I'd like to introduce you to my family...

[Czar_Yoshi]

The problem I have with the classic method is that if your just a little bit distracted at the end of a map, you're basically forced to start over.

If you have a digital copy (or a save dongle) you can mitigate the risk by making backups before starting each pairing.

[PuffPuff]

Chrom/Female!Avatar: Haven't done ever.

Virion/Olivia: Made a great Inigo when I did it once.

Gaius/Nowi: Only did it once, and it was a wrong while ago. I think Nah was okay.

Frederick/Sumia: Amazing for maingame, terrible for Cynthia's potential.

Vaike/Lissa: Made an okay Owain.

Lon'qu/Cherche: Made an okay Gerome.

Donnel/Sully: Haven't done ever.

Stahl/Cordelia: Made a good Severa.

Ricken/Miriel: Haven't done ever.

Where's Panne and Maribelle? :<

I think the above is point of the entire OP.

I did before. I loved it... until English fanbase.

"Meh" because I *mostly* got over my beef with the unreasonable fangirls.

I think it's great gameplay-wise for Lunatic.

^

This and...

It's one of my absolute top recommendations for MU as Lucina can get Veteran and Ignis. Makes a decent Morgan. Just be sure to have him inherit Galeforce before you go and pick him up.

FYI, 130 hours for this game is nothing. There are plenty of people who are around 1,000 hours, and some who have done more.

Even if SoC did all the supports on that 130 hour file (which isn't possible because you need separate files for male and female Avatar), you have to remember that a) that time doesn't reflect the time that the children spent grinding to A with their parents, and b) the amount of time it takes to gain supports varies heavily based on how fast your menu management is, what method of support grinding you use, and whether or not you actually watch the supports themselves.

Indeed.

Upon average we at least do 160hrs minimum per save.

------

Parings I did...

MU(Male)

Aversa-Only one that I ever did and named him Thanatos. This was in my Jap version.

MU(Female)

Chrom-My Absolute favorite for Chrom's choices. It makes Lunatic a walk in the park for Lucina after a few chapters and she can get Ignis. Just hope they give this for her final smash in SSBB4 with having her emit blue flames instead of Red like Roy did.

Chrom

MU-See MU's.

Olivia-I like this one. It gives Inigo Rightful King and Galeforce making him a dangerous advisary with Lethality+Luna+Rightful King+Galeforce. This is recommended for harder difficulties.

Sumia-Gives Cynthia Aether and viewing pie convo's. Those are the sole reeasons to make this pairing.

Lissa

Virion-Makes Owain a good Rally Bot giving him including Rally Res from inheritance.

Stahl-This is not a bad one and the only other one to consider. Only make this pairing if he already haven't got someone else.

Get him Bowbreaker for his Speed issues. Luna and Lethality to hit harder. Counter is also something to consider for his fair amount of defense. Better equip All Stats+2 and Miracle for Apotheosis as Counter and Lethality are rendered useless there.

Sumia

Frederick-Best one for Sumia. Gives Cynthia Luna, Aegis, and a chance to access Sword and Lance Breakers. Gives her good Skill in modifying too, but if only she could get Lethality with this pairing, it'd be even better.

Chrom-See above.

Sully

Vaike-A great one. My favorite one. Get's Kjelle Armsthrift, Lethality, Luna and Sol including inheritance of Counter, Rally Str, and or Despoil. Great Str, Skill and Speed modifying to make her an excellent frontliner. This is recommended for harder difficulties.

Stahl-A decent one. It gets Kjelle Lethality+Luna combo and everything else that you need. I'm talking to you Aegis&Pavise.

Lon'qu-Gets Kjelle Astra, Lethality, Luna, and the Sword and Lance Breaker skills. Good Skill and Speed are always a good thing too. Only advantage that this pairing has is better Speed.

Miriel

MU-The most recommended one. It gives Morgan an insane amount of mag powerful enough for him to solo Apotheosis.

