SSB4: SSB for Wii U and 3DS, maybe the NX and also your toaster!

[Lord of Gabriel Knight]

Geez.

People are so impatient. -.-

And? So? I don't want to have to wait for some unnecessarily long amount of time or do a huge amount of things to unlock a character when I'd rather do it by beating a specific mode with a limitation.

[Anacybele]

Luigi's nemesis is King Boo if anyone. And King Boo wouldn't fit into Smash Bros as a playable character. An assist trophy, sure. But not playable.

And Waluigi did not appear in Dark Moon at all. I've played through the entire game and I have the strategy guide. Nowhere in both is Waluigi seen or mentioned.

Edited May 5, 2014 by Anacybele

[PM ME MARIANNE ART]

He should have made it.

Luigi needs to have his sinister villain in like Wario has for Mario.

If this forum had a like button i would use it for this

[PuffPuff]

And? So? I don't want to have to wait for some unnecessarily long amount of time or do a huge amount of things to unlock a character when I'd rather do it by beating a specific mode with a limitation.

You could just start the mode playing with no one then setting it to one life and killing off your character ending the match in instant seconds.

Luigi's nemesis is King Boo if anyone. And King Boo wouldn't fit into Smash Bros as a playable character. An assist trophy, sure. But not playable.

And Waluigi did not appear in Dark Moon at all. I've played through the entire game and I have the strategy guide. Nowhere in both is Waluigi seen or mentioned.

Oh...

I haven't really played them. I only heard that his rival was him from the Mansion games even though that was probably a joke.

Edited May 5, 2014 by Barbie

[PuffPuff]

Whoops. Double post. Erase. Already sent the report.

Edited May 5, 2014 by Barbie

[BANRYU]

I hate to say it, but Waluigi's almost more like a joke-nemesis to Luigi. He's never actually done anything aside from Kart, Party, and play sports. I really love the way Waluigi is characterized in fan-material like Brawl in the Family, but in the official Nintendo canon, Waluigi is pretty flat...

1) Tease him because he's someone fans have been crying out for since Melee. If there's any potential addition to the SSB4 roster that would be huge and garner a ton of hype, it's Ridley. Given that, I can easily see Sakurai leading up to a grand reveal like this.
2) That would simply be the surface logic. You need such for this kind of teasing/trolling.

That's true, but I think you're missing the most significant part of my observations on the NDD-- Sakurai NEVER hints at playable characters before they're officially revealed. IMO, the fact that he teased Ridley is, in itself, the single biggest reason why he will most likely not be playable. You could even argue that Sakurai hinting at him in the Pyrosphere Miiverse post rules him out as a playable newcomer, since all the newcomers are getting special trailers for their reveals that were otherwise completely unhinted at whatsoever. His shadow in the NDD was just another nail in the coffin... maybe not the final nail, but...

All I see clearly demonstrated is Ridley in the air. Besides, a stage boss' movement shouldn't just be in a straight line, should it? Especially one like Ridley, whom we've seen moving in much spectacular ways back in Brawl.

Try watching the Ridley sequence that I linked a few more times; if you trace the lines of motion for both Ridley and Pikachu, you can clearly see that Pikachu is traveling down the seams dead-center of the stage, while Ridley's shadow is hovering more over the outer panels closer to the background. Technically though, you could perhaps view the fact that he's flying (apparently in a constant motion, without a lot of up-and-down motion that would indicate repeated jumps) as further evidence that he's a stage boss in this appearance.

When I watch it again myself, I'm personally starting to favor the 'unfinished' theory more and more, since you can kind of see that his wings aren't really flapping in what appears to be a natural motion; instead they flap down, and then kind of just reverse back up instead of making the sort of undulating motion that flapping wings make. Although, maybe this is just the shadow and doesn't really reflect the animation on Ridley's model. Anyway the fact that he's moving in a line is merely incidental, I think. It was a very short clip, so I'm sure he'll move in plenty more dynamic ways in the game's final cut.

