PAIRINGS The Pairing Thread

[Alastor15243]

Im starting to lean towards Virion!Brady because he gets 1 more skill and 2 more speed and Luna, which gets him to 75 speed if i have All+2/RallyHeart. Libra!Brady only gives him 1 more magic and Vengeance, and some people do say Vengeance>Luna, but that extra 2 speed and 1 skill can matter a ton. And i might actually go Brady x Nah and Kjelle x Yarne now.

Actually Brady gets Luna no matter the father, and Virion doesn't pass down Luna.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Also, should i get the Aggressor/RallyHeart/All+2 DLC? I dont see any good games i can get on the eShop with 8.75 funds, so i was thinking of getting Rally Heart and All+2, or just save up my funds.

I'd go for it.

[Waifu Severa]

I'd go for it.

Yeah i might do it, but im afraid the purchase will be a waste because i dont really need All+2 and Rally Heart, aside from getting some 100% DS pairs and 75 speed pairs.

And im guessing you agree with me on Virion!Brady? Either that or you just dont care lol.

[Czar_Yoshi]

More like I've given all the advice I have to give. They're both equally viable strategies, for the general goal of "beat Apo" they'll perform equally well.

Technically you also don't "need" LB either... Or even Awakening itself. but you bought it anyway for fun. Whether those skills would enhance your enjoyment of the game is up to you. You do also get the maps and all the enemy convos that come with them, which count for something. And Bride. Brides are cool.

[isetrh]

those who jumped on the Ricken!Laurent!Morgan boat

Is that a bad thing? That's what I was going to do.

[Ownagepuffs]

Stahl!Owain actually isn't too bad. The mod spread is pretty nice.

Is that a bad thing? That's what I was going to do.

No it was just a big thing during the time he is talking about.

[isetrh]

Okay thanks.

[Airship Canon]

Is that a bad thing? That's what I was going to do.

No.

The catch was, that right after Matt did his No DLC run, a huge wave of people were like OMG Ricken!Laurent!Morgan is the best Morgan-- it was the start of the end for G/D/L [Lancekiller Severa was the other nail in that Meta's coffin, really. ...7:2 and 6:3 coming up really just beat the horse]It was huge, so huge that when I came around and proved that run can be done with MaMU that there were people worried it'd happen again, but with MaMU/Lucina.

...

Then there were those who thought that because Ricken!Laurent is a good father for Morgan that he's a good character, when actually, Ricken locks Laurent out of roles beyond Hard Support where he excels [and of the three No-Gale-Ever kids, Laurent is the only one with other roles [Namely V/V] with innate Vengeance and Sage.] ...which makes R!L a good breeding stock character but not Laurent's best.... which boils down to a simple case, if you're not going to marry your FeMU to him, don't do Ricken!Laurent. [And then there's the whole Ricken!Owain!Morgan deal, which is argued as the better option]

It was in part due to Ricken!Laurent not being that good [ignoring his Morgan (which IS a high-end "super" Morgan)] that kept Ricken!Owain alive as the Neo Dark Ages came to it's justified end.

[Waifu Severa]

G/D/L [Lancekiller Severa was the other nail in that Meta's coffin, really. ...7:2 and 6:3

Ok what is 7:2 and 6:3, you've been saying that but i dont know what it is.

[Czar_Yoshi]

It's a ratio of Galepairs to double Galepairs. There are 13 children plus Avatar. When using a male Avatar, you can either pair Nah with a Galeboy and have 7 total Galepairs and 2 double ones, or you can pair Nah with Yarne/Gerome/Laurent and bench both of them, dropping the number of Galepairs to 6 but giving a third Galepair.

This is significant because in the old GDL meta, people saw that Nah was missing Galeforce (and GK), and instantly remedied it by pairing Nowi and Avatar. It wasn't until later that they realized that having 7 female Galeforce users does no good if there are only 6 males for them to marry, forcing the benching of both one girl (and the loss of her Galeforce) and Avatar himself, who has a wife, but is lacking both Galeforce and a Proc. You'd be forced to run 6/3, but since one of the benched units is Avatar (and Morgan's mods are shaky at best), it's on par with 3rd gen 6/3 at best and very often worse.

Also, 7/2 has 16 total child moves per turn (not counting Chrom, Olivia and other parent combatants) and 6/3 has 15. So you really are losing a turn from giving Nah Galeforce.

[Airship Canon]

And... the counter is/was that you leave Lucina unpaired.

...Of course that's giving up a DS+ S-rank, which really is a net negative.