Just watch this vid and you'll see....

Just be sure to give him this

-Hex

-Anathma

-Vengeance

-Vantage

-Hit+20

The best pairing for Miriel, definitely.

If no MU then...

Ta dah....

Ricken- He gives insane Mag to make Laurent a great Sorcerer although he cannot get Vantage.

Lon'qu-You can never go wrong with having Vantage and good Skill and Speed. But his Defense suffers in the long run which is recommended to get him these...

Final Class: Sorcerer

Weapon: Nosferatu/Aversa's Night

-Vengeance

-Swordbreaker

-Lancebreaker

-Vantage

-Limitbreaker

Vaike-My favorite one. Gets Laurent invincibility and better defense once he has this set...

Final Class: Sorcerer

Weapon: Nosferatu/Aversa's Night

-Sol/Vengeance(You need it for Apotheosis)

-Vantage

-Lethality/All Stats+2(You need it for Apotheosis)

-Zeal/Aggressor

-Gamble/Tomefaire

Cordelia

Stahl-You can't go wrong with him. She makes a great Assassin with this pairing. She gets a fair amount of Speed and Def to make up for it.

She should get this...

-Swordfaire

-Galeforce

-Sol/All Stats+2(You need it for Apotheosis)

-Luna

-Limitbreaker

Lon'qu

Her defenses suffers, but she gets great Speed and Defense to make her a worthy candidate for Assassinhood and getting Astra+Lethality+Lifetaker+Lancebreaker(For Anna)/Hex and Anathma.

Maribelle

I only tried it with Gaius and Lon'qu. With Lon'qu you can get him Lance and Swordbreaker, but you can't with Gaius' pairing. Just like with Gaius' pairing, with Lon'qu's, you can't get Sol and Counter.

Nowi

Only did it with Gregor and got her Astra and Armsthrift. I had no regret making this pairing as unlimited Dragonstones are always a good thing.

Tharja

MU(Male)

Donnel

Gaius

Only do these three and only these three with her.

MU gives her the option to get Veteran through inheritance and any class skills. Plus Galeforce.

With Donnel which this is my favorite one. She can get Sol, Luna, Aptitude(Inherit), and Galeforce. This is most recommended for harder difficulties as Aptitude gives her a chance to catch up quickly. Since she's also quite hard to recruit on Lunatic.

With Gaius-She can get Lethality+Luna combo and can get Galeforce.

ONLY make one of these three with her as she can get Galeforce with any of these pairings.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Dark_Huntress

[Gaia]

Woah, all the lolwat.

(Assuming postgame because Apo vid)

A few general points:

-Lethality is bad.

-Making a magical unit physical is bad, and vice versa.

-Dark Magic is bad.

Now then...

-Chrom!Morgan is terrible. You've essentially benched him by making Chrom his father.

-Lissa x Virion/Stahl. Both physical units that offer nothing to Owain. Ricken/Libra/Henry work far better.

-Sumia x Fred is another really bad one. You're trying to contend with Cynthia's base -1 str mod, and it just isn't working out. BTW Cynthia has base Luna.

-Sully x Anybody besides Donny is terrible unless you're doing support. No GF screws you over.

-Uh... Ricken!Laurent can't get Vantage. Why do you think he needs a Vantage father?

-Brady gets everything he wants already in terms of skills, so why throw him physical fathers? Like I said, attempting to make a magical unit physical is bad.

Tharja

MU(Male)

Donnel

Gaius

Correction: Only do Gaius. Donnel and MaMU are desired elsewhere. And that's if Noire's only going to lead. It's like you didn't even consider support.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Gaia

[Czar_Yoshi]

There's no way I'm quoting all that.

Aside from what Gaia said, All+2 isn't necessary for Apo, Roy doesn't have a Final Smash, Zeal is bad and Gamble is useless unless alongside Wrath and a forged Killer, Vaike!Laurent doesn't have Vantage, Hex is useless on a Sage, you forgot to give your Ricken!Laurent LB, Assassin!Severa should use Bowfaire (Swordfaire is for Heroes) and most of all, Owain should never inherit Rally Res.

