[FE10] Tier List v.2

[PKL]

God help me. Im not responding to that wall of text now lol. But you're wrong, as always

Edited August 25, 2012 by CR-S0I

[Quintessence]

lol

[Quintessence]

According to the Tier list, a draft should have the following teams:

1. Titania, Gatrie, Mia, Muarim, Shinon, Makalov, Lethe, Stefan, Kurthnaga
2. Edward, Marcia, Nailah, Rhys, Tormod, Skrimir, Astrid, Nasir, Oliver
3. Jill, Elincia, Ilyana, Mordecai, Heather, Naesala, Sanaki, Renning, Gareth
4. Nolan, Zihark, Nealuchi, Brom, Rolf, Tibarn, Vika, Fiona, Ena
5. Oscar, Aran, Tanith, Laura, Lucia, Meg, Kyza, Pelleas, Bastian
6. Volug, Soren, Janaff, Sigrun, Ranulf, Tauroneo, Caineghis, Danved, Volke
7. Boyd, Nephenee, Ulki, Calill, Kieran, Leonardo, Giffca, Lyre, Mist

:/

Edited August 25, 2012 by Quintessence

[charlie_]

I'm fairly sure that the tier list assumes common sense. I think Laura's a bit high, just being one of many resolve tanks. And she costs a turn because you can't ferry her, which nullifies the turn she shaves by purging Ike

Lethe should only get the bexp as a last resort, as most part 2 units including CRKs make better use of it.

[PKL]

Also, I have another suggestions:

Tormod > Muarim

They have the same availability, Tormod has 1-2 and 3-10 range, making him useful at shaving turns on 4-4 by breaking doors and stuff. Yes, he needs more BEXP than Muarim but Muarim's stuck with melee combat. He has 32Sp, Rexflame and doubles Auras with Nasir and can help getting rid of Cover Auras dealing nice dmg.

What about Heather > Shinon? Heather can be your main unit on GMs with Forges + Adept + Bane. She requires money but can perform well. Shinon can get Adept + Crossbows in exchange but I don't see him better than her. Shinon is picked first because you have already a main GM but when you lack it, Heather's better than him, imo. There's 3-3, for example.

Don't know if Naesala > Tibarn. Nestling is a good option when everybody else picked flyers, he can get to SS by 4-3 and get a 3 or 2 turn on 4-P and a 6 turn on 4-3.

Kurthnaga > Ena? He can double Ashera with capped Sp and Nasir, or at least above Gareth, or Trolliver.

Lol, poor Mist, shouldn't she be better than Stefan? She can get to 3rd Tier by 3-7 or 3-8 and help being a filler. Actually, well, never mind, she's awful, but I don't know.

Hmm... I see Danved a bit low :s.

EDIT: I want to do a Fiona solo.

It should be like a Miccy & Sothe duo for P1 just shaving a turn on 1-7 with Rescue+Canto+Give. For P3, she might get a 7 or 8 turn for 3-6, like a 3 or 4 turn on 3-12 and a 4 turn on 3-13 (Pass Boots 3rd Tier Fiona o_O). Then, Hawks...

EDIT 2: Lol Fiona Sol'ing Ike with Steel Grtlance hahahaha

EDIT 3: Actually, Fiona can get to 2nd tier by 1-E and get an acceptable sp, at least enough to double mage reinforcements. There's Paragon so she can get to something like 20/4 or 20/5 by the end of 1-E. Her Def should be enough to survive at least one Tiger hit.

Fiona

20/5 - 33.75HP 15Str 10.25Mag 15Skl 20Sp 15.25Lck 17.25Def 14Res

Let's give her a Seraph Robe, an Energy Drop, a Secret Book, an Ashera Icon and a Dracoshield (Damn resources).