...But it does give merit to the whole idea that "I typically marry Lucina. When I don't, I leave her unpaired." thing that got a lot of hate by the brickheads in the fandom. That actually has some tangible gameplay merit, being that it has more use than leaving a non-Lucina unpaired.

[isetrh]

Did people actually put DG+ on the lead AND the support? If so, that's... really stupid. And please tell me that they didn't have Lucina use Luna as her only proc.

How important is it to hit 69 Speed? It's becoming a little bit of an issue as I plan out who Nah's husband is.

Would Sage MaMorgan be good with Vengeance or should he stick to Ignis?

AC mentioned Ricken!Owain!Morgan as an alternative to Ricken!Laurent!Morgan. Why Owain when Ricken!Brady!Morgan has better skill? I ask because I am indecisive and am thinking of marrying a Galeboy after all after Czar's advice.

[ipodluffy]

It's a ratio of Galepairs to double Galepairs. There are 13 children plus Avatar. When using a male Avatar, you can either pair Nah with a Galeboy and have 7 total Galepairs and 2 double ones, or you can pair Nah with Yarne/Gerome/Laurent and bench both of them, dropping the number of Galepairs to 6 but giving a third Galepair.

This is significant because in the old GDL meta, people saw that Nah was missing Galeforce (and GK), and instantly remedied it by pairing Nowi and Avatar. It wasn't until later that they realized that having 7 female Galeforce users does no good if there are only 6 males for them to marry, forcing the benching of both one girl (and the loss of her Galeforce) and Avatar himself, who has a wife, but is lacking both Galeforce and a Proc. You'd be forced to run 6/3, but since one of the benched units is Avatar (and Morgan's mods are shaky at best), it's on par with 3rd gen 6/3 at best and very often worse.

Also, 7/2 has 16 total child moves per turn (not counting Chrom, Olivia and other parent combatants) and 6/3 has 15. So you really are losing a turn from giving Nah Galeforce.

Just to make sure i understood that, its better to have 2 double galepairs than 3 double galepairs?

[Alastor15243]

Of course when you have a female avatar, you can have three double galepairs easy. So that would be 7:3, right?

[ipodluffy]

in my case, with a male MU

[Airship Canon]

Depends.

7:2 can ram into deployment issues and the like. It has higher APT though.

6:3 is done with 12 units.

...The big catch is that MU/Gen 2 can pick between them. MU/Gen 1 can't.

...I typically roll 6:3 because of the deployment issue.

...FeMU gets 1 more APT either way. (7:3/6:4 for FeMU. Same deal. FeMU/G2 can pick. FeMU/G1 can't.)

[Byron]

So I'm going to be a pain unfortunately and ask if people could rate my pairings. The twist being that these pairings are already in place so I guess the question is how to make the best of what I've got. Everyone has Galeforce except Nah and the children who can't get it at all.

FeMu x Chrom

Lissa x Stahl

Sumia x Frederick

Maribelle x Libra

Donnel x Sully

Cordelia x Lon'qu

Tharja x Gaius

Gregor x Nowi

Cherche x Virion

Ricken x Miriel

Vaike x Panne

Olivia x Henry

Lucina x Laurent

Kjelle x Yarne

Nah x Brady

Cynthia x Owain

Severa x Gerome

Noire x Inigo

Morgan is spare given that he's a walking ball of destruction and death.

So yeah any advice you guys can give would be much appreciated, if the verdict is that I've got the pairings equivalent of a train wreck I can restart but I'm not going for a full min/max strategy.

Avatar is +Magic -Luck

Thanks for the help guys, much appreciated. I guess My next question would be, do I stand a chance of clearing Apo with this? I'll need to do some class shuffling as my understanding is Sorcs are crap (for Apo) and Heroes are awesome but not sure beyond that.

[Czar_Yoshi]

You can, but you might want to try using a smaller team and just leaving out some of the odd units. Chrom/Avatar/ Lucina/Laurent, Brady/Nah and Inigo/Noire should be more than enough. Make sure to pack lots of Staffbots for Rescue, all the Rallies and tonics, though.

[Airship Canon]

Being forward, you can beat SR Apoth with anything if you bring out full power. [Really, bring 2 Rally bots, drop LB and tonics on everything. Give guys Agg if you've got it.]

The map is sorely undertuned (which is sad all things considered).

Use a bit of common sense and you'll get your win.

Now if you're challenge running, well, that's different. Limitations in power output greatly change things.

[isetrh]

Sorry to do this again, but I had some questions that got skipped (I think) due to being at the end of a page.