[PuffPuff]

Woah, all the lolwat.

(Assuming postgame because Apo vid)

A few general points:

1. -Lethality is bad.

-Making a magical unit physical is bad, and vice versa.

2. -Dark Magic is bad.

Now then...

3. -Chrom!Morgan is terrible. You've essentially benched him by making Chrom his father.

-Lissa x Virion/Stahl. Both physical units that offer nothing to Owain. 4. Ricken/Libra/Henry work far better.

5. -Sumia x Fred is another really bad one. You're trying to contend with Cynthia's base -1 str mod, and it just isn't working out. BTW Cynthia has base Luna.

6. -Sully x Anybody besides Donny is terrible unless you're doing support. No GF screws you over.

7. -Uh... Ricken!Laurent can't get Vantage. Why do you think he needs a Vantage father?

-Brady gets everything he wants already, so why throw him unnecessary physical fathers?

Correction: Only do Gaius. Donnel and MaMU are desired elsewhere.

1. You wouldn't say that if you want to abuse Skirmishes later in the game on Lunatic as you need this to 0KO. Though, Luna is also needed for bad activation rate that Lethality has.

2. Needed for an easier time on Lunatic. Rune, Waste and Nosferatu are commonly used upon Dark Magic.

3. Why is that?

4. Not Ricken as Miriel need him alot more.

5. What the hell?! This is what nearly everyone including me suggests. Sumia doesn't have anything else good going for her other than with Chrom; and, or Freddie.

6. Noire is better off having that.

7. That's what the guy in the vid said that he did in his video. I'm just going by with what he said he did to conquer Apoth like it was nothing.

8. Neeever.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Dark_Huntress

[PuffPuff]

1. There's no way I'm quoting all that.

2. Aside from what Gaia said, All+2 isn't necessary for Apo, Roy doesn't have a Final Smash, 3. Zeal is bad and Gamble is useless unless alongside Wrath and a forged Killer, Vaike!Laurent doesn't have Vantage, 4. Hex is useless on a Sage, you forgot to give your Ricken!Laurent LB, Assassin!Severa should use Bowfaire (Swordfaire is for Heroes) and most of all, 5. Owain should never inherit Rally Res.

1. Don't bother.

2. True. It just makes it a little easier.

3. That's a set that I don't mind along with a Kat's Bolt as well. Gamble+Zeal+Wrath+Sorcerer breaks the main game.

4. I was suggesting Sorcerer for his final class. Is what the guy did in the video to solo Apoth with no Limitbreaker and Rallies.

5. I did. What is wrong with that? What's wrong with a boy having that?

[Gaia]

1. You wouldn't say that if you want to abuse Skirmishes later in the game on Lunatic as you need this to 0KO. Though, Luna is also needed for bad activation rate that Lethality has.

2. Needed for an easier time on Lunatic. Rune, Waste and Nosferatu are commonly used upon Dark Magic.

3. Why is that?

4. Not Ricken as Miriel need him alot more.

5. What the hell?! This is what nearly everyone including me suggests. Sumia doesn't have anything else good going for her other than with Chrom; and, or Freddie.

6. Noire is better off having that.

7. That's what the guy in the vid said that he did in his video. I'm just going by with what he said he did to conquer Apoth like it was nothing.

8. Neeever.

1) I believe you missed the part where I said:

(Assuming postgame because Apo vid)

2)^

3) Morgan misses out on 3rd gen mods. He also doesn't get *ANYTHING* from Chrom that's worth talking about. Procstacking>RfK.

4) lolwat. Ricken!Laurent is terrible.

5) I'd like to see proof that "This is what nearly everyone including me suggests." Because most people suggest either Henry!Cynthia or Chrom!Cynthia, for good reason.

6) Gaia passes GF too, you know?

