Dark Sage Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 Swordmasters can face 40-50 hit rates and against axe users, it can go as low as 20%. Characters like Catria and the Avatar can also support stack to face ridiculously low hit rates and give them a shot at dodging even in Lunatic. Swordmasters in Maniac/Lunatic also have almost unmatched offense, only rivaled by Berserkers and Horsemen, except that a lot of the axe users you get are shit and you need to have endgame level characters with speedwings for the Horseman to even reach their cap (so in most cases, the only reasonable one is Luke). In short, Swordmasters are only consistently worse than Snipers in FE12 if you're a dumbass. (On another note, the female assassin model is hilarious because it highlights some of the problems with the way reclassed character models work. You end up with characters changing bust sizes or muscle masses as they change classes. And in some cases like Gregor, the skin tone of the face does not match the base model's. It's great). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 (edited) not relying on dodging, the occasional dodge helps though (I think PKL compiled some enemy hit rates on H2, and that was with Snipers not Swordmasters!) I dunno, Dodging is only needed when the map can't be calculated off Beetwen AI abuse, and the enemy density, this kind of situation rarely happened, and even if they do, SM get the edge(lolgetit) because they have an existant survival chance. Of course, Sniper abuse is broken, so who cares Edited October 3, 2013 by JSND Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 How are Snipers so good in FE13, again? PKL told me they were really good, but I think it was mostly because Wyverns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 (edited) You mean FE12? AI priority + Competent stats + "FUCK IM NOT TAKING THAT ATTACK HEAD ON, LEMME CHIP WITH SNIPER FIRST" Essentially theres actually a demand on having Sniper, I guess Also 9 Base speed and nice growth maybe Wyvern and DK spam means they can also catch up in EXP quite easilly so thats there But then again, PKL is a Ryan fanboy Edited October 3, 2013 by JSND Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 What about the AI priority? I take it opponents will also take them on 2-range...? Otherwise it's mostly not a good thing to be attacked at 1-range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 There are some instance where you can use Archer to forcefully pull a swarm that will normally not move in(CH3 and CH12 have this), or to perform bullshit where the enemy decided to attack an Archer, and ends up saving your unit who could have been attacked twice and dies otherwise Its pretty useful, although I'm not sure how it would be used in a fast paced playthrough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PandaCelt Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 Ya! Swordmasters are epic classes and I love those guys. True, they can only wield swords and they have low health, but my Swordmasters hardly ever actually GET HIT, so the health doesn't really matter much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iHeartLibra Posted October 4, 2013 Share Posted October 4, 2013 Well, a Swordmaster with access to sword and lancebreaker(like lon'qu) could vanquish the weapon triangle problem. Considering their high speed and skill growths, the skills would be most likely detrimental to enemies with swords and lances. And don't even mention the children that could have skills like pavise and aegis passed down to them (takes care of lower defense and the lack of range weapon accsess ,in case they have bad magic and can't use a Levin Sword, and enimies with range weapons(they have terribad resistance!) by their fathers or mothers, (like Frederick as 0wain's father, or Sully as Kjelle's mother). Add on lethality for a high chance of insta-kills, astra + Killing Edge for high activation and criticals, or swordfaire to add on to their sometimes iffy strength. With the right skill set, you'll have a unit built for many circumstances in one of the cutest outfits in FE: Awakening! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVahne Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 FE11-12 ruined Swordmasters and FE13 just killed them off as a relevant class. A real shame, as I LOVED them in FE6 and 10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadykid Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 FE11-12 ruined Swordmasters and FE13 just killed them off as a relevant class. A real shame, as I LOVED them in FE6 and 10. lolwut? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) Well, a Swordmaster with access to sword and lancebreaker(like lon'qu) could vanquish the weapon triangle problem. Considering their high speed and skill growths, the skills would be most likely detrimental to enemies with swords and lances. And don't even mention the children that could have skills like pavise and aegis passed down to them (takes care of lower defense and the lack of range weapon accsess ,in case they have bad magic and can't use a Levin Sword, and enimies with range weapons(they have terribad resistance!) by their fathers or mothers, (like Frederick as 0wain's father, or Sully as Kjelle's mother). Add on lethality for a high chance of insta-kills, astra + Killing Edge for high activation and criticals, or swordfaire to add on to their sometimes iffy strength. With the right skill set, you'll have a unit built for many circumstances in one of the cutest outfits in FE: Awakening! Honestly, I don't see why you mentioned Lethality since it's pretty useless when other methods are more reliable. FE11-12 ruined Swordmasters and FE13 just killed them off as a relevant class. A real shame, as I LOVED them in FE6 and 10. Well, they were on a downward spiral since FE7... But, TBH, I'd rather take Astra and Swordfaire over a useless