riariadne Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 From my point of view, we have to pick you or him either now or mission 5. As for the second spy, I am most uneasy about Kay. She wanted the mission to go through, but she didn't want to put herself on it- that means she's either resistance and she thinks she's 100% sure of the other three resistance operatives in me/kirsche/blitz, or that she's spy with Kirsche and put him on the team. I should've put much more thought into my approval than I did, in hindsight, as that was basically going into a Kirsche/Slayer coinflip and doubtlessly picking one over the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriemhild Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I think it's pretty obvious why I voted No. The only Spy possibilities that would have made this mission a success were Slayer+Kay and Slayer+Proto. From my perspective, it isn't Slayer+Proto, and now I'm pretty sure it isn't Slayer+Kay either, because a Spy Kay wouldn't send in a proposal with no Spies at this point in time. With Slayer+Kay out of the way, the only remaining Spy possibilities for me to consider are Kirsche+Kay and Reinfleche+Blitzy. The voting pattern of 2.2, where Kay voted YES, and Blitzy voted NO, makes Kirsche+Kay much more likely in my eyes than Reinfleche+Blitzy. I'm happy with any proposal as long as those two are left out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kay Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 She wanted the mission to go through, but she didn't want to put herself on it- that means she's either resistance and she thinks she's 100% sure of the other three resistance operatives in me/kirsche/blitz It would not have gotten enough votes if I put myself on the mission. There was no chance of that. I'm not 100% sure of the others, but it's better than wasting a proposal. Not 100% sure is a lot better than letting a spy get control of the game. Blitzy, I'm counting on you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blitz Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 well I will go with what I had intended to go with from the start ##Give plans to:Blitz, Proto and Dave Strider if anyone has any complaints,please speak up now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 I said last time that I was happy with that team, and thus am saying yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriemhild Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 well I will go with what I had intended to go with from the start ##Give plans to:Blitz, Proto and Dave Strider if anyone has any complaints,please speak up now. As I said before, the only possibilities for me to worry about are Kirsche+Kay and Reinfleche+Blitzy. It's impossible to exclude all four, and I find Kirsche+Kay to be much more suspicious of the two, so this is perfectly fine with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riariadne Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 I'm fine with this team as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zanarkin Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 I'm fine with that team too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tables Posted January 15, 2012 Author Share Posted January 15, 2012 (edited) Mission Prop 4.2 by Cap'n Flint Team: Cap'n Flint, Kiku-Ichimonji, Dave Strider, Yes: Cap'n Flint, SlayerX, Kiku-Ichimonji, Dave Strider, Kirsche, No: Kay, Result: Yes - 5, No - 1 Proposal passes And for the hilarious bit: Mission 4 result Co-operate Sabotage Sabotage Game over. Spies win I promised a closer game and a good chance of a resistance victory. What I underestimated was the incredibe play from Proto, who managed to convince almost everyone that he was town. That was perhaps the deciding factor in this game, as of course he got many oppertunities to sabotage missions and get his opinions across. Proto wins MVP for the game. The town didn't actually do too badly on the whole, but Proto's misleading gave them little chance for cohesiveness. It's hard to pick out a particular player who was best - Kay did well considering that people believed him to be scummy (Blitz in particular thought he was essentially confirmed scum). Slayer said he was suspicious of Rein during the midgame (or at least his list of suspicions suggested it) - I can only assume that had lessened for him to vote yes to this mission. Kirshe's play didn't stand out particularly to me. He didn't make any real mistakes (asides from thinking during round 2 that the two most town players were the two spies), and his play was generally reasonably good. That of course only leaves Rein, whose play as a spy was also very good, with his voting patterns being consistent with his 'beliefs' about who might be resistance. Overall, I'm sorry that the spies beat the resistance so comfortably, but I can't say they didn't deserve the win. Good game, everyone. Here is a link to the spreadsheet that was used. Sheet 2 has some stuff. Yes it's the same spreadsheet I used for Resistance II, I just made it not public again :P Edited January 15, 2012 by Tableskitty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tables Posted January 15, 2012 Author Share Posted January 15, 2012 I have one final question though. I'm just curious, is all. Proto, do you genuinely believe that a spy should never sabotage mission 1, or was that a ploy to gain trust? I have seen arguments for both sides (spies should always/never sabotage a 2 person mission), and in my opinion, both of those are mistakes: Sometimes sabotaging is the way to victory. Of course, in an individual game, you either do or don't, but over many games, never sabotaging means you're wasting an oppertunity as a spy, while always sabotaging puts you in a dangerous metagame position ("we know that X always sabotages while Y rarely does, it's pretty likely that X is the spy") Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zanarkin Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 Oh wow... GJ spies... That was certainly really good play... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaybee Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 kay is female Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zanarkin Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 Also, i started trusting rein because everything seemed to point that Kay and Kirsche were spies... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riariadne Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 spies always win Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tables Posted January 15, 2012 Author Share Posted January 15, 2012 kay is female FFFFfffffffffffffffff I wrote she at first. Then I thought I was deluding myself, and thought I know a guy called Kay, it must be a guy's name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriemhild Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 I have one final question though. I'm just curious, is all. Proto, do you genuinely believe that a spy should never sabotage mission 1, or was that a ploy to gain trust? I have seen arguments for both sides (spies should always/never sabotage a 2 person mission), and in my opinion, both of those are mistakes: Sometimes sabotaging is the way to victory. Of course, in an individual game, you either do or don't, but over many games, never sabotaging means you're wasting an oppertunity as a spy, while always sabotaging puts you in a dangerous metagame position ("we know that X always sabotages while Y rarely does, it's pretty likely that X is the spy") Both, kind of. I tried to make 95% of my posts as objectively as possible with very little traces of subjectivity, and I figured that was the fastest way to gain trust. However, what I did know was that if I were on the mission, I would have most definitely co-operated, and that was why I highlighted the fact that a Spy wouldn't sabotage Mission 1. I suppose my logic was bad, but this was the first time I ever encountered a 2-person mission, so I just talked about whatever I specifically would do, being a Spy myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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