Legend of Zelda series, which is the best?

[peener weener]

You hate Skyward Sword just because the second fight with Ghirahim is similar to the first? That's just lame. Ghirahim is WAY different the third time you fight him. Did you even get that far? His first fight is only repeated ONCE.

Also, being linear doesn't mean it's a bad game. Have you even played it at all?

he never said that. stop getting so defensive and dumb about it.

[Anacybele]

he never said that. stop getting so defensive and dumb about it.

No, but he implied it. Also, excuse me for possibly MISUNDERSTANDING him. You don't have to flame me. Why are people bitching at me lately? In another thread not too long ago, someone told me I was "ruining" it simply because I was harmlessly debating.

[Redwall]

I liked Twilight Princess simply because it was a more refined OoT, and the fact that if you put time into searching, you could always find new things in the overworld, unlike in OoT. Exploring was my favourite thing in Wind Waker and TP, Ocarina's tiny field made finding all it's secrets a task taking only 15 minutes.

Understandable. Like I said, had I played it before playing some of the other Zeldas, I would probably consider TP to be among my favorites. After having gone through so many of the series entries, however, I was expecting something fresher. If it ain't broke, keep improving it.

[peener weener]

No, but he implied it. Also, excuse me for possibly MISUNDERSTANDING him. You don't have to flame me. Why are people bitching at me lately? In another thread not too long ago, someone told me I was "ruining" it simply because I was harmlessly debating.

there was no need to respond to him in a condescending manner. i was only replying in kind.

[Loki Laufeyson]

Skyward Sword was great on story but ass just about everywhere else. It is known.

A Link To The Past all day erryday. Best Zelda ever. 2D, good exploration, no handholding, a lot of fun, good challenge...yep

[Anacybele]

there was no need to respond to him in a condescending manner. i was only replying in kind.

Calling me dumb is not kind.

[peener weener]

Calling me dumb is not kind.

http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/in+kind

you're exactly right.

i'm done with this conversation. we'd both get warned eventually.

[Mighty Kamina]

aLttP > WW >>> Twilight Princess > Ocarina of Time > original > Skyward Sword > Majora's Mask > Adventure of Link

Would be my order from favorite to least. The praise Majora's Mask gets nowadays is a kind of strange when you consider the reaction of this game 10-12 years ago.

Sure, the Stone Tower Temple was probably one of my favorite dungeons ever, but the whole Great Bay area made me cringe.

I'd say the initial backlash for Majora's Mask was due to the fact that most people wanted a straight up Ocarina of Time sequel, and while Majora's Mask has a number of similarities to Ocarina of Time it has a quite a number of huge differences (3 day cycle, more emphasis on other characters and the story, the morbid tone of the plot, the increased difficulty, no Ganondork and such) that it was offsetting to players who just wanted a simple Ocarina of Time sequel. Now that many years have passed players are no longer in that mindset, people are now able to see Majora's Mask as the Masterpiece (IMO) that it is rather than just a strange sequel to Ocarina of Time. At least, that's my take on it.

Mind telling me what was so bad about the Great Bay area? It's one of the few water areas I like in video games, and I also found the Great Bay temple a thousand times more enjoyable than Ocarina of Time's water temple. In fact the Great Bay temple is the only water temple I like in the series. (I'm not meaning to be rude, I just actually like that part of the game.)

Edited April 25, 2013 by Zelos

[BrightBow]

Well, MM certainly wasn't impressive in numbers. Only 4 dungeons. Most models recyled from OoT...

But I say the praise is the result that it really aged well with it's audience.

At least to me, when I play it now, Cremia really gets to me.

The responsibility of the farm and the responsibility for her Romani are visibly a heavy burden to her but she does her best.

Then the foundation of the farm gets stolen and her sister gets abducted and irreconcilable changed. She has no idea what to do from now. And she has reason to feel guilty for both of these.

I never really thought about that much. I was just thinking she should be more concerned about her sister then about the cows.

Or with Pamela. She was not only surrounded by mummies but also had her own death in the closet, who one day might be unavailable to stop himself from eating her or whatever and there would be nothing she could run to.

And once that crisis is over, it's clear that she is the adult of the pair. She has all the responsibility of it... just without the power that usually comes with it.

Her father is free to ignore her concerns, getting his life in danger and that of his daughter along with it. She can see all that but as a child, he can just ignore her. So she is entirely helpless as he walks towards their doom.

All I could think of was, that she was kinda mean for throwing you out of the house.

