Whitefang
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Posts posted by Whitefang
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This is interesting. Serra.
P.S. I really like Integrity's team.
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Edit: I am dumb.
Anyway, I wouldn't count out Integrity yet. I for one am not very good at efficiency.
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Priscilla and Lucius
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I picked...I picked Oswin because I knew for sure someone would pick a Sain support. I never saw someone picking Wil for crying out loud. This has gone completely wrong, yet it is indeed enthralling.
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Damnit! I wanted Priscilla -> Raven!
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Sain's not available in the first round.
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No penalties for letting characters die. I will not be setting team sizes. This is why I set it up to be a second-bid sealed-auction. If you think, "Oh, I'll just bid a lot and win and not pay much and get a lot of characters," you have to consider the very real possibility that someone else thinks like that as well, or has overvalued a mediocre unit, and you end up screwed. I will emphasize again that the optimum strategy is to bid what you value the unit at.
I've also decided to make Marcus free up to Chapter 16. Chapter 17 is the first place where you can have one of Lowen, Kent, or Sain, and they can make a big impact there.
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This looks fascinating! And a lot less tenuous and rage-inducing than a HHM run. I'm potentially game for this.
Why is 28x blocked? If someone wins both nino and jaffar, then they'd have a legitimate way to enter the chapter. And it's also the only way to get the Fell Contract before endgame, if they also have a thief on their team.
One more thing, does it how we go about playing? I'm planning on using an emulator as opposed to a cart. Mine is currently full with incomplete play-throughs that I'm not willing to erase.
Use the honor system and don't abuse save states.
28x...hmm...that's tricky. Jaffar survives much easier on normal mode, so that's not a concern. The biggest concern is that it's a lot of extra exp. It makes Nino a lot more viable, especially, since whoever drafts her can grind her there. (She really needs it, though).
I'm feeling generous, though, so let's give a 20 turn allowance to 28x and make it optional to visit. No abusing of Sonia or the generous reinforcements allowed.
NO LYN MODE. I feel like this is an understood rule unless otherwise mentioned. Is this an incorrect assumption?
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I don't think Lyn's mode should be necessary. The main competition is Hector's Normal Mode.
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I don't think we need to impose a character limit in this draft. I'll let RD and Janissary weigh in, though, as well as whoever signs up in the future. And yes, the plan is to use 100 points with which to draft your team.
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I thought about bidding with turns, but then you have to have a mechanism where people aren't throwing out huge numbers just to draft all the characters. I mean, even if you have a million turn handicap, that doesn't matter if no one else has any units...
2 votes for 1 character at a time
1 vote for multiple characters at a time
2 votes for Marcus banned after Ch. 16
1 vote for Marcus banned after Ch. 20.
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I will let the other drafters weigh in on when the Marcus cutoff point should be.
I will allow thieves to only obtain necessary promotion items. (I thought about it, and there are a lot of items that make drafting thieves valuable). Though they may search for treasure in the desert even if it is unnecessary.
Undrafteds may shop, but may not visit villages (except to recruit). They may also rescue each other, which helps with 13x.
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Ok, draft rules are changed. Hopefully this addresses the concerns that have been brought up.
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How does 'not interact with drafted characters' let Guy (if undrafted) trade his stuff to Eliwood (if drafted)? How does 'you may not deploy undrafted characters' let me deploy Matthew (if undrafted)?
Because Guy is free the chapter you recruit him per the current rules. However, you make some valid points, and I will just use the standard draft rules.
This is one of the many reasons Marcus is (should be...) free for all. Also, if someone doesn't draft any of the starting characters, they probably deserve to take penalties early on (there are more than enough of them).
Fair enough.
Wait, they would even be allowed to fight too? So they would essentially be free if even one enemy had a stealable Vulnerary?
No, it seems I'm not being clear. In my original ruleset, a thief being engaged in combat while undrafted would result in a 4 turn penalty.
It wouldn't take that much longer than usual, and you can combine Bartre and Karla to make it 38 (with Marcus free). And if someone doesn't get Eliwood and Lyn, we can skip Geitz.
Well, I'm willing to give it a shot, I just thought that some people might have this concern.
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1. Whoever gets Marcus wins. The likelihood of the person who drafts Marcus to have a team so anemic that drafting him isn't worth it is almost nil. Make him free for all, and banned after a certain point like he should be.
I'm not so sure. I understand the concern and I will take this into consideration. It is part of the reason why force-deploy characters are free to use.
2. I disagree with these rules; There's no point whatsoever for them. Why shouldn't I be allowed to trade Guy's Killing Edge to Eliwood? Why shouldn't I be allowed to deploy Matthew in a FoW map so I can get a jump on the enemies on the first turn? It's not like either of these are gamebreaking, massive turn saving actions.