7) Don't just blindly listen to the video. Do it yourself.

8) Wat.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Lunatic skirmishes fall flat on their face in terms of difficulty the moment DLC/grinding (especially LB) is introduced. Dark Magic isn't needed.

Chrom!Morgan is the worst Morgan in the game because not only does it lock Lucina out of both of her ideal husbands (Avatar and Morgan), it also doesn't pass Morgan that good of mods, forces you to bench a child due to only having 13, and Lucina doesn't get anything she wants from Avatar.

Literally all Ricken gives Laurent is +2 Mag when what he wants is Vantage. Owain, on the other hand, can actually use that +2 Mag and gets Luna to boot.

I'm not sure where you're looking, but Sumia x Frederick is recommended for maingame, not postagme. Cynthia will be slow and her offenses all messed up. Her father should always be either Chrom or Henry.

Noire can get Galeforce anyway from Gaius while Kjelle gets it from Donnel. Noire also gets her Vantage that way.

That video is about Morgan. Laurent isn't doing the VV sweeping, and regardless the same trick can be done with +Mag/-Def Avatar x Lucina.

Most Secret Apo grunts have 55 Lck. You need at least 50 listed crit to break even with Celica's Gale, and if you're that into critstacking there are more potent skills than Zeal to use. You can't break the maingame with Gamble/Zeal/Wrath/Sorc because by the time you get all that stuff together (requires Fighter, Barbarian, Berserker, and then Sorc, not to mention building up your Mag and Tome rank) the hardest part of the game will be over. It also requires two base class reclasses, a big no-no on higher difficulties.

Watch the video, Morgan is a Sage.

Because it means no Galeforce and you already have 237 spotpass/DLC/guest units with access to all classes to serve as Rallybots for you.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Czar_Yoshi

[PuffPuff]

1. Lunatic skirmishes fall flat on their face in terms of difficulty the moment DLC/grinding (especially LB) is introduced. Dark Magic isn't needed.

2. Chrom!Morgan is the worst Morgan in the game because not only does it lock Lucina out of both of her ideal husbands (Avatar and Morgan), it also doesn't pass Morgan that good of mods, forces you to bench a child due to only having 13, and Lucina doesn't get anything she wants from Avatar.

Literally all Ricken gives Laurent is +2 Mag when what he wants is Vantage. Owain, on the other hand, can actually use that +2 Mag and gets Luna to boot.

3. I'm not sure where you're looking, but Sumia x Frederick is recommended for maingame, not postagme. Cynthia will be slow and her offenses all messed up. Her father should always be either Chrom or Henry.

4. Noire can get Galeforce anyway from Gaius while Kjelle gets it from Donnel. Noire also gets her Vantage that way.

5. That video is about Morgan. Laurent isn't doing the VV sweeping, and regardless the same trick can be done with +Mag/-Def Avatar x Lucina.

Most Secret Apo grunts have 55 Lck. 6. You need at least 50 listed crit to break even with Celica's Gale, and if you're that into critstacking there are more potent skills than Zeal to use. You can't break the maingame with Gamble/Zeal/Wrath/Sorc because by the time you get all that stuff together (requires Fighter, Barbarian, Berserker, and then Sorc, not to mention building up your Mag and Tome rank) the hardest part of the game will be over. It also requires two base class reclasses, a big no-no on higher difficulties.

7. Watch the video, Morgan is a Sage.

Because it means no Galeforce and you already have 237 spotpass/DLC/guest units with access to all classes to serve as Rallybots for you.

1. Only way to make it 100% manageable.

2. True. But...if your not playing post-game, you don't have to bother with Morgan as it makes Lucina alot easier to raise and can get her slightly more skills thanks to Veteran.

3. Better get her Paragon then if your going to get her Luna+Lethality alot faster. She will need it for harder difficulties. Without LB3, then you otherwise can just keep her protected with a good support and having Galeforce inherited.

