Religion.

[Judge Judy]

Logically, religion doesn't make sense.

That entirely depends on people's perspectives of religions and its content. From religious point of view, its makes sense since they studied it and are able to make sense of it, while for others it doesn't.

Though religion is not based on facts. If you put it into that context then yes at times it doesn't make sense.

Edited December 1, 2008 by Dark

[Meteor]

If you make the assumption that some things cannot be explained by physical forces, you could argue religion has its place. If you make the opposite assumption, that's where it cannot succeed.

[Phoenix]

Greek Gods? Well I think the Christian God is more believeable because of popularity alone. Paganism is out. Salvation is in.

[Leonri]

Greek Gods? Well I think the Christian God is more believeable because of popularity alone. Paganism is out. Salvation is in.

Wrong in fact. The Flying Spaghetti Monster is the only deity that makes sense. There's upward of 10 million Pastafarians, and that number is growing daily. Big, impressive numbers mean my religion is more rational than yours.

The Greeks were not Pagans. <_<

[Phoenix]

Wrong in fact. The Flying Spaghetti Monster is the only deity that makes sense. There's upward of 10 million Pastafarians, and that number is growing daily. Big, impressive numbers mean my religion is more rational than yours.

The Greeks were not Pagans. <_<

I don't think that numbers make a religion true or even rational. They just make it popular. That's about it. and when I said Paganism, I was generalizing with multi-God cultures. I like how people think using a dumb sounding God makes their points better. It's funny. Even if you had a billion followers in that faith like the Catholics do, it doesn't make it better, more rational, sensible, or logical, it's just popular. There could be one person on this whole planet in a religion all by himself and he might actually be in the right one assuming there is a "right" one. That would be hilarious! Anyway a religion's size is nothing more than popularity, or influence, not it being rational which is almost impossible to begin with.

[Fox]

Greek Gods? Well I think the Christian God is more believeable because of popularity alone. Paganism is out. Salvation is in.

I don't think that numbers make a religion true or even rational.

Wait what?

[Phoenix]

Wait what?

Read it again. In essence I said that the more popular a religion is, the more people that adhere to it. Then I said that a popular religion isn't made true, rational or logical by mere numbers or popularity. Popularity does not mae a religion true.

[Esau of Isaac]

This alone makes my thoughts scream "AHA GRAM" Everything you do reeks of him. This is the first time I trusted my gut in like three weeks. Too bad I didn't use it for something more important :(

I would have used the name Esau on FEE, but I wasn't in the mood for it.

God doesn't hate sex at all, he embraces it... when it's between a married couple.

Sex for pleasure is not very peachy in God's eyes at all. If it's not for procreation, it's not very right.

Considering hell exists,

Whoa whoa slow down a second. Where was it shown that hell exists?

I find it hard to believe it would be at all enjoyable. He's not exactly a guy you would trust.

Well, considering his head count is like ten and God's is like a billion, it's sort of like choosing between a rock and a hard place.

I've heard decent arguments from either side, but I refuse to believe the Bible is a load of BS, like I know some people do.

Why don't you believe that the historically incorrect events within the Bible are not BS?

Point is, the events written really did happen. Science and archaeological dating or whatever has actually proven that themselves.

I don't remember science ever proving that the Earth was created in six days and that the entire world was flooded under twenty feet of water, killing all life on Earth except one boat. In fact, that sounds downright ridiculous and incorrect.

In fact, since you've never read the Bible, why in the world are you even daring to debate on its validity?

Plus, it's never died out; by it, I mean faith and the Bible itself. Fads come and go, but the Bible and faith in God has persevered through the centuries. That has to mean something.

What? You think that because it's an old religion, that it's right?

What the hell? There are to this day some that adhere to the belief that Odin is the All-Father. Kind of disagrees with the Christian religion on several accounts. Mind telling me why yours would be correct, but not theirs? Or any of the other several dozen that are still held in areas?