20/5 - 40.75Hp 17Str 10.25Mag 17Skl 20Sp 17.25Lck 19.25Def 14Res

Wow, that looks nice for what she was on 1st Tier lol. She can resist 2 or 3 tiger hits with this, but she's stuck on the initial isle on 3-6, she can double them, and with Beastfoe, ORKO them. By the end of 3-6, she might be by 20/9 or 20/10, and probably capped Speed and Resistance, which helps her cap Def by 3-12 Base and get some Str/Hp, Skl and Luck.

She can even get to 3rd Tier by 3-12 and pwn those enemies with that avoid and those defenses. She can even get a good 3 turn. Lol, I'm making an altar for St. Fiona hahahaaha.

Muarim is over Tormod because Tormod cant kill the 1-7 or 1-E boss, Muarim can. Sure, Tormod can be BEXP'd to promotion and made decently useful, but Muarim can be BEXP'd and he can ORKO generals in the map even with A Strike. This lets him help Ike clean Oliver's room much faster. Muarim>Tormod.

There's no way Heather can be your main GM, assuming no RNG abuse. Let's look at the facts:

Heather's bases: Level 7 HP 32 Str 15 Mag 9 Skl 21 Spd 25 Lck 16 Def 10 Res 14 Knife C

She's 8 away from capping HP, 7 from str, 6 from mag, 4 from skl, 5 from spd, 24 from lck, 10 from def and 3 from res.

Heather's growths:

40 25 20 50 70 75 30 40

Assuming she gets BEXP'd to .99 and she gets a level in 2-2, we have:

32.40

15.25

9.20

21.50

25.70

16.75

10.30

14.40

Actually, lets be generous and say she got the boss kill in the map after stealing the Secret Book:

32.80

15.50

9.40

22

26.40

17.50

10.60

14.80

Then, she gets BEXP'd in 2-E to Level 17 (taking all your BEXP):

In her 10th level she would get:

skl spd lck 32.80 15.50 9.40 23 27 18 10.60 14.80

11th level:

skl spd lck 32.80 15.50 9.40 24 28 19 10.60 14.80

12th level:

skl spd lck 32.80 15.50 9.40 25 29 20 10.60 14.80

she capped skl here, her next highest growth is hp, tied with res.

13th level:

spd lck res/hp (lets say res since she can cap it faster) 32.80 15.50 9.40 25 30 21 10.60 15

she now capped spd. So shes going to get hp and res and lck.

14th level:

hp lck res 33 15.50 9.40 25 30 22 10.60 16

15th level:

hp lck res 34 15.50 9.40 25 30 23 10.60 17

she capped res, so now her next highest growth starts proc'ing, guess what? it isnt str.

16th level:

hp lck def 35 15.50 9.40 25 30 24 11 17

17th level:

hp lck def 36 15.50 9.40 25 30 25 12 17

Even if you somehow get her more levels, she still isnt going to start proc'ing str with BEXP anytime soon.

Let's say she joins you in 3-2 with 16 str.

Steel Knive forges have 9 MT and cost around 2000G with max MT and a lot more if you go for crit (which she might sorely need) and only have 20 uses. We're looking at 25 MT 30 AS 125-145 Hit (a bit more if you also give it the knive forge a bit of hit).

She can use Adept, so lets also assume it.

She will 3HKO sages so she does fine vs them as long as she procs Adept which might happen often thanks to 30 spd.

She does good vs swordmasters.

She barely damages halberdiers and like, 8HKOs them.

Same with Paladins.

Dont even think of her not tinking Generals.

Or Dragonknights...

Now she gets BEXP'd in 3-3 to Tier 2:

18th level:

hp lck def 37 15.50 9.40 25 30 26 13 17

19th level:

hp lck def:

hp lck def 38 15.50 9.40 25 30 27 14 17

20th level:

hp lck def 39 15.50 9.40 25 30 28 15 17

Tier 2 promo gains:

+4 +3 +4 +2 +2 +0 +3 +4

43 18.50 13.40 27 32 28 18 21

Now we're looking at 27 MT with a steel knive forge and her BEXP situation is still the same as always. She needs 2 levels on average to get a str proc now. She has innate pass and can have a celerity pass combination, which is cool. 3-3 is actually really kind to her if she can stay alive since she doesnt get care about killing enemies, just to get to the crates ASAP.

