HK Motendra Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 The difference between Roy and the characters from the franchises you mentioned is that Roy is not the main character of his franchise while the others are. FE has many different main characters, and Roy is hardly the most recent one anymore. Chrom is the most likely newcomer for FE right now, if his status as the newest main lord and Arena Ferox being a confirmed stage says anything. About that.... R.O.B. doesn't even have a franchise but has been seen in others like mario kart and f-zero. And if recency had anything to do with it, Game & Watch would have already been dropped Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 About that.... R.O.B. doesn't even have a franchise but has been seen in others like mario kart and f-zero. And if recency had anything to do with it, Game & Watch would have already been dropped ROB appeared in a lot of games, yes. Roy has not. Game & Watch is the main character of his franchise, Roy isn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Not to mention that characters like R.O.B, Game & Watch and the Ice Climbers add quite a bit of diversity to the cast. Roy is just another guy with a sword. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HK Motendra Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 ROB appeared in a lot of games, yes. Roy has not. Game & Watch is the main character of his franchise, Roy isn't. Not to mention that characters like R.O.B, Game & Watch and the Ice Climbers add quite a bit of diversity to the cast. Roy is just another guy with a sword. Both of you have valid points but with that logic,they might as well drop Ike for Chrom and/or Michaiah (although I'm still rooting for Ike to stay). And the difference with Roy to other FE lords is his affinity with fire. That ability can be exploited into many different things. All in all, Marth Roy and Ike are the three most well known and iconic lords and have found a place in Smash Bros. It'd be a shame to just cut any of them out permanently Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 (edited) Roy is just another guy with a sword. Your point is? I'm waiting for a legit one. Roy's animations and flame based attacks give him all the diversity he needs. By this logic of yours Marth has even LESS then Roy but Sakurai gave him many Jugdral style swordmaster strikes to make up for it. Plus if Sakurai wanted to the healing factor of the Sword of Seals could be used. Oh yeah also try telling people "Just a guy with a sword" to Shulk, Issac, Chrom, Lucina and Takamaru supporters. People discredit Roy just because they hate his game. Enough with that, I am willing to say oh maybe Roy won't be returning but darn it if I'm not going to try and support his return, I'd be shaming the character who got me into the FE games if I didn't support his possible return. Edited July 27, 2013 by Folgore Red II Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Not to mention that characters like R.O.B, Game & Watch and the Ice Climbers add quite a bit of diversity to the cast. Roy is just another guy with a sword. Roy's pretty popular in Moonland, as has as much moveset potential as most other possible swordsmen. His return would please a lot of SSB fans, but I'm not sure how relevant he is FE-wise. Still, I could see him potentially appearing as a surprise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garteam Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 I honestly think Roy isn't coming back (just ignoring relevancy or de-cloning or popularity and any other arguement) because Sakurai has already stated all of Brawl's cast isn't going to return due to development time. In my opinion, unless some how a Melee character is gonna take priority over a Brawl character, I doubt Roy is getting in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadykid Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Your point is? I'm waiting for a legit one. Roy's animations and flame based attacks give him all the diversity he needs. By this logic of yours Marth has even LESS then Roy but Sakurai gave him many Jugdral style swordmaster strikes to make up for it. Plus if Sakurai wanted to the healing factor of the Sword of Seals could be used. Oh yeah also try telling people "Just a guy with a sword" to Shulk, Issac, Chrom, Lucina and Takamaru supporters. People discredit Roy just because they hate his game. Enough with that, I am willing to say oh maybe Roy won't be returning but darn it if I'm not going to try and support his return, I'd be shaming the character who got me into the FE games if I didn't support his possible return. I found a projectile, you're wrong! the real most annoying one that people request isn't Roy, it's Owain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) I honestly think Roy isn't coming back (just ignoring relevancy or de-cloning or popularity and any other arguement) because Sakurai has already stated all of Brawl's cast isn't going to return due to development time. In my opinion, unless some how a Melee character is gonna take priority over a Brawl character, I doubt Roy is getting in. Correction, Sakurai said he'll only cut characters if time constraints force him to. He didn't say anyone was getting cut for sure. Also, I believe Ike still has priority over Roy because he's starred in more titles and is a default character in Brawl (which have never been cut completely). Ike has more references in Awakening too, making him more important to FE than Roy. Marth has the most titles and is practically the mascot lord, not to mention he's already been in both Melee and Brawl, so he's sticking around. Edited July 28, 2013 by Anacybele Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HK Motendra Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Correction, Sakurai said he'll only cut characters if time constraints force him to. He didn't say anyone was getting cut for sure. Also, I believe Ike still has priority over Roy because he's starred in more titles and is a default character in Brawl (which have never been cut completely). Ike has more references in Awakening too, making him more important to FE than Roy. Marth has the most titles and is practically the mascot lord, not to mention he's already been in both Melee and Brawl, so he's sticking around. Regardless of priority, Roy is still among the more known lords throughout the series, even if he had only one game. And Smash Bros is no longer just a compilation of Nintendo franchises, it's its OWN franchise now and unless it were like FE which doesn't always have reoccurring characters, no one character should have a higher priority towards another unless it regards choosing whose next to join. It's just one roster that gradually expands. As for Ike, of course he would