The 3DS will likely be my Last Nintendo System for awhile

[Aurabolt]

As I originally posted it on Fantasy Anime on 10/2/2011, I updated it below to reflect a few things:

The top three reasons being--

1. They dropped the ball in regards to the eShop and Virtual Console selections since launch. The eShop wasn't launched until 3 months after the system was launched--the day before E3, actually. Going back to the Wii: they release FFIV and FFIV: After Story early last year via the VC and Wii Ware. Earlier this year both games were released as a bundle on the PSP, PSN and Xbox Live for $15 including all the DLC from the Nintendo releases. Nintendo wanted $20 for both games total plus more for After Story DLC (which is included with the PSP, PSN and XBL versions at no extra charge). I've been hearing from several sources Nintendo isn't "allowed" to offer games for free but if that's true GBA 4 Swords, Netflix (3DS and Wii versions) and 3D Classics: Excite Bike shouldn't have been offered for free to everyone. The game at the center of this debate is Zenonia, which is sold for $8 on DSishop (now eShop as well) but can be bought via smartphone for $2. Same game, two different prices.

2. Every time Nintendo introduces new technology to the market they NEVER USE IT FULLY and instead allow the competition to "show them how it's done". Case example: The PS Move and Kinect. They make the Wii's Motion Control (which was revolutionary at the time) look like shit. Remember the Rumble Pak? Nintendo introduced that back in the N64 days. Sony rolled out Dual Shock controllers the following year. The advantage the Sony version had was unlike the Nintendo version it didn't require batteries.

3. Too many delays in releases I want. At the moment I only have six 3DS games: Michael Jackson: The Experience 3D, Dead or Alive Dimensions, Tetris Axis, OoT:3D, Ridge Racer 3D and Samurai Warriors: Chronicles (I also used to have SSFIV:3D and SF64:3D). At the 6 month mark I had twelve DS Games. I bought the system for a few specific games and I have six of them. The other games I know about I was looking forward to getting 4th Quarter 2011 were MGS3:3D and Kid Icarus: Uprising but it looks like they were pushed to 1st Quarter 2012. Assuming North America gets it I was also looking to get Tales of the Abyss.

...Those are the main sellers, among others. I already announced I'm getting the PS Vita but I'll be keeping my 3DS for the aforementioned games as well as the 3DS Super Smash Bros. announced at E3. It's been out for two years and I got it 5 months after my 3DS but I'm more interested in what my PSP Go has to offer compared to the 3DS.

I shouldn't feel that way not even six months into having a new game system.

As much as I hate to say it, Nintendo is it's own worst enemy. As one person commented on Gamefaqs, Nintendo goes out of its way to tell its supporters "Fuck You!" every Thursday with their crap releases 95% of the time via eShop/Wii Shop/DSi Shop. Given they released the eShop 3 MONTHS LATE, they should have rolled out two dozen new games they know people would like. It's not even an issue in regards to licensing here. The Ambassador Games, 3D Classics and more recently Super Mario Land 2 are proof of that. We're talkin' FIRST PARTY GAMES.

I've had enough.

I got the message loud and clear. Nintendo doesn't want me to support them anymore? That's ok. With my new full-time job I can bought an Xbox 360 in October so I can finally finish Tales of Vesperia. The Vita boasts Augmented Reality which the 3DS introduced. Add to that the 3G version will sell for $50 more (The Wi-Fi only verison is $250) and you can understand why Nintendo took $80 off the 3DS in August. I'll stop short of saying buying the 3DS was a mistake but I think it's clear Nintendo's dominence of the handheld market is coming to an end. They've grown accustomed to not having any serious competition and thus didn't need to try hard to win people over. Seeing as Sony is serious with the Vita I hope this reality check will teach Nintendo a lesson.

Selling $20 value games for $40 doesn't win people over. It pisses them off.

Yes, I'm talking about Starfox64, Ridge Racer 3D and Super Street Fighter IV. SF64 had nothing new compared to the original and the VC release sold for $10. Why should I have had to pay $40 for the 3DS version? I heard rumors someone at the top wants to kill of the Starfox Franchise. It effectively died when Starfox Command was released (worst. concept. ever.). Assault was a step in the right direction (in my opinion of course) but I doubt the port of the N64 version (which lacked Wi-Fi, though Command had Wi-Fi) will save it. SSFIV and Ridge Racer would've sold well at $20, let's be honest. Both franchises are known enough to sell at that price. OoT at $40 is forgivable because it DOES add new ways to play the game along with the free soundtrack CD for those privilaged to get it. DOAD is prettymuch a mashup of the first four games plus it has online, streetpass and weekly DLC since it's launch. Samurai Warriors Chronicles is a good game and has a rustic feel to it for me. It's like playing a movie. The 3DS version of the Michael Jackson Experience was awesome but I wish they had more songs in it. Tetris Axis is probably the best use of AR so far BAR NONE.

...Sorry for the rant but yeah, I needed to get that out of my system.

And here's a followup post later in the thread. Again, mostly my opinion:

It's been about a month since I bought my 360. It took almost 2 full weeks to download all of my Zune Marketplace purchases--all 189GB of them. I haven't touched my Wii since I took the 360 out of the box despite getting Samurai Warriors 3 (Wii) the day before I bought the system. By my estimation it'll proably be 3-5 months before I get back to playing it. I'm too far into Star Ocean to wanna play anything else atm.