TL;DR: her BEXP situation is pretty bad without resources.

With resources like the Secret Book assumed in Part 2:

10th level:

skl spd lck 32.80 15.50 9.40 25 27 18 10.60 14.80

Capped skl, not bad.

11th level:

spd lck res 32.80 15.50 9.40 25 28 19 10.60 15

Let's give her the Talisman too now so she can cap res.

12th level:

hp spd lck 33 15.50 9.40 25 29 20 10.60 17

13th level:

hp spd lck 34 15.50 9.40 25 30 21 10.60 17

she now caps spd.

14th level:

hp lck def 35 15.50 9.40 25 30 22 11 17

15th level:

hp lck def 36 15.50 9.40 25 30 23 12 17

16th level:

hp lck def 37 15.50 9.40 25 30 24 13 17

17th level:

hp lck def 38 15.50 9.40 25 30 25 14 17

Let's give her 3 more levels >_>

18th level:

hp lck def 39 15.50 9.40 25 30 26 15 17

19th level:

hp lck def 40 15.50 9.40 25 30 27 16 17

20th level:

str (finally) lck def 40 16 9.40 25 30 28 17 17

That is still unimpressive. She will still have 26 MT, which fails to ORKO everything.

TL;DR- Heather is still bad even with a book and talisman for BEXP. The cost is just too high and the chance that she procs str is way too low due to other stats taking all the priority when BEXP'd. I'd rather draft Shinon and Rolf. They have 28 MT with a crossbow which is surprisingly much better than Heather, and they can nuke stuff in PP or from behind fences in EP (and with clever use, can have a short EP against 1-2 range enemies :P)

So you were complaining about the hawk's lack of 2 range and now u hail Naesala as a good pick because of his silver army? I dont even know what to say man. I dont agree with Naesala>tibarn btw. Hawk Army 4-2 is one of the hardest part 4 maps to LTC and tibarn helps a lot if you draft him there. On the other hand, even scrubs can do Silver Army well.

Kurthnaga's Night Tide does nothing and hes not a viable combat unit. At least Ena's Blood tide could help, maybe.

Mist isnt even filler. She's just, a big mess of a unit. :/ I think Stefan smashing 2 warriors near him in 4-3 and his endgame is better than Mist lool.

Let's evaluate Danved's contributions:

Getting the speedwing in 2-3.

Getting the other speedwing in 3-9 and being able to go up the ledge (doesnt save turns but its still...something?)

Arrives in 3-11 where foot units are unwanted. Might get BEXP'd.

3-E is flier and paladin land too, so hes largely unneeded...

Free route which is nice, but who wants an underleveled foot unit? Maybe Greil Army?

Meh endgame due to not having hammer access in 4-E-1 and 33 AS for the rest of the maps isnt exactly...ideal.

Yeah, I think he deserves to be that low...

Having Fiona as your main DB is basically a death sentence. You forfeit your BEXP, your 1-8. Your 3-6 will be troublesome too...your 3-12 might be good if you give her the boots and pass lol...Her str might bite though. And 3-13 is meh due to the ledges...

Like I said before, her only real possible contribution is 4-2...

Oh god that took sooooo long...

[Quintessence]

Is Muarim shaving a turn on 4-4 with a unit in charge of doors, another one killing reinforcements and Ike? The boss killing is irrelevant because Sothe can kill both Djur and Jarod. Tormod can blast doors from afar and shave a turn but...Muarim? That's why I think Tormod > Muarim.

At least, Kurth > Oliver. He can deal better damage to auras than what Oliver does. Kurth can get Paragon + Resolve + Wrath and get some level ups, get extra BEXP (after you have BEXP'd your main units) and cooperate with some shit, asides of getting Formshift which is quite nice. Sadly he can't get to S rank but what's doing Oliver? I don't know if he costs turns on 4-4, but he's doing nothing compared to Kurth. Staff use? Not even Rescue is needed for 4-E-4, and if needed, you already have Micaiah.