You are allowed to do all the things you mentioned in the current rules and you would be allowed to do them if we made the rules more conventional as well. I could make this clearer, but I'll probably just go back to the more clear-cut standard draft rules, per your suggestion.
3. Why are forced characters free? That massively devalues quite a few of them.
Mainly because of the first 3 chapters
4. Why are the Thieves allowed to steal and open Doors/Chests if undrafted? Why would I want to draft a Thief, then? Just let them be free to steal/open the chests with necessary (by necessary, I mean stealing Oleg's Hero Crest just to sell it because you have no one that can use it shouldn't be allowed) promotion items, if that's your worry.
Eh, I guess it's so that they can counter and be attacked without penalty. But you are right, they have more value if they are allowed to do fewer things if undrafted. I will probably change this.
5. Why are multiple characters up for auction at the same time? Wouldn't it make more sense just to auction one at a time as usual?
I have a feeling the draft would take forever if we did this one unit at a time. There are up to 40 draft-able characters. My current vision is either 5 blocks of 8 characters or 8 blocks of 5 characters.
6. Have you considered making Lyn, Kent, Sain and Wil free for Chapter 16? It's not like they'll be saving you any turns there, and it prevents people from having to take penalties to meatshield.
They would be allowed under the current rules (they are considered force deployed). If I changed that, I would allow them to be used.
7. I want to join, once everything gets straightened out. I've be meaning to set something like this up for a while now.
Cool, I will definitely make sure that the players have the rules that they want to play under. There's no point otherwise.
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Radiant Dragon (Kitty)
Chapter 11
Chapter 12
Chapter 13
Chapter 13x
Chapter 14
Chapter 15
Chapter 16
Chapter 17
Chapter 17x
Chapter 18
Chapter 19
Chapter 19x
Chapter 20
Chapter 21
Chapter 22
Chapter 23
Chapter 24A/B
Chapter 25
Chapter 26
Chapter 27A/B
Chapter 28
Chapter 28x
Chapter 29
Chapter 30
Chapter 31
Chapter 31x
Chapter 32
Chapter 32x
Final
Janissary
Chapter 11
Chapter 12
Chapter 13
Chapter 13x
Chapter 14
Chapter 15
Chapter 16
Chapter 17
Chapter 17x
Chapter 18
Chapter 19
Chapter 19x
Chapter 20
Chapter 21
Chapter 22
Chapter 23
Chapter 24A/B
Chapter 25
Chapter 26
Chapter 27A/B
Chapter 28
Chapter 28x
Chapter 29
Chapter 30
Chapter 31
Chapter 31x
Chapter 32
Chapter 32x
Final
Quintessence (22 turns at Chapter 13x)
Chapter 13x
Chapter 14
Chapter 15
Chapter 16
Chapter 17
Chapter 17x
Chapter 18
Chapter 19
Chapter 19x
Chapter 20
Chapter 21
Chapter 22
Chapter 23
Chapter 24A/B
Chapter 25
Chapter 26
Chapter 27A/B
Chapter 28
Chapter 28x
Chapter 29
Chapter 30
Chapter 31
Chapter 31x
Chapter 32
Chapter 32x
Final
Shibeebaba
Chapter 11
Chapter 12
Chapter 13
Chapter 13x
Chapter 14
Chapter 15
Chapter 16
Chapter 17
Chapter 17x
Chapter 18
Chapter 19
Chapter 19x
Chapter 20
Chapter 21
Chapter 22
Chapter 23
Chapter 24A/B
Chapter 25
Chapter 26
Chapter 27A/B
Chapter 28
Chapter 28x
Chapter 29
Chapter 30
Chapter 31
Chapter 31x
Chapter 32
Chapter 32x
Final
General Horace (16 turns at Chapter 13x)
Chapter 13x -
Chapter 14
Chapter 15
Chapter 16
Chapter 17
Chapter 17x
Chapter 18
Chapter 19
Chapter 19x
Chapter 20
Chapter 21
Chapter 22
Chapter 23
Chapter 24A/B
Chapter 25
Chapter 26
Chapter 27A/B
Chapter 28
Chapter 28x
Chapter 29
Chapter 30
Chapter 31
Chapter 31x
Chapter 32
Chapter 32x
Final
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Welcome, friends, to what I believe to be the very first Auction Draft Challenge! I've been thinking about this idea for a while, and I hope it works. I found a thread kicking the idea around, and it confirmed a few concerns that I had about the format. I believe that I have a way to make this work. If you don't want to play FE7, don't worry, I might consider running a similar challenge for another game (if you have a request, let it be heard).
Why normal mode?
It's an untested concept. I want to see if the results are close and if this is worthwhile as a continuing format.
Why a Vickrey auction?
This will provide incentive for everyone to bid a unit's true value, and it should also ensure that everyone has some virtual money to play with every round. This also doesn't require everyone to be present at the same time as in an English or Dutch auction.