...I did buy Tetris Axis and the Michael Jackson Experience 3D for the 3DS though. The AR Games thrown in justifies the retail price--more so if you use printout AR cards (LOL). You guys already know I'm a hardcore Michael Jackson fan so...yeah. 'm pretty sure those will be my last Nintendo purchases for the year. Skyward Sword forces you to use just the Wiimote and thus I will pass on it. I don't like being locked into just one control style. That's why I skipped the Wii version of Twilight Princess, too. I'm expecting Mario Kart 7 (Yes, it's number 7. The six before it being MK Wii, MK DS, MK Super Circuit for the GBA, MK Double Dash!!, MK64 and the original, Super Mario Kart) and Super Mario Land 3D to get pushed back as well.

Someone made an interesting comment on MMO-Champion in a thread on the subject. They sarcastically said Nintendo delays games because they know people will still buy them. There is some truth to that statement when you consider Nintendo hates setting dates when they unveil stuff. The best examples I can think of at the moment are the eShop, Brawl and Twilight Princess:

1. We were first promised the eShop would be launched with the system. It was repeatedly pushed back until the day before the Wii U was unveiled. The product was not worth the wait to this day.

2. They "leaked" Brawl a full TWO YEARS before it was released. TWO YEARS. Yes, some of that had to do with the fact Hideo Kojima and Sega asked Nintendo to put Solid Snake and Sonic in the game and for obvious reasons they wanted to avoid leaking THAT early. By the time the game was FINALLY released, much of the hype around it died down. It's true alot of people bought a Wii just for the game, those same people bought the game AND system at the same time.

3. Twilight Princess is the only 1st party game in the franchise to have been released on two different consoles: The Gamecube and the Wii. We were kept waiting for the Gamecube Version almost TWO YEARS and then Nintendo says "Oh you know what? We want to make more money so we're going to release TP on the Wii as a launch title!". Everyone knew TP was going to be final big game released on the Gamecube but much of the hype around the Gamecube Version was stolen by the Wii version. It's actually pretty sad considering the ONLY difference is the controller(s) used. It made me feel like I'd been cheated after waiting almost two years.

Shifting back to the 360:

The RPGs I've got will likely keep me occupied for the next few months. The 360's got 3-4 years left at best while the Wii has maybe 1 or 2. I will be keeping my Wii for the VC games I've bought, many of which I haven't finished yet but plan to before I die (LOL).

My only complaint with Microsoft is their customer service. Nintendo screws over its fanbase in the software department, Sony does it in Online Security and Microsoft does it where it hurts the most. It ain't enough to make me not buy an Xbox of course but I'm buying the console with extended warranty so if I have a problem I can take it back to the store and exchange it for a new one ^_^

...Everything I wanted to say is above. I will add this, though: I still love Nintendo but not enough to buy another system from them.

I'm sick and tired of only getting 1 or 2 quality games a year VS. 4 or 5 for the 360/PS3. Now I feel like I'm playing catch up. Samurai Warriors 3 will likely be my final Wii Purchase. I just bought MW3, Star Ocean: The Last Hope and Civilization Revolutions (Already have the DS version) last month but there's 8-12 more 360 Games I know I wanna buy REAL soon. I just bought a new PSP so I could finish my PSP Star Ocean Games and bought FFVIII for my PSP Go.

Nintendo's Core Fans reminds me of the Occupy Movement being kicked outof Major Cities Worldwide. They'll simply run their course. I never considered myself a Fan of one system. I'm not afraid to own mutliple systems, after all. GAMES sell systems not the other way around, my friends. Economics 101.

[Original Alear]

Selling $20 value games for $40 doesn't win people over. It pisses them off.

If you don't like the price being offered, don't buy the games. However, your post seems to imply that you were willing to spend the money for the games (Why should I have had to pay $40 for the 3DS version?), which implies that you're complaining over Nintendo marking their games for what they're actually worth. If they weren't worth $40 you wouldn't have spent $40 on them. If you don't think that Starfox 64 offered enough to be worth $40, then you as a consumer could have waited for a markdown. But you didn't - you bought it at the price offered, signifying that it was worth exactly as much as you paid, if not more. Because you weren't forced to buy the game. This is economics 101.

2. They "leaked" Brawl a full TWO YEARS before it was released. TWO YEARS. Yes, some of that had to do with the fact Hideo Kojima and Sega asked Nintendo to put Solid Snake and Sonic in the game and for obvious reasons they wanted to avoid leaking THAT early. By the time the game was FINALLY released, much of the hype around it died down. It's true alot of people bought a Wii just for the game, those same people bought the game AND system at the same time.

Umm, that last sentence seems to imply that the hype didn't die down after all, since people actually bought the system for the game. And in my experience there was a lot of talk about brawl around the time it came out.

3. Twilight Princess is the only 1st party game in the franchise to have been released on two different consoles: The Gamecube and the Wii. We were kept waiting for the Gamecube Version almost TWO YEARS and then Nintendo says "Oh you know what? We want to make more money so we're going to release TP on the Wii as a launch title!". Everyone knew TP was going to be final big game released on the Gamecube but much of the hype around the Gamecube Version was stolen by the Wii version. It's actually pretty sad considering the ONLY difference is the controller(s) used. It made me feel like I'd been cheated after waiting almost two years.

Are you kidding? You care because of stolen...hype? What does that even mean? If it came out on the wii as well as the GCN, how does that negatively impact it coming out on just one vs the other? Personally, I played TP sometime around when it came out on GCN and loved it, and I didn't think twice about the fact that it was also on the wii. Cuz who cares? There weren't any missing features.

