Lewyn Posted March 19, 2018 Share Posted March 19, 2018 9 hours ago, SavageVolug said: I'm not familiar with Game of Thrones although I have heard good things about it. But you have summed up what I had in mind when I said a more serious Fire Emblem game. What you're describing also sounds a bit like Thracia 776. Yeah Thracia 776, Genealogy of Holy War, and Radiant Dawn stand out as the most ambitious games in the series. They really tried to do a ton with these games, push the limits in scope and innovation as well. I really like them to return to that, in addition since Heroes pulled like 300 million in its first year, I think money won't be an issue. The designers could go as big as they want and won't be rushed. Imagine if they had the freedom that the team behind Zelda Breath of the Wild had? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsak Posted March 20, 2018 Share Posted March 20, 2018 (edited) I would like for fire emblem to continue it's trend. It's usually fairly serious, even if there isn't any serious decisions to be made immediately the overarching story usually tends to be serious and have dire consequences. Now if only they could tie that in to player choice and make it actually matter instead of goofy stuff like get Kaze Support up otherwise he bites the bucket. I would like to see something like - You don't take a side quest to defend a village so they get occupied or wiped out This causes you to have either consequence or things you must do like A- Take it back B- The enemy gets villagers from that village that you could of otherwise recruited and you have to face them etc Stuff like this makes an Avatar system worth doing because it makes choices and whatnot actually affect gameplay and replay-ability. But mini rant aside i really hope we don't get some really pushed crappy/creepy waifu characters that overall ruin the seriousness of the game. It's hard to get into the story when you got stuff like Peri who makes stuff just look comical or weird ass stuff like Nowi running around and just being wildly out of place in terms of just about everything. Hard to take the world ending seriously when you have some child like looking scantily clad dragon girl running around. It just kinda ruins everything idk Edited March 20, 2018 by Tsak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Call me cynical, but I don't think they are going to pull off their serious elements well, unless they get the writing team who worked on SoV. If they go the way of Fateswakening (and they probably will because $$$), I think we will have a lot of serious elements that are completely undercut by their implementation or other quirky elements. To name an example in Fates, a serious theme about family, what is more important, blood or bonds, is all undercut by the game allowing you to marry your own siblings, loosely justified with "we're not blood related". Or in Awakening, significant characters die only to be recruited later (and are possible to marry), just so the player has more characters to play with. In general, it's hard to maintain a serious tone when you have characters shouting puns when killing people, or characters running around in battle thongs. I don't think Fire Emblem should or will be like Dark Souls in terms of tone, but I would hope they would at least respect the gravity of what's happening in the story. Other games in the series have done this well, with both serious elements and moments of levity. I mentioned SoV earlier, and while I don't think all its dramatic elements were handled perfectly, at the very least I always felt it took itself seriously. Any other pre-3DS game is fine, really. On 3/19/2018 at 11:20 AM, Lewyn said: I'm all for Game of Thrones light. Complex relationships, motivations, politics, lots of surprises, great world building and lore, heroes don't always win, and stuff being on a grand epic scale while still being able to focus acutely on the many characters within this world. I probably sound like a broken record but a GOT-esque FE is all I want. The more horrible things like rape can be left to implication, but overall, I want the world to feel more real. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jotari Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, NekoKnight said: Call me cynical, but I don't think they are going to pull off their serious elements well, unless they get the writing team who worked on SoV. If they go the way of Fateswakening (and they probably will because $$$), I think we will have a lot of serious elements that are completely undercut by their implementation or other quirky elements. To name an example in Fates, a serious theme about family, what is more important, blood or bonds, is all undercut by the game allowing you to marry your own siblings, loosely justified with "we're not blood related". Or in Awakening, significant characters die only to be recruited later (and are possible to marry), just so the player has more characters to play with. In general, it's hard to maintain a serious tone when you have characters shouting puns when killing people, or characters running around in battle thongs. I don't think Fire Emblem should or will be like Dark Souls in terms of tone, but I would hope they would at least respect the gravity of what's happening in the story. Other games in the series have done this well, with both serious elements and moments of levity. I mentioned SoV earlier, and while I don't think all its dramatic elements were handled perfectly, at the very least I always felt it took itself seriously. Any other pre-3DS game is fine, really. I probably sound like a broken record but a GOT-esque FE is all I want. The more horrible things like rape can