Lord of Azure Flame: Chat

[Kanami]

I did have half a page of comments and arguments prepared and written up, but have decided that any further attempts at trying to make this RP follow a logical course of action is impractical and impossible. There is a distinct difference between leniency and idiocy, and you willingly followed the course of events to a certain degree with my deviations before deciding you didn't like it anymore and would pretend none of it ever happened.

The issue isn't exactly an easy one to fix, but instead of attempting to remedy the situation the option to ignore it outright was taken, this is not leniency, but as you say idiocy. And I apologize to all members for wanting the RP to follow at least some logical sequence.

A trial was just as plausible as Katie's trial, if Harold can blackmail/bribe an entire courtroom, having the group trialled with the group and cleared was an option. If not a trial could have simply been the group getting captured, *End chapter* and the results of the courtcase as an opening post. Not very long at all.

So, I can't help but ask, why do Ilyphina? To clear our names? Did people try to do in another thread because I don't see any attempts to head towards Harold, Conrad, and the only person that approached the headmaster was Ixion, who couldn't care less about the groups criminal status.

Crimson weapon: Conrad was holed up and refused to come out, he dealt with Chase a bit but while Viveka came out and tried to pull away one or two members, that doesn't help at all. Never mind the concept of Conrad actually agreeing to follow the group being ridiculous.

So, we didn't go to get our names cleared, we didn't go there to for the CW. I ask, why the hell did we go to Ilyphina? And don't give me "In character" bullshit, because there's nothing in character about heading straight into enemy headquarters for no reason.

[Phoenix]

Viveka just thought she defeated all of us. That wouldn't mean the entire government believed her and just cleared our names that easily.

Exactly, that's what Conrad was for. She wanted to take them to Conrad. If they could convince him, they had better chances and she would just roll with it. Every time she's come after the group, she's been trying to bring you to Conrad, since you refused both times, she tried to force it thinking it was the best solution since trying to kill the group always goes badly for everyone else.

If she reported us dead, they wouldn't have a reason to follow..

That's why Ixion erased her memories the first time, but she and her squad wouldn't be enough to convince everyone so I abandoned that idea.

@ Cuddles

Why Ilyphina

Snowy had plot revealing and stuff planned for the capital, and getting our names cleared as well as getting the axe was on the list. Everything you did made all our goals there impossible, so we just left with little argument and don't have much to do.

Edited June 16, 2010 by Phoenix

[Snowy_One]

It's not a question of if she could kill us all, but if she could either believe she killed us, or wants to make everyone else think there is nothing there at all so she can capture us on her own.

Edit: All it takes is one little report paper.

Edited June 16, 2010 by Snowy_One

[-Cynthia-]

The thing is that other people might not believe her if she said she killed all of us, due to it being unlikely.

Conrad doesn't have the power to overturn the entire legal system though. Even if he were willing to overlook our crimes, I doubt everyone else would just go "oh, ok"

@Nady I believe it was trying to recruit Conrad. I was kind of thinking we would recruit him without getting our names cleared (he's a rebel general or something). Unfortunately our problems with soldiers prevented us from actually getting to his holed up location. Plus, there weren't really other suggestions being thrown out.

Edited June 16, 2010 by -Cynthia-

[Phoenix]

@ Cynthia

If you haven't noticed yet, Viveka never fights alone, forget the fact that there were only three peggies. She usually commands Conrad's entire battalion. They wouldn't have a problem believing she beat the group if she had that many troops waiting around. Would she lie about it? Depends.

[Snowy_One]

You would be surprised actually. Often, all that's needed is simply the report and most people won't even check the paperwork. She could write 'I killed them until they died from it' as how she resolved the issue and no one would ask.

[Kanami]

1: Viveka's memory was restored, making that entire argument nulled.

2: Right, no dead bodies, no evidence, no witnesses, and the army believes that the group is dead. Chase at the very least wasn't part of the group, he was in jail prior, and making a jail break go unnoticed is another convenient plot fudge, or a lack of attentiveness.

All it takes is one little report paper? This is why realism fails you, or rather, you fail it. This is a group that (with help) destroyed an army of cavalry, and then broke free from captivation, you'd think bodies would be required. But no, one report, with absolutely no evidence is enough. It's just a group of highly dangerous criminals, who cares if the report is incorrect?

@Elysimma

I love causing trouble, but I've given you people more then fair warning, and I tried to let things work itself out as you entered the capitol, no soldier attacks barring entry. Which would seem stupid if the guards didn't think a bribing man with a tattered group was suspicious. Instead we decided to socialize at TISME, and have a purple cat running around.

[-Cynthia-]

Aren't you supposed to provide funeral services or at least have the bodies identified or something? I don't think you're supposed to just leave them in the street.

Considering the matter was important enough to involve the military, you think they would doublecheck some of the events. Such as having a ton of troops in the middle of the night on a spur of the moment attack.

