I.M. Gei Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 Well, to be fair, if one person is worried that they have pedophilic urges, I don't see the problem with asking for help or guidance. A forum based on entertainment media might not be the most immediately appropriate place to air it out, and trying to justify acting on those urges with a straight face would easily be cause for alarm, but sitting on it must be painful. When you don't seek actual psychiatric help for it (instead, whining about it on your hugbox like you whine about how you're "persecuted" for your diaper fetish), there's really something wrong with you. And if somebody came here and started trying to seriously promote Nazism, not to say this is to my credit, but I might end up not speaking out immediately beyond quietly reporting them, because it seems so absurd that I'd assume they would be banned pretty quickly. Are the tvtropes forums simply so lightly moderated that almost anything can be said without the staff objecting to it (which supposedly would also leave others free to disagree), or are these guys actually supposed to be the norm? The situation over there is such that they--the moderators and the vast majority of the members--are more than willing to tolerate any degree of misogyny, pedophilia, racism, and whatnot so long as people say their bullshit in a polite manner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrashGordon94 Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 I have to say, I don't really see the need to mock people on other sites because they have dumb opinions. Yes, some of the nastier things sound awful and it sucks that mods would defend them but mocking them won't actually do anything helpful. Silent reporting is always the better option in those severe cases unless the mods really aren't acting on it (to be fair, that's what it sounds like) and mocking the tinier things like the SA threads sometimes did is just doucheyness for the sake of doucheyness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.M. Gei Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 (edited) I have to say, I don't really see the need to mock people on other sites because they have dumb opinions. Having dumb opinions is one thing; having dumb and outright harmful opinions (aka some 90% of Tropers) is a whole new ballgame and, as far as I'm concerned, fair game. I mean, I wouldn't mock somebody for liking anime or using Nino or whatever, but when you punish people for calling someone out on their morally objectionable opinions, I really see no reason to let loose and/or have a few laughs at their expense. Yes, some of the nastier things sound awful and it sucks that mods would defend them but mocking them won't actually do anything helpful. There is no such thing as helping them, since it's so painfully obvious they don't want to help themselves.And even then, the only way people grow out of being horrifically stupid and immature (from first-hand experience) is to be put out on the carpet over it, humiliated, and ridiculed. It's not acceptable to be a misogynistic, racist, shut-in pedophiliac creep. Silent reporting is always the better option in those severe cases unless the mods really aren't acting on it (to be fair, that's what it sounds like) and mocking the tinier things like the SA threads sometimes did is just doucheyness for the sake of doucheyness. But it's so fun reading SA mock the worst of the worst: the pedophiles, the rape apologists, the Neo-Nazis, the people who whine about being persecuted for their diaper fetish while simultaneously holding the moral high ground over people who like MILFs, and-you get where I'm going with this, right? And the mods at TVT do something about it; they actively discourage people from calling these people out on their bullshit. To them, calling someone out on wanting to rape children is worse than actually wanting to rape children. There really is no salvaging a place like that. As a final note, yes, Goons can be highly abrasive. However, they often won't show that side unless you do something really stupid and/or horrible (and TVT oozes that by the truckload). Edited January 26, 2012 by Black★Rock Shooter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Goldie Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Having dumb opinions is one thing; having dumb and outright harmful opinions (aka some 90% of Tropers) is a whole new ballgame and, as far as I'm concerned, fair game. I mean, I wouldn't mock somebody for liking anime or using Nino or whatever, but when you punish people for calling someone out on their morally objectionable opinions, I really see no reason to let loose and/or have a few laughs at their expense. There is no such thing as helping them, since it's so painfully obvious they don't want to help themselves.And even then, the only way people grow out of being horrifically stupid and immature (from first-hand experience) is to be put out on the carpet over it, humiliated, and ridiculed. It's not acceptable to be a misogynistic, racist, shut-in pedophiliac creep. But it's so fun reading SA mock the worst of the worst: the pedophiles, the rape apologists, the Neo-Nazis, the people who whine about being persecuted for their diaper fetish while simultaneously holding the moral high ground over people who like MILFs, and-you get where I'm going with this, right? And the mods at TVT do something about it; they actively discourage people from calling these people out on their bullshit. To them, calling someone out on wanting to rape children is worse than actually wanting to rape children. There really is no salvaging a place like that. BWUAHAHEHEEHHEOHOHOHOJAKAKEKEHWBWBUWAHAHAHAHH! These fellow human being thoughts, they entertain me ohohohohoo! It's incredibly silly, but lovely fellow human being interpretations on which this fellow human being has created for themselves heheheheheheheheeeee! "helping them" "worst of the worst" trying to "prove a point" "stupid" "immature" "humiliated" "ridiculed" "misogynistic" "racist" "creep" and many other lovely and silly fun fellow human being words used here