Sony does it in Online Security

Did Sony's online security suck, or was it just that they were hacked by accomplished hackers?

Edited December 3, 2011 by BlueMartianKitty

[Momo]

Sounds like a lot of bitching for what boils down to "There are not any games worth buying", which goes for every system.

The reason the 3DS will probably be my last (eventually as I do not own one yet) is because Nintendo has shown they still don't understand the concept of online services. Every single game with a decent multiplayer aspect should be playable online. None of this stupid streepass bullshit that works only for people in Japan.

[Aurabolt]

I'm not gonna argue facts because much of this was my opinion and the reasoning behind my decisions in this regard.

If you don't like the price being offered, don't buy the games. However, your post seems to imply that you were willing to spend the money for the games (Why should I have had to pay $40 for the 3DS version?), which implies that you're complaining over Nintendo marking their games for what they're actually worth. If they weren't worth $40 you wouldn't have spent $40 on them. If you don't think that Starfox 64 offered enough to be worth $40, then you as a consumer could have waited for a markdown. But you didn't - you bought it at the price offered, signifying that it was worth exactly as much as you paid, if not more. Because you weren't forced to buy the game. This is economics 101.

Umm, that last sentence seems to imply that the hype didn't die down after all, since people actually bought the system for the game. And in my experience there was a lot of talk about brawl around the time it came out.

Are you kidding? You care because of stolen...hype? What does that even mean? If it came out on the wii as well as the GCN, how does that negatively impact it coming out on just one vs the other? Personally, I played TP sometime around when it came out on GCN and loved it, and I didn't think twice about the fact that it was also on the wii. Cuz who cares? There weren't any missing features.

Did Sony's online security suck, or was it just that they were hacked by accomplished hackers?

1. You seemed to have missed the part about my buying the VC game. Promises and Expectations were made when 3DS version was announced and they were revealed to be either unkept (Online Play though one can argue Nintendo never actually said SF643D would have Online) or misunderstood (Video Chat in Mutlplayer. It's there but how many people actually have people to play with IRL?) in the final product.

2. Yes that's exactly my point. When it comes to Nintendo, unless you're biased in favor of Nintendo you have to take a wait and see attitude.

3. ...Yeah I was just bitching about that XD

4. That's actually very debatable. I say a little of both.

Sounds like a lot of bitching for what boils down to "There are not any games worth buying", which goes for every system.

The reason the 3DS will probably be my last (eventually as I do not own one yet) is because Nintendo has shown they still don't understand the concept of online services. Every single game with a decent multiplayer aspect should be playable online. None of this stupid streepass bullshit that works only for people in Japan.

That's all a matter of opinion which I already stated.

I have all of the current Gen Systems (Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 in the order I got 'em) as of this month. In the case of Handhelds I have 3 PSPs (Original, 3000 and PSP Go), a 3DS and all four DS Variants (Original, Lite, DSi and DSi XL) so it's not like I'm saying "Ok, I have a 3DS so I can't like PSP Games."

As for your other point I agree 100%. It's why I bought a 360. The PSN and Xbox Live both offer more than Nintendo's Wii Shop and eShop/DSi Shop EACH. I have a Zune player which meant I could redownload the 189GB worth of Anime, Movies, Music Videos, Documentaries and TV Episodes (Some in HD) to my console free of charge. Not only that, with XBL you can download several things in the background without having to wait for the download to finish before downloading something else ((NIntendo Systems). With the PSN you can just use your computer and if your connection is GREAT even a HD Movie can be downloaded in a short amount of time.

[Anouleth]

Personally, I'm not going to buy a 3DS yet. For me, the games that I would be really excited for are:

-A new, good looking Zelda game (I already own Ocarina of Time, so I don't see the point in buying it again)

-Fire Emblem

-Advance Wars

-Phoenix Wright

-Mario Kart

-A 2D Mario game

-Castlevania

However, the console so far only seems to have one of these, with little sign of anything else of note about to come out. The DS had all of these except for a good Zelda, and actually had two Advance Wars games, three Castlevania games, and five Phoenix Wright games, as well as some "other" good games like TWEWY, Trauma Center and Pokemon. So far, the 3DS seems to have almost nothing to show in comparison.

Sounds like a lot of bitching for what boils down to "There are not any games worth buying", which goes for every system.

The reason the 3DS will probably be my last (eventually as I do not own one yet) is because Nintendo has shown they still don't understand the concept of online services. Every single game with a decent multiplayer aspect should be playable online. None of this stupid streepass bullshit that works only for people in Japan.

I was really excited when I heard that Mario Kart 7 would let you tweak options on the online multiplayer for stuff like what items drop and what karts people could use. And then I heard that the options were really limited, and that no, there would not be a "No Blue Shell" option.

Oh man, so close...

[Stark]

Honestly, I completely agree. I still own my DS and have no intention of upgrading until Nintendo releases a decent amount of games for the 3DS. Until at least a few of the following are announced, I'm not going near it.

-Fire Emblem (Confirmed in english, screw region lock)

-Castlevania

-Final Fantasy VI remake (hoping)

-"Pokemon Gray"

-Advance Wars

-The World Ends With You 2

-Metroid

-Or something else really exciting

Tales of the Abyss is a start, but one port isn't worth it to me. The rest of the 3DS lineup is just an utterly disappointing mess of ports and inferior games. (IMO)

I also purchased an Xbox 360 about a year and a half ago and have been nothing but satisfied with it. I actually bought it for the same game as you, Tales of Vesperia. Between that, Mass Effects 1 + 2, Dragon Age Origins, Castlevania Harmony of Despair and Lords of Shadow, Shadow Complex and Final Fantasy XIII, I've found way more games that appeal to me then ever did on the Wii. Most of all, I actually have stuff to look forward to on the 360, which haven't had on the Wii since ... um, Radiant Dawn.