Plus, helpless children with oblivious parents is a recurring theme in the game. A very real thing.

I think that it's something that gets over the head as long as you still have unlimited faith that your parents are always right and know what they are doing and you take the safety of your environment for granted.

Once those illusions are crushed and you experience this helplessness, then it will start sending shivers down your spine.

Edited April 25, 2013 by BrightBow

[Anacybele]

Cremia is one of the few MM characters I really like. She's a hardworking girl that's tasked with running a big ranch pretty much all by herself and has to deal with unrequited love because Kafei chose Anju over her for some reason (why, I don't know. Anju sucks at everything she does, it seems and she's not anywhere near as pretty as Cremia. Plus. Cremia could really use a man to help her out at the ranch). And there's those Gorman brothers that hassle her when she tries to deliver milk, and the cows disappearing. She really deals with a lot of crap, the poor girl. And no one seems to care but Link.

I also like Skull Keeta. He's cool cause he's a skeleton dude that puts up a fight and has a lot of honor and respect. And he gives Link one badass-looking hat.

Edited April 25, 2013 by Anacybele

[Anouleth]

I would have liked Majora's Mask more if it had less bullshit in it. Aside from the bullshit, it was a great game.

[BrightBow]

I would have liked Majora's Mask more if it had less bullshit in it. Aside from the bullshit, it was a great game.

Would you mind telling what you mean? Because I have to say, your post is not self-explanatory at all.

[Knight]

The thing I like about Majora's Mask was Skull Kid and the mask, I think Skull Kid may be my favourite Zelda villain.

[Icon of Sin]

Mind telling me what was so bad about the Great Bay area? It's one of the few water areas I like in video games, and I also found the Great Bay temple a thousand times more enjoyable than Ocarina of Time's water temple. In fact the Great Bay temple is the only water temple I like in the series. (I'm not meaning to be rude, I just actually like that part of the game.)

Even getting to the dungeon wasn't that exciting IMO. Invading the pirate fortress was a nice touch but I didn't really like the whole Zora egg retrieval part considering you have to keep them in bottles. The dungeon was also pretty confusing and I even had the player guide with me. The Zora form was pretty cool but I'm more of a Goron type of guy. I can see the appeal to the dungeon for some people but it really isn't my thing.

The only 3D water dungeon I even liked in comparaison was the Ancient Cistern in Skyward Sword. OoT Water Temple was mostly boring rather than difficult while the TP Lakebed Temple wasn't exactly entertaining either, sandwiched between two great dungeons. In most games I've never been fond of water settings, but always loved volanic, desert and haunted ones. The Ancient Cistern's Asian influences were a very nice touch and was overall a very beautiful and fun area.

[Anouleth]

Would you mind telling what you mean? Because I have to say, your post is not self-explanatory at all.

I mean the bits where instead of doing something cool, like going on an adventure, you were roped into doing some bullshit, like gathering eggs for some chick so she could get her voice back, or finding some old man so we could put a child to sleep, or having a "stealth section". Like, non-adventure stuff.

Wasn't really a big fan of the Goron Mask, either. And of course, it was too short. Instead of putting in more sidequests where you wipe people's asses, they should have put in more adventures. Or action or whatever. Isn't Zelda supposed to be action-adventure?

[Jedi]

This review says pretty much all of what I'd like to say of Majora's Mask

[Zera]

You hate Skyward Sword just because the second fight with Ghirahim is similar to the first? That's just lame. Ghirahim is WAY different the third time you fight him. Did you even get that far? His first fight is only repeated ONCE.

Also, being linear doesn't mean it's a bad game. Have you even played it at all?

I didn't say I hate SS, in fact I loved it, even beat it 100% on Hero Mode. But after that I had to check it against TP, my current favorite Zelda, so I did a speedrun. But then my speedrun turned into a completionist run at some point, and as I got sucked into Hyrule again I remembered why TP is my favorite.

I prefer TP's graphical style and music. There's more caves to explore, minigames, dungeons, and sidequests. This, combined with the fact that most of it is optional, greatly increased the replay value for me. There are some things that you just can't do outside of TP, like chicken-gliding across a large lake or fishing in the most scenic pond ever created. Oh, and bomb arrows, those are fun. Also, the ball and chain is my favorite item ever.

