Fire Emblem Radiant Dawn,Hypothetical Tier list

[Ether]

Tier List FAQ by Vykan12.

Hard Mode.

This is an experiment of mine,the idea is looking at a hypothetical situation and see how it affects a specified character.This will be archived here.

The main point of this is to

A: Promote discussion.FE10 Tiering has been rather dead lately.

B: Vent frustration. Ever wanted to know how a character would move if *insert scenario here* were to occur?Go ahead and ask away.

General Efficiency stuff applies,similar to RFoF's list.

Here's our first Scenario:

Mist's Miracle skill is replaced by Arcanium,a 15 Capacity skill(comes on Mist for free) that causes the users Strength to be replaced with it's mag for all actions/effects(AKA,Weapon Weight is lessened by mag instead of Str,ect.) As well,Mist's second Florete appears in a base conversation,not in Aimee's bargains.

[grandjackal]

Well, let's review.

Rhys with Ellight has 28 magic damage. Mist under this has 27 might with the Flourette, and like the Ettard and Thani basically has no excuse not to spam the crap out of this since you just get the second one for free. She levels faster than Rhys thanks to her lower base level, she has better all around growths and avoids getting doubled much sooner, she'd actually be able to kill things so her leveling would skyrocket as now she can also do usable chip (if Rhys's chip can be considered helpful...).

Bunch of bonds, greater supporter thanks to Water, higher move and canto, can actually have real combat at some point with the Flourette and the eventual speed, staff utility overall, insane promotion bonuses...

Then consider she has no competition for this skill, as anyone else would get destroyed by it (it would be like using those shitty magic weapons in FE9).

Below Michaiah, above Laura.

[-Cynthia-]

I think that's a bit high. Mist still has really terrible durability, and while her chip damage is OK, it's not that great or necessary. Basically, she's Soren who gets doubled for longer, but can heal. I doubt this would even put her above Boyd.

[Anouleth]

Funny, I'd still rather use a Vulnerary.

[Silith]

For endgame purposes she becomes a lot better. Since she has had 2 free weapons it shouldn't have been too hard to train her up to 3th tier and with a cap of 35 instead of 25 she is probably the best Alondite user now. Trueblades still win on Speed but 34 is enough to do what you wanna do. The fact that she grows more all-round then spikes a certain stat hurts her a bit in that she can't BEXP abuse as early as sopme of the Trueblade candidates.

[Zkirsche]

Then consider she has no competition for this skill

Ena wants it for 4-E, priests might want it for staves, though that's probably pushing it.

Edited April 24, 2010 by The Syobon

[Anouleth]

For endgame purposes she becomes a lot better. Since she has had 2 free weapons it shouldn't have been too hard to train her up to 3th tier and with a cap of 35 instead of 25 she is probably the best Alondite user now. Trueblades still win on Speed but 34 is enough to do what you wanna do. The fact that she grows more all-round then spikes a certain stat hurts her a bit in that she can't BEXP abuse as early as sopme of the Trueblade candidates.

With two Blood Tides, a Trueblade has 42STR/40SPD, with a White Pool, Mist has 40MAG/40SPD, so when you take into account higher resistance on Auras, she's actually still doing less damage. But I guess she still has Canto...

Trueblades also get Parity for Cover Auras. Wardwood Auras are easy enough and Mist can't double with Parity, so she won't get that skill.

[Snowy_One]

Arcanium! <3

Anyways... I would actually think she would jump up quite a bit. I don't know the arguments, but I know that one of the reasons why Mist isn't good is because she needs to use her STR to defend against others instead of being able to use her MAG.

[WeaponsofMassConstruction]

She'd probably go above Rhys.

...Oh wait.

[Rewjeo]

What if Lethe and Lyre had an automatic A earthxearth support, SS Strike, and formshift?

This gives Lyre...

HP: 47

ATK: 32

HIT: 120

CRIT: 15(bond)

AS: 22

AVO: 83

CEV: 26(bond)

DEF: 14

RES: 16

That's a pretty huge improvement. She almost ORKOs some pallies in her joining chapter (weakest ones left at 4 HP, strongest left at 13) and cleanly 3HKOs and doubles all of them since she can't be screwed. ORKOs Sages easily, 4HKOs Generals (wasn't she, like, 22HKOing before?) 4HKOs Dragonmasters(doubles), ORKOs Bishops, 6HKOs the boss. Also, a speedwing gives her 26 AS, leading to her doubling literally everything on this map except maybe the one SM. That may make her better for it than Haar/Titania, and she might be better for Adept than Shinon, at least if she gets the speedwing. Haven't looked too much into it, though.

Defensively, the SM is the most accurate, with 55 HIT on her and a 4HKO (that could potentially go to a 5HKO). The Steel Lance Halberdier have 43-45 HIT on her and 4HKO. Steel Poleaxe Paladin 3HKOs, but only has 15.96 true hit on her. Elthunder Sages 6HKO at 35.7 true hit. Her biggest issue is the 3HKO at 56.29 true hit from steel lance Dracos, and something similar from some generals. But she's also 2RKOing them.

Too lazy to look into Lethe right now.

[Anouleth]

What if Muarim existed in Part 3 and had formshift?