[Paperblade]

ctrl+f paper mario

Screw you guys, that game is gonna be amazing and I'm going to be buying a 3DS for it alone

Fire Emblem is just a bonus, just like KH

[Aurabolt]

Paper Mario is awesome enough to hack your Smart Phone for.

I know it's remote but I am hoping for a Scared Stones remake on the 3DS. I would DIE if they did it ^_^

[Original Alear]

Paper Mario is awesome enough to hack your Smart Phone for.

I know it's remote but I am hoping for a Scared Stones remake on the 3DS. I would DIE if they did it ^_^

I would meh so hard.

[Mikethfc]

Ah reminds me of when there was a 3DS trial publicity event at the guild, when asked if I would like to have a go I replied "No thanks I played these games plenty back when they were first released in 1997" walked off like a bawse and snuck into the tent as soon as she turned her back. Thems were the days.

As far as the 3DS goes I might get it eventually when the price drops as I've heard retro studios are involved in mario kart and hopefully they'll be more games I'm interested in by that point, it isn't like I'm not amused or envious of the tales of people who have messed with Link's name in OoT so that Navi says "Fuck me it's cold in here" and although Snake Eater and Lylat Wars are two of my favourite games, forking out however much for a 3ds when I already have the originals didn't appeal to me.

[Esau of Isaac]

I bought a 3DS after I gave my DS Lite away to a friend for her birthday. Honestly, I wish I'd just stuck with giving the Zelda wallet, and saved those hundreds of dollars. I expected, hey, I might as well buy one because there'll probably be at least a few games I genuinely want. It's been like what, six months, and the only game that arrived which I've remotely felt like buying is Devil Survivor, and only then because I never owned it on the DS. This fucking beast should have been codenamed the NGP, not the Vita. And all of the games that seem to be coming out in the future are more rehashes and ports. I don't want that shit, I want some inventive IP. Where's my Hotel Dusk, Phoenix Wright, Professor Layton? You know, games that aren't just another first-party title played out ad nauseam. Shit, if you're going to remake them then at least go the route Square-Enix did (I can't believe I'm complimenting anything S-E related these days). Touch it up at least a little bit, for Chrissakes enough of this direct port shit with, like, an extra enemy and bestiary. Ooh, Ocarina of Time and Starfox 64, but in 3D guys! That'll hold me over for a year and a half until an actual new game comes out!

And don't even get me started on the utterly moronic eShop, because it's just downright pathetic to look at. First of all, it's an incredible headache to even wade through the damn thing. There's like a million tabs that don't meaningfully separate content, and it's filled to the brim with shit that absolutely no one wants to waste their time downloading. If any of you decided to actually download the trailers for OoT 3D or the Shrek shit, I will personally come to your house and punch you in the genitals. Then there's the search function, which has like two dozen categories to search for content, but less than half of those actually have anything defined under those tags. Why are they there if there's nothing related to those search functions? Obviously the biggest problem with the eShop are the games. Link's Awakening is the only thing that is truly worth buying in that entire store. There are dozens upon dozens of meaningless, stupid little DSi games that no one gives a single fuck about, most of which just should not exist. This is a defined portable gaming system, you want to download tiny, cheap titles, go buy a goddamn phone. People bought this bulkier piece of equipment so they could actually buy titles worth playing for longer than a minute. I've never met or even heard of a single person that thought it would be cool to spend hundreds of dollars to play indie-style games blown up way out of their native resolution from a system that already utterly failed.

Finally, there's constant talk about a complete redesigning of the system. I think we all knew there was going to be another cheaper variant eventually; smaller, better battery life, etc. It's Nintendo, it's just unavoidable. But now they're talking about a literal redesigning with a new control stick? And all of the first-buyers have to go out and buy an incredibly ugly, bulky peripheral? And if you don't get it, you may very well be incapable of playing many Nintendo titles in the future? Really?

Fuck this buying Nintendo products in the beginning thing. It's a huge swindle, and I refuse to be a part of it in the future. I'm gong to wait until they're incredibly cheap, then buy all the games that look decent enough to play years down the line.

[burning_phoneix]

Where's my Hotel Dusk, Phoenix Wright, Professor Layton? You know, games that aren't just another first-party title played out ad nauseam.

Oh! Hotel Dusk? The Game that came out three years after the DS came out? Phoenix Wright? The 4 year old GBA port that come out a year after the DS was released? Professor The game that came out three years after the DS came out?

Look back to when the DS came ou, look back to when the Wii came out, OR when the PS3 came out, or even when the old Xbox1 came out. NO SYSTEM has a plethora of games at launch. Hell, the DS launched with Super Mario 64 DS and some other shit like Rub Rabbits.

BTW: There is already a Layton game on 3DS, it was a launch title in Japan even: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professor_Layton_and_the_Mask_of_Miracle

Oh and let's not forget Ace Attorney versus Professor Layton http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professor_Layton_VS_Ace_Attorney

Shit, if you're going to remake them then at least go the route Square-Enix did (I can't believe I'm complimenting anything S-E related these days). Touch it up at least a little bit, for Chrissakes enough of this direct port shit with, like, an extra enemy and bestiary. Ooh, Ocarina of Time and Starfox 64, but in 3D guys! That'll hold me over for a year and a half until an actual new game comes out!