Why is Marcus available?
He should cost more money, so the question is what is his value? Is he worth grabbing even though you'll have a smaller team than the other players?
Before we get to the fun stuff, here are the rules:
Your objective is to get the lowest turn count. Should two players tie, the player with the most auction points remaining will be the winner. If still tied, the player with the fewest drafted units will be victorious.
Free characters and allowed actions
Hector and Athos are free for all players. And Merlinus, obviously.
Marcus is free to use up to and including Chapter 16. He is banned in Chapter 17 and onward.
Lyn, Wil, Kent, and Sain are free to use in Chapter 16.
Thieves may obtain necessary promotion items if undrafted. They may search for treasure in the desert like other undrafted units.
Undrafted characters may trade with drafted characters and recruit other characters. They may help find hidden treasure in the desert. They may also shop, and they can rescue each other. And they can move, but hopefully that's obvious. (They specifically cannot visit villages, except to recruit)
Any other actions taken by undrafted characters results in a 4 turn penalty for each character (maximum once per map per character).
Gaidens
23x is prohibited (19xx is impossible)
28x is optional and will not affect your turncount if completed in 20 turns or less.
All others are forced
NO LYN MODE
The draft!
The draft format will be a sealed-bid second-price auction (I'm linking it again in case you missed it earler). A group of characters will be presented for auction, and you will PM me with your bids for each character. The total of your bids may not exceed your current total auction points.
The player who presents the highest bid for a character will win the character, and will pay a number of auction points equal to the value of the second highest bid.
Ties will be decided randomly, unless one player has won more ties than the other, in which case the other player will win the tie.
You begin with 100 auction points.
To keep you on your toes, I will not reveal the results of each auction, so you will not know how many auction points are available to each other player, nor will you know who has won the character.
I will let you know if you won, and how much you spent, so that you can plan for subsequent characters.
I will try to avoid having like characters in the same auction, so expect the Paladins to be split up, as well as the fliers, etc.
Auction is done
When you sign up, please state whether or not you think that multiple units should be put up for auction at the same time.
There will be 5 teams for this challenge. (as it is a sealed auction format, I cannot participate)
1. Radiant Kitty - Farina, Erk, Fiora, Raven, Serra, Matthew
2. Janissary - Priscilla, Dorcas, Lowen, Louise, Oswin, Legault, Renault
3. Quintessence - Lucius, Dart, Rebecca, Florina, Wallace
4. Shibeebaba - Harken, Sain, Rath, Jaffar, Bartre, Karla, Canas, Lyn, Heath, Nino
5. General_Horace- Ninian, Nils, Kent, Eliwood, Isadora, Hawkeye, Pent
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I'm going to go with Oswin
I'm fairly certain that I know my next two picks as well, but we'll see if a better option occurs to me.
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I actually don't think either of them are available in the first round. Radiant Kitty's post on the first page has all the options.
Anyway, you can chain off of Hector and Marcus's supports.
Marcus chains Lowen, Isadora, and Harken.
Hector chains Oswin, Matthew, Florina, Serra, and Farina
Also available are Fiora (via Eliwood), Rath, Kent, Wil, Wallace (via Lyn), Hawkeye (via Ninian), and Nino and Vaida (via Merlinus)
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You've correctly left out the Berserk staff (available only in 23x), but Fenrir should also be off the list (only available in 28x), so you can put the Slim Sword back in the draft.
Alternatively, Luna being free makes Canas suddenly become a very desirable character. Maybe the best solution is to let Athos use Luna for free only, and put Luna in the draft instead of the Slim Sword (and let it be free).
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You have Fiora twice and are missing Farina, but otherwise that seems correct.
I don't want to give away too much, but let's just say that I don't plan on drafting Rath first.
Interestingly, I believe that Karel is the only unit that can't be drafted by round 2. (Bartre comes with Karla, otherwise he would be undraftable by round 2 as well.)
I think the first draft round is going to be very important, and going 5th is probably a big advantage.
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Drafting weapons and characters at the same time would create serious issues imo. However, after a certain point in the weapons draft, it's definately concievable that we could pick two weapons at a time.
Yup, that makes sense.
One more dumb question. Merlinus? Can we chain his supports for the first pick? Not that you'd want to, but maybe you would.
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Sure, why not? I'll sign up.
Maybe to speed things along we could draft 2 weapons with each character?
Edit: No, that's a bad idea.
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Hey, +3 avoid is pretty good for a level up! Right?
(FE7) Yet another gimmick draft: The Support Chain + Weapon Draft
in Fire Emblem Drafts
Posted · Edited by Whitefang
He's locked himself to Lowen. No one else can get him and it's his only choice next round. It's really quite brilliant, actually.
Anyway, I'll take Erk. I'm thinking my team will just blast their way through each chapter.