How Will Choose Your Legends Categorize Three Hopes characters?

[Jotari]

Three Hopes does something that Three Houses really should have done. It gives faces to a bunch of politically important people that are inexplicably offscreen for the entirety of the original game. This, I think pretty much anyone can agree, is a good thing (unless you're really attached to the joke of Holst being built up but never appearing due to repeated weak excuses). And I'm sure these characters, along with originals such as the protagonist and the Almyrian prince(?) will eventually make it into Heroes. If TMS characters can get in, then surely Holst and Count Bergalitz can. But...how will they be presented in Choose Your Legends? They aren't Three Houses characters, after all, so it'd be a bit weird to list them amongst the other cast. The only other solution would be to have a dedicated Three Hopes game to select from...only all the Three Houses characters are in the game too. Though, at leas they all have redesigns, but are we really going to have three separate titles in Choose Your Legends dedicated to Fodlan? If they hadn't already split Three Houses into War/Academy I could see them listing it all as one title under Three Houses/Three Hopes, similarily to how they list Gaiden/Shadows of Valentia (but not Shadow Dragon NES and Shadow Dragon DS in English, funnily enough).

So...yeah this isn't really a super important thing, and I reckon they'll probably go with the option of having Three Hopes as it's own title to select, but...eh, maybe people have thoughts on what they think/want to see happen in this regard.

While I'm at it, I'll say I am kind of surprised they didn't release the Three Houses protagonist as a Legendary to promote the game, or otherwise release a character from the game in Heroes. Give us a tonne of Three Houses banners doesn't feel like it'd sell any extra copies compared to giving us the actual characters, like they did when Three Houses was first released.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Jotari

[Diovani Bressan]

My guess is:

Three Hopes will appear as it's own title during the CYL voting phase. Three Hopes votes will be combined with Three Houses votes, and the most voted version of that character will be picked for the Brave Hero appearance, just like how it already works in the event.

Example: If Felix wins CYL (1st or 2nd place), and his most voted version is the Three Hopes one, then that will be his appearance in the game.

For FEH, I am still not sure how they will classify Three Hopes. Will they just put characters from that game under the Three Houses title, or create a Three Hopes filter (with Arval's or Shez's chibi head as icon) and then combine both titles for Limited Battles/Resonant Battles, just like how it happens with Genealogy & Thracia and Path of Radiance & Radiant Dawn?

But I expect Three Hopes units to be added at some point... at least the exclusive ones like Monica, Holst and, of course, Shez. I honestly hope they don't be like "here's Three Hopes Edelgard, and Three Hopes Dimitri" because... please no.

Things like Legendary Hero Shez and Mythic Hero Arval, I can see happening at some point.

[Fire Emblem Fan]

I'd guess they group Three Hopes with Three Houses for CYL, either that or just ignore Hopes entirely.

[Florete]

Well for one, I don't think most, if any, of these characters are getting into Heroes. Many of them are just old dudes who no one really cares about (who is actually going to pull for Linhardt's dad?). But the fact that we haven't gotten any Three Hopes characters yet, not even Shez or Arval, tells me we're not getting them at all. SoV and Three Houses units came to Heroes shortly before the release of the games themselves. Even TMS units came at the same time as the TMS Switch port. But Heroes has already acknowledged Three Hopes without adding any units from it, similar to what they did with the first Warriors game. Any "Three Hopes" characters we get will probably just be characters from Three Houses like Rodrigue, and maybe Monica and Holst since they do technically exist in Three Houses.

If they appear in CYL at all, they'll likely be under the Three Houses section. It's a little weird, but not that much different from characters like Ullr and Elimine.

8 hours ago, Jotari said:

While I'm at it, I'll say I am kind of surprised they didn't release the Three Houses protagonist as a Legendary to promote the game

The only characters to ever get in as a legendary without a prior base version are Heroes OCs. That's probably not changing any time soon.

[Jotari]

3 hours ago, Diovani Bressan said:

My guess is:

Three Hopes will appear as it's own title during the CYL voting phase. Three Hopes votes will be combined with Three Houses votes, and the most voted version of that character will be picked for the Brave Hero appearance, just like how it already works in the event.

