Do you have any movesets you'd like to change?

[Thane]

Hello everyone.

This might seem like a petty, casual complaint, but I've never liked Ganondorf's moveset. Aside from maybe Samus, I can't think of anyone in Nintendo's repertoire of characters that has as many tricks up their sleeve as him, yet he's a copy of Captain Falcon...a racer.

Let's see, Ganondorf can fly, shoot energy balls, is an excellent swordsman, a sorcerer that can summon puppets, transform into energy, is more or less unkillable (I'm obviously not saying he should be here, just that skills could be added to show that fact - you know, something like Little Mac who doesn't flinch) and wields the Triforce of Power.

After playing through Hyrule Warriors Legends - belonging to a genre that's not my cup of tea but proved surprisingly addictive - I realized that they gave Ganondorf far more fitting abilites than Smash ever did, being able to transform his limbs into dark energy in a shape resembling claws, shooting energy, flying for finishing moves etc. It just seems like a waste to have such a recognizable and diverse character being a slow brawler in Smash.

Do you have any similar complaints, or would you like to change a move for whatever reason? I'm not into competetive play so I can't comment on that, but as a Zelda fan, I just think Ganondorf's potential is wasted.

Edited February 6, 2016 by Thane

[Anacybele]

Yeah. I would have Ike ditch Counter, move Eruption to down B, and make Ragnell's ranged attack the standard B. I don't care if Sakurai thought it would be OP, it could be dumbed down like he dumbed down Aether.

I would also completely change Toon Link so he is based more off of the Four Sword games instead of TWW. It's not because I hate TWW and love Four Sword Zelda, it's so Toon Link isn't a freaking clone. He'd wield the Four Sword instead of the Master Sword and have some TMC items as his special moves. He'd still keep the Spin Attack and Bow though. Side B would become Roc's Cape and down B would become the Gust Jar. With the Roc's Cape he can also use the Down Thrust skill from TMC, just hit the B button again while in midair. Final Smash? The four-way hurricane spin from FSA! Link splits into four, they go into cross formation, and hurricane spin everything in their path!

Edited February 5, 2016 by Anacybele

[Tsunami922]

I wish they'd change Palutena's default specials to Explosive Flame (B), Super Speed (Side-B), and Lightweight (Down-B). Warp is fine.

[Alex95]

I terms of Ganondorf, yeah, he could've done something a bit more. Maybe something akin to how he is Hyrule Warriors?

Ike's Ragnell range attack should be there, too. And Aether should use Sol and Luna.

I want Mario's tornado move back, though I know Luigi and Dr. Mario have it. F.L.U.D.D. just doesn't feel right. Either that or have Mario's specials be entirely around the water pack.

Lucina should use Lances and Dark Pit should use Arms and his Staff in actual battle. I know they were made to be clones, but still...

Um... I think everyone else is pretty much okay? That's all I got at the moment.

[Tolvir]

Lucina getting a complete rework as a character. Have her using Lances and Swords. And also have all of her abilities represent the fact that you can pass down so many skills and reclass to get skills with the characters. Pretty much find a way to incorporate various important skills like Galeforce, Aether, Luna, Lethality, Etc.

[OakTree]

In which game does Wario rides a motorcycle?

Edited February 6, 2016 by OakTree

[Alex95]

In which game does Wario rides a motorcycle?

Wario Ware games

[NinjaMonkey]

DK gets his Coconut Gun instead of the headbutt and transforms into Rambi for his Final Smash.

[maybe]

In which game does Wario rides a motorcycle?

wario blast

no, seriously, that was the first game to have wario's bike

i haven't played it but i'm pretty sure that was its first appearance

[OakTree]

Wario Ware games

Really? I must have forgot about it.

When though?

[Alex95]

Really? I must have forgot about it.

When though?

Usually within cutscenes concerning him going around town. I've only really played through Mega Party Game$, though.

[Nym]

Yeah. I would have Ike ditch Counter, move Eruption to down B, and make Ragnell's ranged attack the standard B. I don't care if Sakurai thought it would be OP, it could be dumbed down like he dumbed down Aether.

I would also completely change Toon Link so he is based more off of the Four Sword games instead of TWW. It's not because I hate TWW and love Four Sword Zelda, it's so Toon Link isn't a freaking clone. He'd wield the Four Sword instead of the Master Sword and have some TMC items as his special moves. He'd still keep the Spin Attack and Bow though. Side B would become Roc's Cape and down B would become the Gust Jar. With the Roc's Cape he can also use the Down Thrust skill from TMC, just hit the B button again while in midair. Final Smash? The four-way hurricane spin from FSA! Link splits into four, they go into cross formation, and hurricane spin everything in their path!

No masks?

[Anacybele]

No masks?

Why would he have any masks? Toon Link never used any in any of the games he's been in, not counting the outfits that come with them in TFH.

[solrocknroll]

No one but Dark Pit and Alph. Everyone else should stay how they are.

Dark Pit needs a total overhaul and Alph needs to become a semi-clone. Diversifying Dr or Lucina would just make them Luigi and Roy.

[Fire Emblem Fan]

I've been wanting Ganondorf to get a new set of moves since Melee, I've always hated that he's a (semi) clone. I mean, he has so much to draw from...but they give him C. Falcon's moves? Doesn't make sense to me.

Lucina and Dark Pit could have had much more unique moves as well, both of their games also have lots to draw from! I understand why they were made clones, and I'm happy they're at least in the game, but I can't help but wish they'd been given their own moves.

