Growth Rates

[LegendaryHero0]

I know we definitely don't have any hard numbers on any growth rates, and supposedly the game's coding makes it difficult to determine them this time around, but I think it'd be interesting to have a discussion about implied growth rates of the characters.

Of course, members who have played the games will be most valuable here. I'd like to see each individual's personal experience with what they've noticed in a character. It might not be accurate per case, but if we see a lot of trends, we can get a rough feel.

So, of anyone who has played the game, what trends have you noticed about certain characters?

Is Gaia surprisingly strong? Does Anna have underwhelming HP? Is Libera very magically resistant? Etc...

What have we all observed? Go ahead and pick any character you'd like to comment on~ ^^

Edited May 14, 2012 by LegendaryHero0

[Ema Skye]

It's hard to judge character growth rates off of experiences of using the character because its perfectly possible for RNG screwage/blessings.

[VincentASM]

If the guidebooks don't provide, we'll probably have to end up pooling everyone's characters and using good ol' statistics to figure out growth rates. Sure, the RNG will mess things up slightly, but when we have over 1000 results, we should be fairly close, I think.

Actually, I reckon it would be fun to try it now ^^

[LegendaryHero0]

It's hard to judge character growth rates off of experiences of using the character because its perfectly possible for RNG screwage/blessings.

That's definitely true. I guess I should have been a bit more clear, but by seeing individual insight from a mass amount of people, you can get a feel for what it'd be like.

If you take 5 people who all trained up Azure, and 3 of those people saw Speed grow amazingly, while 1 person saw it as "okay", and another hardly even got any speed, you can reasonably assume that Azure is probably in the higher end of the speed tier.

So personal observations is what i'm looking for. ^^

If the guidebooks don't provide, we'll probably have to end up pooling everyone's characters and using good ol' statistics to figure out growth rates. Sure, the RNG will mess things up slightly, but when we have over 1000 results, we should be fairly close, I think.

Actually, I reckon it would be fun to try it now ^^

My thoughts exactly~

It may not be exactly accurate for now, as I doubt thousands of people will post in this thread, but it'd still be nice to try and get a feel for some of the characters .

Edited May 14, 2012 by LegendaryHero0

[Othin]

With 1000 level results, looking at a growth rate expected to be 50% (worst-case scenario), we'd have a margin of error of about 3% when aiming to be 95% confident. 3% is small, but with how many things we're looking at and how it can be a relevant difference when we're building on previous calculated growths for figuring out class growths within 5%, it might cause some issues.

We don't actually need 1000 people, just 1000 levels. For each character. For each stat, for each class we're analyzing. So it's still kind of a big undertaking. Hopefully we have better luck with that guide or hacking.

Edited May 14, 2012 by Othin

[Lexington]

With 1000 level results, looking at a growth rate expected to be 50% (worst-case scenario), we'd have a margin of error of about 3% when aiming to be 95% confident. 3% is small, but with how many things we're looking at and how it can be a relevant difference when we're building on previous calculated growths for figuring out class growths within 5%, it might cause some issues.

We don't actually need 1000 people, just 1000 levels. For each character. For each stat, for each class we're analyzing. So it's still kind of a big undertaking. Hopefully we have better luck with that guide or hacking.

Well, if they'd finally release it here in europe, I'd be happy to help.

"For each character. For each stat, for each class we're analyzing."

You do get a result for each stat with each level up though. So it's 1000 level ups, for each character, for each class.

But that might not be enough for the children characters if they inherit growths from their parents.

[BBM]

With 1000 level results, looking at a growth rate expected to be 50% (worst-case scenario), we'd have a margin of error of about 3% when aiming to be 95% confident. 3% is small, but with how many things we're looking at and how it can be a relevant difference when we're building on previous calculated growths for figuring out class growths within 5%, it might cause some issues.

We don't actually need 1000 people, just 1000 levels. For each character. For each stat, for each class we're analyzing. So it's still kind of a big undertaking. Hopefully we have better luck with that guide or hacking.

Go, Othin, play the game 50 more times!

[Othin]

Go, Othin, play the game 50 more times!

Oh, I'm sure I will. But for this, I have a slightly different method in mind.

Saria - Sorcerer

HP: 90%

Str: 20%

Mag: 75%

Skl: 50%

Spd: 45%

Luck: 25%

Def: 45%

Res: 55%

Calculated by repeatedly having her gain a level at the beginning of a skirmish and then resetting. It took much longer than I thought - I only did it 20 times, and I don't plan on repeating this anytime soon. This means there's a lot of room for error, with growths around 50% having a 95% margin of error of 22%. With the sorts of numbers we're dealing with, that's huge. For example, I know Saria's Skl growth isn't anywhere near 50%. It's likely on the lower end of that spectrum, at 30%, tops. But it does capture some general trends: 405% does seem to be a typical growth total, and plenty of characters have HP growths over 100%.

[Melonhead]

and plenty of characters have HP growths over 100%.

Occasional +2's in anything other than HP? With the crazy stat caps, I wouldn't be suprised.

[Othin]

Occasional +2's in anything other than HP? With the crazy stat caps, I wouldn't be suprised.

Only one I've seen is DLC Marth with Good Growths.