be left to implication, but overall, I want the world to feel more real. Have you played Geneoalogy of the Holy War? Because you're describing it right there. Edited March 21, 2018 by Jotari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 1 minute ago, Jotari said: Have you play Geneoalogy of the Holy War? Because you're describing it right there. Not yet, I was hoping for a remake but I might go for it if they decide not to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SavageVolug Posted March 21, 2018 Author Share Posted March 21, 2018 In addition to a tone that's more serious I wouldn't mind seeing some more in depth development, lore and culture being added to the world instead of seeing Country A is generic European Country, Country B is Generic Japanese Country, Country 3 is Big Bad Empire country. First of all I would like to see at least 5 major kingdoms each with their own lore, culture and identity. Have a diverse patheon, and some rich lore for any legendary weapons and or tomes that exist in the world, maybe where each one is guarded by either a paticular deity of the patheon or is the national treasure of a paticular kingdom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dreamyboi Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 37 minutes ago, SavageVolug said: In addition to a tone that's more serious I wouldn't mind seeing some more in depth development, lore and culture being added to the world instead of seeing Country A is generic European Country, Country B is Generic Japanese Country, Country 3 is Big Bad Empire country. First of all I would like to see at least 5 major kingdoms each with their own lore, culture and identity. Have a diverse patheon, and some rich lore for any legendary weapons and or tomes that exist in the world, maybe where each one is guarded by either a paticular deity of the patheon or is the national treasure of a paticular kingdom. Seriously doubt they'd go that far unless the majority of fans said they wanted it specifically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ae†her Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 I only expect a a serious FE in perhaps Genealogy Echoes, and maybe if they decide to be extra passionate in Binding Blade Echoes, and try to make it dark. I really hope the FE Echoes become actually dark though, not Shadows of Valentia (pun) standards, but like actual Genealogy standards. IS just really needs to up their game on story writers above all else honestly, screw realism just give a good sensible story at the very least from now on. Retcon the past FE games too because they're stories are not perfect either, but they can be with a little bit of rewriting. As for main FE titles, I just don't see them getting very serious (and by serious I mean realistic) because Fire Emblem is sort of in that midway between Nintendo's family-friendly motto, and their more mature titles. At the very least we can expect an anime-like story with some dark moments suggested, but overall it'll be all positivity and "bonds across time" as I see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewyn Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 12 hours ago, NekoKnight said: I probably sound like a broken record but a GOT-esque FE is all I want. The more horrible things like rape can be left to implication, but overall, I want the world to feel more real. They are pulling so much money from their mobile game, maybe they could offer a massive sum to GRR Martin to create the story for the next Fire Emblem? I really hope they use all the money they've gotten to hire a top notch writing staff, there are many lesser known incredibly talented writers and it should be easily affordable to hire some of them. In short there is no excuse for any games where story is a large element (any RPG, including SRPGs like Fire Emblem) for it to be poor or have tons of problems. The gameplay is king, and certainly most resources should go to that, however the story, music, art all of that is important as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivy Wife Supremacy Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 I said it before and I'll say it again every FE game was "serious" in their situations. But although Fire Emblem is one of Nintendos mid-mature IPs I don't see it going a darker way in story especially with who they cater to in big majority. It'll obviously will still have fanservice (for clear obvious reasons), shipping mechanics, self insertion and anime style humor but possibly again still retaining a "serious" story for those who want it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jotari Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 3 hours ago, Lewyn said: They are pulling so much money from their mobile game, maybe they could offer a massive sum to GRR Martin to create the story for the next Fire Emblem? I really hope they use all the money they've gotten to hire a top notch writing staff, there are many lesser known incredibly talented writers and it should be easily affordable to hire some of them. In short there is no excuse for any games where story is a large element (any RPG, including SRPGs like Fire Emblem) for it to be poor or have tons of problems. The gameplay is king, and certainly most resources should go to that, however the story, music, art all of that is important as well. If they pay Martin to do it, then we could probably expect to see the next Fire Emblem title by 2040. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zapp Branniglenn Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 A few ports of M rated games isn't going to make nintendo games suddenly more mature. Resident Evil 4, Bayonetta 2, and Fatal Frame 4 were all made exclusive for a nintendo system but it didn't put a gun in Mario's hands like some dweebs were expecting. And Fire Emblem is probably going to be fine. Freaking Heroes is starting to get chapters with dialogue and themes that approach mid tier quality for this series. And the silence on the game is making me feel confident it won't be rushed for release. When it comes to mature writing, It's all a matter of presentation. Are you going to introduce your characters like this, or like this? When you see a playable character for the first time, how many lines of dialogue will they have before you learn their character gimmick? When a character gets possessed by the evil dragon god, will it be appropriately tragic because we knew how that person was before? Will paralogues feel like they could conceivably occur in the game's world and expand on its lore, or will everything take place in dumb outrealms in order to avoid explanation? On 3/18/2018 at 5:32 PM, Slumber said: The story will be serious. It always has been. The characters, however, are an entirely different question. I'm gonna say no. I'm sure it'll be a cast of 60%+ comic relief like Awakening and Fates. Can't wait for those supports then. "Hey baby, I'll show you my character gimmick if you show me yours" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Book Bro Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 I hope I don't regret it but I'm feeling optimistic. SoV took its story and cast more seriously than the other 3DS games and even Heroes hasn't been so bad with their OCs. And there was that interview where they said this game would let us get to know the characters like never before (paraphrasing) - hopefully this means better development and not more face petting. I don't think the story will be up there on a Jugdral or Tellius level, but if it has world building and is cohesive I'll be satisfied. Anything more than that will be a very welcome bonus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewyn Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 1 minute ago, Book Bro said: I hope I don't regret it but I'm feeling optimistic. SoV took its story and cast more seriously than the other 3DS games and even Heroes hasn't been so bad with their OCs. And there was that interview where they said this game would let us get to know the characters like never before (paraphrasing) - hopefully this means better development and not more face petting. I don't think the story will be up there on a Jugdral or Tellius level, but if it has world building and is cohesive I'll be satisfied. Anything more than that will be a very welcome bonus. Oh that sounds very promising, when did they say that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Book Bro Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 8 minutes ago, Lewyn said: Oh that sounds very promising, when did they say that? Here ya go: https://nintendoeverything.com/switch-allow-for-a-completely-different-fire-emblem-will-breathe-life-into-characters-like-never-before/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewyn Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 3 minutes ago, Book Bro said: Here ya go: https://nintendoeverything.com/switch-allow-for-a-completely-different-fire-emblem-will-breathe-life-into-characters-like-never-before/ Oh thanks! It is vague but I am hoping more in depth supports, more actual character events and such as well. I think this switch game is going to be their most ambitious since Radiant Dawn, I hope they take their time and have tons of funding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troublesome Knight Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 It kind of annoys me how people keep talking about wanting a serious or dark story like that's the same thing as a good story. What we should want is a good/ well-written story first and foremost. The problem with Fates especially was that it wasn't well written, not that it wasn't serious enough. It's inability to balance the more serious aspects of the story with the sillier stuff was part of it being badly written. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dreamyboi Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 3 hours ago, Book Bro said: I hope I don't regret it but I'm feeling optimistic. SoV took its story and cast more seriously than the other 3DS games and even Heroes hasn't been so bad with their OCs. And there was that interview where they said this game would let us get to know the characters like never before (paraphrasing) - hopefully this means better development and not more face petting. I don't think the story will be up there on a Jugdral or Tellius level, but if it has world building and is cohesive I'll be satisfied. Anything more than that will be a very welcome bonus. I HOPE it'd be on par with Jugdral and Tellius because if the series has accomplished stuff like that before there's not much excuse for it to not deliver as much now, unless the dev team had conflicting views again like the Team A/Team B shit with Fates but we're past the """Awakening sold well so we need Awakening 2""" phase so that shouldn't be an issue I hope. Also I agree with the bolded bit. I just hope it's "Good", it doesn't need to be Fantastic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewyn Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 1 hour ago, Troublesome Knight said: It kind of annoys me how people keep talking about wanting a serious or dark story like that's the same thing as a good story. What we should want is a good/ well-written story first and foremost. The problem with Fates especially was that it wasn't well written, not that it wasn't serious enough. It's