Example: If Felix wins CYL (1st or 2nd place), and his most voted version is the Three Hopes one, then that will be his appearance in the game.

For FEH, I am still not sure how they will classify Three Hopes. Will they just put characters from that game under the Three Houses title, or create a Three Hopes filter (with Arval's or Shez's chibi head as icon) and then combine both titles for Limited Battles/Resonant Battles, just like how it happens with Genealogy & Thracia and Path of Radiance & Radiant Dawn?

But I expect Three Hopes units to be added at some point... at least the exclusive ones like Monica, Holst and, of course, Shez. I honestly hope they don't be like "here's Three Hopes Edelgard, and Three Hopes Dimitri" because... please no.

Things like Legendary Hero Shez and Mythic Hero Arval, I can see happening at some point.

I expect the game would just classify them under Fodlan. CYL separates things by game title, but the game itself tends to branch things by continuity, with Marth's games and the Tellius games...actually I just checked and Tellius actually is split up. Huh..that's weird. Guess they were dedicated to having a Micaiah head...Even though pretty much everyone categorized under it except Micaiah herself (and a few laguz) was introduced in Path of Radiance because they've been holding out on giving us the Dawn Brigade for a long time now. Well I guess it's possible they will seperate the games in terms of categorization. Especially since they have Sothis and not Byleth representing Three Houses, leaving Chibi Arval open as a corresponding head to categorize.

1 hour ago, Florete said:

The only characters to ever get in as a legendary without a prior base version are Heroes OCs. That's probably not changing any time soon.

This is true, and, conversely, all Mythics have gotten into the game without a base version. But we're also reaching the bottom of the barrel of what's viable for both. I've increasingly been thinking recently that the best way to implement the characters from the original Warriors would be as stand alone Legendries/Mythics, as, with a total of three real characters (Rowan, Lianna and Darios) there simply isn't enough characters for a standard banner, unless they want to count the queen or Darios's dad who both show up for like a single cutscene without any existence in gameplay. I don't even like Warriors but I feel it kind of unfair that TMS is counted while it's excluded. Wouldn't bein this mess if there had been more cross communication and they'd decided to use Alfonse and Sharena as the protagonists in Warriors solidifying them as the heroes of spin off games. Or if they'd taken a step back from Fateswakening and gave us Ephraim, Eirika and Lyon in the role of the main characters, which the three already kind of match.

But, anyway, yeah, while I reckon they will be including the new characters from Three Hopes because they're already attached to the universe of Three Houses, I think Warrios 1 will continue to be ignored, but if Three Hopes proves popular they might go back and the best way to do so would be stand alone Legendaries/Mythics (or maybe as a Fallen Hero for Darios).

[Diovani Bressan]

My main problem with Warriors 1 is that we have three options for playable units: Rowan Lianna and Darios. And all three are sword users (and clones of each other in the game).

Even if they made a three heroes banner, it would be 3 red units.

Three Hopes is different, since it introduced more characters. So they can make it work more easily.

[Jotari]

47 minutes ago, Diovani Bressan said:

My main problem with Warriors 1 is that we have three options for playable units: Rowan Lianna and Darios. And all three are sword users (and clones of each other in the game).

Even if they made a three heroes banner, it would be 3 red units.

Three Hopes is different, since it introduced more characters. So they can make it work more easily.

I doubt they'll ever exhibit the creativity to do it, but they could make Darios a breath unit who summons the final boss. Velezerk or something (don't super care about his name as he's an absolute nothing character. What he absolutely should have been was Loptyr's physical body though, as that's an unaddressed plot point in the series's overall continuity).

[Ice Dragon]

As far as CYL goes, it seems fine to just add them under a separate title. Having multiple versions of the same character hasn't been an issue ever since they started combining votes across all versions of the same character.

If they were to ever be added to Heroes, they'd probably still be under the Sothis head icon, like how all of the Akaneia games are combined under the Marth head icon despite listing different source games in their descriptions.