TP Dungeon Variety: Forest, Lava, Water, Sand, Ice, Time, Wind, Twilight, Epic Castle Finale (9 unique dungeon themes)

SS Dungeon Variety: Forest, Lava, Sand/Timeshift, Water, Sand/Timeshift, Lava, Bit-of-everything (4 unique dungeon themes)

SS has the best controls though. I kept trying to throw a bomb with the Wiimote in TP before realizing I had to run and tap the A button. I also like the item upgrade system. What's better than a slingshot? A spreadshot that spews seeds everywhere! Whats better than a bow? A sacred bow that instantly kills half the enemies in the game! What's better than a bug net? A really big bug net!

Unfortunately Skyward sword has very few unique midbosses and dungeon themes, and Ghirahim 2 is a terrible excuse for a boss (Ghirahim 3 is great though). And although the puzzles are fantastic as usual, it irks me that I can't skip any or complete them in a different order, like with other Zelda titles. And too many of the sidequests are fetch quests. (My sister is stuck on an island! Go there, then come back here for medicine, then go there again, then come back again for my gratitude crystal.) While Midna from TP is both an important character and very useful, Fi is a living, breathing tutorial that never goes away. "Master, the batteries in your Wii remote are nearly depleted." What I hate most of all though, is that the dialogue is pathetically slow for no reason, and holding the A button will barely speed it up at all.

Conclusion: I love SS, but I love TP more.

If anyone has finished TP and thinks SS is the best, speak now, or forever hold your argument.

[Zera]

This review says pretty much all of what I'd like to say of Majora's Mask

Excellent review. MM is my brother's favorite 3D Zelda too. I've always wanted to get into MM, and I really hope they make MM3D.

[Knight]

Excellent review. MM is my brother's favorite 3D Zelda too. I've always wanted to get into MM, and I really hope they make MM3D.

It's worth a play, especially if you're looking for something different than traditional Zelda. I think Anouleth dislikes it because it's far from any traditional sort of Zelda game, so if you do try it, be warned. However I don't expect a MM3D any time soon, as they're already working on 3 Zelda's at once.

[Anacybele]

I didn't say I hate SS, in fact I loved it, even beat it 100% on Hero Mode. But after that I had to check it against TP, my current favorite Zelda, so I did a speedrun. But then my speedrun turned into a completionist run at some point, and as I got sucked into Hyrule again I remembered why TP is my favorite.

I prefer TP's graphical style and music. There's more caves to explore, minigames, dungeons, and sidequests. This, combined with the fact that most of it is optional, greatly increased the replay value for me. There are some things that you just can't do outside of TP, like chicken-gliding across a large lake or fishing in the most scenic pond ever created. Oh, and bomb arrows, those are fun. Also, the ball and chain is my favorite item ever.

TP Dungeon Variety: Forest, Lava, Water, Sand, Ice, Time, Wind, Twilight, Epic Castle Finale (9 unique dungeon themes)

SS Dungeon Variety: Forest, Lava, Sand/Timeshift, Water, Sand/Timeshift, Lava, Bit-of-everything (4 unique dungeon themes)

SS has the best controls though. I kept trying to throw a bomb with the Wiimote in TP before realizing I had to run and tap the A button. I also like the item upgrade system. What's better than a slingshot? A spreadshot that spews seeds everywhere! Whats better than a bow? A sacred bow that instantly kills half the enemies in the game! What's better than a bug net? A really big bug net!

Unfortunately Skyward sword has very few unique midbosses and dungeon themes, and Ghirahim 2 is a terrible excuse for a boss (Ghirahim 3 is great though). And although the puzzles are fantastic as usual, it irks me that I can't skip any or complete them in a different order, like with other Zelda titles. And too many of the sidequests are fetch quests. (My sister is stuck on an island! Go there, then come back here for medicine, then go there again, then come back again for my gratitude crystal.) While Midna from TP is both an important character and very useful, Fi is a living, breathing tutorial that never goes away. "Master, the batteries in your Wii remote are nearly depleted." What I hate most of all though, is that the dialogue is pathetically slow for no reason, and holding the A button will barely speed it up at all.

Conclusion: I love SS, but I love TP more.

If anyone has finished TP and thinks SS is the best, speak now, or forever hold your argument.

I've finished both games, so I'll speak. Of course Skyward Sword doesn't have as many dungeon themes, it doesn't have as many dungeons period (which admittedly, I was a little disappointed in). Also, as mentioned before, Skyward Sword makes more use of all the items while TP just has Link use an item in one dungeon and then it's never needed again. The Spinner is my favorite item in the whole damn series, I really wanted to get to use it more outside Arbiter's Grounds aside from a strip of cliff in northern Hyrule Field. The Ball and Chain was neat too, as was the Dominion Rod and other stuff. But you didn't get to use them much at all outside the dungeons you got them in.

