Video FE10 HM LTC (expected ~125 turns)

[56282508]

Savior Haar > Savior Marcia for 4-P

Micaiah army： Jill, Haar, Ilyana, Ulki,Rhys

Ike army：Nephenee，Tanith

Hawk army：Marcia，Janaff，Boyd？

4-p：1

4-1：2？

4-2：3？

4-3：2？

4-4：3？

4-5：1

Edited January 12, 2016 by 56282508

[Camilla]

Micaiah army： Jill, Haar, Ilyana, Ulki,Rhys

Ike army：Nephenee，Tanith

Hawk army：Marcia，Janaff，Boyd？

4-p：1

4-1：2？

4-2：3？

4-3：2？

4-4：3？

4-5：1

Those units were based on Chiki's easy mode LTC, in which he got 2 + 3 + 2 + 3 + 1 for 4-1, 4-2, 4-3, 4-4, 4-5. But it might be different for hard mode, we'll see in the next week or two. Part 4 is annoying.

[ruadath]

Hey everybody, FWIW I'm planning on returning to this run soon (hopefully). Get excited lol.

[Junkhead]

Wait, I thought this was Rudy's thread...

[ruadath]

Yeah, it still is lol.

Also, Soul, check your PMs.

[Junkhead]

Doesn't look like it.

[56282508]

Those units were based on Chiki's easy mode LTC, in which he got 2 + 3 + 2 + 3 + 1 for 4-1, 4-2, 4-3, 4-4, 4-5. But it might be different for hard mode, we'll see in the next week or two. Part 4 is annoying.

He got 1turn for 4-1 on EM

[ruadath]

We've yet to see part 4 of Chiki's run, but it looks like (so far at least) none of the transfers are absolutely necessary except for Ilyana (for 1-4, assuming I use the same strat), and perhaps Nephenee (I don't think anyone ever confirmed whether or not 2-1 was 2-turnable without transfers).

So anyone still up for a combined LTC run with FE9? I think you can replace Soren with Ilyana and get her the necessary transfers (not so certain you can get Neph to 20). I've also confirmed that with RNG abuse (which is much more painful on the GameCube than Wii, since Suspend doesn't save the RNG state), you can at least save turns on Chapter 2 and Chapter 7 of that run (and perhaps Chapter 4, haven't checked).

Or perhaps this should be left for a later time.

[ruadath]

New poll questions added. Please fill out!

[ruadath]

By the way, are we certain that it's impossible to 2-turn Chapter 2-2? From movement alone (including killing the boss with a Nealuchi crit) it looks possible, but I can't tell how many enemies stand in the way (don't have a save there).

[Junkhead]

You've been going all-out enough as it is. It'd be a waste to go "minimal RNG abuse" at this point.

[ruadath]

Well, there is my sanity to keep in mind. Even if the chances aren't absolutely awful (i.e. 2 Eddie non-Wrath crits in one EP + 2 Eddie dodges), I still don't want to do it if I don't have to. I don't know how Chiki manages to consistently obtain results with <.1% probability while playing only "3-4 hours a day," but that's certainly not something I'm capable of doing.

[Camilla]

Edit: Strategies removed due to plagiarism.

Edited January 12, 2016 by Camilla

[Yojinbo]

2-1 can probably be 2-turned without transfers but Nephenee will have to crit just about everything.

[Junkhead]

Well, there is my sanity to keep in mind. Even if the chances aren't absolutely awful (i.e. 2 Eddie non-Wrath crits in one EP + 2 Eddie dodges), I still don't want to do it if I don't have to. I don't know how Chiki manages to consistently obtain results with <.1% probability while playing only "3-4 hours a day," but that's certainly not something I'm capable of doing.

I mentioned this before, but most of the (heavy, HEAVY) rigging is only for the first half of Part 1. Then you have 2-1 (and I forgot if you had transfers or not) and...that's sort of it. Haven't check either Chiki or LD's 3-P, but I doubt it isn't sort of reliable.

Really, the hardest parts in an LTC is Part 1, lol. It's why I have so much trouble getting it going.

[ruadath]

Sorry, but do you really think it's impressive to rip off someone else's strategies which take time and effort to discover and just slightly improve them by shaving off a turn or two because you're willing to reset endlessly? It just makes you look like a tryhard. You did the same thing with FE9 and FE13, too, without even knowing what Galeforce was in FE13. Like dondon said,

I believe this is what you are currently doing to 56282508's run.

[Camilla]

I believe this is what you are currently doing to 56282508's run.

1. Chiki came up with many of the strategies that 56282508 is using (in case you don't remember, Chiki was the first to post LTC videos of FE10). He also discovered many of the lowest turncounts on HM and EM.

2. Chiki didn't even know that he had videos up, you'll see this if you read the thread.

3. The playthroughs have major differences, such as whether or not Heather is recruited, whether or not Boyd or Nephenee is used, whether or not third tier Ilyana is used, whether or not the Energy Drop in 2-E was taken, whether or not Shinon is trained, whether or not the Part 1 Spirit Dust was bought, whether or not Meteor was left with Part 2 people.. and there is a major turncount difference between them (like 15 or so?).

4. Chiki doesn't even like to look at other people's strategies since it's more fun to come up with things by himself.

5. Chiki is already a few chapters ahead of him and he came up with 3-E and 4-P before 56282508 even attempted them on HM.

Edited December 31, 2015 by Camilla

[dondon151]

there's also the fact that like

chiki/camilla don't post 10 times in a row for trivial improvements

[ruadath]

Well, in any case, I've got my new clear of 1-P recorded, but bandwidth is a thing and I don't have it at home, so I probably won't be posting these videos until I get back to college in late January.