That's really old and vague. I think that would probably be impossible. If we had put our best efforts into it, we may have been able to do it.
I think Ridley is worth their best efforts. I don't think he's guaranteed or anything, but I think there's reason enough to believe he still stands a pretty good chance. E3 will be the deciding factor.

It's an old interview, that's very much true, but the point I was making is that this demonstrates how Sakurai has a very decidedly clear-cut mindset when it comes to Ridley. I absolutely agree that Ridley is worth the effort, and probably wouldn't even be as difficult as characters like Wii Fit Trainer or even Little Mac to come up with moves for, but I just question whether Sakurai himself actually believes he's worth the effort. Maybe things have changed in his mind, but I can't help but remain skeptical.

If was Ridley was revealed, do you think it would be as huge as Sonic's was?

Not really. I can guarantee that I will personally provide a nearly-equal explosion of hype should he in fact get in, though.

"Life is nothing, it's a nothing, life is nothing but a slap to the face. Life is nothing, it's a nothing, life is nothing but a fat rat race."

Smash Bros is love, Smash Bros is life.

Haha well said.

You remember that Brawl had six Pokemon, right? Sakurai doesn't care about making sure that some imaginary 5 character per franchise limit is followed.
Edit: source: http://www.polygon.com/2013/8/7/4598234/smash-bros-sakurai-discusses-the-pain-of-modern-game-development

True enough, though I don't see the evidence of that in the source. What I do see is words of wisdom from the big man up top...

I never said that it wasn't. That's just what I think.

...And Mewtwo should make it because of his Mega evolutions.

Fair enough. o3o Just keep in mind that 'should' =/= 'will'. Ridley in Brawl (and debatably, Smash 3U) is perfect proof of that... ~___~ Although MegaMewtwo WOULD be really cool to see.

I agree that Falco and Wolf need their own Final Smashes. Three Landmasters is just lazy, lazy, lazy. Especially since as Banryu said, Falco prefers the air. :P He IS a bird, after all.

What's more, I think Falco even has a line in one of the Star Fox games where he actually explicitly says, "You'll never get me in one of those things," when Fox is in a Landmaster.

SAKURAAAAAAIIIII

Edited May 5, 2014 by BANRYU

[SoulSilver]

I'm wondering what moveset waluigi would have used...

[BANRYU]

There are a few Brawl mods that made Waluigi playable.... here's one:

Edited May 5, 2014 by BANRYU

[Anacybele]

Well, now I've made myself want King Boo for an assist trophy lol. Him and Frederick are now my most wanted assist trophies! Franchises are getting more than one assist trophy now since we know Metroid has three, so Fire Emblem could get more than just Lyn too. As for other series:

Mario: Daisy, Bowser Jr.

Zelda: Ghirahim, Vaati (if neither are playable)

All I can think of atm.

[solrocknroll]

I honestly think that the only way that Waluigi could possibly be playable in any Smash Bros game is if he becomes a character in a Wario game. Even then, he'd likely need to be prominent in said game, and even then-er still, Captain Syrup, Mona, or Ashley all could vie for a Wario character.

This makes me think that a Wario Land with Wario, Waluigi, and Syrup would be pretty cool.

[PuffPuff]

I'm wondering what moveset waluigi would have used...

Already shows it on display of his asset trophy.

[SoulSilver]

For the mother series i could think of paula (she has my name lol) kumatora, duster, masked man or even boney (as assist trophies)

Edited May 5, 2014 by SoulSilver

[SoulSilver]

There are a few Brawl mods that made Waluigi playable.... here's one:

It looks fun to play with, and that final smash, it's epic x)

[Florete]

That's true, but I think you're missing the most significant part of my observations on the NDD-- Sakurai NEVER hints at playable characters before they're officially revealed. IMO, the fact that he teased Ridley is, in itself, the single biggest reason why he will most likely not be playable. You could even argue that Sakurai hinting at him in the Pyrosphere Miiverse post rules him out as a playable newcomer, since all the newcomers are getting special trailers for their reveals that were otherwise completely unhinted at whatsoever. His shadow in the NDD was just another nail in the coffin... maybe not the final nail, but...

