Inui Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 (edited) Isn't Dorcas at 16, Bartre at 15, and Geitz at 14? Edited February 2, 2010 by Inui Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CATS Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 No. Look at the links I gave. Bartre's base Con is 13. His promo gain is +2. Geitz's Con is 13. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inui Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 Typo. I meant 15 for Bartre. I thought Geitz was 14, but I was mistaken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candlejack Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 No. Look at the links I gave. Bartre's base Con is 13. His promo gain is +2. Geitz's Con is 13. You voted for FE6 Bartre. HE IS ALREADY PROMOTED ergo NO PROMO FOR HIM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CATS Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 I meant to vote for FE7 Bartre, forgot that there are two incarnations of him when initially viewing the poll, and so voted for the first one to catch my glance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dondon151 Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 Thus at worst, Bartre is clearly not "failing" or "sucking" or anything like that. He's significantly underrated imo. I recall that you disagreed with me when I stated that forcing Bartre to be deployed should not count as a negative against Karla. If Bartre isn't worth deploying in the long run (i.e. if there are better unit choices than Bartre), then he pretty much automatically loses to Geitz. You of all people should be aware of this. You're sure you're perfectly fine with contradicting yourself? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CATS Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 I'm perfectly fine with contradicting whatever I said a good while back, particularly since it was in a tier topic as opposed to general discussion topic here. Opinions can and do change frequently as new facts are considered or old ones re-evaluated. I thought Guy was the best unit in the game at one point like a year or two ago. Also, no, Geitz does not automatically win with an extremely strict net utility mindset. Bartre has use in Ch 12, 13, 13x, and 14 at the very least, with no opportunity cost of deployment. Geitz is unable to contribute much if anything towards your efficiency in the one chapter where he doesn't consume a deployment slot (his join chap) due to his placement in the bottom right corner (while your group will be going up the left side of the map), he will spend the chapter either catching up or just camping at his recruitment spot killing a few Pirates. After that there is nothing to indicate that Geitz should continue to be fielded. He might do filler duty on the big lategame chapters, but Bartre has more chapters of utility and his come with no opportunity cost of deployment. It would still be between Dorcas and Bartre, or I guess Garcia would have a better case now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 @ BlazingSwordsman. I thought your species died out already, but I see they are alive and well at places besides FEFF... Jaffar is good to you, but the other prepromoted units aren't? Are you aware that Jaffar is typically rated in the lowest or second lowest tier? Even Marcus, who has the worst stats, is crushing him terribly in durability and only losing offense against units he can't double that Jaffar can (not many) and often Marcus's one hit will do more than his two (Slayers/Silvers). Geitz is amazing right when you get him and he never gets bad. His growths aren't mediocre at all. I believe he has an 80% in HP, 50% in Str, and 40% in Spd. Pretty good. Harken is the one with horrible growths, but his level 8 Hero base stats are insane. He's already beating Raven's 20/20 Def, Luk, and Res, IIRC. He's nearly capped in Str. Pent's 20/6 bases vastly exceed Erk's 20/6 stats and Pent actually ends up winning in several stats even at the end, most notably Skl and Def and a small win in Mag. We died out? :( I was mentioning his end stats not his growth For me a good unit either caps or gets close to capping a stat If you average it out he only gets close to capping his STR Ross can get close to capping all his stats Cleary Ross is the best Oh yeah Bartre is almost as good as Gietz My one came out pawnsome but when i averaged it Bartre sucks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inui Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 For me a good unit either caps or gets close to capping a stat This helps you efficiently complete the game...how? By your logic, Marcus is the worst unit even though he's by far your best character for ~10 chapters in the actual game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 I dont use Jaffar <_< He looks like he is going to cap alot of stats Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inui Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 Too bad the only one he has any shot at capping is Str and that he's horrendous in the actual game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candlejack Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 I wouldn't actually say HORRENDOUS. Horrendous is Miranda, Diadora, Arden, Wendy, Sofiya, Est, Arran, etc. Jaffar is really more of a Norma of thieves. A punishment, if you will, for not using Matthew or Legault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inui Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 My standards are high, but yeah, you're right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candlejack Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 And Vivek just has wtflogic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Divine Swordmaster Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 (FE7) Barte? Really? lmao Geitz wins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CATS Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 Evidence exists within the topic, so I would say the joke is on you and your assumed superiority of a completely unsupported position. I guess you are entitled to your opinion though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 And Vivek just has wtflogic. <_< i forgot to average Bartre i will admit it Gietz seems better then Bartre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candlejack Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Evidence exists within the topic, so I would say the joke is on you and your assumed superiority of a completely unsupported position. I guess you are entitled to your opinion though. I think its safe to say that others disagree with you as well. FE7 HHM Tier sez hi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CATS Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 I don't mind people's opinions disagreeing when the numbers agree with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inui Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 I understand 100% how CATS feels. While I disagree with his stance on Bartre based on my belief that RNG-proof units that never have any problems have a large inherent advantage over units like Bartre, I totally understand it and see a case for Bartre being the best Warrior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrhesia Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Actually, I'm changing my vote from Ross to Geitz. Ross may turn out well due to 10 more levels and pretty good growths if I remember right, but it takes ages to get him there. If you need Axes Garcia's right there with way too much Strength and HP begging to be used. Geitz may be the best bowman in the game XD and definitely has high utility. My prejudice against prepromotes in general mostly comes from GameFAQs I guess, where there seems to be a prevailing endgame mindset. This has also given me newfound respect for Dorcas and Garcia, characters I've always liked but never really used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inui Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Geitz is the best bow user in the game indeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Poleax Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 I voted for Geitz. I'm not a big fan of any of them though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted February 3, 2010 Author Share Posted February 3, 2010 (edited) We died out? :( I was mentioning his end stats not his growth For me a good unit either caps or gets close to capping a stat If you average it out he only gets close to capping his STR Ross can get close to capping all his stats Cleary Ross is the best Oh yeah Bartre is almost as good as Gietz My one came out pawnsome but when i averaged it Bartre sucks *sigh* How many times do we have to explain it? You are clearly a stat-junkie, you know, those kids that just want to see green and care about how good a character's stats are when they reach 20/20. That does NOT make a unit better, so, by your criteria...Nino is the best character, you also have mentioned it multiple times, it does NOT- I repeat, it does NOT make a character better, a "GOOD" unit is a unit that is actually useful, one that does not require babying. Characters that get 1 or 2 rounded like Nino or Ross are NOT "great" characters, and of course, the training is just a "What if", but when it comes to effeciency and ranked runs you are not going to waste your time training such an underleveled character, because it's a waste of funds and it reduces your star number in tactics. Then there's Ross, who despite ending up good doesn't mean he always is, he requires alot of babying, he's getting 2RKO'd by everything. Edited February 3, 2010 by Alan Rainsworth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CATS Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 I dunno. I might have to say Rebecca > Geitz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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