EDIT: Also, at least in the context of GBA games, trivial improvements are important for the context of reproducibility.

Edited December 31, 2015 by ruadath

[ruadath]

My bad, forgot to give details of the clear:

Micaiah: Level 2.00 (+Str, +Mag, +Spd, +Res)

Edward: Level 5.70 (+HP, +Str, +Skl, +Spd, +Res)

I might reset to get Micaiah a better level, but in all honestly, Mag and Spd are the only things she really needs, so I might just be lazy about it (especially since both their level ups occur on the last enemy phase, where I also have to rig 3 dodges and a Wrath crit). Skill might be worth resetting for, but not really sure.

I honestly would have preferred to just get Eddie up to level 6, but my younger sibling insists that I pick up the Hand Axe from 1-1, even though I don't really need it, and Micaiah needs to be level 2 for that. This will make 1-1 a pain to do, but oh well.

Edited December 31, 2015 by ruadath

[Junkhead]

1. Chiki came up with many of the strategies that 56282508 is using (in case you don't remember, Chiki was the first to post LTC videos of FE10). He also discovered many of the lowest turncounts on HM and EM.

2. Chiki didn't even know that he had videos up, you'll see this if you read the thread.

3. The playthroughs have major differences, such as whether or not Heather is recruited, whether or not Boyd or Nephenee is used, whether or not third tier Ilyana is used, whether or not the Energy Drop in 2-E was taken, whether or not Shinon is trained, whether or not the Part 1 Spirit Dust was bought, whether or not Meteor was left with Part 2 people.. and there is a major turncount difference between them (like 15 or so?).

4. Chiki doesn't even like to look at other people's strategies since it's more fun to come up with things by himself.

5. Chiki is already a few chapters ahead of him and he came up with 3-E and 4-P before 56282508 even attempted them on HM.

I'm still wondering why most of this is about Chiki & LD when this is really his run. Like, wouldn't a thread on their be able to stand on it's two feet, if that's the case?

[Gradivus.]

EDIT: Also, at least in the context of GBA games, trivial improvements are important for the context of reproducibility.

Not really,

a) it isn't really important how easily one can copy your strategies. (see more in c)) The difference between a strat with medium difficulty in execution and another one with slightly easier execution is pretty irrelevant, unless you want it for your own pleasure, which shouldn't be a big deal when you played through it with the other strat already. (see more in b))

b) even if the strat without the improvement requires like 30 RN burns more, it still isn't harder because you can just note them down and someone can reenact them pretty simply.

c) if in some other type of playthrough, a here-trivial improvement is important, it can just independently be gunned for in these playthroughs. In the current playthrough, it would simply not be worth redoing for.

On a related note, where do you think would that improvement of 1-P concretely help? Why not just continue from 1-4 if you don't see any direct need for it?

[ruadath]

I suppose it's really just an OCD I have about minimizing RN burns/optimizing what I can get out of the preseeded RNG in the GBA games. So in other words, I guess it's really just a personal pleasure thing, but when I said "reproducibility," I meant that I feel obligated to notify you guys of the changes so you don't end up wondering where Lowen got that extra 10 EXP from, or why I suddenly have one more Javelin use than I originally did, etc.

Regarding your latter question, I actually screwed up my calculations regarding 1-1 in the above playthrough. I recorded a different version and am currently uploading (but with my sucky bandwidth, expect it to take like 24 hours), where Micaiah didn't level and Eddie got closer to level 6. I won't be able to pick up the Hand Axe, but that's OK because like I said, I don't actually need it.

[ruadath]

Woohoo! I got lucky and one of my RNG seeds from early experiments in this playthrough ended up working perfectly for the dodges on turn 1 of 1-1, so I got through the chapter fairly quickly. Eddie hit level 6 (obviously), and Micaiah is still level 1 lol. No Hand Axe, but that doesn't matter.

Things are looking up, although 1-2, 1-3, and 1-4 will all be RNG sadness (unless I'm lucky, but I doubt it). Thankfully, I've temporarily moved my LTC operation to my uber desktop, so I can turbo the game for quicker resets (especially at low resolution), so hopefully this will go by quicker than before. The videos will still take forever to upload (seriously, how does a 3 minute video take upwards of 12 hours!), so don't expect to see them too soon.

Also, I forgot to record sound on 1-P, but I'm too lazy to redo it, and you guys probably don't care anyway.

EDIT: Also, I forgot to mention this last time (or maybe I did? can't rememeber). That for 1-2, Edward can actually get shoved one more space forward. This allows him to drop Laura in a much safer position (only gets attacked by the archer, and she can survive one of two hit if he rounds down Str). Eddie gets attacked on three sides, but he is faster than all of them, so he only sees 3 attacks (unless he wrath crits something, I'm not sure), and can survive at least one (haven't tested).

However, on the bottom portion of the map, Micaiah and Leo are exposed to attacks (one of them twice). Leo easily survives one attack, but I'm not even sure that Micaiah can survive one (remember, she hasn't leveled yet, and she won't get a chance to until the turn 2 EP with this strat). This is actually another problem, as then in addition to whatever normally happens I have to rig Edward and Micaiah's level, so this might actually be worse to do than the original 1-2.

Edited January 1, 2016 by ruadath

[ruadath]

The 1-P playthrough finally finished uploading!

I've since realized that it's possible to get 1 more EXP for Edward at no cost to Micaiah, but I'm far too lazy to go back and redo it (it's a bit more RNG reliant), since it won't matter at all in the long run. PM me if you really care about it. I've also realized that rigging the Def proc may have been a poor decision; it was useful in 1-1, but in 1-2 prevents the Steel Lance guy from putting Edward into wrath range. I guess I'll just deal with that when the time comes.