How important is it to hit 69 Speed? It's becoming a little bit of an issue as I plan out who Nah's husband is.

AC mentioned Ricken!Owain!Morgan as an alternative to Ricken!Laurent!Morgan. Why Owain when Ricken!Brady!Morgan has better skill? I ask because I am indecisive and am thinking of marrying a Galeboy after all after Czar's advice.

[Airship Canon]

Ricken!Brady!Morgan really hasn't been poked around but, yeah, it's basically just a better ROM

... trades out defense for more Skill. [Note that R!B!M has the -6 Modifier. Keep it clear of physical attacks.]

Probably not poked because some people don't like Ricken!Brady cause massive overlaps.

Notable Apoth Speed Thresholds:

75 Doubling Threshold for Nightmare Sniper, Anna

69 Doubling Threshold for Thronie.

66 Conventional Survival Threshold for Anna. [0 Hit Strategy allows consistent survival without 66 Speed; Nightmare Sniper ...is different, and shouldn't be tanked]

65 Doubling Threshold for Invincisorc.

60 Survival Threshold for Thronie

56 Survival Threshold for Invincisorc.

Make of it what you will. 69 means you double everything but Anna/Nightmare Sniper.

...if there's any "But thou must" speed threshold it's 60.

[isetrh]

Thanks! I will go with ROM since he gives Owain Luna. Not sure if I should go with Morgan x Chrom!Cynthia and Libra!Brady x Henry!Nah or Morgan x Nah and Brady x Cynthia.

I was going to use Virion!Severa as a Wyvern Rider. Is she better with Lances or Axes? She has Lancefaire and not Axefaire, but Lances are kind of bad in Apo right? If she dropped Lancefaire for Lancebreaker, how would that be?

Edited August 16, 2014 by isetrh

[Waifu Severa]

Thanks! I will go with ROM since he gives Owain Luna. Not sure if I should go with Morgan x Chrom!Cynthia and Libra!Brady x Henry!Nah or Morgan x Nah and Brady x Cynthia.

I was going to use Virion!Severa as a Wyvern Rider. Is she better with Lances or Axes? She has Lancefaire and not Axefaire, but Lances are kind of bad in Apo right? If she dropped Lancefaire for Lancebreaker, how would that be?

No point in using Lancebreaker when you are using Axes/Lances, unless you meant Axebreaker and using Lances. I'd rather just go with Lancefaire instead of Axebreaker because lances are sort of accurate, and that 5 bonus strength can help you with the weapon triangle.

EDIT: Ik i've asked this a lot and it is getting annoying, but should i do Virion!Brady or Libra!Brady? Virion gives that awesome 2 more speed to hit 75 speed and 1 more skill and Deliverer, but Libra gives 1 more Mag and Sorcerer. I'm thinking Virion here because speed and skill>1 Mag and Vengeance, because he already gets Luna. What do u guys think? And I dont even think Brady will have room for Deliverer anyway, because he gets all these good skills:

Galeforce, Tomefaire, Luna, LB, Deliverer, Aggressor, All+2 (Assuming i get All+2 and Aggressor).

Edited August 16, 2014 by Waifu Severa

[Czar_Yoshi]

I was going to use Virion!Severa as a Wyvern Rider. Is she better with Lances or Axes? She has Lancefaire and not Axefaire, but Lances are kind of bad in Apo right? If she dropped Lancefaire for Lancebreaker, how would that be?

Lances for sure. Even with WTD she'll still outdamage an Axe, and she's got 72 Skl and is a dedicated lead meaning she'll never have hitrate issues outside of stuff on Thrones (which she shouldn't be fighting in the first place because they all have Counter).

Just for fun, S.Apo has: 11 enemies with Swords, 22 enemies with Lances (including the Generals in Wave 0), 25 enemies with Axes, 14 enemies with Bows (that can use them), and 19 enemies with Tomes. Of those Axe users, 11 have Counter and 18 have Pavise+ (and all of them have at least one of those) so Severa wouldn't likely be fighting them even if she had WTA.

I'd go Virion.

[isetrh]

Oh okay. I will use lances.

How is this VVDS+ build?

Lon'qu!Laurent @ Sage

Limit Breaker/Tomefaire/Vantage/Vengeance/Anathema (should I usw Aggressor instead for more PP power?)

Sumia!Lucina @ Dark Flier

Limit Breaker/Galeforce/Tomefaire/Hit +20/All Stats +2

Edited August 16, 2014 by isetrh