inability to balance the more serious aspects of the story with the sillier stuff was part of it being badly written. Well obviously great stories come in all genres and forms. Yes it should be well written first. Yes unfortunately while there was some potential, and some memorable characters, much of the story was awful. I think a big part is how Corrin, the player avatar, is the focus of everything and faultless and worshipped no matter what decision he makes. I think Fire Emblem generally being about large wars kind of lends itself to serious storytelling though. After all many die in war, and in these times, villagers and non participants are effected in many ways. It can be uplifting, inspirational, not necessarily dark and/or depressing. However super silly stuff can be very jarring and completely ruin the atmosphere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charmeleonbrah Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 I'd like for the main antagonist to be better than the usual one-dimensional villain that wants to destroy humanity just cuz. Give them a more nuanced backstory pls. I'm sick of the Bad Dragon/Ganondorf style antagonists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Book Bro Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 9 hours ago, Troublesome Knight said: It kind of annoys me how people keep talking about wanting a serious or dark story like that's the same thing as a good story. What we should want is a good/ well-written story first and foremost. The problem with Fates especially was that it wasn't well written, not that it wasn't serious enough. It's inability to balance the more serious aspects of the story with the sillier stuff was part of it being badly written. As another poster said, FE is a series about war. Too much silliness detracts from the main theme of the series. I realize you can have war stories that are "black comedies", but I don't think FE can or should be that. There can be funny and cheerful moments, especially in supports and character building, but even then they should avoid high school type mischief and reliance on gimmicks. Otherwise we get a situation like in Fates where a character gets murdered and then we're back to joking around like nothing happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 (edited) 12 hours ago, Book Bro said: I hope I don't regret it but I'm feeling optimistic. SoV took its story and cast more seriously than the other 3DS games and even Heroes hasn't been so bad with their OCs. And there was that interview where they said this game would let us get to know the characters like never before (paraphrasing) - hopefully this means better development and not more face petting. I don't think the story will be up there on a Jugdral or Tellius level, but if it has world building and is cohesive I'll be satisfied. Anything more than that will be a very welcome bonus. I'm looking at the credited writers and directors for SoV, Fates and Heroes. SoV has completely different directors to the other two games who share Kouhei Maeda. Maeda also works on the writing for Heroes, along with Satoko Kurihara, who is also the writer of SoV. None of Fates writers worked on SoV or Heroes. I wonder which members of the staff are contributing to the good or bad elements of the series. Kurihara might be a positive influence, if SoV is any indication. Maeda has been with IS since 2001, so it's hard to say how much he has affected the quality of the series. I'm pleased that none of the Fates writers returned, but I'm still a little anxious. Is SoV and Heroes (to a lesser extent) an indication they are trying harder now? Edited March 22, 2018 by NekoKnight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thane Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, NekoKnight said: I'm looking at the credited writers and directors for SoV, Fates and Heroes. SoV has completely different directors to the other two games who share Kouhei Maeda. Maeda also works on the writing for Heroes, along with Satoko Kurihara, who is also the writer of SoV. None of Fates writers worked on SoV or Heroes. I wonder which members of the staff are contributing to the good or bad elements of the series. Kurihara might be a positive influence, if SoV is any indication. Maeda has been with IS since 2001, so it's hard to say how much he has affected the quality of the series. I'm pleased that none of the Fates writers returned, but I'm still a little anxious. Is SoV and Heroes (to a lesser extent) an indication they are trying harder now? So what you're saying is that all the writers who worked on Fates are busy with FE Switch? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinar87 Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 (edited) I really don't mind awakening and fates anymore in terms of writing, though I do prefer echoes/tellius in terms of story and tone. What I'd like for story is something like echoes again, but I wouldn't be opposed to having S supports or even children, as long as they could find a good reason to have either of them that fits with the story and themes of the game, and isn't just included because of pandering reasons. Heck I'm getting persona 5 for my birthday, and that game has fan service and stuff in it despite me usually hating that stuff, so that shows it's all about doing it right as opposed to whether you do it at all. Edited March 22, 2018 by Dinar87 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 18 minutes ago, Thane said: So what you're saying is that all the writers who worked on Fates are busy with FE Switch? Delet this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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