You do know that the graphics were completely overhauled, right? For both games?

Frankly, I don't really know why Nintendo is getting all this bad press all of a sudden.

Edited December 4, 2011 by burning_phoneix

[Anouleth]

Oh! Hotel Dusk? The Game that came out three years after the DS came out? Phoenix Wright? The 4 year old GBA port that come out a year after the DS was released? Professor The game that came out three years after the DS came out?

Look back to when the DS came ou, look back to when the Wii came out, OR when the PS3 came out, or even when the old Xbox1 came out. NO SYSTEM has a plethora of games at launch. Hell, the DS launched with Super Mario 64 DS and some other shit like Rub Rabbits.

I'm not going to buy a 3DS in the "hope" that eventually people start making good games. I remember waiting a while to get a DS as well because it didn't have a good launch line up. So I'm adopting a "wait and see" position on the 3DS, but I don't have a whole lot of optimism. I suppose that the new Starfox game looks pretty good and it's been ages since I played the original, so I could try that. And localising that Fire Emblem game would go a huuuge way towards me buying it. But other than that? No sign of an Advance Wars (not surprising, the series is pretty dead), no sign of a Castlevania, that Phoenix Wright/Professor Layton crossover might not even be localised, no sign of a 2D Mario, and if the Zelda games are as shit as the DS ones, I don't want to touch them. So I feel like my pessimism is justified.

Edited December 4, 2011 by Anouleth

[Ragnell]

2. Every time Nintendo introduces new technology to the market they NEVER USE IT FULLY and instead allow the competition to "show them how it's done". Case example: The PS Move and Kinect. They make the Wii's Motion Control (which was revolutionary at the time) look like shit. Remember the Rumble Pak? Nintendo introduced that back in the N64 days. Sony rolled out Dual Shock controllers the following year. The advantage the Sony version had was unlike the Nintendo version it didn't require batteries.

I'm sorry, but your complaint is that when a technology is debuted, it isn't used to perfection immediately? What a shocker. Nintendo tries to do new things with technology. Of course someone later is going to do it better; that's the whole freaking point of progress. For example, Vita had the better part of six years to watch what worked and didn't work with touch screens on DS and smart phones, so it better use the thing properly. Sony had a better rumble pack? Well it darn well better; Nintendo showed theme exactly how to make a good one through its successes and failures.

And how on earth do Move and Kinect make Wii look like shit? There are a fair amount of good motion controlled games on Wii, but I've yet to see a single one on either of those systems. Wii Motion + can compete perfectly fine with any of its competitors.

I got the message loud and clear. Nintendo doesn't want me to support them anymore? That's ok. With my new full-time job I can bought an Xbox 360 in October so I can finally finish Tales of Vesperia. The Vita boasts Augmented Reality which the 3DS introduced. Add to that the 3G version will sell for $50 more (The Wi-Fi only verison is $250) and you can understand why Nintendo took $80 off the 3DS in August. I'll stop short of saying buying the 3DS was a mistake but I think it's clear Nintendo's dominence of the handheld market is coming to an end. They've grown accustomed to not having any serious competition and thus didn't need to try hard to win people over. Seeing as Sony is serious with the Vita I hope this reality check will teach Nintendo a lesson.

If you think Nintendo is in trouble in the handheld market, you are sorely mistaken. Nintendo is a household name when it comes to handhelds. Even if all the super-macho-hipster-hardcore gamers go and get a Vita, 3DS will still be fine. And given the fact that so far it looks like a decent competition between the two, I'm sure Nintendo will do more than fine. The 3DS has already sold more in six months than DS did in its first six months. And look how that turned out. I highly doubt 3DS will be able to match the unbelievable sales of DS, but 3DS is far from failing.

...I did buy Tetris Axis and the Michael Jackson Experience 3D for the 3DS though. The AR Games thrown in justifies the retail price--more so if you use printout AR cards (LOL). You guys already know I'm a hardcore Michael Jackson fan so...yeah. 'm pretty sure those will be my last Nintendo purchases for the year. Skyward Sword forces you to use just the Wiimote and thus I will pass on it. I don't like being locked into just one control style. That's why I skipped the Wii version of Twilight Princess, too. I'm expecting Mario Kart 7 (Yes, it's number 7. The six before it being MK Wii, MK DS, MK Super Circuit for the GBA, MK Double Dash!!, MK64 and the original, Super Mario Kart) and Super Mario Land 3D to get pushed back as well.

@bold

Wait, what?! You have got to be joking. You rail on motion controls and then refuse to play a game that not only pushes motion controls farther than any game yet, but also integrates them into a long, satisfying adventure? Skyward Sword is fantastic. I fail to see how you can pretend to be so knowledgeable on motion controls to condemn them. Also, you must hate like 90% of all games ever made, then. Including the GCN TP, since it has only one control style. Actually, that includes pretty much every Zelda game ever made. And all the Mario's. And the Metroids. And the Fire Emblems. And most games on other consoles too. That's gotta be rough.

Also, MK7 and SM3D weren't pushed back. So...

Someone made an interesting comment on MMO-Champion in a thread on the subject. They sarcastically said Nintendo delays games because they know people will still buy them. There is some truth to that statement when you consider Nintendo hates setting dates when they unveil stuff. The best examples I can think of at the moment are the eShop, Brawl and Twilight Princess:

So you're mad that Nintendo releases games when they're finished and adequately tested to be enjoyable, not at some arbitrary estimated date set ridiculously early in development? Would you rather TP and Brawl be released earlier in development and not be as polished as they are?

