Agree or Disagree. Reddits Smash 4 Tier List

[euklyd]

Huh. I didn't expect Pikachu to move up so much, but I'm definitely not complaining. Also pretty happy about ZSS. Not quite sure about Rosalina or Sheik, but fair enough. Robin ought to be higher, though, and I'm surprised Lucina's so far down - even considering the tipper thing, I don't think that warrants a tier and a half of difference. Out of curiosity, why is the Mii Brawler so much higher up than the others? There's a few posts about Swordsman above, but I don't think I've seen anything about Gunner.

mii brawler is good because they combo well and can kill or s/t idr too well

there are also some stupid kill combos, at least, and one of his customs has this thing where it kills super early iirc

the reason reddit thinks brawler is good is because there's this one mii brawler player (I can't for the life of me remember his name) whose gifs or whatnots are posted on /r/smashbros relatively frequently, and mii brawler has also been getting at least some hype

[Ice Sage]

first tier list this month with customs.

thoughts everyone?

[Tsunami922]

Seeing Palutena jump up a few tiers makes me sad I can't use custom moves online.

Edited March 8, 2015 by Tsunami922

[euklyd]

for more complete info (jumps from last month w/o customs, full point values, etc) you can look in this imgur album

[spoiler=basically the only important one imo]

e: I love how pacman and olimar are so much higher after abadango and dabuz at apex

brawler probably shouldn't've dropped as much as it did from a few months ago (iirc it has solid kill combos on literally everyone at like 50%)

'zard should probably be higher; his customs are p legit

idk it still seems pretty early for real tier lists

Edited March 8, 2015 by Euklyd

[Elieson]

Ganon so low wow

Marth is way above lucina, I didnt see that coming.

Foxes customs are pretty eh im not surprised at his drop.

What makes Luigi so special with his customs jc I havent researched his in any way other than what I assume his UpB has a farther jump without hitting.

[Anacybele]

Marth and Lucina don't have the same customs? The gap between them now is indeed surprising.

Ike went higher though, just like I thought he should! Still believe he could be a little higher still, but I'm satisfied for right now. Glad Luigi didn't drop. Luigi is too great. ^^

Poor Little Mac lol.

Palutena. o.o (I expected her to jump up a good bit, but not THIS much!)

Still nobody giving much attention to that poor Mii Swordsman. :(

Edited March 8, 2015 by Anacybele

[Ema Skye]

>Palutena: +32

Dat's mah gurl

[Elieson]

Yeh

her speedboosts are really that amazing.

[Florete]

How is Sheik above Diddy?

People are sleeping on Zelda.

[Ein]

dat palutena boost

I wonder if people will still be adamant about custom moves not being allowed. Your Sheiks and Diddys and Rosalina and Pikachu and Zero Suit Samus will still win constantly make the game boring to watch competitively.

[Comet]

Marth and Lucina don't have the same customs? The gap between them now is indeed surprising.

no, they're the same. marth just has stuff like tipper f smash which makes him way better than lucina already. i'm surprised they both moved down, since crescent slash is really good. f throw into it is guaranteed, as well as grab release iirc. it's also really strong.

[Zkirsche]

Speaking of new tier lists, here's the japanese one, the first for the WiiU: https://game8.jp/items/297696

Dat Villager hype though =3 They also hate sword users =(

As for the customs one, I'm surprised DK didn't get higher because of dat windbox.

Edited March 8, 2015 by kirsche

[Anacybele]

Wow, first time I've ever seen Ike placed above Marth (and Lucina). :o But sadly, he's still very low. The Japanese DO hate sword users. :(

[kingddd]

Speaking of new tier lists, here's the japanese one, the first for the WiiU: https://game8.jp/items/297696

Dat Villager hype though =3 They also hate sword users =(

Wario being that high, I what? I love using him but he's not that good.

[Moishe Oofnik]

I really just don't see what's so good about ZSS. I get that people hyped her a lot in the early days of the 3DS, but she has so few kill moves and her durability is just awful. It's so easy to kill her at less than 100%. I had an easier time using Samus than ZSS.

Though I still feel like most tier lists for Sm4sh are just taking Brawl's and making very slight changes to it. I really don't think Ike is worse than Marth/Lucina and I'd say Samus has some room to move up as well.

ZSS has the best aeriel game in smash 4 as far as im concerned

[Jedi]

Wario being that high, I what? I love using him but he's not that good.

