Zanarkin Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Proto's voted Yes three times... What can we make of this? Edit: Also, does anyone other than me suspect that Balcerzak, zorbees and Lightning might be spies? Hmmm... Lightning and Zorbees are pretty suspicious voting yes in mission 1.2, yet not in the other missions. It seems odd. Most likely there was a spy in mission 1.2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Also, why would a spy send another spy on a mission he's on when they have no way of coordinating who is sabotaging, which would cast unneeded suspicion on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zorbees Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) I'd gladly be suspicious. I don't care as long as the resistance wins. I voted Yes for a reason... EDIT: If you folks want to make anything of it, I will point out that Psych was the only one on mission 1.2 who was not in the other proposals. EDIT2: Responding to this post: I'm voting Yes because I have no clue who the Spy is and so, I have no reason to oppose any plan. Going at what zak said, five people vote no, while the rest vote their heart. So I said Yes. I have no reason to disagree because I am not suspicious of anyone being a Spy. Because this is only the first mission, where we have no real info to work with. Everyone else voting No does not tell me anything. You apparently are incapable of using logic. We could make it so the first 4 proposals would have every user at least once, and you'd vote yes for all of them. This is insanely idiotic if you don't want to approve a mission with a spy, considering that there would be at least one proposal, probably more, with spies on them. The default vote shouldn't be yes because you aren't particularly suspicious of anyone. We should be trying to find information while not letting a spy in; approving any mission you feel like is likely to fail both of these objectives. Especially considering the first mission is the mission containing the smallest team, which means that it could get harder from now on. Edited August 17, 2011 by zorbees Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriemhild Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 You apparently are incapable of using logic. We could make it so the first 4 proposals would have every user at least once, and you'd vote yes for all of them. This is insanely idiotic if you don't want to approve a mission with a spy, considering that there would be at least one proposal, probably more, with spies on them. The default vote shouldn't be yes because you aren't particularly suspicious of anyone. We should be trying to find information while not letting a spy in; approving any mission you feel like is likely to fail both of these objectives. Especially considering the first mission is the mission containing the smallest team, which means that it could get harder from now on. So... I guess I should have just voted No by default? Which would mean voting No for all of them? Because on the first mission, I really can't distinguish any team from another. Even if I'm included. I'm only doing this for the first mission btw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 You should not be voting Yes if you are not on the mission. There is only a 1/14 chance that a team of 4 without you on it has no spies (compared to 1/6 if you are on it, which is still bad odds, but that's why I voted No). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riariadne Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 ughhh My laptop is broken via my brother, so I could be gone any time between 1 day and 1 week >_______________________________> might need a sub hopefully not, but >> << >< Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darros Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I think that the spies aren't going to sabotage the first mission if they have the choice. (They do) There's only 4 people required, and it'll be easier to find a spy out of those 4 than out of the 5 people or 6 people missions, especially mission 4 because of the two card thing. We're forced to vote yes to this or the next mission as well or automatic failure. >_> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaybee Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Wrong, this is mission 1.4. Aka this is the one where we actually THINK if it works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balcerzak Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) Also, does anyone other than me suspect that Balcerzak, zorbees and Lightning might be spies? That's odd, I've been getting the exact opposite. zorbees has been giving me some powerful town-vibes, and has shown initiative to go reading the strategy links posted, criticizing poor thinking and promoting high-level play. Now it's possible that's the work of a spy, heck anything is possible, but I just get the feeling he wants this game to be taken seriously. The spies have more to lose by advocating everyone constantly use their critical thinking skills, as a lazy town is an easy town to slip the wool over. Also while initially concerned at Rein's silence, his computer problems explains much (though not all) there. In fact, taking this into account, if the off-chance that he is a spy turns out to be the case, he may not be online and able to sabotage if a team with him on it goes through. Now, you may say I'm doing this just to spite you, but aside from Rein, the team I was considering was almost identical. ##Give plans to: Balcerzak, zorbees, SlayerX, and Luka M. Edited August 17, 2011 by Balcerzak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiant Dragon Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Then I would like to hear zorbees' and Lightning's reasoning for voting yes to JB's proposal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riariadne Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Quite simply I don't think that if there are spies that they'll sabotage this mission because that would guarantee at least 1/4 of the people as a spy so I don't think who goes on the first mission matters too much, tbh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaybee Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Reminder: Don't blatantly say no to this proposal. If this fails, then we HAVE to go with the last one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zorbees Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I approved because I figured that it wouldn't go through, so my approve wouldn't let a spy in. I didn't really want the same 1/10 split as the first mission proposal because that tells us absolutely nothing. I was trying to spur as much discussion and questioning as possible. I figure though, that this fourth vote will be a big one for finding patterns and such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiant Dragon Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Well, I still think Lightning is a Spy, although I'm less sure on the others now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zanarkin Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I approved as well. Eventhough saying no should be done until a suitable team is found, or until we are forced, we are not going to get anywhere voting no. Atleast, not on mission 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 I'm voting no because A. I'm not on this mission, which from my perspective greatly reduces