FE6 Localization Patch v1.2.1 - Full localization with new features, including Support Conversation reader

[RJWalker]

I'm gonna have to agree that 'The Neverending Dream' just works.

And if we're talking about FE's prose, let's make this like Shadow Dragon's dialogue. Now that's a challenge.

Edited August 31, 2013 by Ranger Jack Walker

[Celice]

I'm gonna have to agree that 'The Neverending Dream' just works.

And if we're talking about FE's prose, let's make this like Shadow Dragon's dialogue. Now that's a challenge.

You mean making everything eloquent to cover up a sup-par, limited script from a 90s NES game?

[RJWalker]

You mean making everything eloquent to cover up a sup-par, limited script from a 90s NES game?

Well, it managed to turn that sub-par limited script and make it more interesting that FE13 so I'd say it worked.

[gringe]

I don't think I have the writing talent to do such a thing. I can write in a way that's entertaining and I feel I have a decent sense of how to adapt for a translation, but I can't write particularly eloquently.

If I'm going to try to emulate any game's writing style, it'll be FE7's, for a couple reasons. First, it obviously has a close relation to FE6, and second, it's relatively easy to emulate. >_>

[King Marth 64]

And also, I noticed that in Smash Brethren series in Fire Emblem: Awakening that I saw Wolt did called Roy as "Lord Roy" and I think the dialogue in the patch needs be fix from "Master Roy" as "Lord Roy" (that I guess that can probably can be fixed with Allen's and Lance's dialogue calling Roy as "Lord" instead of "Master" also).

[gringe]

Well, that's a minor thing, but something to consider. I liked "Master Roy" because of his "Master Lord" class but I might make the change to "Lord Roy" if that's the case.

[King Marth 64]

Well, that's a minor thing, but something to consider. I liked "Master Roy" because of his "Master Lord" class but I might make the change to "Lord Roy" if that's the case.

It said in his defeat quote in SB1 and battle quote in SB3.

SB1

>Deathquote

Wolt

Sorry, Lord Roy...I can't...ahh...

SB3

>Battle

Wolt

This boy serves Lord Roy!

And is Roy's promoted Lord class is fixed to "Great Lord" if anyone maded near to the end? I am in middle of Chapter 6.

Edited September 1, 2013 by King Marth 64

[gringe]

I don't plan to change his class to "Great Lord."

[King Marth 64]

I don't plan to change his class to "Great Lord."

Its the localized name of that class that it appeared in The Sacred Stones and Awakening.

Edited September 1, 2013 by King Marth 64

[Samias]

I agree with having everyone address Roy as Lord in the places where it is applicable. Master has some connotation associated as low-rung servitude, like a butler or servant.

[Celice]

I agree with having everyone address Roy as Lord in the places where it is applicable. Master has some connotation associated as low-rung servitude, like a butler or servant.

Even if Marcus were to address Roy as master...?

[CT075]

i think in cases where the person is directly working under roy as a servant of pherae (like a knight or merlinus) "Master Roy" is alright, but someone like cecilia or miledy (where they are only under him by circumstance) "Lord Roy" is better

[gringe]

Its the localized name of that class that it appeared in The Sacred Stones and Awakening.

Regardless, FE6 is more closely related to FE7, and the "Great Lord" appeared in that game as Hector's heavy lord class. I can see where you're coming from, and I don't feel particularly strongly about, it so if popular opinion is for "Great Lord" I'm willing to go with it. However, as it is, my logic is to differentiate Roy's promotion from the Lords' in FE7.

I agree with having everyone address Roy as Lord in the places where it is applicable. Master has some connotation associated as low-rung servitude, like a butler or servant.

I can definitely see where you're coming from, but I still kind of liked it. Oh well, though.

Edited September 2, 2013 by gringe

[bookofholsety]

Regardless, FE6 is more closely related to FE7, and the "Great Lord" appeared in that game as Hector's heavy lord class. I can see where you're coming from, and I don't feel particularly strongly about, it so if popular opinion is for "Great Lord" I'm willing to go with it. However, as it is, my logic is to differentiate Roy's promotion from the Lords' in FE7.

a) it's not an inappropriate comparison between the two, really, in that while Roy's version may not be a heavy armour class like Hector's, he's still Hector's direct successor as the leader of Lycia's army. in that respect it's fitting they share a promoted class name across twenty years

b) there's literally no consistency between what a Great Lord is supposed to be between games - Eirika and Ephraim are mounted, Hector's armoured, and Chrom and Lucina are pretty much just Roy again with lances and non-stupid promotion criteria. it's as personal to the individual lord as their characterisation and their weapon(s) of choice. we're all used to it by now, really

side note still going through my beta test of the last release, just really slowly because i'm lazy

Edited September 2, 2013 by bookofholsety

[gringe]

a) it's not an inappropriate comparison between the two, really, in that while Roy's version may not be a heavy armour class like Hector's, he's still Hector's direct successor as the leader of Lycia's army. in that respect it's fitting they share a promoted class name across twenty years

This is true. I'll consider it. No rush as far as I'm concerned though; it's a change that'll take all of 5 seconds so I can do it whenever.