BWUAAHHEEHEHEHAHAAHAAHAHH! All these fellow human being interpretations to be used in such a funny and lovely wayo OHOHOHOOHOOOOo! BWUAHHEHEHEHEHAAHAHAHAAHH! HehhehejejekekekekekjajajajajajajjJAJAJAJEKEKWEBWUEHAHAHAAHAAHAHH! So beautiful! All of these aren't really "facts" on anything ohohohohoo! It's all based on interpretation of what you see as "creepy" and so forth HHEHEEEEEEEheheheeeee! The fellow human being society is set up this very entertaining and silly way BUWAHAHEHEEHAHAHAAHAHAAHAHH! The birth of all these kinds of fellow human being interpretations, how is it a "surprise"? BWUAHEHEHEOHOHOHOHOHOJAJAAKKAKEKEAALBWUWHEAHAHAHAH! The billions of fellow human being "attempts" and "efforts" to simplify the complicated, is there really any fellow human being surprise in the ways each fellow human being differentiates themselves from each others? BHEHEEHEOHOHOHOHOHOHHOOOO! The separations we've all given our fellow human being selves heheheheeee! Isn't it the result of the fellow human being society's "efforts" in making everything as simplified as possible? BWUAHAHEEHEHEHAAHAHAAHH! Isn't this obvious info?! HEHEHEHEHEHEBWUAHAHEHEHEHAHAAHAHH! ohohoOHOHOHOHOHHOOOO! HOW ENTERTAINING! I feel 39 excitements and joys from this silliness ohohohooHEHEHEHEHEEEE! It's impossible for my fellow human being self to see any fellow human being as "bad" as the society has tried simplifying things to the point of silliness everywhere heheheheheHEEEEEEE! Many different fellow human being interpretations shall always be given birth and "madness" shall continue to appear from all over - creating even more new versions of fellow human being interpretations as "time" continues to move forward with society's desperate attempts to simplify the complicated reaching it's latest fellow human being level oooOOOHOOOOOOOHOHOHOHOHOHOOOOo! BWUAAAAAHEHEEHHEOHOHOHOHOHOHQWBEBUWHEHEAHAHAAHAAHAAHHH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrashGordon94 Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 There is no such thing as helping them, since it's so painfully obvious they don't want to help themselves.And even then, the only way people grow out of being horrifically stupid and immature (from first-hand experience) is to be put out on the carpet over it, humiliated, and ridiculed. It's not acceptable to be a misogynistic, racist, shut-in pedophiliac creep. I'm not talking about helping them personally, I'm talking about helping the situation. If you mock them repeatedly, it might actually make it look like they have a point when they say they're "persecuted" and stuff. And if it can't be helped, the best thing to do is wash your hands of the situation and leave it alone really. I cut out the other parts of your post because I don't have anything else to say other than that. I understand why you want to call them out, I really do. It just achieves nothing good, you're not going to make them stop, you're only going to make them more defensive than they already are and it might even make you look bad if you go about it wrong (Though not as bad as them, admittedly). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.M. Gei Posted January 26, 2012 Author Share Posted January 26, 2012 (edited) I'm not talking about helping them personally, I'm talking about helping the situation. If you mock them repeatedly, it might actually make it look like they have a point when they say they're "persecuted" and stuff. And if it can't be helped, the best thing to do is wash your hands of the situation and leave it alone really. I cut out the other parts of your post because I don't have anything else to say other than that. I understand why you want to call them out, I really do. It just achieves nothing good, you're not going to make them stop, you're only going to make them more defensive than they already are and it might even make you look bad if you go about it wrong (Though not as bad as them, admittedly). I don't even have to mock them or get involved in the situation; they manage to implode pretty spectacularly just with the rest of the world watching on the sidelines. And really, if they won't change, there's no reason for the rest of the world to not have a few laughs at their expense. Edited January 26, 2012 by Black★Rock Shooter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peener weener Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 I'm not talking about helping them personally, I'm talking about helping the situation. If you mock them repeatedly, it might actually make it look like they have a point when they say they're "persecuted" and stuff. And if it can't be helped, the best thing to do is wash your hands of the situation and leave it alone really. I cut out the other parts of your post because I don't have anything else to say other than that. I understand why you want to call them out, I really do. It just achieves nothing good, you're not going to make them stop, you're only going to make them more defensive than they already are and it might even make you look bad if you go about it wrong (Though not as bad as them, admittedly). By that logic we should have let Hitler kill everyone because showing opposition might have made him more aggressive I love hyperboles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Original Alear Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 By that logic we should have let Hitler kill everyone because showing opposition might have made him more aggressive I love hyperboles How much more aggressive than killing everyone can you get? