Low-Tier Playlog

[Rewjeo]

Uh, I'm 100% sure that there is an objective concept of "low" and that "turncounts" is a very clearly defined word.

Low is relative and therefor, to some extent, subjective. Although some of these chapters... not so much.

You should try an efficient run. It's obvious that when you think about it you can clear chapters quickly, you should just think about it more.

[StinDuh]

Low is relative and therefor, to some extent, subjective. Although some of these chapters... not so much.

You should try an efficient run. It's obvious that when you think about it you can clear chapters quickly, you should just think about it more.

Its easier to rush through chapters that are "Defeat Boss". It's harder to rush through chapters that are "Seize Throne" because, even if I get to the throne quicker by leaving enemies in my dust, I still have to kill the boss, and deal with the units coming on my tail now. Like in chapter 8, about 15 turns were because Ross couldn't do more than 5 damage against the boss without getting seriously injured. And he would miss about 25% of the time.

Edit: Although I am trying to be more efficient.

Okay so I finished chapter 9. My turn counts are still pretty bad. I still don't know how I'm supposed to change that.

Chapter 9:

Units Out: Gilliam, Ross, Neimi, Ephraim, Franz, Amelia.

Turns:26

This chapter is pretty straightforward. Franz only came to recruit Amelia. The priest with a sleep staff got Neimi and that slowed me down a little bit. Not much happened. Recruited Amelia. Sent Gilliam, Ross, and Neimi towards the boss while Amelia finished off that priest(gained a level). Ignored the chests up top, no reason to pay attention to them. Gilliam killed the boss with the help of the axe-reaver, Neimi gave support. I didn't lollygag on this chapter either. I was prompt with getting to the boss and still took 26 turns.

Level ups:

Name    Lv Class      HP  Str Skl Spd Lck Def Res WeaponRank
Gilliam 19 Knight     37  14  11  5   9   18  7   Lance: A
Ross    17 Journey(2) 36  16  12  13  20  10  10  Axe:   A
Neimi   18 Archer     26  12  16  18  14  5   2   Bow:   A

Chapter 10:

Units Out: Gilliam, Ross, Neimi, Amelia, Ephraim, Tana, Cormag, Duessel

Turns: 10

Like always, Tana is only coming to recruit Cormag. Gilliam promoted to Great Knight(decided that more con and great shield were better than +2 Mov). Ross was sent down to the south village to get that Hero's Crest so he can promote later. Everyone else was left up north to deal with the Cavalier reinforcements. Ross, with luck, managed to get the Hero's Crest on the last turn and stay alive. I'm deeming this the hardest chapter I've done so far. It was a tough chapter. I restarted so many times. Here are the my units now:

Name    Lv Class        HP  Str Skl Spd Lck Def Res WeaponRank
Gilliam 1  Great Knight 41  17  12  8   10  20  8   Lance: A, Axe: D, Sword: E
Ross    18 Journey(2)   37  16  12  13  20  11  11  Axe:   A
Neimi   18 Archer       26  12  16  18  14  5   2   Bow:   A
Amelia: 3  Recruit(1)   18  4   3   5   7   2   3   Lance: E

Note: Neimi didn't level up that chapter :( weird.

Edited July 23, 2011 by StinDuh

[Excellen Browning]

P: I've recorded a 2 turn Eirika solo of this map, and I've recorded a 5 turn solo. It's all about the RNG. Quit bitching about it.

Chapter 7: I did it in 10 turns, you did it in 22. Meh. I don't think it's that bad considering your team. Most of the fools here tend to forget that if you don't bring a healer you're automatically gonna go a lot slower. Because you have to heal with vulneraries and all. And to be fair, I had a level 17 Eirika, Colm and a blessed Garcia to speed things up. StinDuh has a team that's not only small, but also offensively and defensively very weak. This means you have to play almost like FESD H5, enemy by enemy. And then comes the boss, of course. Murray has some decent stats, and this makes him hard to kill by this team. Especially so because StinDuh doesn't have access to effective weapons.