[gringe]

Just chiseling away at supports recently but I haven't inserted them so there's not much to show unfortunately. I've got about 20 of 143 total pairings done, so I'm slowly getting there.

Speaking of that, I was thinking that it might be best to just work on support conversations for the time being then release a new patch when I finish that. Supports are difficult to test, so I think it's best to have them in the game for as long as possible as I work my way through the rest of the main story and other miscellaneous text. That way, testers can help with supports as I progress with other things, because I sure as hell will not be able to test all the supports myself.

Talking more long term, I think we may just be able to reach 1.0 before the end of the year here, people. I'm pretty excited. (Though I plan to leave the patch open for bugfixes and improvements for at least a few months after release.)

[BBHood217]

I don't plan to change his class to "Great Lord."

For me, the only Great Lord is Hector. Everyone else is a Master Lord.

[ThisProfileNoLongerUsed]

Also, I don't know if anyone said this already, but are you going to be expanding the pairings? I felt that the pairings only mattering for Roy was pretty shitty.

[bookofholsety]

nope, this is a straight translation without adding any additions of that sort. perhaps take it up with Arch's project as something to consider, since that sort of thing is more in line with its goals?

(also whoops i slacked off on betatesting again maybe i'll just dump what i have so far later and keep going)

[gringe]

I'm not opposed to adding a feature where it can be implemented seamlessly and without contradiction to canon. I would be all for putting in a support conversation viewer like in FE7 and 8 if it could be done flawlessly for example.

But adding supports or endings requires all new writing and I want to avoid at all costs inserting fan-fiction, which is what new endings would amount to.

Edited September 10, 2013 by gringe

[ThisProfileNoLongerUsed]

Alright, I understand.

[Diddy Kong]

Are there already better translations around by the way? FE6 is the best translated game probably. Perhaps outclassed by FE12, but definitely one of the better patches around. Yet, the writing sometimes feels a little... Bland. Not to critisize or anything, it's probably the way FE6 is written in Japanese to, but I do think improvements in writing would make the game a lot better. Also, obviously more references to FE7 would be wicked as well.

[Robert Stewart]

Pretty much the only FE game with a really decent complete translation atm is FE12. Though I've heard Gaiden's is pretty good. This project, however, is really looking good.

If you want horrible translations, you should play TRS. >.<

Edited September 12, 2013 by shinpichu

[bookofholsety]

to my knowledge, there's no complete improved translation as of yet, though gringe's work here isn't the only ongoing project: Arch is also chipping away at doing it over here, though his project does numerous other things as well. there may be more of which i'm not aware

about the claim that that's how it's written in Japanese: i'd have to call that into question. the actual process of straight-up translation is only half of any fiction translation endeavour, and adaptation and localisation is typically necessary to polish the script, make it sound more natural for an English speaker and get across required nuances which come across somewhat differently depending on the language, such as someone like Maribelle, Raquesis or Clarine doing their upper class brat thing. the problem with the current FE6 translation's blandness is that it's only really done the straight-up translation part: it sounds so stiff, awkward and literal because that's exactly what it is. do a straight-up translation of ANY FE game's script and that's exactly what you'll get, and the games as we know them, for better or worse, are always adapted and polished for their English releases to better suit the English-speaking eye. gringe talks about the process in a pretty good example with Zephiel taunting the defeated Hector here

that's not to say, of course, that adaptations, localisations and liberties taken always end up perfect, no matter how necessary the process is. there are plenty of examples of adjustments that kind of fuck up intended conveyances or just fall flat on their face (my personal favourite is Lewyn's "well let's just say my shrink has had steady work for a while" in the FE4 patch)

of course, the entire thing with fan translations is that people do them in their spare time with no real reward. it's grueling without compensation, unless you feed off people getting angry at your translation choices to gain energy or something. understandably, going out of your way to pull a FE11 is considerably less of a priority when your goal is to just get a patch out to let people play the damn thing. i admit claiming this is a tad hypocritical of me given how much time i spend griping about the shittier fan translation scripts, but w/e it's late and i'm rambling again

(if i had to rank the script quality i'd go FE12 >>>>> FE2 > FE4 >>> FE6 > FE5 = FE3, with my unfamiliarity with the FE1 patch making me unable to judge there. bear in mind that pretty much anything beneath FE2 still qualifies as shit... it's more a race to the bottom than anything)

Edited September 12, 2013 by bookofholsety

[VincentASM]

I'm not sure about the FE4 patch or some of the newer ones like FE1 and FE2, but traditionally, Fire Emblem translation patches have always prioritised translating the game from Japanese to English over anything.

As bookofholsety stated, if you just translate, you're very likely to get stiff and bland text.

Translating is a tough work by itself, as is the actual hacking.

Put two and two together and that leaves very little time and effort for what I term the localisation (or the text editing), where the text is rewritten to be more English-friendly.

With FE12, we already decided we'd go with the translation + localisation route, which meant the patch took much longer to finish than other patches. However, I think the end product was definitely worth it.

In FE6's case, you could say the translation part has been done and now it's time for the localisation part. Personally I think gringe is in a good position, since there aren't people hungering for a release since the patch is technically "done".