Bantu's Cipher art is way too cool for him

[Jotari]

Just saw Bantu's Cipher artwork, and it's more like something from Magic the Gathering. Look at what an absolute beast he is. Definitely representing his NES stat line more than is DS one.

 

[indigoasis]

I don't play Cipher or collect any of the cards, but you will never get more banger artwork than from Cipher. This feels obligatory to say, but it's legitimately an absolute shame it was discontinued. The cards that show a whole scene going on around the character being illustrated are the best ones, imo, kinda like the one with Bantu there.

[Jotari]

34 minutes ago, indigoasis said:

I don't play Cipher or collect any of the cards, but you will never get more banger artwork than from Cipher. This feels obligatory to say, but it's legitimately an absolute shame it was discontinued. The cards that show a whole scene going on around the character being illustrated are the best ones, imo, kinda like the one with Bantu there.

It's a shame it wasn't ever released in English. What IS and Nintendo really should have done is release a video game version of it, like the old Pokemon TCG game on the Gameboy colour (which has recently been released on Switch). That would have drawn more attention to it from the fanbase across the spectrum and could have been a soft introduction to it overseas to test the waters and see the potential of localizing it.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Listen the version of him we know is obviously retired. But he's not ready to give himself up at the graveyard of dragons. He'll move the earth to protect that little girl

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

11 hours ago, Jotari said:

It's a shame it wasn't ever released in English. What IS and Nintendo really should have done is release a video game version of it, like the old Pokemon TCG game on the Gameboy colour (which has recently been released on Switch). That would have drawn more attention to it from the fanbase across the spectrum and could have been a soft introduction to it overseas to test the waters and see the potential of localizing it.

That would be kind of a big ask for a project that was probably floundering (if it wasn't, why cancel it?). My approach would be, pick a small subset of cards with characters you know people will want overseas. Your Tikis (not Bantus), Edelgards (not Wendys), and Ryomas (not Jesses). Something of a "greatest hits", but packaged as a totally new set - since, well, any cards will be new to folks outside of Japan. If it's successful, then the next international set can mix Japan's latest with some older cards of lesser-recognized characters.

A bigger ask would be - integration with Fire Emblem Heroes. Basically, create a set where every card includes a small RFID code in the corner. Scan it with your phone, and you unlock that character in Heroes. Most would just be another means of obtaining already-existing characters. But some cards would grant totally new characters, or unique variations that aren't obtainable any other way. And with that, you've gotten the Heroes audience interested in a trading card game.

Anyway, yes. Bantu looks quite imposing here. Fantastic art.

[Jotari]

10 minutes ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

That would be kind of a big ask for a project that was probably floundering (if it wasn't, why cancel it?).

Floundering would be precisely the reason to do it imo, as it would be huge advertising to be released as a Fire Emblem video game. I don't think making a card game video game is going to be that budget breaking. You have very little investment in terms of visuals and the mechanics of the game have already been designed and tested in full. All you really need to do is whip up a plot about Sohiro or something wanting to be the best Cipher player in Japan and design a bunch of opponents themed around different Fire Emblem concepts.

Edited September 3, 2023 by Jotari

[Imuabicus der Fertige]

... why does he only have 3 claws? 5 fingers = 3 claws? That seems like a downgrade, would not transform, tbh.

[Fire Emblem Fan]

But Bantu himself is a cool character, darn it!

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

22 hours ago, Jotari said:

Floundering would be precisely the reason to do it imo, as it would be huge advertising to be released as a Fire Emblem video game. I don't think making a card game video game is going to be that budget breaking. You have very little investment in terms of visuals and the mechanics of the game have already been designed and tested in full. All you really need to do is whip up a plot about Sohiro or something wanting to be the best Cipher player in Japan and design a bunch of opponents themed around different Fire Emblem concepts.