Chapter 8: Having 3 units hurts, and you have to go safeguard Eph and company before going toward the throne room. Having only 3 units also means you can't split up. this creates the problematic situation where you first have to guard Eph in the south west side of the map, and then work your way up to the north east for the chest with the angelic rob. Hard work, lots of turns. The boss itself shouldn't be a very big problem. Hammers should be available to you by now, and Gilliam can carry the silver lance Seth came with. I cleared in 16 turns, I'm not surprised by StinDuh pulling 29 turns.

Chapter 9: Oh god Rigwald. Welcome to Ephraim route, you're going to hate it. This chapter, you're plagued by archers and mages and are generally dealing with high enemy density. It makes the fortress entrance a particular pain in the ass. And let's not forget he has to protect Amelia and Neimi as well. I'm not surprised by a 29 turn clear.

Chapter 10: Bitch of a chapter yet again. Those bastilla boats are a nightmare for defensively weak units. Again a very high enemy to player units ratio and high density and lots of reinforcements to plague you.

TL;DR: Stop bitching about his high turns. This game IS an extreme bitch when you've got very little and bad units. Just like any other FE game, really.

Edited July 23, 2011 by Excelkitty

[Anouleth]

Chapter 1:I've recorded a 2 turn Eirika solo of this map, and I've recorded a 5 turn solo. It's all about the RNG. Quit bitching about it.

I assume that you mean Prologue and not Chapter 1, since 2 turns is impossible on Chapter 1 (and 5 turns is basically perfect for an Eirika solo).

[Excellen Browning]

I assume that you mean Prologue and not Chapter 1, since 2 turns is impossible on Chapter 1 (and 5 turns is basically perfect for an Eirika solo).

I stand corrected.

[StinDuh]

Thanks for explaining many of the things I couldn't manage to get across. Especially about healers. It's seriously hard to do anything without a healer. And Sacred Stones is packed so full of them, you don't notice how hard it is without one until you do it. Anyway. I've yet to successfully finish chapter 11. It is INCREDIBLY difficult. I can't go for efficiency at all on this one because I have to guard Ephraim and Amelia in a really tight fog of war map with many flying enemies that come out of no where. Neimi's effectiveness against the Gargoyles helps(she one-rounds, if not one-hits all of them), but it's not enough to not make this chapter the hardest I've done so far. Even harder than chapter 10, which compared to this is not hard at all. The only "easy" thing about Chapter 11 is that the revenants and wights do practically no damage to Gilliam. Amelia is the hardest to keep alive. Anyway that's all I have to say for now. Once I'm able to beat this chapter I'll update again.... sigh.

EDIT: Gilliam can also, thankfully, double most of the enemies on this map. Also concerning healers, I do finally get one I'm allowed to use after this chapter. I also get Dozla, but he's technically in "Lower Mid" so I can't use him :/

Edited July 24, 2011 by StinDuh

[dondon151]

P: I've recorded a 2 turn Eirika solo of this map, and I've recorded a 5 turn solo. It's all about the RNG. Quit bitching about it.

RNG for the prologue is fixed. I also have a hunch that it's like that for every other map, but I can't be bothered to test.

[Janissary]

RNG for the prologue is fixed. I also have a hunch that it's like that for every other map, but I can't be bothered to test.

That's awesome. This game gets even easier.

[StinDuh]

RNG for the prologue is fixed. I also have a hunch that it's like that for every other map, but I can't be bothered to test.

Is it fixed on Hard Mode?

Rule #3 is killing me. Amelia is forced, and I can't manage to keep her alive. I'm not really even using her right now anyway... Ugh, this is impossible.

[Janissary]

Is it fixed on Hard Mode?

Rule #3 is killing me. Amelia is forced, and I can't manage to keep her alive. I'm not really even using her right now anyway... Ugh, this is impossible.

Turtle it. You are far past the "I am trying to remotely look like I can play efficiency" point anyway.

[StinDuh]

Turtle it. You are far past the "I am trying to remotely look like I can play efficiency" point anyway.

You have a point. My current strategy is having Gilliam rescue her... If I can't manage to finish the chapter this way, I'll bag her for the chapter then bring her back next.

And as a rebuttal, I AM trying to play efficiently. It's just incredibly difficult

Edited July 24, 2011 by StinDuh

[Janissary]

You have a point. My current strategy is having Gilliam rescue her... If I can't manage to finish the chapter this way, I'll bag her for the chapter then bring her back next.