4. Yep and I've also forgot to mention that Lon'qu is also quite a good pairing for Tharja for better Speed even though her Res will slightly worsen, but good enough Mag to make her a good Sorcerer. She can get Vantage this way too along with Vengeance. Never underestimate the Vantage+Vengeance combo with Nosferatu. But she only should be paired with...

-MU

-Donnel

-Gaius

-Lon'qu

No one else. I REPEAT. No one else. I tried the Lon'qu one too and it wasn't bad.

5. Oh. -.-

6. That is a problem without access to Skirmishes or DLC.

7. Yes, ha ha. I realized that. (But it can be done with any good Mag Sage+Vengeance+Vantage) As the rest of us are sane as we wouldn't dare to set foot there without LB+Rallies, or one or the other. 65x2 from the strongest enemy in the game the Berserker Part 4 (Apotheosis Secret Route) by the fort is nothing to laugh at. Really would be 97x2=dead Morgan if he got countered attacked with a hit.

...and two probs with that vid.

1. Never make Chrom a Sniper in the end.

2. I don't use Olivia.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Dark_Huntress

[Shadow Mir]

It get's very complicated, especially with so many opinions on the web about who wants this and who wants that. During my search I came across a user who posted that in the end it's your game so play however you want. I know now that he was right. -- Primrose: Blue haired Inigo everybody! Yay!

Exactly - as far as I'm concerned, I don't relish the though of needing to restrict Sully and Tharja to Donnel and Gaius just because of Galeforce.

I... I don't know what to say to that. Do you seriously not enjoy the story one bit? The gameplay is alright, not the most balanced of the series but it's alright. I just don't see how you can play Lunatic+ without caring for characters/story -- that's what awakening is all about. The hard mode was suppose to make you feel more of the reality of what Chrom and the team is going through. But awesome; atleast you care enough to be here right? Cheers! =D

I wouldn't tie the story to the game's difficulty, considering that if I'm playing on a harder mode, odds are I've already beaten the game before.

@Ayanami: Counter is bad. Lethality is, to put it bluntly, a wasted skillslot. Also, as to dark magic, if there's a reason I want it, it ain't Ruin, and it sure as hell ain't lolWaste.

[shadowofchaos]

I... I don't know what to say to that. Do you seriously not enjoy the story one bit? The gameplay is alright, not the most balanced of the series but it's alright. I just don't see how you can play Lunatic+ without caring for characters/story -- that's what awakening is all about. The hard mode was suppose to make you feel more of the reality of what Chrom and the team is going through. But awesome; atleast you care enough to be here right? Cheers! =D

I'm one of the first people to ever play Awakening since importing it from Japan.

...The story is mediocre at best. I realize that. I realize its flaws. But I love the game anyway.

But there are people that just can't empathize with it. You need to realize that. And "care enough to be here" in the Awakening forum is very... err... I don't know how to describe it. A lot of people that post in the Awakening forum couldn't give a crap about the story. That's the reality of this fandom.

...And Lunatic+ is a difficulty where you really just don't care about story than the gameplay.

Especially when it's a difficulty that you have to beat the game before to unlock.

Edited April 13, 2014 by shadowofchaos

[Canadian Dynamite]

Oh hey, it's Primrose! I wonder if you're the same one Will is friends with. I've done most of those pairings before. GaiusxNowi in my first file, VaikexOwain in my recent Lunatic file and OliviaxVirion in my recent Lunatic file are all ones we share. That's some good taste right there!

[Silver Lightning]

Oh hey, it's Primrose! I wonder if you're the same one Will is friends with. I've done most of those pairings before. GaiusxNowi in my first file, VaikexOwain in my recent Lunatic file and OliviaxVirion in my recent Lunatic file are all ones we share. That's some good taste right there!

???

[MRDRHAWK]

Optimization.jpeg

Still, pretty good optimization at that, even if Vaike/Lissa's a pretty meh pairing for Owain (I know this because I did it in my initial run).