Ya know, that's kind of the exact point I was making. If any character would be worth such a special case, it's Ridley. Think of it this way: if he really wanted to de-confirm Ridley as playable, why didn't he just do it completely? There are two supposed de-confirmations, but both are vague, unlike others such as Dillon or any assist trophy. For the Pyrosphere thing, he could have said "Samus will fight Ridley," instead of a vague "someone from her past*." For the boss thing, they could have shown Ridley more in full, even if he's just unfinished (surely they could have shown something).

And if Ridley isn't playable but Sakurai still didn't want to de-confirm him completely...why? What would be the point?

*Another thing I thought of on this note: We don't know most of the modes in this game, and if I recall correctly, this was before the announcement of stage bosses at all. There could be something like Melee's Adventure mode, and it's on that stage where you fight Ridley.

Edited May 5, 2014 by Red Fox of Fire

[BANRYU]

Ya know, that's kind of the exact point I was making. If any character would be worth such a special case, it's Ridley. Think of it this way: if he really wanted to de-confirm Ridley as playable, why didn't he just do it completely? There are two supposed de-confirmations, but both are vague, unlike others such as Dillon or any assist trophy. For the Pyrosphere thing, he could have said "Samus will fight Ridley," instead of a vague "someone from her past*." For the boss thing, they could have shown Ridley more in full, even if he's just unfinished (surely they could have shown something).

And if Ridley isn't playable but Sakurai still didn't want to de-confirm him completely...why? What would be the point?

I guess this is the point where we hit subjective interpretation, which can't really be proven one way or another. :0 I don't know how to answer why Sakurai wouldn't just come out and say it's Ridley; I suppose maybe he wants to perform the dual act of keeping younger/ignorant gamers guessing, while throwing out the unmissable references to those who can catch them, but that's only a guess at best, I really can't imagine why.

I guess I'm just cautious of the possibility that this is such a 'special case', as you say... This has happened before, you know.

I don't know if y'all were following Brawl's development as closely as I was back in the day, but there were many such hints toward Ridley being playable then as well. First we got the badass remix of Ridley's theme, then the announcement of Norfair-- where Ridley's lair lurks-- and Frigate Orpheon, the ship he commanded in Metroid Prime prior to its crash. All this appeared, yet still no mention of Ridley being playable... Of course, I had no doubt that he would be, why would all this evidence be presented if he WEREN'T going to be?

...I didn't realize then what I realize now, which is that all the signs didn't point to him being playable, as I thought-- I didn't see the simplest and most subtle sign of all: Sakurai was indeed hinting toward his existence in the game, but he never does that with playable characters. Maybe things will be different this time around... ...but like I said, this has happened before. I can only see history repeating itself so far as Ridley's fate is concerned.

And if I'm wrong, well, I'll be as happy as can be, you can be sure of that.

But I'm quite certain that I'm not.

Edited May 5, 2014 by BANRYU

[NinjaMonkey]

I agree that Falco and Wolf need their own Final Smashes. Three Landmasters is just lazy, lazy, lazy. Especially since as Banryu said, Falco prefers the air. :P He IS a bird, after all.

You do realise that giving Falco and Wolf an Arwing/Wolfen, would be a lot harder to implement than giving them a Landmaster, (assuming it could be even implemented in the first place), right?

[TheWill]

I'd find it pretty funny if the Ridley wing shown was from a playable Ridley, with the stage hazard actually being something else entirely. I don't really care for Ridley too much (Toadette much better), but to the fans who want him, good luck!

[Anacybele]

You do realise that giving Falco and Wolf an Arwing/Wolfen, would be a lot harder to implement than giving them a Landmaster, (assuming it could be even implemented in the first place), right?

I said I never played Star Fox before. So no.