Here's the point; both sides have only evidence. Neither side can prove themselves right nor the other side wrong. The believers have a historical book with lessons still taught today and real historical events, while the non-believers have all their science and stuff. Neither is direct proof of a God existing or not. So there's only one thing left; a choice. Do you choose to believe, or do you choose to be a non-believer? Saying either one is wrong or right is completely unjustified and cannot be proven.

I say that Christian believers are wrong, for several reasons that have already been stated numerous times throughout this topic. Please move back some pages and read my arguments and respond to them.

Wait a sec, how do you know? Were you there? Were you alive thousands of years ago?

You're doing it wrong. When there is no evidence of something, you assume a negative, not a positive.

For example, are you standing right next to me? Are you watching me? If no, then why don't you believe that I'm God? Or Iron Man? Or Flash? Or Superman?

Because there is no evidence that points to it. You don't have to be there to assume that something that is ridiculous and without evidence is false; it would be absolutely unreasonable to hold any other position.

My point is that people continue to believe. I'm sure other religions (Not all, but some) try to push their beliefs onto people as well, but with less success. It's easier to live with Christianity because, compared to other religions, it ultimately makes the most sense.

Again, stop talking about how it makes the most sense if you've never read the book.

[Not Changed by VASM :(]

I am.......not sure what the hell I am?

I believe in elements of everything, but no organized religion.

So, what I am...would be........a...

Well let's put it this way, I take elements of every religion, then apply them to my own believes, then I just do what I have to do to life with myself and hope that the choices I make are the right ones...

[Meteor]

Sex for pleasure is not very peachy in God's eyes at all. If it's not for procreation, it's not very right.

Says who? The Catholic church?

[Phoenix]

Why did the Catholics go and paint sex as evil? They're ruining marriages with that crap.

Anyway... Hell does actually exist that's fact. The word Hell in Hebrew means hole in the ground and in Greek it means Grave. So yeah there is a hell, trust me and your dead relatives on that one. Now as far as a pit of fire to burn bodies in... aka Gehenna hell fire, that place might not actually exist yet, as it's more related to judgement day events and such.

Listen carefully. Everyone. Religion is illogical. That's fact. Don't defend it with logic because Esau and Revan will cheerfully tear you a new asshole. If you've got to defend your religion, do so in this manner:

Oh pitiful one, you cannot imagine the power of God. You are blinded by the ways of this world. You will one day learn that you are mistaken and hopefully on that day, you will run to us and become brethren with us, and we will laugh and play and worship together as a people.

[Phoenix]

I am.......not sure what the hell I am?

I believe in elements of everything, but no organized religion.

So, what I am...would be........a...

Well let's put it this way, I take elements of every religion, then apply them to my own believes, then I just do what I have to do to life with myself and hope that the choices I make are the right ones...

That makes you freelance. You could loosely call yourself a Protestant too if you want to belong to some group.

[Fox]

Listen carefully. Everyone. Religion is illogical. That's fact. Don't defend it with logic because Esau and Revan will cheerfully tear you a new asshole. If you've got to defend your religion, do so in this manner:

How else would you have people debate, other than logically?

[Meteor]

The point is that it can't be argued logically.

[Not Changed by VASM :(]

I find it ironic that a lot of atheists complain about the church "Tellin em what to do"

but I find a lot of Atheists feel the need to force their believes more then religious nutjobs

Edited December 2, 2008 by Toa Lord Meowth

[Phoenix]

How else would you have people debate, other than logically?

How else? I'm positive I covered that in my post. Yep.

Pikachu might win ya know. Pokemon never get killed. FE characters on the other hand drop left and right.

[Fox]

How else? I'm positive I covered that in my post. Yep.

Mind pointing it out for me, then? Because I don't see it. Oh wait, you mean that bolded fundamentalist spiel at the end of your post?

[Phoenix Wright]

Well, considering his head count is like ten and God's is like a billion, it's sort of like choosing between a rock and a hard place.

How about YOU get your [religious] facts straight for once? In the book of Revelation, Satan's army has the amount of people to a grains of sand. Most likely a metaphor, but it's meant to say he's got a shitload of people.