I'm kinda curious why Virion!Olivia is considered good, though? I mean, he loses Luna and really only gains Tomefaire in return, and imo that's a pretty shit tradeoff; considering the freak retard Skill that he'd have with Virion as his dad would boost Luna's activation rate through the roof. Plus, Inigo's moreso built for support anyways.

Otherwise, not bad. I prefer certain other pairings if we're looking from a story perspective (Gaius/Maribelle and Donnel/Olivia, for one), but this is still a pretty good pairing set.

???

I assume he meant VaikexLissa for a Vaike!Owain

Edited April 13, 2014 by Polydeuces

[Czar_Yoshi]

I'm kinda curious why Virion!Olivia is considered good, though? I mean, he loses Luna and really only gains Tomefaire in return, and imo that's a pretty shit tradeoff; considering the freak retard Skill that he'd have with Virion as his dad would boost Luna's activation rate through the roof. Plus, Inigo's moreso built for support anyways.

He's kind of in the middle- Virion doesn't give him anything bad, so I'd count it as a decent pairing. While a Luna/Vengeance Inigo will be better, there are so many worse Inigos (Gregor and Donnel come to mind) that Virion's still near the top of the list.

-MU

-Donnel

-Gaius

-Lon'qu

No one else. I REPEAT. No one else. I tried the Lon'qu one too and it wasn't bad.

VV users actually don't care for Skl/Spd. If your foe gets to attack, you die, so doubling doesn't matter, and Vengeance is pretty much 100% on a Sage no matter what. Hit rates usually aren't an issue because Celica's has plenty of hit and can't have a WTD, if they are for one particular foe (Invincisorc) just get an Aura support standing nearby.

That said, Noire shouldn't be dedicated VV because she can't marry Lucina for 100% DS. She can use it as an offenisve proc, she can use it to mop up grunts that don't require DSes, but Laurent and especially Avatar are better cut out for the job.

[Anacybele]

Chrom fathered Inigo ftw. Rightful King + pseudo Aether (Luna and Sol) + Astra/Lethality + Limit Breaker is da bomb. :D

[Gaia]

TBH, Pseudo Aether is the worst proc stack in the game. Chrom!Inigo should be going off of LB, Agg, Luna, GF, and Sword/Bowfaire.

[Anacybele]

Why not Rightful King? Aether and Rightful King are like THE main reasons for a kid to have Chrom as a father because they're good skills and he's the only one that can pass them down.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Anacybele

[Gaia]

So tell me exactly what you would take out, then.

LB - lolNope

Agg - lolNope

Luna - lolNope

GF - lolNope

-Faire - lolNope

Honestly, RfK isn't that great. Hell, I wish that RfK was passed to the female children instead, just for this reason (Far more good male children than female, and Lucy would get Aether regardless).

[Shadow Mir]

Why not Rightful King? Aether and Rightful King are like THE main reasons for a kid to have Chrom as a father because they're good skills and he's the only one that can pass them down.

Rightful King honestly isn't that great at all. Primarily because the one skill that benefits most from it is a useless one. Also, diminishing returns.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Levant Caprice

[Anacybele]

Rightful King increases the chances of offensive skills activating. How is that not good?

[ZemZem]

Rightful King gives skills like Luna and Aether a better chance at proccing. I'd say that makes it worth a skill slot.

[Shadow Mir]

Rightful King increases the chances of offensive skills activating. How is that not good?

Rightful King increases skill activation chance, but - get this - so does Limit Breaker, which does much more. And, once again, the principle of diminishing returns comes into play. Basically, when Rightful King has the most effect, skills are unreliable, And it doesn't help that most of the skills that ARE worth using have a Skill% activation rate.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Levant Caprice

[ZemZem]

What if one were to not have Limit Breaker access.

[Gaia]

What if one were to not have Limit Breaker access.

Then use it if there's nothing better to fill the slot with. However, how many people on this forum do you think don't have LB? Most likely a very miniscule amount.