And as a rebuttal, I AM trying to play efficiently. It's just incredibly difficult

If you have Gilliam rescue her, you are kind of ruining the point of using her. This playthrough is incredibly difficult because of your arbitrary restrictions. No one wouldn't be using Natasha or Moulder right now just because they want to use L'arachel. They would just switch to L'arachel when they get her.

Basically, you have an entirely playthrough bourne of ridiculous regulations that no one would ever use.

Edited July 24, 2011 by Janissary

[StinDuh]

Basically, you have an entirely playthrough bourne of ridiculous regulations that no one would ever use.

Yup. It's exciting.

Edit: Bagging Amelia for the chapter. I wish it were possible to bag Ephraim too...

Deemed it implausible to complete this map without bringing meat shields. So... bringing meat shields.

Edited July 24, 2011 by StinDuh

[Rewjeo]

The RNG IS fixed, but the two turn of the prologue, IIRC, requires some RN wasting with Seth since I spent a LONG time trying to do it without RN wasting and couldn't. IIRC.

[Anouleth]

That's awesome. This game gets even easier.

By that standard, all of the Fire Emblems that use a fixed RNG are easy since a player can, with foreknowledge of the RNG, ensure that they always hit and the enemies always miss.

Turtle it. You are far past the "I am trying to remotely look like I can play efficiency" point anyway.

Turtling is probably quite difficult when your only durable unit is Gilliam and you have a vulnerable Ephraim, Amelia, and Neimi to protect. It's not like Phantom Ship is a map where you can take it slowly, either, since it's so small and the enemy density is quite high.

This playthrough is incredibly difficult because of your arbitrary restrictions.

No shit, sherlock.

[Excellen Browning]

RNG for the prologue is fixed. I also have a hunch that it's like that for every other map, but I can't be bothered to test.

Then there might be a quirk in that theory somewhere. I recorded the 2 turn for one PT and the 5 turn for another. In both I did everything the same way, from the way units are placed to how they move and how items are traded. .

[StinDuh]

Neimi still died when I brought along Duessel and Seth at shields in tight spots. It's the unpredictable Gargoyles and Mogalls that kill me. Not to mention L'Arachel is hard to keep alive too. And she's on the other side of the map. Strategies I've tried so far are:

-Holing up at the north end of ship. (Didn't work, Amelia or Ephraim died from Gargoyles/Mogalls)

-Sending Ross and Gilliam across the ship to try and beat the chapter as quickly as possible(Didn't work, Ross died. And if he hadn't, the Gargoyles would have gotten to Amelia)

-Bringing only Gilliam, Ross, and Ephraim, and having Gilliam rescue Ephraim. (Didn't work, Ross died)

-Bringing along Duessel and Seth as bodyguards for Neimi(she still died...)

-Scattering my units across the ship in hopes that the Gargoyles would not attack a single person(didn't work... they still all attacked Ross).

So yeah. The Gargoyles are my biggest problem. If anyone has suggestions as to new strategies, they'd be greatly appreciated.

Edit:

Then there might be a quirk in that theory somewhere. I recorded the 2 turn for one PT and the 5 turn for another. In both I did everything the same way, from the way units are placed to how they move and how items are traded. .

I'm really not convinced that the RNG is fixed, either. And if it is, I'd be surprised if it's fixed on hard mode.

Edited July 24, 2011 by StinDuh

[Excellen Browning]

Phantom Ship is also a very difficult chapter. There are a LOT of 1-2 range fliers on this map and the chapter boss appears on your starting position a few turns into the chapter as a reinforcement. Think you're safe with a tank like Gilliam? Here come the evil eyes to fuck your shit up. All this makes even turtling near impossible.

What you should do in my opinion: force an early promotion on both Neimi and Ross. They can miss the 2 levels. Then take Amelia to Valni and train her up to 10/1 at least. It's impossible to use her without it. And do the same to Ewan when you get him.

[StinDuh]

Phantom Ship is also a very difficult chapter. There are a LOT of 1-2 range fliers on this map and the chapter boss appears on your starting position a few turns into the chapter as a reinforcement. Think you're safe with a tank like Gilliam? Here come the evil eyes to fuck your shit up. All this makes even turtling near impossible.