Also, how could releasing TP on Wii be a problem? Nintendo requested a Zelda game at launch, but the Zelda team didn't have time to make an all-new game, so they decided to port TP. Then both versions came out within about a month of each other. Where's the problem? You don't like that more people get to play the game?

I'm not going to buy a 3DS in the "hope" that eventually people start making good games. I remember waiting a while to get a DS as well because it didn't have a good launch line up. So I'm adopting a "wait and see" position on the 3DS, but I don't have a whole lot of optimism. I suppose that the new Starfox game looks pretty good and it's been ages since I played the original, so I could try that. And localising that Fire Emblem game would go a huuuge way towards me buying it. But other than that? No sign of an Advance Wars (not surprising, the series is pretty dead), no sign of a Castlevania, that Phoenix Wright/Professor Layton crossover might not even be localised, no sign of a 2D Mario, and if the Zelda games are as shit as the DS ones, I don't want to touch them. So I feel like my pessimism is justified.

So the new Zelda being designed for 3DS, Mario 3D Land, Mario Kart 7, Kid Icarus Uprising, Resident Evil Revelations, Luigi's Mansion 2, Paper Mario 3D, Fire Emblem, Professor Layton and the Mask of Miracle, Kingdom Hearts: Dream Drop Distance, Mario Tennis 3DS, Layton vs. Ace Attorney (which has been hinted to be localized, even if it isn't official), Monster Hunter 4, and freaking Super Smash Bros don't look good? And this is assuming you've already played OoT, SF64, SSF4, MGS3, MHTri, Cave Story, and all of the Bit.Trip series and have no interest in buying them as well. That's a significant bunch of games. While I respect waiting for games you're interested in, I feel you're a little pessimistic about what is at the least a passable group of titles.

No game system in history has a stellar lineup of games six months in. All those DS games you mentioned earlier? Came out over the course of like five years. Granted the 3DS' first months were particularly rocky (not so much in Japan, where they had Layton), but things seem to be getting loads better heading into 2012. I honestly don't see what all the fuss is about. Everyone talks about how the Vita has mountains of games, unlike 3DS, but all I ever hear about is Uncharted. And who knows what games will be at launch anyway. The 3DS had loads of games planned for launch, and look how that turned out. I'm not saying the Vita doesn't have games I don't know about, and I genuinely hope that system does well too, but if the games are so low profile that I don't even hear about them, then I feel bashing the 3DS left and right is utterly unjustified.

Finally, there's constant talk about a complete redesigning of the system. I think we all knew there was going to be another cheaper variant eventually; smaller, better battery life, etc. It's Nintendo, it's just unavoidable. But now they're talking about a literal redesigning with a new control stick? And all of the first-buyers have to go out and buy an incredibly ugly, bulky peripheral? And if you don't get it, you may very well be incapable of playing many Nintendo titles in the future? Really?

As much as I despise the new circle pad, and as much as I can't believe the 3DS didn't have 2 to start with, there has been absolutely no hint of this sort of thing from Nintendo. A list of games using the peripheral has been released, but none require it. Anything beyond that is purely sensationalist fan speculation.

[Esau of Isaac]

Oh! Hotel Dusk? The Game that came out three years after the DS came out? Phoenix Wright? The 4 year old GBA port that come out a year after the DS was released? Professor The game that came out three years after the DS came out?

Yeah, those ones. Should I have to wait years for good games on a new system?

And Phoenix Wright is a GBA port. In Japan. I'm sure everyone in the west is totally familiar with good ol' Gyakuten Saiban, right? Sure.

Look back to when the DS came ou, look back to when the Wii came out, OR when the PS3 came out, or even when the old Xbox1 came out. NO SYSTEM has a plethora of games at launch. Hell, the DS launched with Super Mario 64 DS and some other shit like Rub Rabbits.

Where the hell did I say anything about tiles at launch? It's been out for nine months, almost a goddamn year. You know what titles I had around nine months after the DS came out? Dawn of Sorrow, Advance Wars, Trauma Center, WarioWare, Nintendogs, and Meteos. Not to defend the DS' shitty launch or anything, but this one's even more pathetic than that one's was.

And speaking of that, you're listing systems that all had a ridiculously notorious start out the gate, with terrible launching titles (Xbox's saving grace Halo aside).

BTW: There is already a Layton game on 3DS, it was a launch title in Japan even: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professor_Layton_and_the_Mask_of_Miracle

Oh and let's not forget Ace Attorney versus Professor Layton http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professor_Layton_VS_Ace_Attorney

Oh hey, that's awesome as shit. For Japan. I live in North America. I'm talking about North America.

You do know that the graphics were completely overhauled, right? For both games?

You are calling this a graphical overhaul:

(After Years as an example rather than literally interpreted)

I am saying this is a graphical overhaul:

Both 3DS titles were anything but an overhaul. They put as much effort in as SE did porting Final Fantasy I and II to the PSP.

Frankly, I don't really know why Nintendo is getting all this bad press all of a sudden.

Because people are finally getting completely sick and tired of being fucked around with out of what I assume is pure laziness.

Edited December 4, 2011 by Esau of Isaac

[Momo]

Yeah, those ones. Should I have to wait years for good games on a new system?