[Snowy_One]

Naddy, you're talking to someone with a history in legal matters. If the report is filed, a lot of people will accept that they're dead regardless of if a body was found or not. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that there is four to five cases per county where they call the guy dead just so they can hunt him in secret at any one time.

[Phoenix]

Aren't you supposed to provide funeral services or at least have the bodies identified or something? I don't think you're supposed to just leave them in the street.

Considering the matter was important enough to involve the military, you think they would doublecheck some of the events. Such as having a ton of troops in the middle of the night on a spur of the moment attack.

That's what Dalton and Jones, and all the other bandit corpses were for, but once again, you guys tried to chase Viv off and I had too intervene to try to make another angle work, which didn't ... but hey, I'm still trying :D

[Snowy_One]

In America, yes. Nothing is set about Elyisima.

And honestly, no one likes paperwork, much less having to read through it.

[Kanami]

In that case you need to revise your legal history, unless you learned your legal matters from sesame street. Your claim is true for minor cases, perhaps minor theft, or a civil case. But wanted criminals who have killed armed officers (think police killers) and are held accountable for several disasters, it'd be neccessary to identify who these people were, if they had any connections and what their motives were.

If you're saying a single piece of paper is your attempt at clearing the groups name, your attempt is laughable and ridiculous. If that were the case, I could have a soldier file a report saying they exterminated local bandits from Elyssima, and he'd be promoted in no time right? After all, no one questions the almighty paper.

Citing legal background and then making stupid comments like that emphasize a lack of knowledge, in a desperate bid to pull your point through.

Losing legal documents in the mess is one thing, but outright ignoring one is a completely different matter.

Also, if you ever get assigned to paperwork duty let me have a word with your employer, since that has got to be the most irresponsible rubbish I've heard you spout thus far.

Edited June 16, 2010 by Kanami

[-Cynthia-]

Meh this brings up a problem of a very inconsistent justice system. They send wyverns, cavaliers, pegasus knights etc. to capture/kill us, but they can't be bothered to check an implausible story?

The system came off as being full of devoted people willing to bring in criminals (look at all the people we had to kill), changing that to "too lazy to check the paperwork" seems to be a retcon.

Edited June 16, 2010 by -Cynthia-

[Phoenix]

Meh this brings up a problem of a very inconsistent justice system. They send wyverns, cavaliers, pegasus knights etc. to capture/kill us, but they can't be bothered to check an implausible story?

The system came off as being full of devoted people willing to bring in criminals (look at all the people we had to kill), changing that to "too lazy to check the paperwork" seems to be a retcon.

Not really.

Soldier tend to be pretty loyal on average, especially the well trained ones, but on the flipside, you've got the folks in charge and the desk workers who just want better positions. They're not out fighting for honor like the people we fought. Laziness and corrupt thinking isn't far fetched.

[Snowy_One]

I learned it first-hand and have had some minor dealings with it (granted, not in police matters, but still...). Anyways, I don't deny the implausibility, but I want this wrapped up without waylaying us for several topics pointlessly to either bribe a judge or try to get through the legal system normally.

[Phoenix]

Snowy I have an idea, but I'd like to discuss it with you via pm. Invite Cynthia too I guess.

[Snowy_One]

I don't know how to invite. Best you start it off anyways.

[-Cynthia-]

Not really.

Soldier tend to be pretty loyal on average, especially the well trained ones, but on the flipside, you've got the folks in charge and the desk workers who just want better positions. They're not out fighting for honor like the people we fought. Laziness and corrupt thinking isn't far fetched.

Viveka is essentially a cop (she's apparently authorized to bring in people and kill them regarding legal matters), so it would essentially be another cop (soldier) checking her work. Even if not, making some blanket statement like that glorifies soldiers and bashes everyone else unecessarily. If it would be previously established, that would be one thing, but you're just kind of showing you bias against politicians there.

I'm not seeing why we can't just leave the country and not come back at this point, thereby avoiding the whole name clearing issue.

[Kanami]

Not really.

Soldier tend to be pretty loyal on average, especially the well trained ones, but on the flipside, you've got the folks in charge and the desk workers who just want better positions. They're not out fighting for honor like the people we fought. Laziness and corrupt thinking isn't far fetched.

Corruption is a possibility, but that wasn't mentioned, and what wasn't mentioned shouldn't have been considered to have happened.

It's not deskwork people missing a document, it's the bureaucracy approving of a document without reading it. It's like congress passing a bill without reading it. And wanted criminals running around is pretty important IMO, don't know about America, but if criminals were hiding around my area, I'd get notified to be careful, and another notification when the criminal was captured, whether that be via news, word of mouth or whatever other medium is available.

Even if Elysimma someone convinced everyone, "oh, no it's just bandits, attacking our military right enough of our gates, right next to your homes, no need for concern" I seriously don't know what you people are thinking anymore.