 

1 hour ago, Diovani Bressan said:

Even if they made a three heroes banner, it would be 3 red units.

Why limit it to 3 red units when it could be 4 red units with Velezark as a red dragon?

[Jotari]

2 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

Why limit it to 3 red units when it could be 4 red units with Velezark as a red dragon?

I realize you're probably joking, but we haven't seen any unit that isn't humanoid in their base form. So a character who is just pure monster without a human character is unexplored territory. The closest is probably Naga who had a human base design but no transformed design which they kind of made up themselves. I wouldn't exactly object to having dragons and beasts just hanging around the castle (gender ambiguous Feral Corrin as an always transformed dragon was my idea for a mounted breath unit back in the day before they actually started including feral Corrin), but I don't think it's a line they're really likely to cross unless a more tame character like Red XIII bridges the gap.

[Ice Dragon]

54 minutes ago, Jotari said:

I realize you're probably joking, but we haven't seen any unit that isn't humanoid in their base form. So a character who is just pure monster without a human character is unexplored territory. The closest is probably Naga who had a human base design but no transformed design which they kind of made up themselves. I wouldn't exactly object to having dragons and beasts just hanging around the castle (gender ambiguous Feral Corrin as an always transformed dragon was my idea for a mounted breath unit back in the day before they actually started including feral Corrin), but I don't think it's a line they're really likely to cross unless a more tame character like Red XIII bridges the gap.

Velezark would probably just be in a Grima situation where a possessed Darios would summon Velezark behind him.

And yes, I'm definitely joking about having a new character banner with 4 red units on it, but it would definitely be funny. (And Velezark makes more sense to be colorless anyways since his entire gameplay gimmick is that he periodically changes his weapon triangle affinity.)

[Diovani Bressan]

2 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

And Velezark makes more sense to be colorless anyways since his entire gameplay gimmick is that he periodically changes his weapon triangle affinity.

Velezark: Chaos Dragon (Colorless Dragon)

Chaos Expiration (Might 16 / Ranged 2)

Unit can counterattack regardless of foe's range. If unit's HP ≥ 25%, inflict Atk/Res-6 on foe during combat, foe cannot make a follow-up attack and grants WTA against X colored foes based on current turn (see below). If foe's Range = 2 or unit has WTA against foe, calculates damage using the lower of foe's Def or Res.

(Specified color: Odd Turns= Red and Blue, Even Turns = Green and Colorless.)

[Jotari]

2 hours ago, Diovani Bressan said:

Velezark: Chaos Dragon (Colorless Dragon)

Chaos Expiration (Might 16 / Ranged 2)

Unit can counterattack regardless of foe's range. If unit's HP ≥ 25%, inflict Atk/Res-6 on foe during combat, foe cannot make a follow-up attack and grants WTA against X colored foes based on current turn (see below). If foe's Range = 2 or unit has WTA against foe, calculates damage using the lower of foe's Def or Res.

(Specified color: Odd Turns= Red and Blue, Even Turns = Green and Colorless.)

A unit that changed their wta on the fly would actually be pretty novel for Heroes. Though I'm not sure doubling down on it with two colours per turn is the best. It's objectively more useful than being on a four turn rotation (provided there's no wtd) but idk, feels kind of weird to group green with colourless. 

4 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

Velezark would probably just be in a Grima situation where a possessed Darios would summon Velezark behind him.

You going to but Darios on the banner twice then? Suppose Darios's father could summon him by sacrificing the queen.

[Diovani Bressan]

1 minute ago, Jotari said:

A unit that changed their wta on the fly would actually be pretty novel for Heroes. Though I'm not sure doubling down on it with two colours per turn is the best. It's objectively more useful than being on a four turn rotation (provided there's no wtd) but idk, feels kind of weird to group green with colourless.

I was about to make one color per turn, but then I was also considering Velezark a mythic hero, or at least a good unit to use in AR/Duels, and would be bad to wait 3-4 turns to use the color advantage you need in a game mode that has limited turns.

