sage. Plus the whole monster damage bonus thing and C Staves - which, notably, means instant Restore.

Actually, Artur is faster than Lute with Excalibur due to better CON, and he has more durability so he can actually fight bosses without being instantly OHKOed.

And the best thing about C Staves is Barrier, not Restore.

[Junkhead]

Most of the monsters are Revenants and Bonewalkers (which are kind of fail). You'd be best off pouring EXP into Vanessa so she can cover the Mogalls.

You're forgetting the Deathgoyles spawning from every side as well. And Bonewalkers and Revenants, despite failing, they will at least score some hits since there are tons of them.

[Integrity]

Artur is unlikely to reach S Rank Anima, and the main selling point of Excalibur is bonus damage on monsters (which he gets from Bishop).

Actually, Artur is faster than Lute with Excalibur due to better CON, and he has more durability so he can actually fight bosses without being instantly OHKOed.

@1: Truth. You further my point.

@2: Artur is slightly faster and Lute hurts more with it. Give and take, really. At almost any given level neither or both are going to be doubling the Demon King, not one or the other. I maintain Lute and Saleh use it better than Artur anyway.

WRT Barrier, I never use it for anything other than cheap leveling of L'Arachel before Warp arrives. I suppose it's useful for things but I find Restore to be essential when it's needed, not useful.

-

EDIT: The promoted zombies can actually do a surprising lot of damage; they just have ~20% displayed hit so they very probably won't. Anything else on the ship isn't likely to hurt as badly.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Integrity

[Thor Odinson]

Doesn't Aura!Bishop do more damage anyway? Seeing that Holies are 2x Mt damage and Slayer is 3x, where Holies have priority over Slayer...

I'm pretty sure Artur can get A Light easily provided that he is in play.

[Integrity]

Aura's 12x3=36, Ivaldi's 17x2=34. So yes, barely.

EDIT: Pathetic mathfail. IET would be disappoint :(

Edited September 2, 2010 by Integrity

[Thor Odinson]

Two points of MT can make the difference between a 2RKO and a 3RKO, so it's still pretty worth noting.

*Still angry at HM Fomortiis's 36 DEF versus Seth's max 64ATK with Audhulma with A Eir when he needs 66ATK to 2RKO*

I am disappoint, as well, Integ. I may not be as dedicated to math as IET is, I'm still a giant math nerd. And Asian.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Luminescent Blade