be a default, he was a newcomer that was already released prior to his inclusion along with being an international character. His status in the FE franchise doesn't make him the better candidate because both of them appeared in Smash at one oint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Last I checked Roy is actually more popular than Ike >_> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Last I checked Roy is actually more popular than Ike >_> Did I say anything about popularity? Anyway, that's only true in Japan. As far as I've seen, the west likes Ike more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadykid Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Last I checked Roy is actually more popular than Ike >_> Japan doesn't count, therefore Ike is more popular Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gelato Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Japan doesn't count, therefore Ike is more popular Yes, Japan doesn't count. The Japanese series made by a Japanese company by Japanese staff does not account to Japan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) Did I say anything about popularity? Anyway, that's only true in Japan. As far as I've seen, the west likes Ike more. Because US players did not get SoS? Because US players perception on Roy is he is the worst Lord ever since Marth, despite the fact that before SD, Marth ranges from good(3) into hilariously overpowered?(1) Edited July 28, 2013 by I have a Dragon Boner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amadeuscho Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Regardless of priority, Roy is still among the more known lords throughout the series, even if he had only one game. And Smash Bros is no longer just a compilation of Nintendo franchises, it's its OWN franchise now and unless it were like FE which doesn't always have reoccurring characters, no one character should have a higher priority towards another unless it regards choosing whose next to join. It's just one roster that gradually expands. As for Ike, of course he would be a default, he was a newcomer that was already released prior to his inclusion along with being an international character. His status in the FE franchise doesn't make him the better candidate because both of them appeared in Smash at one oint In terms or priority, it is about how the roster appears to be determined. Theres a number in programming that indicates possible the ord the characters were programmed in, so that appears to be how Sakurai's team works when putting in characters. Smash Bros has been its own franchise since Melee, but it still is a celebration of Nintendo's history. Ike has a character better represents that particular era of Fire Emblem. His status as a Fire Emblem character makes him a better candidate because he made it into Brawl, while Roy did not make it much farther than the planning stages. That means there is something in either his character or design within the FE series that made him a better choice for that iteration of Smash. Nothing has really changed for these two characters to change this status within FE or Smash for that matter. Because US players did not get SoS? Because US players perception on Roy is he is the worst Lord ever since Marth, despite the fact that before SD, Marth ranges from good(3) into hilariously overpowered?(1) I think it's more of the former, as there is different level of love and popularity that comes with a character whose game you have experienced in its entirety. It's unfortunate, but it's not the fault of players in the West. I'm sure most would have played the game had it been brought over. It is just a function of Roy's existence that you have to reconcile. It sucks that Sigurd, Leif, Alm, Celica, and Seliph get no love in the west as well. But that's Nintendo's fault. And it doesn't change Ike's popularity. I think I would approach the reps by having reps for each of the individual eras of Fire Emblem: Classic Era: Marth. The series remained in Japan during this era, from famicom to super famicom. Marth reflects the design principles of that era, from his background (which many of the other FE games use a blueprint) to his design (blue hair, etc). Marth also represents the classic lord archetype, in terms of fighting style and attributes. Modern Era: Ike. The series skipped the N64 and went straight to the GBA and GC. The series also went international for the first time, allowing individuals across the world to play the series. Roy comes from this era as well, but Ike represents it better and is more iconic for a few reasons. Ike breaks the typical Lord more than any other Lord before by being not royalty, having a rough fighting style, being from the mercernary archetype, and being such a useful unit with a good defense from the start. This is also more reflective of modern gaming (hence the modern era). Ike also happens to be in an internationally released game, which is an important feature of this era. His design also reflects modern sensibilities of a hero in the modern gaming era moreso than any other lord in the series. Revival Era: Lucina (or Chrom). The other story of the modern era is the series decline (in sales), starting RD, and continuing with Shadow Dragon, resulting in its sequel being Japan-only. Awakening is conceived as a possible swan song of the series, combining the series most popular elements and streamlining the game even more in terms of difficulty and design. The resulting game is a strong success for Nintendo and the series, both commercially and critically. It puts the series back in Nintendo's good graces and even allows for FE to have a crossover with another series, Shin Megumi Tensei. Lucina would be the best in my opinion because she represent certain aspects of the game, but Chrom would work as well. I think it should go to whoever ends up being the more popular of the two amongst new FE fans whose first game was Awakening (my guess is that would be Lucina). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) I agree with your post, Jaytalks. Except because Chrom is actually the main character of Awakening rather than Lucina, he's more likely to get in SSB4 than her. Edited July 28, 2013 by Anacybele Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shotguner159 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I agree with your post, Jaytalks. Except because Chrom is actually the main character of Awakening rather than Lucina, he's more likely to get in SSB4 than her. Lucina's both more popular and is the one IS push as the face of the game now it's out. She's on the cover of both the soundtrack and artbook and Chrom isn't. If Sakurai asks IS who they think he should put in like he did with Brawl, aren't they more likely to suggest Lucina than Chrom with how much they love her? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amadeuscho Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 I agree with your post, Jaytalks. Except because Chrom is actually the main character of Awakening rather than Lucina, he's more likely to get in SSB4 than her. I think Chrom is more likely, but I personally prefer Lucina. But if Chrom made it in I would not mine. In agreement with Shotguner159, I think IS favors her as the character to represent the game in other media. I can't speak about who IS would recommend, but I think it should be Lucina. I think of Robin, Chrom, and Lucina all as the main characters, in the same way as Lyn, Eliwood, and Hector are all the main characters. There are clear indications of this as all have important prior battle talks with bosses, all are present at the end of the intro, etc. Lucina is only not automatically available because she comes in at a lower level. I don't mind her death not resulting in a gameover because if give other players more options on how they want to play, and matches with the other potential mothers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadykid Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 Yes, Japan doesn't count. The Japanese series made by a Japanese company by Japanese staff does not account to Japan. how many s do I have to add for you to catch sarcasm or should i also add /kappa to it next time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Stewart Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 Because US players perception on Roy is he is the worst Lord ever since Marth, despite the fact that before SD, Marth ranges from good(3) into hilariously overpowered?(1) I really wish people would stop using "OMG but Roy sucks!" as an argument against him. In-game abilities don't really affect characters all that much in Smash, otherwise characters like Mewtwo and Samus would be gamebreakers. I think I would approach the reps by having reps for each of the individual eras of Fire Emblem: Classic Era: Marth. The series remained in Japan during this era, from famicom to super famicom. Marth reflects the design principles of that era, from his background (which many of the other FE games use a blueprint) to his design (blue hair, etc). Marth also represents the classic lord archetype, in terms of fighting style and attributes. Modern Era: Ike. The series skipped the N64 and went straight to the GBA and GC. The series also went international for the first time, allowing individuals across the world to play the series. Roy comes from this era as well, but Ike represents it better and is more iconic for a few reasons. Ike breaks the typical Lord more than any other Lord before by being not royalty, having a rough fighting style, being from the mercernary archetype, and being such a useful unit with a good defense from the start. This is also more reflective of modern gaming (hence the modern era). Ike also happens to be in an internationally released game, which is an important feature of this era. His design also reflects modern sensibilities of a hero in the modern gaming era moreso than any other lord in the series. Revival Era: Lucina (or Chrom). The other story of the modern era is the series decline (in sales), starting RD, and continuing with Shadow Dragon, resulting in its sequel being Japan-only. Awakening is conceived as a possible swan song of the series, combining the series most popular elements and streamlining the game even more in terms of difficulty and design. The resulting game is a strong success for Nintendo and the series, both commercially and critically. It puts the series back in Nintendo's good graces and even allows for FE to have a crossover with another series, Shin Megumi Tensei. Lucina would be the best in my opinion because she represent certain aspects of the game, but Chrom would work as well. I think it should go to whoever ends up being the more popular of the two amongst new FE fans whose first game was Awakening (my guess is that would be Lucina). That's nice, but I thought we played as characters in Smash, not "Eras." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadykid Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 I really wish people would stop using "OMG but Roy sucks!" as an argument against him. In-game abilities don't really affect characters all that much in Smash, otherwise characters like Mewtwo and Samus would be gamebreakers. That's nice, but I thought we played as characters in Smash, not "Eras." fortunately for him, he's probably right about the characters inb4 Ike gets cut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 (edited) I really wish people would stop using "OMG but Roy sucks!" as an argument against him. In-game abilities don't really affect characters all that much in Smash, otherwise characters like Mewtwo and Samus would be gamebreakers. We're talking about popularity here I mean, go make a poll about favorite lord Generally, Marth would get high votes, because he's Marth Hector would get tons alongside Lyn, because they are the "popular Lord" of the first game in the series Chrom/Luci would get some for being in Awakening etc However, one that would be an outlier is Sigurd, one of the LEAST popular Lord in the series, possibly outclassing Seliph in the poll. And guess what? Sigurd's popularity comes mainly for the fact that he is fucking overpowered, and the same can't be said for Japan, who actually nearly does not give a fuck about Sigurd Edited July 29, 2013 by I have a Dragon Boner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Stewart Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 I mean, go make a poll about favorite lord Generally, Marth would get high votes, because he's Marth Hector would get tons alongside Lyn, because they are the "popular Lord" of the first game in the series Chrom/Luci would get some for being in Awakening etc However, one that would be an outlier is Sigurd, one of the LEAST popular Lord in the series, possibly outclassing Seliph in the poll. And guess what? Sigurd's popularity comes mainly for the fact that he is fucking overpowered, and the same can't be said for Japan, who actually nearly does not give a fuck about Sigurd http://www.easypolls.net/poll.html?p=51763efee4b0bd1609c69c04 Yeah, I mean look at how popular Sigurd is. He's like, way more popular that Roy amirite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadykid Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 http://www.easypolls.net/poll.html?p=51763efee4b0bd1609c69c04 Yeah, I mean look at how popular Sigurd is. He's like, way more popular that Roy amirite. Eliwood and Eirika=Roy, yup yup definitely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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