Mind you Harold mentioned a "bandit hunt" meaning several people may have been looking to "capture/kill" the group for a reward, you (Phoenix) have built on the fact that soldiers do not like Viveka's promotion, and such a claim going uncontested doesn't make sense at all.

[Snowy_One]

Firstly, it's Naddy. If we don't clear our names, she's going to find some way to have it spread and soon we'll be wanted in all countries.

Secondly, Elyisima is ment to be similar to the Begnion/Crimea of the world and be supportive of the group. Especially since they have TISME, which I did plan on having much greater importance later on (doubly so for the headmaster).

Edit: Quite frankly, I'm of the mind to make Naddy clean up the mess on her own seeing as she's oh-so-smart and realistic with her story and it is her mess in the first place.

Edited June 16, 2010 by Snowy_One

[-Cynthia-]

I would oppose that. There's enough animosity established between the nations that they aren't hunting each other's criminals down.

Second point...plans change. Personally I think making Halton the "home nation" would be an interesting subversion (although Naddy plans to make that hostile as well, so I dunno). I do agree that it would be nice to have one of the three be allied.

[Phoenix]

@ Cynthia

Yeah I don't like politicians but that doesn't make my point invalid either. Also, Viveka has more than just one job. She files her own battle reports(and those for the entire battalion sometimes), and she's sometimes the only one doing that unless she has help. She could easily get the people who actually matter on her side, and Conrad's just a threat at demotion waiting to happen for her enemies. Just summarizing a few things with little detail.

@ Cuddles

You need to come to America. Do you have any idea how much sh*t the military has gotten away with simply because they have guns and politicians on their payroll? It's aw inspiring and sad.

[Kanami]

Firstly: I am honored that the term "Naddy" can be so descriptive here now. Though I wasn't aware that Elysimma was so powerful as to influence the other nations into cooperating with hunting down bandits.

Secondly: Should have tried to fix things earlier eh? Not leaving things so unclear and hoping everything would solve itself.

@Edit:

You clearly are illiterate or have a 5 second memory, but just for you I'll quote my message

And you've claimed you didn't solidify anything, this is false. I burned down an inn.

Unanimous consensus seemed to be to flee. (Group)

Phoenix decided it'd be a good idea to make a quick buck out of the situation by conning people (Phoenix)

Pre-Percy wyverns attacked and were killed (Snowy)

Percy was defeated and Esphyr(?) threatens to kill Katie (Snowy)

Istample Conrad sends troops (Chase)

Selizara Phoenix and Rein organize a showdown which makes no sense, I end situation (Rein/Phoenix/Kanami)

Convoy is destroyed as we arrive at Ilyphina (Cynthia)

Bandit raid upon Ilyphina fails, though group participation was group choice (Kanami)

Soldiers followed group, wasn't supposed to be hostile and only one attempted attack (Kanami)

Soldiers notice group at Hamburg (Kanami)

Though if I were to clean it up, it'd be an actual attempt to clean it up which is more then anything you've done.

@ Cynthia

Yeah I don't like politicians but that doesn't make my point invalid either. Also, Viveka has more than just one job. She files her own battle reports(and those for the entire battalion sometimes), and she's sometimes the only one doing that unless she has help. She could easily get the people who actually matter on her side, and Conrad's just a threat at demotion waiting to happen for her enemies. Just summarizing a few things with little detail.

@ Cuddles

You need to come to America. Do you have any idea how much sh*t the military has gotten away with simply because they have guns and politicians on their payroll? It's aw inspiring and sad.

Again, you're citing corruption, which Viveka isn't possible of doing, due to her not knowing she's making a false report. And that's getting away with "Shit". That's different from a group of people completely blocking their senses and pretending nothing happened, without any coercion.

Viveka's report would be filed to someone, someone being either Conrad (Who would want to see Chase's dead body, to which Viveka would reply "who?) or another officer who would probably question her reports validity.

Edited June 16, 2010 by Kanami

[Snowy_One]

Elyisima is the most powerful nation, and the 'pretty much heads' all are friends, so yea... I would think it harder to explain all the nations not hunting them down than not.

You realize it would have been solved if you hadn't brought it up so consistently? It really is your mess Naddy.

And yes Naddy... I want you to clean it up... in less than a topic... without compromising any plot points... and without delaying the group for long at all. Oh. And you will need to state how to manage it here as well.

[Phoenix]

@ Viveka's report

I was referring to her filing a report AFTER she got her memories back, or before depending on whether the group cooperated with her(which they didn't). She wouldn't lie to Conrad about that, because she wants him to trust her no matter what. I'm citing corruption because before the memory wipe, she would have done it if the group cooperated, and she would do it now if they cooperated.

Viv's Priorities:

My and Conrad's careers

Honesty and Virtue

Clothes

Everything else