I also prefer Skyward Sword's graphics to TP's. I like the realism in TP, but I love how Nintendo took TWW's graphics and TP's graphics, both of which I loved, and combined them into a new and beautiful art style that satisified fans around the world. They did this because while TWW's style appeals more to the Japanese fans, the realistic style appeals more to us western fans. Nintendo wanted to create a style they thought would appeal to all of us and they succeeded for the most part.

I also liked ALL of Skyward Sword's dungeons, whereas TP had some I didn't fancy, like the City in the Sky and Lakebed Temple. Yes, TP's variety of themes is nice, but they could've been executed better in some areas, imo.

I also thought SS had a cooler overworld. I loved every area. They were all so fascinating and lovely, especially the Lanayru Desert, imo. I also thought Skyward Sword had better characters and sidequests. TP's just annoyed me half the time.

TP is an awesome game, don't get me wrong. I just loved Skyward Sword more.

[Zera]

I find it odd that people keep mentioning TP's items not getting use outside of dungeons. I guess that's to be expected, as TP has roughly twice as many items as SS.

I think I'll review them!

TP's Items

Horse Caller - With this, you can call Epona without horse grass, but you get it so late in the game that you'll stick to warping unless you really enjoy horse riding. 6\10

Double Clawshot - What's better than one clawshot? TWO! Now you can go ANYWHERE! 10\10

Dominion Rod - Any item that is a magical staff is good in my book, and this one is particularly interesting. It brings old statues to life, so it's useless without one nearby. It is used mostly in the Temple of Time, but there are other statues throughout Hyrule that you must awaken to gain access to The City in the Sky. There's even a statue in one of the courtyards of Hyrule Castle. 8\10

Ball and Chain - Not only can it break rocks as an alternative to bombs, but it can smash other things as well! It's very effective against ice enemies and redeads. Carrying it slows you down, but it can block certain attacks while in your hands. I had so much fun smashing all the furniture in Snowpeak Ruins. 10\10

Spinner - The spinner can deal minimal damage to enemies, but it's really only useful with a spinner rail nearby. There are many in the second half of Arbiter's Grounds, but only a few here and there around Hyrule. Although its use is limited, it is extremely fun to ride across rails at high speeds. 8\10

Bow and Arrow - Mandatory Zelda item. Accurate, powerful, but limited ammo. Also, the TP bow can use bomb arrows, which is just awesome. 9\10

Iron Boots - Stopping rolling gorons, walking on magnetic walls, stepping on tough switches, and walking underwater all require them, but they are also used against three different bosses (Fyrus, Morpheel, Argorok). This versatility and use throughout a great portion of the game make the TP iron boots my favorite. 9\10

Boomerang - Useful for spinning wheels, moving bomblings, grabbing distant items, and bringing bird monsters in Hyrule field into close combat. It doesn't get much late game use though. 7\10

Lantern - Unlike in many Zelda games, the lantern is not only useful for lighting torches, but also useful just for the light itself, because the caves in TP are really dark. You could just turn up the brightness on your TV, but that would be cheating! 9\10

Slingshot - Not only is it not required for anything in the game, but the slingshot is rendered obsolete upon obtaining the bow in the second dungeon. 4\10

Fishing Rod - Has no combat purpose whatsoever, but fishing in the pond on Zora's River is surprisingly deep and relaxing. 8\10

Hawkeye - Like the telescope from Windwaker. Not useful on its own, but you can combine it with your bow to snipe enemies. You can even combine it with bomb arrows for explosive sniping. 7\10

Bomb - Max 30. Blows up rocks and enemies, as always. Oh, and you need them to use cannons in Snowpeak Ruins. It's good to see classic items used in new ways. 8\10

Water Bomb - Max 15. Works underwater, but otherwise just a regular bomb. 7\10

Bombling - Max 10. Bomblings walk along the ground and explode when they hit something. They are more useful than regular bombs for combat because of this, but you can't hold many. 8\10

SS's Items

Bow and Arrow - The wooden bow can be upgraded to steel and sacred variations, making it extremely powerful. And because you get it later in the game, it doesn't kill the slingshot immediately. 9\10

Bomb - You can roll bombs as well as throw them, but you can also put bomb flowers in your bomb bag! Now you will never be without bombs! 9\10

Beetle - Good for cutting ropes, moving bombs, hitting switches, and scouting the area ahead. Useful throughout the whole game. 9\10