It's easier to live with Christianity because, compared to other religions, it ultimately makes the most sense.

Sorry but, even as a Christian I believe that to be false. If it was easy to understand, it would have everyone be a Christian, not separated faiths. There wouldn't be religions that believe in other deity's or polytheistic faiths.

I would also like to add we can never prove our religion true, we can only believe and have faith. If we say one religion is false, we would all be hypocrites because we don't know that. Atheism could be VERY right too, seeing as how every Atheist here is phenomenal at debating because debates are using facts over opinion or belief. Facts are a big part in reality.

We are handicapped in that matter, believers cannot use belief as fact. Therefore, we can never prove God's existence. Nor can a polytheistic religious person prove their Gods exist either.

Which makes Atheism just as much a religion. Prove me wrong but isn't Atheism just living your life the way YOU want to? Without anyone else in the picture, unless they are chosen to be? That is a belief, and there is no way in hell you can prove that to be the way everyone should live life.

In conclusion, we will just have to find out the day we die, or until The End of the World happens. Whichever comes first.

Edited December 2, 2008 by Citrusman

[Balcerzak]

I would also like to add we can never prove our religion true, we can only believe and have faith. If we say one religion is false, we would all be hypocrites because we don't know that. Atheism could be VERY right too, seeing as how every Atheist here is phenomenal at debating because debates are using facts over opinion or belief.

We are handicapped in that matter, believers cannot use belief as fact. Therefore, we can never prove God's existence. Nor can a polytheistic religious person prove their Gods exist also.

Which makes Atheism just as much a religion. Prove me wrong but isn't Atheism just living your life the way YOU want to? Without anyone else in the picture, unless they are chosen to be? That is a belief, and there is no way in hell you can prove that to be the way everyone should live life.

In conclusion, we will just have to find out the day we die, or until The End of the World happens. Whichever comes first.

No.

Buddhism is atheistic. So is (LaVeyan) Satanism. Atheism by itself, does not a religion make. Atheism is simply the lack of belief in deities, period. It doesn't dictate any other beliefs, and even if it did, religion is not solely defined by beliefs, but also by actions. Let's take a look at a reputable definition of religion, shall we.

Religion

1. a. A state of life bound by monastic vows; the condition of one who is a member of a religious order, esp. in the Roman Catholic Church.

{dag}b. man, etc. of religion, one bound by monastic vows or in holy orders. Obs.

{dag}c. house, etc. of religion, a religious house, a monastery or nunnery. Obs.

2. a. A particular monastic or religious order or rule; {dag}a religious house. Now rare.

{dag}b. collect. People of religion. Obs.

{dag}c. A member of a religious order. Obs.

3. a. Action or conduct indicating a belief in, reverence for, and desire to please, a divine ruling power; the exercise or practice of rites or observances implying this. Also pl., religious rites. Now rare, exc. as implied in 5.

{dag}b. A religious duty or obligation. Obs.

4. a. A particular system of faith and worship.

{dag}b. the Religion [after F.]: the Reformed Religion, Protestantism. Obs.

c. religion of nature: the worship of Nature in place of a more formal system of religious belief.

5. a. Recognition on the part of man of some higher unseen power as having control of his destiny, and as being entitled to obedience, reverence, and worship; the general mental and moral attitude resulting from this belief, with reference to its effect upon the individual or the community; personal or general acceptance of this feeling as a standard of spiritual and practical life.

b. to get religion: see GET v. 12d.

{dag}c. Awe, dread. Obs. rare{em}1.

6. transf. {dag}a. Devotion to some principle; strict fidelity or faithfulness; conscientiousness; pious affection or attachment. Obs.

b. In phr. to make (a) religion of or to make (it) religion to, to make a point of, to be scrupulously careful ({dag}not) to do something.

{dag}7. The religious sanction or obligation of an oath, etc. Obs.

8. attrib. and Comb., as religion-complex, -dresser, -game, -making, -mender, -monger, -shop; religion-arousing, -infectious, -masked, -raptured adjs.; {dag}religion man = sense 1b.