What you should do in my opinion: force an early promotion on both Neimi and Ross. They can miss the 2 levels. Then take Amelia to Valni and train her up to 10/1 at least. It's impossible to use her without it. And do the same to Ewan when you get him.

I'll try it. As for Amelia and Ewan, I'll train them via Valni after Chapter 12(theres no map movement after chapter 11 IIRC). It's not abuse if I don't overuse it.

Edit:

Compiling multiple strategies together:

Promoted both Ross and Neimi(stats later)

Brought Duessel, Seth, and Cormag to act as shields for Neimi(seems to be working...)

Holding choke on lower bridge with Gilliam. Gilliam is able to double most units.

It's totally breaking like five of my rules, but desperate times call for desperate measures.

Edited July 24, 2011 by StinDuh

[dondon151]

I'm really not convinced that the RNG is fixed, either. And if it is, I'd be surprised if it's fixed on hard mode.

Ahaha, no, this is just your natural predisposition to disagree with me. I assure you, the RNG is fixed when starting a new file on hard mode. I've tested it, someone else tested it to confirm, and most of the FE8 draft players are aware of that as well.

This will always happen in the prologue upon starting an HM file:

Turn 1

Move Eirika 4R and attack fighter. Eirika will crit, fighter will miss, Eirika will hit for the KO.

Move Seth 1D 5R and attack fighter. Seth will crit and OHKO fighter.

O'Neill will attack Seth during enemy phase. O'Neill will miss and Seth will hit twice for the KO.

It's not particularly contingent on completely skipping the cutscenes either; you can let most of the cutscenes run and the result would still be the same. You might need to skip the Valter battle, but you can view Seth and Franz escaping the castle, the enemies chasing Seth and Eirika, etc.

[StinDuh]

Ahaha, no, this is just your natural predisposition to disagree with me. I assure you, the RNG is fixed when starting a new file on hard mode. I've tested it, someone else tested it to confirm, and most of the FE8 draft players are aware of that as well.

...no, it isn't just because it's you. I have nothing against you.

This will always happen in the prologue upon starting an HM file:

Turn 1

Move Eirika 4R and attack fighter. Eirika will crit, fighter will miss, Eirika will hit for the KO.

Move Seth 1D 5R and attack fighter. Seth will crit and OHKO fighter.

O'Neill will attack Seth during enemy phase. O'Neill will miss and Seth will hit twice for the KO.

It's not particularly contingent on completely skipping the cutscenes either; you can let most of the cutscenes run and the result would still be the same. You might need to skip the Valter battle, but you can view Seth and Franz escaping the castle, the enemies chasing Seth and Eirika, etc.

Okay, so the RNG may be fixed, but what's the point of putting this here then? I don't really understand what this has to do with anything, other than that I 5-turned the Prologue. And to that, I want to note that the aforementioned strategy requires the use of Seth. I did not use Seth. Still, what's this have to do with anything?

Also... I FINALLY FINISHED CHAPTER 11!!! ...with heavy losses. Seth, Cormag, Dozla, and most importantly, L'Arachel died... UGH. But the chapter is over, and there's no looking back. Here's my chapter 11 Summary:

Units Out: Seth, Duessel, Cormag, Gilliam, Neimi, Ross, Ephraim, Dozla, L'Arachel (Only Ephraim is stricken because he was rescued the entire time and did not face battle. All others, including Duessel, Seth, and Cormag all faced battle.)

Turns: Haha. Way too many to matter.

Alright. This chapter was beaten by breaking many of my rules. Frankly though, I don't care. The chapter would have been impossible otherwise. Ross and Neimi were promoted at the beginning of the chapter(each were level 18). I'm not going to look like this is total miracle that I finished this chapter. It's partly miracle, but it's also thanks to lots of Save-States and RN Wasting/Abuse(but it's the first time I've really used either, so whatever). The only thing I wish I could change was L'Arachel dying. This is a serious blow to my PT, but I also don't think I could have managed to keep her alive(Dozla died too, but for that I don't care). Yeah. So anyway, this chapter is in the past. Levels:

Name    Lv Class        HP  Str Skl Spd Lck Def Res WeaponRank
Gilliam 3  Great Knight 43  17  12  8   10  20  9   Lance: S, Axe: D, Sword: E
Ross    3  Journey(3)   42  17  16  15  21  13  14  Axe:   S
Neimi   3  Sniper       31  16  19  20  15  7   5   Bow:   S
Amelia: 3  Recruit(1)   18  4   3   5   7   2   3   Lance: E

Note: Amelia didn't participate in Chapter 11, but I listed her stats here anyway.

