Esau of Isaac Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 PAHAHA where are you coming from??? Haha Microsoft was one of the last oh wait they still are they don't have motion controllers.. Get some more facts. What is Kinect? Home consoles are designed with a price range and mass production in mind. With the PS4's rumored launch price of $400-$450, you can't honestly expect them to build and mass produce a platform capable of competing with a high tier gaming PC. The 360 and PS3 also used outdated technology, except Sony tried to be "innovative" with the PS3 and it ended up costing them because people weren't willing to pay that much for new technology on a home console. To be honest the gaming industry has not been truly "innovative" since the Xbox with Live; it has been gimmicks competing with other gimmicks since then.What can be said from the specs is that it blows the Wii U completely out of the water. It's not even worth discussing, and that is the worst we could've asked for, because if they try to do multiplat games the Wii U is either going to get none of them or hold the PS4 and new Xbox back. Okay, so it's a cheap PC for people that can't afford a gaming PC. That is what we should be saying, not that it's an innovative new powerhouse. Because it's not. Must.. Resist.. B-b-bring it Buster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Vanguard Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 If it can play all the PS games then it's an insta-buy. The controller looks like it will take some time getting use to. Other than that I will buy it on release day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangerine Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 (edited) Don't strawman my argument. You specifically said features that are new to the PS4/Nextbox. Shit like streaming video games is only actually good if you're a millionaire who can afford infinite bandwidth. Greatly pushing into more digital features while neglecting physical media (removing backwards compatibility is the big one) is absolutely baffling. I'm sure they'll announce more crap that PS4 can do. What they've shown so far does not impress me. Um, no, I didn't. I said the Wii U wishes it had features they will have - how could I possibly only be talking about new features when we barely know anything about the Xbox and PS4? Maybe take another read of my post. The Wii U can hardly compete with the features of the PS3 and 360, and there are still giant question marks on its actual competitors. Be unimpressed, but don't act like it doesn't compare favorably to the console we do know about. I love Nintendo games, but I'm not going to pretend their console or services are good. Okay, so it's a cheap PC for people that can't afford a gaming PC. That is what we should be saying, not that it's an innovative new powerhouse. Because it's not. Specs-wise the PS4 is innovative...for a home console. The allure of them has always been that they get a ton of games you can't legally play on your PC, and it won't be any different this gen. It's nothing special compared to a PC, but compared to the rest of the home console market it's a spectacle. I imagine the new Xbox will impress as well if it's anything similar. Edited February 21, 2013 by Tangerine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constable Reggie Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 (edited) The PS4 is not trying to copy the Wii U. The Wii U wishes it had half of the features the new PS/Xbox will. You specifically stated the next generation consoles. The features they will have. Not already have. Some of the PS4 features were shown, so I argued that the Wii U is (arguably) better off not having those Ps4 features. You turned this into an assumption that I was arguing that the Wii U not having as good online play as the Ps3/Xbox was a good thing, and changed the argument from the next generation console features to current gen console features. If that's not a strawman, I don't know what is. And no, the PS4 does not impress me so far compared to the WiiU for reasons mentioned already. I don't give a shit about better graphics if everything else, besides a small minority, you do is for the worse. The WiiU has the potential to make absolutely awesome party/couch co op games. The PS4 is urging me to just play with my friends online even more. Everything's online. I wouldn't be surprised if the co op in new PS4 games was just outright replaced with the online sharing feature thing. Edited February 21, 2013 by Constable Reggie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangerine Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 You specifically stated the next generation consoles. The features they will have. Not already have. Some of the PS4 features were shown, so I argued that the Wii U is (arguably) better off not having those Ps4 features. You turned this into an assumption that I was arguing that the Wii U not having as good online play as the Ps3/Xbox was a good thing, and changed the argument from the next generation console features to current gen console features. If that's not a strawman, I don't know what is. And no, the PS4 does not impress me so far compared to the WiiU for reasons mentioned already. I don't give a shit about better graphics if everything else, besides a small minority, you do is for the worse. The WiiU has the potential to make absolutely awesome party/couch co op games. The PS4 is urging me to just play with my friends online even more. Everything's online. I wouldn't be surprised if the co op in new PS4 games was just outright replaced with the online sharing feature thing. In this day and age, people are incapable of basic thinking! Let's break this down. "Features they will have" ..Features they will have. At what point does this statement specify what generation of features I am talking about? Are you saying they will not have the same features as the PS3 and 360? Because apparently it is improper for me to suggest they WILL have them just because they're old features. Here's a list of events for you: 1. I say the Wii U wishes it had features the PS4/Xbox will have 2. You mistake what I say to mean features that are COMPLETELY NEW to the consoles 3. I reply thinking you understood what I meant and still found the Wii U more impressive 4. You keep insisting that I am somehow at fault for this when it was you who didn't stop to think that maybe it would be illogical for me to only be talking about new features when we don't even know very much about the PS4, and don't know anything about the Xbox. Super? Super. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esau of Isaac Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 Specs-wise the PS4 is innovative...for a home console. The allure of them has always been that they get a ton of games you can't legally play on your PC, and it won't be any different this gen. But they don't, that's the thing. As time has passed the concept of true single-platform killer app titles has fallen by the wayside. Oftentimes they are multiplatform. For example, the only truly amazing title that I've seen from the PS4 so far is Watch Dogs. Which will be on the PC. Probably on the Xbox's successor console as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klokinator Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 ZombiU is a really, really good game. I'm just throwing this out there for no reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangerine Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 (edited) But they don't, that's the thing. As time has passed the concept of true single-platform killer app titles has fallen by the wayside. Oftentimes they are multiplatform. For example, the only truly amazing title that I've seen from the PS4 so far is Watch Dogs. Which will be on the PC. Probably on the Xbox's successor console as well. I disagree, the PS3 (and Wii to a lesser extent) has a ton of very good exclusives. It's the 360 that has had a lot of its best games shared with PC, but I still don't feel that makes it any less of a good buy. Edited February 21, 2013 by Tangerine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constable Reggie Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 (edited) Oh boy, semantics. Thankfully I already got the Wii U, which means now I gotta make the choice between PS4 and Xbox. I am at a loss for what next gen console I'm going to get next, the PS4 hasn't interested me yet so far, the only thing it says to me is "hey, we can be Nintendo too." *Is discussing next generation consoles, and specifically, new PS4 features, of which none have impressed the op* The PS4 is not trying to copy the Wii U *Still implicitly Implies that the discussion is on new features, ie the ones that the WiiU introduced and is being debated on whether or not the PS4 is aping those new features* The Wii U wishes it had half of the features the new PS/Xbox will. *Is the reverse of the previous sentence, and still implicitly implies the discussion is on new features, essentially saying that the WiiU wants to have the new features the PS/Xbox will have* If that was not your original intention, fine, just clarify to me that you were talking about all features in general instead of blatantly chastising me and my preferences. I disagree, the PS3 (and Wii to a lesser extent) has a ton of very good exclusives. PS3 had fuckall for good exclusives until roughly 2 years after launch, which probably isn't a very good indication of the PS4's games. edit: Common Sense? PFFFFF, more money please. Edited February 21, 2013 by Constable Reggie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangerine Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 If that was not your original intention, fine, just clarify to me that you were talking about all features in general instead of blatantly chastising me and my preferences. PS3 had fuckall for good exclusives until roughly 2 years after launch, which probably isn't a very good indication of the PS4's games. I like this "implicity implied"... I'm pretty sure I already clarified that and you decided to say I was forming a strawman argument, but alright. Uncharted and Ratchet and Clank were fantastic exclusives early on in the PS3's lifespan. But yes, it took a while to get started. Still doesn't change the fact that it has a lot of amazing exclusives you can't get on PC now, which was the point of the chat Isaac and I were having. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constable Reggie Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 (edited) A shame you won't be able to get them on PS4 likely anytime soon either. Pretty sure he was talking about PS4 exclusives too, not PS3. I like this "implicity implied"...I'm pretty sure I already clarified that and you decided to say I was forming a strawman argument, but alright. You didn't clarify shit. Your response felt like a straw man argument through and through. Edited February 21, 2013 by Constable Reggie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangerine Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 You didn't clarify shit. Your response felt like a straw man argument through and through. I guess my meaning wasn't clear when my reply discussed current generation features transferring to next generation consoles. I'll remember to spell things out better for you next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klokinator Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 99% of the good features from PS1 transferred to PS2. The same for the PS2 to PS3 transition. What Tangy is saying is that the same logic will most likely apply for the PS3 to PS4 transition, which certainly sounds logical to me. Gods this thread is turning into a shitfit contest though xP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 (edited) My favorite PS3 exclusive is Yakuza 4 and I'm mad that not everybody has the same tastes in that matter as I have Also mad that it is in fact an exclusive, and not a game everybody gets to play, but etc. To be honest, while parts of the game-sharing and play-while-downloading thing sound nice, they don't really get me that excited. As far as motion controls go, I've actually been sold on their potential, but I haven't seen polished enough games being made with MC to get me excited about it. There was Trauma Center, and then there was.. the other Trauma Centers? If the motion control Sony has in store has as much or more potential than anybody else's, that'd be cool, but it'd be nice if I could see the games for it please The little footage I've seen so far has had really cool visual fidelity and animations, from the looks of them, but I'm wondering just how much it'll leads to games costing to make. I'm wondering if that's the reason the lists I've seen for upcoming games have been so small. I can't know that for sure until I see numbers, of course, but I haven't heard of the upward trend in development costs changing any time soon. At least twice