The only relevant entries in this list being 3, 4, and 5, let's examine them a little closer. 3 deals with the divine, so is right out for atheists; 4 deals with systems of faith and worship, neither of which atheists necessarily have or perform (though they could if they chose, cf. Buddhism, Satanism); and 5 is back to some higher power worthy of reverence and worship, not something you get when you become a card-carrying athiest.

Atheists are freely able to adopt any religion they want, or none at all, provided said religion doesn't involve gods. Atheism by itself is not a religion. Discussion over.

NB: {dag} is short for the dagger symbol, which apparently doesn't copy/paste well, but it is used as the "obsolete status marker".

Edited December 2, 2008 by Balcerzak

[Phoenix]

Upon death eh? Well if you want to learn anything after death, you'd better hope there is an immortal soul, cause without one, death is exactly what it looks like. No learning, no conscious existence, no thought at all. Honestly I prefer that in the end because then wicked people don't need to be burned forever like the Catholics believe, instead, they just die. That'd be the end of it. Dead, gone, done with. That's the kind of mercy I look for.

[Phoenix Wright]

No.

Buddhism is atheistic. So is (LaVeyan) Satanism. Atheism by itself, does not a religion make. Atheism is simply the lack of belief in deities, period. It doesn't dictate any other beliefs, and even if it did, religion is not solely defined by beliefs, but also by actions. Let's take a look at a reputable definition of religion, shall we.

The only relevant entries in this list being 3, 4, and 5, let's examine them a little closer. 3 deals with the divine, so is right out for atheists; 4 deals with systems of faith and worship, neither of which atheists necessarily have or perform (though they could if they chose, cf. Buddhism, Satanism); and 5 is back to some higher power worthy of reverence and worship, not something you get when you become a card-carrying athiest.

Atheists are freely able to adopt any religion they want, or none at all, provided said religion doesn't involve gods. Atheism by itself is not a religion. Discussion over.

NB: {dag} is short for the dagger symbol, which apparently doesn't copy/paste well, but it is used as the "obsolete status marker".

All this time I was under the impression that Atheism was a belief.

Oh well, just forget about that sentence. Esau, PLEASE don't quote this a page letter and tell me AGAIN. It's VERY annoying.

Upon death eh? Well if you want to learn anything after death, you'd better hope there is an immortal soul,

Yeah...I do believe that. What are you trying to say exactly? I said no one is right until everyone is dead. No learning, you'll know if you were right or wrong.

[Phoenix]

Anyway... on to more retarded things!

I LIKE MY RELIGION AND YOU BASTARDS CAN'T TAKE IT FROM ME!!! SO SCREW YOU!!!

With all due respect.

[Phoenix Wright]

Anyway... on to more retarded things!

I LIKE MY RELIGION AND YOU BASTARDS CAN'T TAKE IT FROM ME!!! SO SCREW YOU!!!

With all due respect.

Your personal statement...or making fun of others? Not sure.

I'm sure everyone likes their religion.

How are Atheists, Buddhists etc. classified? If they are not religions I mean...

Edited December 2, 2008 by Citrusman

[Florete]

I said I don't read the Bible, not that I haven't read it. I read it, just a while back, and I don't continue anymore. And ok, my whole line of making sense was wrong; I'm biased, sue me.

Unfortunately, I have to go right now, so I can't say all that I want to.

[uguu]

Firstly, How does Adam and Eve make sense? Their certainly are more than 2 races, so even if Adam and Eve were to be different races then how would that account for multiple other races? And do you really think that this world would've been this populated by this point in time if it started out as only two humans?

Secondly, Noah's Ark, how would an old man build a giant boat and get 2 of each animal on the boat, each being a different gender (you know he had to check...), and then (as far as I'm aware of) not take any humans on the boat? How would the world repopulate with humans if all that was left was Noah unless the bible supports beastiality and the babies just happened to be closer to human (or God made another Adam and another Eve)

So yeah, as far as I've been paying attention I haven't gotten an answer to these two questions. (and the answers for my third and fourth questions were pretty half-assed) so bleh.