Yeah, kind of. It sucks but the exact same thing goes for every system ever made. Developers need time to get a feel for it and figure out what they want to d.

[Celice]

As much as the 3Ds appears to be bleh, its sales apparently, are not.

The Nintendo 3DS has sold more units in its first eight months than the original DS did in its first year, according to Nintendo of America president, Reggie Fils-Aimes.

In an interview with Time, Fils-Aimes said that this past Saturday saw the 3DS surpass the sales of the first 12 months of the DS.

“The original DS sold 2.37 million and we just surpassed that this past Saturday, so we’ve got real good momentum going into the holidays,” he said.

http://www.kotaku.com.au/2011/12/3ds-outsells-dss-year-one-sales-in-8-months/

I'm wondering what exactly people have been playing to warrant that many sales.

[burning_phoneix]

Yeah, those ones. Should I have to wait years for good games on a new system?

Yes.

And Phoenix Wright is a GBA port. In Japan. I'm sure everyone in the west is totally familiar with good ol' Gyakuten Saiban, right? Sure.

I was saying it took a company a full year to localize and port a damn GBA title that's been out for 4 years. Now think of how long it will take to program one from the ground up.

And speaking of that, you're listing systems that all had a ridiculously notorious start out the gate, with terrible launching titles (Xbox's saving grace Halo aside).

All systems start with shit at launch with maybe one or two good titles.

Oh hey, that's awesome as shit. For Japan. I live in North America. I'm talking about North America.

I'm willing to bet it will come out in North America, Professor Layton vs Ace Attorney was actually shown in English.

You are calling this a graphical overhaul:

(After Years as an example rather than literally interpreted)

I am saying this is a graphical overhaul:

Both 3DS titles were anything but an overhaul. They put as much effort in as SE did porting Final Fantasy I and II to the PSP.

Yes I'm calling it a graphical overhaul because they had to completely change all the models in the game. You're comparing SNES games remade for today's market Instead of PS1 and N64 games remade for today's market. And Zelda 3DS still looks better than Final Fantasy the After Years.

Because people are finally getting completely sick and tired of being fucked around with out of what I assume is pure laziness.

Or it's just people getting nostalgia for some golden age of nonfuckness that never existed.

I'm wondering what exactly people have been playing to warrant that many sales.

The release of Super Mario 3D Land, The Upcoming release of Mario 7 and Black Friday really pushed up the sales.

[Anouleth]

So the new Zelda being designed for 3DS, Mario 3D Land, Mario Kart 7, Kid Icarus Uprising, Resident Evil Revelations, Luigi's Mansion 2, Paper Mario 3D, Fire Emblem, Professor Layton and the Mask of Miracle, Kingdom Hearts: Dream Drop Distance, Mario Tennis 3DS, Layton vs. Ace Attorney (which has been hinted to be localized, even if it isn't official), Monster Hunter 4, and freaking Super Smash Bros don't look good? And this is assuming you've already played OoT, SF64, SSF4, MGS3, MHTri, Cave Story, and all of the Bit.Trip series and have no interest in buying them as well. That's a significant bunch of games. While I respect waiting for games you're interested in, I feel you're a little pessimistic about what is at the least a passable group of titles.

I haven't seen the new Zelda or anything about it. As I said, I don't have a lot of hope given how terrible the DS games were. I'm not really interested in Mario 3D Land either. I've already mentioned MKart 7 as being something I have interest in. I don't have any interest in Kid Icarus or Luigi's Mansion, or Paper Mario. There has been no announcement on whether the new Fire Emblem will be localised, I remind you that the last one wasn't, and I've already said that I might buy a 3DS if it is localised. I don't have any interest in Kingdom Hearts (played a bit of, I think it was the DS one, and didn't like it), or Professor Layton, or Mario Tennis, or Monster Hunter either (I played MH3 on the Wii, and while it was good, it's not worth buying a console over).

I had forgotten about the new Super Smash Bros, but I feel that SSB is kind of wasted without having other people to play it with, so that would be contigent on my friends having 3DSes. I already mentioned Layton vs. AA, but there's nothing to show it will be localised either.

And yes, I've already played Ocarina of Time, MHTri, and Cave Story. I'm not really a big fan of Street Fighter or Metal Gear Solid, however. Why should I pay for a console to play Bit.Trip on when I already own a PC, that would be far cheaper to play it on? Hell, Cave Story can be downloaded for /free/.

No game system in history has a stellar lineup of games six months in. All those DS games you mentioned earlier? Came out over the course of like five years.

Really? Because when I bought my DS about a year and a half in, I already got a Castlevania, a Trauma Center, and an Advance Wars. That's three great games. Are there three great games out /right now/? No, there's Mario Kart and that's it. There's no sign of anything else on my "list", such as it is. Maybe there will be some unanticipated game, like TWEWY was for the DS. Who knows? For now, everything else is a "maybe". I'm not going to buy a 3DS because "maybe" the new Zelda won't suck balls, because "maybe" they'll localise Phoenix Wright and Fire Emblem. When these games are actually released, I'll factor them in.

Granted the 3DS' first months were particularly rocky (not so much in Japan, where they had Layton), but things seem to be getting loads better heading into 2012. I honestly don't see what all the fuss is about. Everyone talks about how the Vita has mountains of games, unlike 3DS, but all I ever hear about is Uncharted. And who knows what games will be at launch anyway. The 3DS had loads of games planned for launch, and look how that turned out. I'm not saying the Vita doesn't have games I don't know about, and I genuinely hope that system does well too, but if the games are so low profile that I don't even hear about them, then I feel bashing the 3DS left and right is utterly unjustified.

