Avestus Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 By the way, is European english version of Fates is just slightly adapted from what NoA did? Or did they translate from scratch? Anyone has any info on that matter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saisymbolic Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Some people just appreciate his sexual humor and find him likeable for it. However i think a great deal of his fans are from how he was in the Japanese version. There are some details about him that got removed or changed in order to fit in better with the localization, removing a lot of character depth imo. For more details you can refer to this post (and the reddit one it links): http://agoddamn.tumblr.com/post/145083852665/in-the-style-of-your-elfie-vs-effie-post-what I take personal offense to how they changed Arthur X Niles the one true OTP. Took good personality traits and character development from them both. *sob* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steshii Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Some people just appreciate his sexual humor and find him likeable for it. However i think a great deal of his fans are from how he was in the Japanese version. There are some details about him that got removed or changed in order to fit in better with the localization, removing a lot of character depth imo. For more details you can refer to this post (and the reddit one it links): http://agoddamn.tumblr.com/post/145083852665/in-the-style-of-your-elfie-vs-effie-post-what Ah okay, thanks SO much! A victim of poor localization, sigh. I hate when they do that. I can appreciate Zero much more now. Niles...eh, still not so much. But I'll let people like what they like. By the way, is European english version of Fates is just slightly adapted from what NoA did? Or did they translate from scratch? Anyone has any info on that matter? Wasn't it just... ported from the NoA version? lol. Anyway, I think there's another thread that speaks in detail about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageHarpuiaJDJ Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Some people just appreciate his sexual humor and find him likeable for it. However i think a great deal of his fans are from how he was in the Japanese version. There are some details about him that got removed or changed in order to fit in better with the localization, removing a lot of character depth imo. For more details you can refer to this post (and the reddit one it links): http://agoddamn.tumblr.com/post/145083852665/in-the-style-of-your-elfie-vs-effie-post-what I actually would've preferred this, but if would've been localized, the sexual assault could've been traded in for something else. Maybe child neglect? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maybe Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Some people just appreciate his sexual humor and find him likeable for it. However i think a great deal of his fans are from how he was in the Japanese version. There are some details about him that got removed or changed in order to fit in better with the localization, removing a lot of character depth imo. For more details you can refer to this post (and the reddit one it links): http://agoddamn.tumblr.com/post/145083852665/in-the-style-of-your-elfie-vs-effie-post-what I take personal offense to how they changed Arthur X Niles the one true OTP. Took good personality traits and character development from them both. *sob* oh man this support got butchered so badly the japanese one was one of the only supports to actually really flesh out Niles' character well it's disappointing how in the NA version they managed to have pretty much the same sequence of events but made it nowhere near as emotional and instead just made it essentially another comedy support among two silly characters although tbh while Niles was definitely much better in the Japanese version and in the NA version he's basically degraded to a really obnoxious and generally not good guy who constantly makes people feel uncomfortable by spouting innuendos and stuff with very occasional references to his troubled past i feel like i wouldn't like him nearly as much in the NA version even if they toned down the sexual references and kept most of his more serious dialogue involving his past purely because the NA version doesn't have dual audio which means he won't be DIO BRANDO himself in my game no matter what Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The DanMan Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 (edited) I don't find these polls very informative, to be honest. People can like or dislike characters for any number of reasons, including appearance, voice, personality, plot involvement or usefulness as a unit. I clicked "Like" for Velouria because of her appearance and class but she's a very gimmicky (furry pandering) character (sorry Thane). I clicked "Dislike" for Xander because of his plot involvement but he looks cool and functions well. The results don't generally surprise me besides Soleil being popular. Ideally, a poll like this should let you rate units and characters separately. Some people just appreciate his sexual humor and find him likeable for it. However i think a great deal of his fans are from how he was in the Japanese version. There are some details about him that got removed or changed in order to fit in better with the localization, removing a lot of character depth imo. For more details you can refer to this post (and the reddit one it links): http://agoddamn.tumblr.com/post/145083852665/in-the-style-of-your-elfie-vs-effie-post-what *agoddamn* I'm not quite sure I can take a person who unironically compared the Treehouse to 4-kids and has made nothing but negative comments towards the localization fairly seriously, regardless of any truthfulness in evaluations. His