[Radiant Dragon]

Okay, so the RNG may be fixed, but what's the point of putting this here then? I don't really understand what this has to do with anything, other than that I 5-turned the Prologue. And to that, I want to note that the aforementioned strategy requires the use of Seth. I did not use Seth. Still, what's this have to do with anything?

The point was that Eirika can do the Prologue by herself in 2 turns, I believe.

[StinDuh]

The point was that Eirika can do the Prologue by herself in 2 turns, I believe.

No, because the strategy involves Seth killing two of the enemies.... I believe

[Anouleth]

Ahaha, no, this is just your natural predisposition to disagree with me. I assure you, the RNG is fixed when starting a new file on hard mode. I've tested it, someone else tested it to confirm, and most of the FE8 draft players are aware of that as well.

This will always happen in the prologue upon starting an HM file:

Turn 1

Move Eirika 4R and attack fighter. Eirika will crit, fighter will miss, Eirika will hit for the KO.

Move Seth 1D 5R and attack fighter. Seth will crit and OHKO fighter.

O'Neill will attack Seth during enemy phase. O'Neill will miss and Seth will hit twice for the KO.

It's not particularly contingent on completely skipping the cutscenes either; you can let most of the cutscenes run and the result would still be the same. You might need to skip the Valter battle, but you can view Seth and Franz escaping the castle, the enemies chasing Seth and Eirika, etc.

That only happens in the prologue if you have just booted up the copy, so the RNG is only fixed in the Prologue in the sense that the RNG will always spit out the same string of RNs upon starting the game. By that logic, every chapter in FE6, 7, and 8 has a fixed RNG, since performing the same actions will always produce the same results if that is the first chapter you play. It is perfectly possible to get a different set of results just by loading up any given chapter, suspending the game, and then starting a new game from the main menu.

The point was that Eirika can do the Prologue by herself in 2 turns, I believe.

Actually, she can't. The best you can get that way is a 3-turn.

Edited July 24, 2011 by Anouleth

[StinDuh]

Chapter 12:

Units Out: Neimi, Ross, Gilliam, Ephraim

Turns: Didn't get to check

The first part of the chapter I just hung out on and around my ship. It's not particularly hard at this point, and I'm convinced the rest of it will be easy. In fact, compared to the last chapter, this chapter is a nothing. The three gargoyles that appear in the south weren't even a problem because I could actually see them. At turn 11(I know it's a lot) I finally left the boat and took my units up the western path. I then used Neimi to recruit Ewan while I prepared to bait out Marisa to recruit. That's another unit to add to my team(never thought I'd be so happy to recruit Marisa, of all people). My strategy for recruiting Marisa was to use Gilliam as bait(no weapons) and then using Ewan to recruit(obviously). I then got ready for my assault on the boss. Ross used a silver axe, Gilliam used and Axe-Reaver, and Neimi got a critical to kill(that's why I didn't get to see the turns; I didn't think Neimi would kill him.). Overall a really really easy chapter. I would guess on probably ~25 turns....

Name    Lv Class        HP  Str Skl Spd Lck Def Res WeaponRank
Gilliam 4  Great Knight 44  17  12  8   11  20  9   Lance: S, Axe: D, Sword: E
Ross    5  Journey(3)   42  17  18  15  23  13  15  Axe:   S
Neimi   4  Sniper       31  17  19  21  15  7   5   Bow:   S
Amelia: 3  Recruit(1)   18  4   3   5   7   2   3   Lance: E
Ewan    1  Pupil(1)     15  3   2   5   5   0   3   Anima: E
Marisa  5  Myrmidon     23  7   12  13  9   4   3   Sword: D

Gilliam, Ross, and Neimi have the same strength... weird.