58HP 46ATK 158HIT 22AS 71AVO 12CEV 30DEF 18RES

Oh will you look at that he beats even your blinged-out Lyre in absolutely everything.

Also, you made a mistake with your maths. Lyre would have higher hit and higher avoid. I think you forgot to add in luck and authority stars?

[Rewjeo]

I added luck, but not authority stars. Thanks.

And I never expected it to make her amazing, but I wanted to see how much better she was.

Also, I think that speedwing!Muarim might just be the best unit in the game.

[Anouleth]

Muarim is pretty ridiculous. Perhaps that's why they gave him crappy availability.

[Snowy_One]

What would have happened if the sage speed cap was two points higher than it currently is? In every mage/sage/archsage class of course.

[-Cynthia-]

What would have happened if the sage speed cap was two points higher than it currently is? In every mage/sage/archsage class of course.

Not much really. Soren barely reaches his Spd cap as is (though he's better for BEXP), Ilyana/Bastian don't reach theirs (and Ilyana's is still awful).

Calill gets some benefit. So does Tormod, although training Tormod is still so painful I don't know why anyone would bother.

[Narga_Rocks]

What would have happened if the sage speed cap was two points higher than it currently is? In every mage/sage/archsage class of course.

Aside from making Soren a little better in tier 2 I don't see much happening. The other mages either lack availability or something called a "spd growth". The only reason Soren is saved that fate is because he can cap mag/skl/res really quickly in tier 2 and then bexp his way to his spd cap. Now you don't have to find a way to justify taking a crown from Gatrie/Haar/really almost anyone else. He can get to 24 AS by 3-7 without too high a cost (probably) and then 25 AS for 3-8 and that's good. Then comes tier 3 and he'll actually have 27 AS so it might help a bit in 4-1. And then his slow growth kills him again and he's never making 34 AS anyway so it's not helping his 4-E unless you burn a wing (only one that doesn't have an extreme opportunity cost is the 3-9 one, but even that is hard to justify). Calill and Tormod were always just fine cap-wise and Ilyana's tier 2 was already decent and her tier 3 is beyond getting saved by a +2. Not like she could reach it (without a lot of lucky levels) in HM anyway. And poor Pelleas has a 31 spd cap normally so it doesn't even help him. Not like it would matter given how inefficient it is to even try to raise him, but maybe if he at least had a good cap there might be a reason to try.

On the bright side, I'd probably be willing to accept Soren > Calill.

[ReformBlade]

If Shove and Canto didn't consume 5 and 10 Points respectively? Food for thought.

[Jaybee]

If Shove and Canto didn't consume 5 and 10 Points respectively? Food for thought.

Paragon/Adept + Transfer Jill would become pretty good. Probably something like Paragon for 1-7 to get EXP, while switching it around with Nolan. It would get both of them to promotion much quicker, I'd imagine, which would subsequently make 1-E and 3-6 easier. Probably warrants a rise of a few places on the tier list,

[Anouleth]

If Shove and Canto didn't consume 5 and 10 Points respectively? Food for thought.

I'm totally behind this. Gives me room for a 15 point skill on Tanith after giving her Nullify.

[ReformBlade]

Seriously, they (Shove and Canto) weren't skills in the first one. Seems silly to include them as skills that A: Take up room and B: Take up capacity points. It'd be one thing if you could remove them and have em cost points, but still...

[Rewjeo]

Seriously, does it take up THAT much brain power to PUSH someone?

Any more comments on the Lyre/Lethe thing?

[Anouleth]

Well, I think Canto is well worth 10 points, personally, even if it's not quite as good as Adept or Paragon. I'd only ditch it on units for which that 10 points takes away their ability to equip a 15 cost skill like Adept/Paragon or even a 20 cost skill like Celerity.

Shove is even cheaper, but again, in some cases, it's effectively the same price as Resolve or Paragon. I know if I could take Shove off Eddie I'd do it in a heartbeat and give him one of those 15 skills instead.

[ReformBlade]

Well, I think Canto is well worth 10 points, personally, even if it's not quite as good as Adept or Paragon. I'd only ditch it on units for which that 10 points takes away their ability to equip a 15 cost skill like Adept/Paragon or even a 20 cost skill like Celerity.

Shove is even cheaper, but again, in some cases, it's effectively the same price as Resolve or Paragon. I know if I could take Shove off Eddie I'd do it in a heartbeat and give him one of those 15 skills instead.

Yeah, Canto is worth the 10 points it takes up, I just feel it's a big dick move to make it cost just enough that most units with it don't get to actually make much use of the skill system. Pallies are supposed to be balanced in everything, not equally shitty in all aspects except Move which is debatable I still think what with all those crappy maps where they can't even go past certain areas at times...

[Krad]

Seriously, they (Shove and Canto) weren't skills in the first one. Seems silly to include them as skills that A: Take up room and B: Take up capacity points. It'd be one thing if you could remove them and have em cost points, but still...

You could say that they were hidden skills in FE9 that took the same capacity. All units have a total of 25 capacity before promotion and 30 capacity after. With shove, ground units get 20 and later 25, while mounted units get 15 and after promotion had 20.

[ReformBlade]

Yes, but you could still, for instance, put Adept AND Wrath on Oscar. They still had options! But I digress.