Elise support in the Japanese version was infamously creepy, for one; also, the comment on Corrin's lines during his recruitment is assuming that they view Felicia/Jacob as nothing more than servants (which, judging by their supports, they clearly don't). Though there are a few changes for the worse, the amount of nitpicking here is a major turnoff. I wouldn't mind having a more in-depth character discussion. Some of the results aren't terribly surprising, but I'm going to need a little bit to chew on for shockers such as Oboro and Kaze. I like them just fine myself, but I don't know if it's for the same reasons as others. I'm thinking a new topic discussing the results might be the way to go; if it bears any fruit, then Dualazi's approach was indeed sound. She's a solid unit with a solid set of supports, isn't gimmicky, is flawed and has her flaw taken seriously, and is basically overall considered one half of Takumi. Edited May 31, 2016 by The DanMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 She's a solid unit with a solid set of supports, isn't gimmicky, is flawed and has her flaw taken seriously, and is basically overall considered one half of Takumi. Does this mean you support the OTP I didn't vote in the popularity poll, but I agree with people who say that the results aren't necessarily telling. It might better to either rank them ALL from favorite to least favorite, or list your top (arbitrary number) favorite and least favorite, with REASONS. But I think all of those might be too much work for the average poll! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Odinson Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Does this mean you support the OTP I didn't vote in the popularity poll, but I agree with people who say that the results aren't necessarily telling. It might better to either rank them ALL from favorite to least favorite, or list your top (arbitrary number) favorite and least favorite, with REASONS. But I think all of those might be too much work for the average poll! It'd be a fun forum post, though! what do you mean i'm just looking for more excuses to talk about ryoma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Res Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 I'd be willing to create a more comprehensive poll, although I wouldn't wish to step on any toes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saisymbolic Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 How difficult would it be to create a poll that states the reasons as to why a person likes a character? There can be any number of reasons as to why a person likes or dislikes a character. Would it be better to limit the reasons to something more general, such as based on appearance, personality, supports or gameplay functionality. Does my question even make sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medeus Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 (edited) Does this mean you support the OTP I didn't vote in the popularity poll, but I agree with people who say that the results aren't necessarily telling. It might better to either rank them ALL from favorite to least favorite, or list your top (arbitrary number) favorite and least favorite, with REASONS. But I think all of those might be too much work for the average poll! One idea I was thinking of is that maybe what could be done is to split the votes into categories for design, unit, and character. Then, they each would have two subcategories where you would vote for a number of characters (lets say 10) that are your favorite and least favorite for each. Based on their placement, they could also get a certain number of points that would be collected and the total sum used to fully place the character on the final list. With that method, you could get a gauge of who's more popular and for what reason while still allowing characters that you do like to still get a vote, they just don't get as much support as your top favorite. It still would need some ironing out since you'd still have a number of characters in the middle unaccounted for, but I think it would be a good start to get deeper into the meaning behind the votes. *agoddamn* I'm not quite sure I can take a person who unironically compared the Treehouse to 4-kids and has made nothing but negative comments towards the localization fairly seriously, regardless of any truthfulness in evaluations. His Elise support in the Japanese version was infamously creepy, for one; also, the comment on Corrin's lines during his recruitment is assuming that they view Felicia/Jacob as nothing more than servants (which, judging by their supports, they clearly don't). Though there are a few changes for the worse, the amount of nitpicking here is a major turnoff. I have to agree, while I don't completely disagree with what they said, their post didn't really feel like it was made with the intent to properly contrast both characters. ZeroxElise is one such example of that as I remember that support got a lot of criticism in the early days, but I didn't see the negative aspects of that support mentioned at all in the post, same with examples like ZeroxPeri. I can understand having a preference here, but I can't say I felt both sides were properly represented, especially when the poster has a clear bias against the localization. Edited May 31, 2016 by Medeus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The DanMan Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Does this mean you support the OTP I didn't vote in the popularity poll, but I agree with people who say that the results aren't necessarily telling. It might better to either rank them ALL from favorite to least favorite, or list your top (arbitrary number) favorite and least favorite, with REASONS. But I think all of those might be too much work for the average poll! For an OTP to exist implies that there are even