instant kill and the ability to pass through enemies, which - dull surprise - is almost as useless. Edited October 5, 2013 by Levant Fortner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just call me AL Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 SM does have a higher base speed and durability over Assassin, though. So I wouldn't say it's "completely outclassed by Assassin". Doesn't change the fact that SM is a "journey" class, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJWalker Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Assassins used to have the lowest strength cap and now they trump SMs in everything that matters. FE13 SMs are a joke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Assassins used to have the lowest strength cap and now they trump SMs in everything that matters. FE13 SMs are a joke. >implying skill matters while defense and resistance don't What. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) >implying skill matters while defense and resistance don't What. The difference beetwen Assassin and SM in defense is even lower than Sumia vs Cordelia Caps: -2 Def - 7 Res Except Assassin comes with much more superior PU bonus as well And.... if you actually played the game before the game is over Swordmaster vs Assassin SM 20 HP 7 STR 13 SPD 6 DEF Assassin 21 HP 8 STR 12 SPD 5 DEF So, basically they have identical defensive parameter, and Swordmaster is faster Of course most players are playing the game after it is over, so who the fuck cares Edited October 5, 2013 by JSND Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) ...So you've gone and proven what I was arguing in the first place, which is that Assassins weren't even that much better than Swordmasters aside from their pair up bonus. Edited October 5, 2013 by Levant Fortner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dying Blaze Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 I've been wondering for a while how to make every class equally usable, and I haven't seen or known anybody that uses swordmaster after they start capping some stats, why is this? I actually went through a game with my Swordmaster-FeMU. She clobbered everything. Swordfaire/Astra are some of my favorite skills. (What's funny is that I don't care for Assasins at all) Swordmasters are in my top 3. But i'm I don't really have a favorite class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) ...So you've gone and proven what I was arguing in the first place, which is that Assassins weren't even that much better than Swordmasters aside from their pair up bonus. Sadly this Pair Up bonus and "performance as Pair Up Partner" make it significantly better than Swordmaster Also I was arguing that Swordmaster Defense is not even important, considering that 1. Swordmaster has identical defensive base compared to Assassin 2. Lol Defense in min maxing. Edited October 5, 2013 by JSND Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djing Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 But, TBH, I'd rather take Astra and Swordfaire over a useless instant kill and the ability to pass through enemies, which - dull surprise - is almost as useless. Conveniently, being a level 15 Swordmaster with those skills puts you in the perfect position to reclass into an Assassin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Sadly this Pair Up bonus and "performance as Pair Up Partner" make it significantly better than Swordmaster Also I was arguing that Swordmaster Defense is not even important, considering that 1. Swordmaster has identical defensive base compared to Assassin 2. Lol Defense in min maxing. Lol min maxing. That is all I have to say. Conveniently, being a level 15 Swordmaster with those skills puts you in the perfect position to reclass into an Assassin. Except it having skills that are worth less than junk, among other factors, means no reason to reclass into Assassin, I have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) Lol min maxing. That is all I have to say. This would be legit if not for the fact that everyone and their mom uses min maxing logic to argue "Dude SM have liek better durability than Assassin" "But dooods its liek 1 HP vs 1 DEF" "But dood Assassin is fastah than bouldah" "But peeps Assassin is slower than SM by 1 Speed!" Edited October 5, 2013 by JSND Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djing Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Except it having skills that are worth less than junk, among other factors, means no reason to reclass into Assassin, I have. When you're done getting all the skill you want, Assassin > Swordsmaster. Astra and Swordfaire are pretty meh anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadykid Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 This would be legit if not for the fact that everyone and their mom uses min maxing logic to argue "Dude SM have liek better durability than Assassin" "But dooods its liek 1 HP vs 1 DEF" "But dood Assassin is fastah than bouldah" "But peeps Assassin is slower than SM by 1 Speed!" whoa whoa wait a minute when did I get warped to GameFAQs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZemZem Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Swordfaire is more worth the trouble than Astra. Astra would be a way better skill if the activation rate was the same as Sol and Luna. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSND Alter Dragon Boner Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) whoa whoa wait a minute when did I get warped to GameFAQs SF is not that much different than GameFaqs when it comes to this kind of discussion Except some gamefaqs poster eclipsed SF when it comes to maximization. Its laughable how Sumia is mocked for BAD CLASS SET around 4 month ago in SF Edited October 5, 2013 by JSND Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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