[NinjaMonkey]

In that case. why are you moaning about it, then?

[SoulSilver]

I think Ridley did a fine job as a boss in brawl (both of them) i like him better that way, if he is playable indeed, i hope at least a fight against meta ridley as a boss

[Anacybele]

I never "moaned" about it. In fact, I never even mentioned an Arwing or Wolfen. I simply said Falco and Wolf should have their own Final Smashes rather than Fox's.

[BANRYU]

You do realise that giving Falco and Wolf an Arwing/Wolfen, would be a lot harder to implement than giving them a Landmaster, (assuming it could be even implemented in the first place), right?

Do you realize that you're not a video game programmer and thus probably have no idea what you're talking about?

It's probably no harder to implement than anything else in the game. Sakurai's a creative guy, have a little goddamn faith. He can figure it out if that is indeed what he decides to do with Falco and Wolf.

I'd find it pretty funny if the Ridley wing shown was from a playable Ridley, with the stage hazard actually being something else entirely. I don't really care for Ridley too much (Toadette much better), but to the fans who want him, good luck!

Yeah... that would be pretty funny if that's what happened lol.... I'd welcome it. =3= The problem is that there's literally no one else it could be.

Edited May 5, 2014 by BANRYU

[Jave]

Sakurai NEVER hints at playable characters before they're officially revealed.

It depends on what you view as hints. He definitely hinted at ROB back in the Dojo days by having him show up in disguise long before he was confirmed playable.

Recently there were a few updates that were hinting at a possible Rosalina reveal (All Mario characters revealed early probably to set up the Rosalina trailer, the Galaxy stage with no Rosalina in sight, and the screenshot that had Mario, Luigi and Peach holding Toad shown in the day Super Mario 3D World was released, but without secret character Rosalina)

I also want to point out that Sakurai NEVER teased a character the way he teased Ridley in the Direct. I can't say I care that much about Ridley, but I think it could go either way. With Sakurai, you really REALLY never know.

[Robert Stewart]

Sorry for the late reply;

True enough, though I don't see the evidence of that in the source. What I do see is words of wisdom from the big man up top...

The evidence is that Sakurai says Brawl has 39 characters, which you only get if you count transformations separately.

[BANRYU]

It depends on what you view as hints. He definitely hinted at ROB back in the Dojo days by having him show up in disguise long before he was confirmed playable.

Recently there were a few updates that were hinting at a possible Rosalina reveal (All Mario characters revealed early probably to set up the Rosalina trailer, the Galaxy stage with no Rosalina in sight, and the screenshot that had Mario, Luigi and Peach holding Toad shown in the day Super Mario 3D World was released, but without secret character Rosalina)

I also want to point out that Sakurai NEVER teased a character the way he teased Ridley in the Direct. I can't say I care that much about Ridley, but I think it could go either way. With Sakurai, you really REALLY never know.

You're referring to the Ancient Minister, right? I'm gonna go ahead and call BS on that one. Are you really telling me that you correctly guessed who was under the Ancient Minister's robes? :0 Nah man, that plot twist was so dumb that NO one could have seen it coming lol.

I'll allow you the thing with Rosalina and the Starship Mario stage, that's a fair point. I think the SM3DW thing without Rosalina is reading too much into it, though; she WAS a secret character in that game.

I guess you never really do know... I just know that I've seen patterns like this before, that's all.

Sorry for the late reply;

The evidence is that Sakurai says Brawl has 39 characters, which you only get if you count transformations separately.

Oh right, gotcha. Well, that is a legit point on Pokemon's character count. All I can say as rebuttal is that maybe he decided that was too many and decided to cut back in this game? :0 Keep in mind also that, even though there WERE technically six different Pokemon characters, half of them were all under the banner of the Pokemon Trainer, who's absent from Smash 3U (four characters, six movesets, if you want to think of it that way). I don't know if the same conditions are going to apply, since the Pokemon Trainer is gone as a metaphorical umbrella for other characters.