other options (which I don't even consider). "Optimizaiton" be damned, I always pair up Takumi and Oboro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steshii Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Okay...so...Niles is a gross caricature in both versions? :D Anyway, One idea I was thinking of is that maybe what could be done is to split the votes into categories for design, unit, and character. Then, they each would have two subcategories where you would vote for a number of characters (lets say 10) that are your favorite and least favorite for each. Based on their placement, they could also get a certain number of points that would be collected and the total sum used to fully place the character on the final list. With that method, you could get a gauge of who's more popular and for what reason while still allowing characters that you do like to still get a vote, they just don't get as much support as your top favorite. It still would need some ironing out since you'd still have a number of characters in the middle unaccounted for, but I think it would be a good start to get deeper into the meaning behind the votes. Would people even be willing to take the time out to do this? It seems like a lot. I liked this one because it was quick, and then just hopped in here to talk about specifics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter Nightblood Posted June 1, 2016 Author Share Posted June 1, 2016 How difficult would it be to create a poll that states the reasons as to why a person likes a character? There can be any number of reasons as to why a person likes or dislikes a character. Would it be better to limit the reasons to something more general, such as based on appearance, personality, supports or gameplay functionality. Does my question even make sense? Hmm.. that probably would be rather difficult, as the first thing you would have to do is ask them whether they like the character, then ask them why based on those results, which would require logic statements. I'll look into it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Sage Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 (edited) I actually would've preferred this, but if would've been localized, the sexual assault could've been traded in for something else. Maybe child neglect? They could still keep the sexual assault aspect in, Sacred Stones is pretty blatant about the fact that Valter is a rapist and Orson is slightly implied to be a necrophiliac. And then there's Gheb. That's for an E10+ game too, Fates could definitely get away with implying Niles was molested as a child. *agoddamn* I'm not quite sure I can take a person who unironically compared the Treehouse to 4-kids and has made nothing but negative comments towards the localization fairly seriously, regardless of any truthfulness in evaluations. His Elise support in the Japanese version was infamously creepy, for one; also, the comment on Corrin's lines during his recruitment is assuming that they view Felicia/Jacob as nothing more than servants (which, judging by their supports, they clearly don't). Though there are a few changes for the worse, the amount of nitpicking here is a major turnoff. To be honest, I'd rather have someone whose upfront about their dislike of the localization in their analysis than someone who pretends to be objective while blatantly gushing over it. Regardless, it doesn't hurt her main points. I do think his support with Elise in the JP was creepy, but the localization could've simply removed the perverted comments towards her, they didn't have to remove the fact he's deliberately sabotaging her from there too. Plus it's not like she said it's a localization on the same level as 4kids, just that it dips into that quality at times. And given some of the bizarre changes and inconsistencies and sloppiness present overall, I don't really blame her. There's bad writing specific to the localization, but not technically bad enough like FFT, FF7, or Xenogears to be funny or enjoyable in its own right (whose translations veer between serviceable and Plan 9 level bad). I'm starting to get the feeling that if the localization changed one scene into a high resolution picture of goatse, you'd still try to find some way to justify it. Edited June 1, 2016 by Dark Sage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Sage Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 (edited) EDIT: Fuck, doublepost. Could a mod remove this please? Edited June 1, 2016 by Dark Sage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The DanMan Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 (edited) To be honest, I'd rather have someone whose upfront about their dislike of the localization in their analysis than someone who pretends to be objective while blatantly gushing over it. Regardless, it doesn't hurt her main points. I do think his support with Elise in the JP was creepy, but the localization could've simply removed the perverted comments towards her, they didn't have to remove the fact he's deliberately sabotaging her from there too. Plus it's not like she said it's a localization on the same level as 4kids, just that it dips into that quality at times. And given some of the bizarre changes and inconsistencies and sloppiness present overall, I don't really blame her. There's bad writing specific to the localization, but not technically bad enough like FFT, FF7, or Xenogears to be funny or enjoyable in its own right (whose translations veer between serviceable and Plan 9 level bad). I'm starting to get the feeling that if the localization changed one scene into a high resolution picture of goatse, you'd still try to find some way to justify it. I myself am pretty neutral towards the overall localization, with their being good and bad changes; I just don't dwell on either of them. If you could please stop with the hyperbolic remarks, it