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peener weener Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Bombing some harmless lands? Waging war on the possible aliens through radio transmissions? Becoming god? fuck if I know, it's hitler. he'll pull some shit up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrashGordon94 Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 By that logic we should have let Hitler kill everyone because showing opposition might have made him more aggressive I love hyperboles Not really, some people saying dumb things on the net isn't that bad. And I recognise the hyperbole, there's simply no problem with this logic at this level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peener weener Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 (edited) There is no problem with mocking them either. also the hyperbole comment was something about responding to a hyperbole with a hyperboler so that wasy my point really. come on it's pretty easy to see isn't it. Edited January 26, 2012 by Stolypin Necktie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Life Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Not really, some people saying dumb things on the net isn't that bad. And I recognise the hyperbole, there's simply no problem with this logic at this level. Crash, I'm going to respond to you nicely about this. But note, it's really hard to do this when I feel like I'm talking to someone with a maturity level of a 6 year old. Everyone has an opinion. But not all opinions are correct or equal. Justifying genocide, for instance, is an example of an opinion that should not be fucking shared with the world. And just because this is the internet and it's anonymous does NOT mean you can go around spouting garbage. Calling for the deaths of thousands of people isn't just "a dumb thing". It's a disgusting thing to say. The fact that you can't realize this really infuriates me and perfectly explains why a lot of people think that you're a retard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peener weener Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 <3 evolutionary social awareness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrashGordon94 Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Crash, I'm going to respond to you nicely about this. But note, it's really hard to do this when I feel like I'm talking to someone with a maturity level of a 6 year old. Everyone has an opinion. But not all opinions are correct or equal. Justifying genocide, for instance, is an example of an opinion that should not be fucking shared with the world. And just because this is the internet and it's anonymous does NOT mean you can go around spouting garbage. Calling for the deaths of thousands of people isn't just "a dumb thing". It's a disgusting thing to say. The fact that you can't realize this really infuriates me and perfectly explains why a lot of people think that you're a retard. Yes, but that's not the only thing they're mocking, they also mock things which are purely "dumb things" too. I won't try to defend those assholes who ARE saying things like that, that IS disgusting. The real reason I'd say they don't deserve to be mocked is because they deserve worse than that. I probably wouldn't be bothered if those were the ONLY targets of their mockery, but they aim at people being dumb without doing anything truely terrible as well. And the reason these methods are bad is because they won't accomplish anything in the long run, I'm not sure any of my ideas would work but given the amount of effort being put into tracking this stuff down I'd think it'd at least be worth channelling some of that into finding avenue that might solve the problem once and for all. It's very likely not going to work but it's at the very least worth thinking about instead of just using the situation as entertainment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peener weener Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 there isn't much work involved in tracking down anything honestly it's usually as easy as typing something on a search engine and clicking the first link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uguu Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Yes, but that's not the only thing they're mocking, they also mock things which are purely "dumb things" too. I won't try to defend those assholes who ARE saying things like that, that IS disgusting. The real reason I'd say they don't deserve to be mocked is because they deserve worse than that. I probably wouldn't be bothered if those were the ONLY targets of their mockery, but they aim at people being dumb without doing anything truely terrible as well. And the reason these methods are bad is because they won't accomplish anything in the long run, I'm not sure any of my ideas would work but given the amount of effort being put into tracking this stuff down I'd think it'd at least be worth channelling some of that into finding avenue that might solve the problem once and for all. It's very likely not going to work but it's at the very least worth thinking about instead of just using the situation as entertainment. Almost none? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nestling Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 and here I was thinking that my morally objective opinions were the oddest that could exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanami Touko Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Man, I thought Kay was a bad white knight, but here's Crash defending tropers D: The respect I never had for him has gone into the negatives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peener weener Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 and here I was thinking that my morally objective opinions were the oddest that could exist. objective is not the word you're thinking of here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peener weener Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Man, I thought Kay was a bad white knight, but here's Crash defending tropers D: The respect I never had for him has gone into the negatives. no pokerespect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Original Alear Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 and here I was thinking that my morally objective opinions were the oddest that could exist. Your opinion on mental people was colored strongly, in fact apparently entirely, by your experience with your sister. Not very objective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Tropers are wimps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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