He has a very solid recovery, fast and wacky moves

A lot of power and he's difficult to kill. What makes a good character to you?

Also I disagree with the Japanese list highly, and partly the custom added list. I've seen some amazing Ganondorfs here in Washington able to crush Yoshies, Rosalinas and the like, two Dorfs are on our power rankings as is a Zelda.

I still see tons of variety in smash 4 so I think the lists are still far from complete.

[kingddd]

He has a very solid recovery, fast and wacky moves

A lot of power and he's difficult to kill. What makes a good character to you?

While it is true that most of his attacks are powerful and he has an amazing recovery with his bike now, most of his moves are easily punishable even his tilts. They don't come out fast enough and you really have to get a good read in order to actually hit them. Like his forward tilt is like a mini smash but the build up to the actual attack with its animation is a bit slow and easily avoidable. He also doesn't have many true combo options thus making it a bit difficult to rack up damage in close quarter combats especially considering his range is pretty bleh in general.

He's a very risky character and thus making it really easy to punish him for his regular attacks. He has great manueverability but his approach are kind of bleh and the bite neutral B with its lack of momentum makes it difficult to punish shield users.

Edited March 8, 2015 by kingddd

[Jave]

Still nobody giving much attention to that poor Mii Swordsman. :(

It's not that nobody pays attention to him. It's that the general consensus is that the character IS terrible. It's amazing that not even adding his customs saved him from Bottom Tier.

[Anacybele]

People said earlier that hardly anyone has really explored the Mii Swordsman. So that's why I started to and I don't think the character is that bad.

[Jave]

People said earlier that hardly anyone has really explored the Mii Swordsman. So that's why I started to and I don't think the character is that bad.

People have tried out and explored Mii Swordfighter. It's just that no matter what's done with him, even on his best combos and stuff, he's severely outranked by pretty much every other character at almost everything.

Consensus at Smashboards is that he might move a few spots, but he's Low Tier at best.

[Anacybele]

Well, I guess I shouldn't be surprised. I just always end up using low tiered characters... Luigi is an exception this time, but everybody else I use is still rather low. :(

[Elieson]

I wish samus got more custom love. Trip bombs still meteor, break your from grabs, and open up combo possibilities.

Shotgun is just horrible. I use it entirely as a gimmick but its DONKEY PUNCH minus the super armour at best.

I want to explore her missile customs though. Her homing relentless missiles make for fierce and safe edgeguarding

[Zkirsche]

Wario being that high, I what? I love using him but he's not that good.

He and villager do amazing in japan IIRC so that's why they're so much higher than in the american counterpart list.

Also I disagree with the Japanese list highly, and partly the custom added list. I've seen some amazing Ganondorfs here in Washington able to crush Yoshies, Rosalinas and the like, two Dorfs are on our power rankings as is a Zelda.

I'm afraid their success just isn't widespread enough to be well known and respected. It's all about results, and so the ones that are pushed into the spotlight the most end up being higher while some characters are slept upon. There's still a while to go before accuracy and stuff but it's still fun to look at these lists, just for comparative purposes later on. (It's very interesting comparing earlier tier lists with more current ones).

[kingddd]

He and villager do amazing in japan IIRC so that's why they're so much higher than in the american counterpart list.

I'm afraid their success just isn't widespread enough to be well known and respected. It's all about results, and so the ones that are pushed into the spotlight the most end up being higher while some characters are slept upon. There's still a while to go before accuracy and stuff but it's still fun to look at these lists, just for comparative purposes later on. (It's very interesting comparing earlier tier lists with more current ones).

My guess is because they always play final destination stages which villager dominates pretty easily in those because of its flat infrastructure making it really easy for him to do setups with projectiles. I would really like to see what Wario players do because I'm really not getting much results from even the American Tournament scenes that go around.

[Zkirsche]

Japanese players are better at campy play (years of playing brawl) and villager is king camper in this game. I'd say I prefer smashville than FD and MJG picks battlefield before FD too so it's not that.

Fun fact about villager though: customs on is stupidly good. People are really sleeping on him:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=noZgIAU8pXI

So dumb. Tripping is back guys with a vengeance. No super axe is harder though. Anyway, wario:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JZt9G3dE2E

Fart kills super early and good use of aerials + bike.

Edited March 8, 2015 by kirsche