would be appreciated. If I did see people relentlessly praising the localization, I'd level counterpoints; I don't see people do that though. I see a vocal group of people complain and nitpick, with nothing positive to say. In general, I try to raise counterpoints towards people who are being overtly positive or negative towards something I'm familiar with; you just don't get to see that here because of the vocal negativity in this community. Edited June 1, 2016 by The DanMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter Nightblood Posted June 1, 2016 Author Share Posted June 1, 2016 (edited) Alright, based SaiSymbolic's suggestion, I have a test survey up on my website, so it might will load slowly. Can people please test it out? http://nightblood.net/surveys/index.php/332557?lang=en This survey is 1-3 question(s). It should change the second question depending on what answer you pick. Edit: ...and it doesn't seem to be actually collecting responses. Crap. Edit 2: Or... maybe it is. I don't know. Edited June 1, 2016 by Hunter Nightblood Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 For an OTP to exist implies that there are even other options (which I don't even consider). "Optimizaiton" be damned, I always pair up Takumi and Oboro. Dude, I always knew you were cool I think one way you can do a poll is to have positive and negative values for each position of "like" or "dislike". If you decide to have people list their top five favorite and least favorite characters, the most liked character will have a value of +5, going down to +1 to the fifth person on the favorites list, while the most hated character will have -5, all the way up to -1. Characters in the middle would just have a value of 0. It could be done on Serenes Forest, easy, provided someone cares to tally all of the points. The only issue is that if we do it on SF, you'd only get SF players. Since we're also discussing localization a bit … I think my only issue with the localization is that I miss the subtlety in the Hoshidan characters' personalities (not to mention some of the personalities being exaggerated for the worst. If Hoshido is really based on Japan, Takumi being flippant towards Ryouma in their C-support would not ever fly, ever.) And despite the fact that they're trying to tell a serious story (well, presumably), the script doesn't feel very serious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nordopolica Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 @the 65 people who voted that they don't like Saizo: 1. Who hurt you? 2. Fite me. Other than that I'm generally pretty disappointed by polls like this so I won't comment much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Res Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 Alright, based SaiSymbolic's suggestion, I have a test survey up on my website, so it might will load slowly. Can people please test it out? http://nightblood.net/surveys/index.php/332557?lang=en This survey is 1-3 question(s). It should change the second question depending on what answer you pick. Edit: ...and it doesn't seem to be actually collecting responses. Crap. Edit 2: Or... maybe it is. I don't know. It only let me complete the first question, then took me straight to the results? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saisymbolic Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 Alright, based SaiSymbolic's suggestion, I have a test survey up on my website, so it might will load slowly. Can people please test it out? http://nightblood.net/surveys/index.php/332557?lang=en This survey is 1-3 question(s). It should change the second question depending on what answer you pick. Edit: ...and it doesn't seem to be actually collecting responses. Crap. Edit 2: Or... maybe it is. I don't know. Oh gosh, I didn't know you'd seriously make a poll with my suggestion. Okay, so I just tried it out and there is only one question, despite saying there are three questions. The first question was "What's your opinion about Male Corrin?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure Sen Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 Oh gosh, I didn't know you'd seriously make a poll with my suggestion. Okay, so I just tried it out and there is only one question, despite saying there are three questions. The first question was "What's your opinion about Male Corrin?" There are three questions, but the second and third (what do you like/dislike about male Corrin) only show up depending on how you answer the first question. Or at least that's how it worked when I did it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saisymbolic Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 (edited) There are three questions, but the second and third (what do you like/dislike about male Corrin) only show up depending on how you answer the first question. Or at least that's how it worked when I did it. Oh, okay. I only got that one result because I was neutral about him. Edited June 1, 2016 by SaiSymbolic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 (edited) Alright, based SaiSymbolic's suggestion, I have a test survey up on my website, so it might will load slowly. Can people please test it out? http://nightblood.net/surveys/index.php/332557?lang=en This survey is 1-3 question(s). It should change the second question depending on what answer you pick. Edit: ...and it doesn't seem to be actually collecting responses. Crap. Edit 2: Or... maybe it is. I don't know. This is exactly the sort of survey we need (although I'd merge 'personality' with 'character interactions' and add in 'plot involvement') to get an accurate reading of what people like. I don't know how many would answer all the questions but I'd like to see the data. Edited June 1, 2016 by NekoKnight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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