the number of titles listed on Giantbomb's summary page would be nice to hope for in the overall (if not exclusive) next-gen launch, if the next thing I ask for magically comes true. What would be really cool to me at this point is a console that makes game development more cost-efficient. The graphics in some of these titles look extremely polished, but it has been possible to make a game with such outstanding aesthetics that I didn't actually care whether it pushed the machine to its limits since, like, Sly Cooper at least? Wind Waker? Brutal Legend? I'd like a console that makes the rest of the Brutal Legend trilogy (yes I'm dumb enough to hold out "faith" and/or "hope" that one day Schaefer will touch the world of AAA's again, and that EA won't refuse to get out of the way) cost a combined total of one million dollars to make, please. Anybody remember that game, which isn't Watch Dogs, that had a trailer where the (female) protag is supposedly going to sneak/parkour around a cyberpunk/somewhat dystopian near-future setting and basically hack the memories of dudes? I remember seeing a trailer for it a while back, got a guy to kill himself by making him falsely remember that he'd shot his wife IIRC, something like that. This is totally irrelevant really, I just want to remember what that game's name was, and am assuming it'll be a next-gen title. Edited February 22, 2013 by Rehab Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S_Cero Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 http://www.destructoid.com/psn-purchases-will-not-carry-over-to-ps4-update--246229.phtml This just killed a lot of my anticipation for the console. Not only is it not backwards compatible with discs but it can't even play previous PSN downloads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 (edited) http://www.destructoid.com/psn-purchases-will-not-carry-over-to-ps4-update--246229.phtml Thanks a lot, Obama Shuhei Edited February 22, 2013 by Rehab Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balcerzak Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 But a touchscreen doesn't seem useful for the wiiu or the ps4 for the games I tend to play. Too much stuff happening too quickly that you can't switch between the touchscreen and the other controls so the touchscreen probably won't see much use in action rpgs. I thought the same thing until Castlevania:OoE Albus mode. Touch-screen warping, etc. was vital to my clear of Barlowe, Death, and probably a bunch of other bosses I can't remember. Granted, I think I didn't bother with the stylus, but just snuck in a pinky or something, but hey, whatever works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangerine Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 (edited) The reason the PS4 can't be backwards compatible is because it's using a completely different architecture from the previous three PlayStations, which were all notoriously difficult to develop for; Sony worked closely with third party devs who had complaints about the PS3's architecture in order to make the PS4 easy to develop for. The result is a system significantly easier for third party devs to work on, but impossible for previous generation games to be played the way they are currently. It's a painful loss but in the end it's a good thing. They had an answer for this issue in the future, it's just not clear how it's going to work yet. This is basically all we have so far: The PS4 will not support native backwards compatibility, but Gaikai will support some PS3 games on cloud (it’s still a project). The long-term goal is to have PS1, 2, 3 games on any device, and it will be rolled out in phases. They need to make the games capable of running on the PS4 rather than make the PS4 run the games with built-in backwards compatibility like we have gotten used to previously. The downside is it's most likely going to be entirely digital. And if we have to pay for games we already own then that would be ridiculous. Edit: Actually, I shouldn't even be replying to troll posts.. Edited February 22, 2013 by Tangerine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Exclusives do sell a console, and while the 360 doesn't have an abundance of said exclusive titles, Ace Combat 6 was essentially the only reason I got a 360 over a PS3. And the price between the consoles at the time. However I have yet to play MGS4, despite being a rather large MG fan. Once the PS4 is out, the PS3's price should hopefully plummet and I will finally play those PS3 exclusives I've wanted to since forever (MGS4 and GT5 come to mind). Well after looking at the list of PS3 exclusives, I would like to finally play the rest of the Killzone series, since I played the first on the PS2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constable Reggie Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 (edited) Even more reason to just buy a PS3 instead. Cheaper, doesn't prioritize online bullshit, and actually has games! I've always wanted to play MGS4. Incoming new "PS4 has no games" meme edit: Awww yeah give me more of your money Edited February 22, 2013 by Constable Reggie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esau of Isaac Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 It also won't support any of the PSN titles you bought on the PS3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constable Reggie Posted March 2, 2013 Share Posted March 2, 2013 http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/pre-owned-games-block-on-ps4-is-a-publisher-decision/0111344 Knowing most dumbass big publishers, this is not a good sign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Envoy of the Beginning Posted March 2, 2013 Share Posted March 2, 2013 Incoming new "PS4 has no games" meme The Wii U is suffering from "It has no games" though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constable Reggie Posted March 2, 2013 Share Posted March 2, 2013 To be fair, the WiiU only came out like 4 months ago. PS3 didn't have much significant stuff until like 2-3 years in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab Posted March 2, 2013 Share Posted March 2, 2013 (edited) Bioware wary of possible increasing development costs, while Take-Two claims to have actually tightened expenditures and is perhaps even bullish/supportive about/of the PS4. You know how to keep me on the edge of my seat, guys Edited March 2, 2013 by Rehab Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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