Bug Net - For the first time ever, I used the bug net to catch...bugs. 8\10

Slingshot - The slingshot is your only quick, high distance projectile until the 5th dungeon, and the upgraded spreadshot is excellent for stunning enemies and hitting switches without using the beetle or expending arrows. 9\10

Double Clawshot - Exactly as it is in TP, only this time it's not new. 9\10

Whip - While I used the whip in Spirit Tracks all the time, this one never saw any use outside of the Ancient Cistern. You can steal items from enemies, but it's easier to just equip the treasure medal. 5/10

Gust Bellows - Blowing away sand in the desert dungeons reminds me of sucking away sand in the basement in Luigi's Mansion. It can also spin spinners and move ceiling-rope platforms. Has no direct combat use. 7\10

What's YOUR favorite Zelda item?

[Knight]

I don't think the Dominion Rod deserves a score any higher than the whip, because it has pretty much the same amount of uses. The spinner I'd give only a slightly higher score, because I found it enjoyable to ride rails and pull it out randomly during boss fights. Clawshots have always been my favourite Zelda item anyway, in any incarnation. Also, you didn't review the Mogma Claws? They aren't on the item screen but are just as much an item as the rest.

Edited April 28, 2013 by Knight

[Anacybele]

TP also had more dungeons than Skyward Sword though, so its items could've gotten just as much usefulness. I see no excuse for them not to.

Also, you forgot items like the Digging Mitts/Mogma Mitts, Fireshield Earrings, Water Dragon's Scale, and Goddess's Harp.

Edited April 28, 2013 by Anacybele

[Zera]

Those aren't items, they are accessories. I actually don't like the Mogma Mitts that much. When I played the Earth Temple, I kept thinking it should be called the Fire Temple. I know that lava is molten rock, but in videogames lava=fire, and there were lots of fire enemies. So I was a bit disappointed when the Fire Sanctuary had - you guessed it - lava and fire enemies. Other than a new wallpaper, the only things that stuck out to me were the water fruits and lava hands. The midboss was literally just a recolored lizalfos which I defeated within seconds, and because I had all the major items already, the game gave me the Mogma Mitts. Digging underground sounds like a cool ability, but the underground rooms were cramped, links crawling speed was slow, and the game had to load upon entering and exiting a room. It just really killed the pace of the dungeon for me. So we've got a reused dungeon theme, a reused midboss, and an item that wasn't entirely necessary. I was expecting that Nintendo would make up for all this with a huge, epic, original, fun boss. So you can imagine my sheer disappointment upon re-fighting the first boss in the game.

The worst part of it all is this. (Skip to 37:00)

That platform you drop onto is made of ice, with slippy-slide physics and everything. It is the only ice in the entire game. It's as if Nintendo said "Yeah, we could have put a fun ice dungeon here like Snowpeak Ruins in TP, but whatever, let's do LAVA again! It's not like we have a massive budget or anything." I'm gonna be honest, Fire Sanctuary is a good dungeon, but in a game with only 7 dungeons, each one has to be special, and FS is not. And that's why Fire Sanctuary is my least favorite dungeon (Snowpeak Ruins is my favorite).

[Zera]

I also prefer Skyward Sword's graphics to TP's. I like the realism in TP, but I love how Nintendo took TWW's graphics and TP's graphics, both of which I loved, and combined them into a new and beautiful art style that satisified fans around the world. They did this because while TWW's style appeals more to the Japanese fans, the realistic style appeals more to us western fans. Nintendo wanted to create a style they thought would appeal to all of us and they succeeded for the most part.

I also liked ALL of Skyward Sword's dungeons, whereas TP had some I didn't fancy, like the City in the Sky and Lakebed Temple. Yes, TP's variety of themes is nice, but they could've been executed better in some areas, imo.

I didn't know Nintendo chose the visual style that way, thanks for telling me! For me, TP's graphics are better not because they're realistic, but because they're more detailed. What matters to me is that walls and cliffs are only blurry when I shove my face into them (Which I sometimes do that to appreciate wall and floor textures ).

Just because a game is cel-shaded doesn't mean it can't be detailed. A really good example of a highly detailed cel-shaded game is Red Steel 2.

See? Now if SS had THAT level of detail, it could definitely be better-looking than TP.

Also the Lakebed Temple is one of my favorite water temples. The best dungeons are those that are so confusing that you can just get lost and hang around for hours.

And the music is so...ambient!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSeY3T1wN5M