I'm not bashing the 3DS. I'm merely pointing out that the games that excite me are not on it, and that usually when they are on it, they usually come with a "but". Fire Emblem "but it might not be localised", Zelda "but it might be another Spirit Tracks-style turd".

[Esau of Isaac]

Yes.

The answer was "no." No, I should not have to wait years for a hundreds-of-dollars system to be worth using.

I was saying it took a company a full year to localize and port a damn GBA title that's been out for 4 years. Now think of how long it will take to program one from the ground up.

Poor excuse. The developers don't (or shouldn't) have to wait to make a game until after the hardware is released to the public.

All systems start with shit at launch with maybe one or two good titles.

The NES launched with Baseball, Duck Hunt, Excitebike, Golf, and Super Mario Bros. Genesis launched with Altered Beast, Ghosts n' Ghouls, and Golden Axe. The SNES launched with Super Mario World, Gradius III, and F-Zero. At least the titles that many consoles launch with are memorable and interesting enough to hold players over until more games come out. What's the 3DS' Super Mario Bros? Steel Diver?

Why don't you respond to the part where I pointed out mutliple well-received titles that had already been out on the DS this fart along after its release?

I'm willing to bet it will come out in North America, Professor Layton vs Ace Attorney was actually shown in English.

I don't care, I'm talking about the release of the console. If it gets localized like a year from now, great, then I'll actually have more games for this stupid system. I'm saying the launch of this thing was catastrophically terrible software-wise.

Yes I'm calling it a graphical overhaul because they had to completely change all the models in the game. You're comparing SNES games remade for today's market Instead of PS1 and N64 games remade for today's market. And Zelda 3DS still looks better than Final Fantasy the After Years.

Fine. 2D to 2D. Is this a graphical overhaul?

If you say no you're inconsistent. If you say yes you are wrong.

Edit: And Zelda 3DS looks like shit compared to After Years.

Or it's just people getting nostalgia for some golden age of nonfuckness that never existed.

Even if this were true, it's a poor argument on your part. You can't defend a shitty opening by saying they've always had shitty openings.

The release of Super Mario 3D Land, The Upcoming release of Mario 7 and Black Friday really pushed up the sales.

Record sales occurred before Super Mario 3D Land was even announced, and of course before Black Friday occurred. The opening launch was one of the most profitable Nintendo's had in history.

It's because of stupid people like me, who assume that eventually the handheld will have good games. Whether or not that's true, it encourages bad behavior like this on Nintendo's part.

Edited December 5, 2011 by Esau of Isaac

[Aurabolt]

...The Nostalgia Factor only works for those old enough to have played and enjoyed the original.

Re-releasing OoT on both the Gamecube (TWICE!) and Wii (Virtual Console) and THEN the 3DS negates the "Nostalgia" those playing...say Final Fantasy Tactics: War of the Lions or the Halo 10th Anniversary game a decade plus after they were first released.

The DS and hell the GBA for that matter may not have had the perfect launches (in comparison to the 3DS) but at least you had a good stock of games to chose from until later in the year. SM64 DS may have gotten mosly negative reviews but I thought it was an awesome game overall. The nostalgia of the original game was still there and that was good enough for me ^_^

Of course, I already know/suspect the reason for the frequent ports of the same older titles is to keep the licensing alive. Well, that and to discourage ROM Hackers--not that it's working, of course--as well for who knows what reasons. Sega do it too yes but Nintendo does it way too much, alienating those looking for fresh new games.

[Life]

Nice to know you can drop so much money on video game systems. I've had my Xbox 360 since about 2007 or something like that and I've never felt the need to buy a new video game system every 6 months (certainly not the 3DS).

I think I counted 5 different systems in your post that you claim to have (unless the PSP and PSP Go are two different things). I just hope that you're actually working for that money in order to know the value of it.

[Aurabolt]

I've had my Xbox 360 since about 2007 or something like that and I've never felt the need to buy a new video game system every 6 months.

Well, good for you.

I think I counted 5 different systems in your post that you claim to have (unless the PSP and PSP Go are two different things). I just hope that you're actually working for that money in order to know the value of it.

I have no need to lie but sorry for the crappy resolution. I forgot to adjust and was too laz to afterward xD

Took this one with my DSi:

Taken with my 3DS:

Self-Explanatory:

Same as above:

I hope this isn't seen as showing off. You asked for proof. Hope four's enough ^_^

...The black box on the top shelf is the slim model. The first TV stand picture you see my 3DS and one of my PSPs. The others are closeups of my Three PSPs. I bought the PSPs on the right Used but bought the PSP on the left as well as the DSi and 3DS New. See the Wii Games on the second Shelf? Those are Gamecube games to the right of them.

[Life]

I hope this isn't seen as showing off. You asked for proof.

No, I didn't ask for proof. I believed you. I was implying that A) you're a show-off about how much money you can drop on video games and B) that if you aren't self-sufficient, you're pretty spoiled.

[Aurabolt]

No, I didn't ask for proof. I believed you. I was implying that A) you're a show-off about how much money you can drop on video games and B) that if you aren't self-sufficient, you're pretty spoiled.

I have a full-time job thank you very much.

I GLADLY work my ass half to death to buy the games I wanna play. Not alot of people can say that about ANYTHING these days.

...And finally your Avatar is mindblowing. It's like a cross between terrifying and AWESOME. I want to look away but just can't xD