That's about it, I think.

[Radiance]

Cloud stole Ike's shock wave move. It is a grim time for us. That's all I want

[Knight]

If they ever get rid of Ganon's current moveset, it must be migrated to Black Shadow from F Zero.

[Ema Skye]

I'd like to see Ganondorf adopt a trident from his earlier Zelda appearances. It'd help him stand out from the many sword characters. Plus Hyrule Warriors shows how good Trident Ganon is.

I'd change Lucina's Up B to Galeforce. It'd function like After Burner Kick where if she hits someone with the move, she can use it again. Also give her Dancing Blade a fifth hit and rename it to Astra, and rename her Shield Breaker to Luna.

[BrightBow]

It's really strange how Ike doesn't have his sword beam and now that Cloud has joined the rooster it's even more annoying. It seems to be the obvious choice for his neutral b, so why give him a completely made up move instead? I have the impression that Sakurai thinks that heavyweights would be broken with actual projectiles.

Anyway, I would say a sword beam would be ideal for Ike. It would help him against those agile characters that dominate him, while not being of much help in a battle royal, where Ike is already very strong.

Also, yeah. Ganondorf deserves a complete overhaul. Two Smash games and 14 years later and Ganondorf is still following the way of the Falcon. At least back in Melee, Captain Falcon's moves weren't that unfitting for the young and agile OoT Ganondorf. But TW Ganondorf spinning in the air looks ridiculous.

I would say, Smash should go a similar route as Hyrule Warriors, creating a Ganondorf that maintains the spirit of his various incarnations without being directly one of them. Personally I support building his moves around the usage of the Trident.

Zelda should get a similar treatment. Not just because it doesn't match what she has shown in combat in the games after Melee but also because her moveset sucks and needs a complete overhaul anyway.

I'm not all that happy with Wario either. I would say, he should get his shoulder bash as a side b special. And there has to be something else to replace his random corkscrew jump, like the bunny ears he used in his first appearance or one of his various transformations in Wario Land. And for his Final Smash, I would love to see him turn into that gigantic, deformed form of his in Mario Land 2.

I would also advocate a complete reworking of Samus. Especially now that Mega Man is in the game. Her moveset should have a similar concept to it then his, seeing how their basic moves are very similar. I almost wish she wasn't in the first two games. If her first appearance was in Brawl or Smash 4, she would probably get all kinds of cool stuff, like an actual Morph Ball mode.

And yeah, Palutena should have different special moves as a default. Why choose overused moves like Teleport and Counter when she has moves that are completely fresh and new?

Lucina should probably have been an Ike clone. His animations are a closer match to her moves in Awakening.

As for Dark Pit, he should be an alternate to Pit because then he would actually be more accurate, seeing how his Silver Bow is supposed to fire bright green-yellowish projectiles with great homing abilities. The arrows he fires in Smash are pretty much the opposite of that, both in appearance and properties.

Edited February 8, 2016 by BrightBow

[Anacybele]

I have the impression that Sakurai thinks that heavyweights would be broken with actual projectiles.

Dedede's spike ball thing isn't considered a projectile? But yeah, Cloud having a sword beam and Ike not having one is really stupid, especially if Sakurai really did think Ike's sword shockwave would be OP.

Edited February 8, 2016 by Anacybele

[Knight]

It's pretty slow, it's not really reliable for keeping your opponent away, especially since it can be easily reflected.

Though Samus is a heavy weight, and Link and Megaman are mid-heavy, though these fighters are specialized on projectiles. (even if Samus' suck)

[secondworld]

Yeah give G-Dorf an accurate moveset. Use the heavy falcon one for Black Shadow or something though.

Whatever makes Samus and Zelda good.

Give Lucina her standard battle pose for a bigger size difference. Differentiate specials by basing them off skills: B=Luna or her version of Aether(2 button inputs) >B=Astra(5 strikes, with something else different from dancing blade I can't think of atm) ^B=...Sol?(regenerates health if it connects at a certain point)

Overhaul for Pittoo, there are way too many weapons in Uprising for him to be that much of a clone.

Replace Ike's eruption for Ragnell sword beam things.

[Knight]

What if eruption both made a flame pillar and launched a powerful sword beam?

[Anacybele]

Yeah, that'd work for me, I guess.

It's pretty slow, it's not really reliable for keeping your opponent away, especially since it can be easily reflected.

Yeah, that's true.

[BrightBow]

It's pretty slow, it's not really reliable for keeping your opponent away, especially since it can be easily reflected.

Though Samus is a heavy weight, and Link and Megaman are mid-heavy, though these fighters are specialized on projectiles. (even if Samus' suck)

Samus only contributes to that impression. Usually, heavy weights have powerful moves with long and wide range. Samus' attacks are both weak and have crappy hitboxes, yet they are still as slow as the attacks from other heavy weights. And of course she has that legendary jab of hers, which we know was deliberately designed that way because it's mentioned in the hint boxes.

Basically, the only reason I can think of for Samus being so bad in melee combat compared to other heavy weights, is that Sakurai's team vastly overestimates the advantage she gains through ranged attacks.

Anyway, I would also like to see Wii Fit Trainer changed. I don't actually know how she should change, but I find her to be a very boring character, with the only thing that makes her interesting being that a lot of her hitboxes hit behind her. Which I really don't think is a point in her favor since a lot of characters have moves like that. Meanwhile, her Neutral special is a generic charge shot and her down special is a simple buff.

Edited February 8, 2016 by BrightBow