[PKL]

Is Muarim shaving a turn on 4-4 with a unit in charge of doors, another one killing reinforcements and Ike? The boss killing is irrelevant because Sothe can kill both Djur and Jarod. Tormod can blast doors from afar and shave a turn but...Muarim? That's why I think Tormod > Muarim.

At least, Kurth > Oliver. He can deal better damage to auras than what Oliver does. Kurth can get Paragon + Resolve + Wrath and get some level ups, get extra BEXP (after you have BEXP'd your main units) and cooperate with some shit, asides of getting Formshift which is quite nice. Sadly he can't get to S rank but what's doing Oliver? I don't know if he costs turns on 4-4, but he's doing nothing compared to Kurth. Staff use? Not even Rescue is needed for 4-E-4, and if needed, you already have Micaiah.

Tormod's combat in 4-4 when promoted is unreliable, because he starts the map in worst bio and is too frail. Muarim has no threat of dying and can contribute more by helping Ike with the generals in oliver's room. He's like a mini-nailah. And Sothe killing Jarod and Djur is kinda unreliable. Muarim makes it more reliable :P.

Kurth requires a huge BEXP dump just to have terrible combat with low move in 5 maps. Oliver can at least use rescue and use purge I guess. Both are horrible but Oliver might be able to contribute with rescue or he could be recruited early in 4-4 to help clean up his room (?) i dont even know since Ive never used him lol. But he cant be worse than Kurth, right?

[Aere]

Why is Shinon so low?

[charlie_]

Bow lock, lack of solid 1-2 range until the Double Bow and being a pain to shove iirc

[Quintessence]

Tormod's combat in 4-4 when promoted is unreliable, because he starts the map in worst bio and is too frail. Muarim has no threat of dying and can contribute more by helping Ike with the generals in oliver's room. He's like a mini-nailah. And Sothe killing Jarod and Djur is kinda unreliable. Muarim makes it more reliable :P.

Again, is Muarim really shaving a turn there? If yes, then, 1 or 2? Because Tormod does.

Kurth requires a huge BEXP dump just to have terrible combat with low move in 5 maps. Oliver can at least use rescue and use purge I guess. Both are horrible but Oliver might be able to contribute with rescue or he could be recruited early in 4-4 to help clean up his room (?) i dont even know since Ive never used him lol. But he cant be worse than Kurth, right?

Rescue is ok, although Miccy does that and better :s. But Oliver's combat is shit even with Resolve. At least Kurth can get bunches of skills and ORKO thunder sages and 3HKO generals, he flies, has shit 5 move, but can get to areas Oliver can't, for example, 4-E-1: when gens block the path, Kurth can "fly" and kill bishops, while Trolliver is stuck killing those gens. With Paragon + Resolve + Wrath, Kurth can crtkill gens and help clearing the map there (eastern side) while other units can focus on the center or on the Saints; whereas Oliver is 2HKO'd by gens and he has lolshine, or lolnosferatu, or lolvalaura with lolmagic! And barely kills them with Corona, lolskill and dat' bio. In the next chapters they are really irrelevant until 4-E-4 (where Oliver can, indeed, help with Rescue) or 4-E-5 (where Kurth, with all those combat levels and BEXP levels can have nice combat and deal more dmg to auras than Trolliver).

Oliver needs Rafiel to be on range. Rafiel can get to Oliver's room by turn 7 or 8, I don't remember clearly. However, he can be ferried by someone else, but why bother someone else who can contribute on something better (like opening doors, killing reinforcements, even getting chests) rather than ferrying Rafiel, and thus, recruiting Oliver? The one and only draft I used Oliver, I got 8 turns, and, iirc, he was ORKO'd by the spearberdier, and to kill gens, I had to rely on his best bio and make him Corona a general and then kill him.