But you'd need to localize the cards in the process of making the game itself! On top of coming up with a story, translating the cards and game play mechanics to a digital medium, designing OCs for the game, coming up with a plot, getting voice actors on board, advertising the game itself... It's immensely more work than simply localizing the cards, and releasing them physically. Plus, what's the install base for such a game? Are English-speaking players going to touch a Cipher Video Game, when they've had no exposure to the game itself? A massive part of why Pokemon TCG for GBC was a success, was because it was supplemental to the cards which already existed, and already had a fandom. As it stands, you've got a great recipe for a game that almost nobody's going to buy, and would almost certainly take the Cipher franchise from "struggling" to "deceased" overnight.

[Jotari]

14 minutes ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

But you'd need to localize the cards in the process of making the game itself! On top of coming up with a story, translating the cards and game play mechanics to a digital medium, designing OCs for the game, coming up with a plot, getting voice actors on board, advertising the game itself... It's immensely more work than simply localizing the cards, and releasing them physically. Plus, what's the install base for such a game? Are English-speaking players going to touch a Cipher Video Game, when they've had no exposure to the game itself? A massive part of why Pokemon TCG for GBC was a success, was because it was supplemental to the cards which already existed, and already had a fandom. As it stands, you've got a great recipe for a game that almost nobody's going to buy, and would almost certainly take the Cipher franchise from "struggling" to "deceased" overnight.

A specifically Cipher Video Game, no not really. But a Fire Emblem video game? Sure, maybe. It's a decently big brand name so if you make a game on the cheap and sell it at a reduced price I'm sure it would have moved copies. I'd buy it at least...course I am very much biased as I'd probably buy anything they attached the Fire Emblem brand too (I certainly bought TMS).

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

1 hour ago, Jotari said:

A specifically Cipher Video Game, no not really. But a Fire Emblem video game? Sure, maybe. It's a decently big brand name so if you make a game on the cheap and sell it at a reduced price I'm sure it would have moved copies. I'd buy it at least...course I am very much biased as I'd probably buy anything they attached the Fire Emblem brand too (I certainly bought TMS).

But... the Fire Emblem series of video games already exists. I don't see how another game advances the trading card game, specifically. It'd be like releasing Monopoly: The Video Game in Swahili, when you could just... release Monopoly (the board game) in Swahili. It doesn't solve, or even address, the core issue (that is, the utter physical non-existence of the Fire Emblem Cipher trading card game in international markets). Instead, it provides an answer that's an insult to two camps of fans. General TCG fans see the game taunting them with digital versions of cards that they can't own physically, while FE video game fans see a game that took IS's development time away from the actual next mainline game. A handful of people could be happy with it, sure, but I don't expect it to be enough to recoup the costs associated with its own development.

[Jotari]

1 hour ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

But... the Fire Emblem series of video games already exists. I don't see how another game advances the trading card game, specifically. It'd be like releasing Monopoly: The Video Game in Swahili, when you could just... release Monopoly (the board game) in Swahili. It doesn't solve, or even address, the core issue (that is, the utter physical non-existence of the Fire Emblem Cipher trading card game in international markets). Instead, it provides an answer that's an insult to two camps of fans. General TCG fans see the game taunting them with digital versions of cards that they can't own physically, while FE video game fans see a game that took IS's development time away from the actual next mainline game. A handful of people could be happy with it, sure, but I don't expect it to be enough to recoup the costs associated with its own development.

You seem to be under the impression that a card based video game can only have value as a tie in and not just be fun (and this successful) in itself. Which I don't think is true. Yu-Gi-Oh Forbidden Memories certainly wasn't a tie in to the real card game as it very evidently predated the card game having it's own bizarre set of rules. Yet it seems to be a pretty fondly remembered and moderately successful game. Personally I'd rather play a video game rendition of a tcg than an actual tcg given what a money sink collecting real cards is, compared to a video game with an in game currency and the ability to save scum making obtaining the right kind of deck you want more of a fiscal reality. In addition, I'm pretty sure Heartsone was a very successful video game tcg that had no physical version (though one that did gouge money in the same way as a physical game). Ultimate point being, if a game is good, it will be good wether it's physical or digital.

Edited September 4, 2023 by Jotari