[Ice Dragon]

1 hour ago, Jotari said:

You going to but Darios on the banner twice then?

Yep.

 

4 hours ago, Diovani Bressan said:

Velezark: Chaos Dragon (Colorless Dragon)

Chaos Expiration (Might 16 / Ranged 2)

Unit can counterattack regardless of foe's range. If unit's HP ≥ 25%, inflict Atk/Res-6 on foe during combat, foe cannot make a follow-up attack and grants WTA against X colored foes based on current turn (see below). If foe's Range = 2 or unit has WTA against foe, calculates damage using the lower of foe's Def or Res.

(Specified color: Odd Turns= Red and Blue, Even Turns = Green and Colorless.)

I'd also add "Neutralizes effects that grant weapon triangle advantage to foe and effects that inflict weapon triangle disadvantage to unit" (only on turns when he has advantage against the opponent's color) so that we don't get weird things happening when he goes up against Litrraven or himself. Against Litrraven, his effect will win on turns that he has advantage against the opponent's color, and against himself, both units will always be neutral to each other.

[Jotari]

One very novel thing they could do would be to retroactively add the popular Three Hopes to Three Houses as some kind of spotpass DLC. Not mess with the canon or anything, just make them some units you can recruit to your army at the start of the game. It doesn't take a whole lot of work to create an entirely new Fire Emblem character. All the models are there now from Three Hopes and generic voice lines can be reused too. Whip up a personal skills and some boons/banes and you're done (Holst in particular could get a personal skill that lets him fight better against flying enemies due to his whole Almyrian rivalry, that would actually be quite a useful niche as enemy flying units are some of the most troublesome in Maddening Mode).

Not something I actually expect them to do, but they do give some bonuses for having Three Houses in Three Hopes, it would be really cool if they went back and made the reverse happen too.

[Aedan7479]

Well, for Three Hopes characters, there are:

Shez, Arval, Holst, Shahid, Counts Gautier, Gloucester, Bergliez, Herving, and Varley. Except for Shez and Arval

All of those sound more like GHB's rather than banner heroes, plus the fact that the only female option is Shez, doesn't give them much hope. I won't be surprised if we get all the lords on a banner though, (maybe then we'd get Holst GHB? He’s the only new and playable character outside of Shez).

Edited July 13, 2022 by Aedan7479
Forgot Count Gloucester.

[Jotari]

1 hour ago, Aedan7479 said:

Well, for Three Hopes characters, there are:

Shez, Arval, Holst, Shahid, Counts Gautier, Gloucester, Bergliez, Herving, and Varley. Except for Shez and Arval

All of those sound more like GHB's rather than banner heroes, plus the fact that the only female option is Shez, doesn't give them much hope. I won't be surprised if we get all the lords on a banner though, (maybe then we'd get Holst GHB? He’s the only new and playable character outside of Shez).

Bergliez isn't playable? T.T

If they do categorize them alongside regular Three Houses characters, then they can slip them into regular Three Houses banners without trying to make a dedicated banner for them. On the other hand, if they are considered a different game, then they can also fill out the banner with other units that appear in both games under those character designs (or just the likes of Nader or Jearlt who use the same character design but aren't in the game yet). I agree the counts aren't likely to get in, but I could see Shahid on a banner, though he wouldn't be illsuited to a grand hero battle either.

Edited July 13, 2022 by Jotari

[Florete]

5 hours ago, Aedan7479 said:

Well, for Three Hopes characters, there are:

Shez, Arval, Holst, Shahid, Counts Gautier, Gloucester, Bergliez, Herving, and Varley. Except for Shez and Arval

All of those sound more like GHB's rather than banner heroes, plus the fact that the only female option is Shez, doesn't give them much hope. I won't be surprised if we get all the lords on a banner though, (maybe then we'd get Holst GHB? He’s the only new and playable character outside of Shez).

Most of those don't seem like GHB contenders to me. Only Shahid and Varley feel like real GHB candidates, and Holst in particular would seem like a particularly odd choice for GHB. Not that I expect any of the dads to get in to begin with.