the chances of it having no spies B. I don't trust Rein Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darros Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I voted yes, because if the next host is a spy they have an easy sabotage, but it's unlikely they'd sabotage anyway due to this being mission 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zanarkin Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I voted yes, because if the next host is a spy they have an easy sabotage, but it's unlikely they'd sabotage anyway due to this being mission 1. There being 4 spies however would mean that even if one is found out, they still have 3 others to sabotage in 2 other missions and win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tables Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 Mission Proposal 1.4 by Balcerzak Team: zorbees, Balcerzak, Luka Mefeline, SlayerX Yes: Darros, JBCWK, zorbees, Balcerzak, Kirsche, Kiku-Ichimonji, SlayerX No: Radiant Kitty, Luka M, Paperkitty, Psych Result: Yes - 7, No - 4 Proposal Passes. zorbees, Balcerzak, Luka Mefeline, SlayerX to PM whether to co-operate or sabotage the mission Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Also since Proto doesn't seem to understand why people did not approve of his insistence on upvoting every proposal. This is roughly the equivalent of bandwagoning on the first lynch vote made in mafia--it gets us nowhere. Now, Proto, you play NOC, so you should know that first day discussion (and most day discussion) should be dragged out as long as possible in order to get information on where people stand on various things in order to get a good idea on who's scummy and such and for buddying etc. You are trying to stifle that discussion. Throwing away free information for no reason. The only reasons you would do that are because you are: A. Dumb B. Spy C. Trolling/don't care If we just blindly upvote every proposal, that reduces our chances of success greatly. A mission you are not on has a 7.14% chance of succeeding. And just the first mission. On the next mission, that drops to 2.38%! We NEED information, and you trying to shut that down makes me not want to put you on missions, which really sucks if you're just option A instead of B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Also I can guarantee this mission will be sabotaged, since I am Resistance, which means at least 1 Spy liked this mission. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tables Posted August 20, 2011 Author Share Posted August 20, 2011 Waiting for 1 person to send in their orders. On a possibly related note, I will wait for ALL orders on missions, including if I'm waiting for a resistance member to confirm co-operation. It isn't fair on a spy to be slow and get caught by that. On a certainly not related not, you might notice updates are slow and rare this week. This is a result of me being on holdiday and having access once per day. So I won't be sending many reminders out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriemhild Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Looks like I need to explain myself to Paperblade. Just so you know, I'm only voting Yes for every proposal because it's the first mission. I suppose it might have been a stupid idea for the first three proposals, but I really didn't expect them to go through anyway, with five people automatically voting No anyway. And right now, come on, you can't seriously expect me to vote No simply because I'm not it. If you were to go by that logic in the first mission, only four Resistance members at most would vote Yes, assuming that the other Resistance members are not "dumb". Which means it will only go through if two other Spies vote for it. And if that happens, it probably means there's a Spy in the mission that's sabotaging it. Therefore, the logical thing for a Spy to do would be to vote No for every proposal until the fifth one where they vote Yes. If that's what ends up happening, we won't get to learn ANYTHING from the failed proposals. I believe I prevented that by voting Yes in the first one before trying to logically explain why I choose to vote Yes in every mission. Yeah, I might be branded as a Spy, but at least I know what I'm doing and I think I'm capable of making my own deductions by myself. Also since Proto doesn't seem to understand why people did not approve of his insistence on upvoting every proposal. This is roughly the equivalent of bandwagoning on the first lynch vote made in mafia--it gets us nowhere. Now, Proto, you play NOC, so you should know that first day discussion (and most day discussion) should be dragged out as long as possible in order to get information on where people stand on various things in order to get a good idea on who's scummy and such and for buddying etc. As I explained, I'm not trying to shut down info. If we got 11 Nos in the first proposal, and nobody claimed that they would vote for Yes, I bet we'd end up getting 11 Nos in the second and third proposal. I would learn nothing by seeing 10 people vote 10 Nos. So I declared a Yes vote in the first proposal and gave some intentionally lame reasoning as to why I will always vote Yes, hoping that I would end up seeing less than 10 Nos in the later missions. And with mission 1.2's 2/8 split (not counting myself), I think I DID end up gaining some information. For instance... I approved because I figured that it wouldn't go through, so my approve wouldn't let a spy in. I didn't really want the same 1/10 split as the first mission proposal because that tells us absolutely nothing. I was trying to spur as much discussion and questioning as possible. I figure though, that this fourth vote will be a big one for finding patterns and such. This sounds a lot like my logic, except zorbees never actually declared that he'll be voting Yes for that mission. zorbees decided to go with a 2/9 split, in which case he himself wouldn't learn anything at all. Maybe if he told everyone that he'll be voting Yes, like I did, then some Spies might feel more comfortable about voting Yes, and we could have learned something from this failed proposal. But no, none of us had any clue that he would be voting Yes so it seems completely pointless for him, as a Resistance operative, to vote Yes. This alone makes him extremely suspicious in my eyes. If we just blindly upvote every proposal, that reduces our chances of success greatly. A mission you are not on has a 7.14% chance of succeeding. And just the first mission. On the next mission, that drops to 2.38%! We NEED information, and you trying to shut that down makes me not want to put you on missions, which really sucks if you're just option A instead of B. We don't have a Town Leader here to analyze everything by himself. A mission you are not on is a mission that another Resistance operative is on. It may be 7.14% chance to you, but a 16.7% chance for whoever is in it. A maximum of three Resistance operatives will thus have more info than the others, and I'm not so desperate as to vote No simply because I'm not chosen to bear this burden. There is also one other thing that I need to point out, but I'll explain it later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Proto, if just ONE other member of the Resistance had thought that way, the spies could have all voted yes and forced a bad mission on us. And by "could have," I of course mean "just did" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.