HP +2s seem to be common, though: I've seen several of them on every Barbarian, Berserker, and Manakete I've used, as well as on Frederick.

[ISRMMBV]

If Othin gets 3 or more GRs right we all owe him a cookie...agreed?

[Skyrius]

There's actually one thing I noticed on my playthrough, but only because he was overwhelmingly UNDERLEVELED and still kept up with all my other units.

CHAMBRAY'S GROWTH RATES. What the heck is up with them? @_@ He's a good 10 levels below everyone else and his strength is higher than everyone (except Vake I think, I have to double check) and his other stats are pretty close to quite a few of my main fighters.

Actually, I think Velvet had ridiculous growth rates too. I don't remember since I didn't use her that much, but now that this happened, I think I have to go back and check it out.

EDIT: Actually now that I think about it, I did reclass him to the Berserker branch relative early, but he's only a level 1 Berserker right now. I don't care how big of a difference between stats class branches has, that's a little excessive.

Edited May 15, 2012 by Skyrius

[Othin]

There's actually one thing I noticed on my playthrough, but only because he was overwhelmingly UNDERLEVELED and still kept up with all my other units.

CHAMBRAY'S GROWTH RATES. What the heck is up with them? @_@ He's a good 10 levels below everyone else and his strength is higher than everyone (except Vake I think, I have to double check) and his other stats are pretty close to quite a few of my main fighters.

Actually, I think Velvet had ridiculous growth rates too. I don't remember since I didn't use her that much, but now that this happened, I think I have to go back and check it out.

What class? I'm having similar experiences with him as a Berserker. He's not so underleveled because I sent him through a couple of DLC maps to catch up and promote, and as a result he has insane offense and is one of my best units.

Edit: Okay, yeah. Mine's a 10/10/9 Berserker with 76 HP and 42 Str. For comparison, Krom is another one of my best units as a 15/15/3 Paladin with 55 HP and 28 Str.

Edited May 15, 2012 by Othin

[Skyrius]

I actually reclassed him to the thief class first for a few levels before noticing that even then his strength stat growth was higher than normal so I switched back straight-away into the Barbarian branch (which he stayed until I got him to Berserker). As a result however, he manages to double some enemies 5+ levels above him :| Maybe I just haven't played enough Fire Emblem games, but I don't remember my Berserker classes ever pulling that off (I might be wrong. I've only played Sword of Seals and Path of Radiance). I've got 61 HP and 32 Str but I'm 7 levels below you.

EDIT: By the way, does anyone know the average growth rate for stats in the theif class? (30% chance of Str and 80% for Spd I think??? I'd like to know because I reclassed Chambray to test something out. I got him just under level up and I'm resetting each time to see what he tends to gain).

Edited May 15, 2012 by Skyrius

[Othin]

Well if he went Taguel 10 --> Thief 10 --> Barbarian 10 --> Berserker 1, that's still pretty high-leveled.

[Skyrius]

Yeah but on my main file that's about 10 levels belows some of my other characters (but I've been reclassing them like crazy. XD I'm still looking for the best combinations). But yeah, that's basically what I did. That's 32 (level 2 Berserker actually, I can't read XD) levels but I'm more focused on his gains per level. Those seem higher than everyone else's.

[Othin]

To the edit above: We can't really calculate anything for class growths on their own yet. Have you seen him getting any +2s as a Thief?

Edited May 15, 2012 by Othin

[Skyrius]

Oh I mean from previous games. I don't think the developers will change the algorithms by that much, so I was thinking that they might still be relative to this experiment.

But still, I know the thief class has high speed growth, but for most unpromoted classes, you don't see that many +2's normally right? Out of 20-30 tries, I've seen +2 to his speed 2 times. And then I just kept going for fun while I was multitasking and the weird part is, I think he's gaining STR points more often than the thief class normally does. Does anyone have him as just a Taguel still? Maybe he just leans towards strength by default or something.

You have to realize, I've clocked like 80+ hours on this game already so most of my units are pretty high leveled. Chambray's underleveled since I didn't use Velvet that much and only recently got her up to a level S support with Gaia.

....Well, his dad's a thief so many that's why his speed even in Berserker class is high? Wait, is that even how inheritance works for children? In hindsight, pairing Velvet with Gaia wasn't the best idea gameplaywise since I've got a lot of repeated skills (I think Gaia and Chambray have a lot of overlapping possible class changes) and I could've gotten a unique skill off someone else...

.....

....

herp derp, oh well. XD I never really plan these things ahead of time. I just go with whoever has the most d'aaw worth support *bricked*

[TheVinceKnight]

Can Mark (myunit's child) be practically good as any class?

Pegasus Knight lvl 15 -> Dark Pegasus Lvl 15 -> Sorceror lvl 5

[Skyrius]

Depends on MU's gender I suppose. I actually have a male MU on my main file since the female-only classes tend to get some of the better abilities (Lightning Speed) but actually it works out either way.

Ironically though, I think the best possible setup is actually with a FeMU. I've been wanting to get Good Growth on Mark @_@ But Donny is the only one who has it (oh, or his son I guess. I could pass it on like that. XD) and Krom give Royal Weapon which can be coupled with a lot of things. And also, since Mark can inherit Lightning Speed from FeMU and naturally learn Rainbow Cry, put him in the middle of a bunch of units and everything will be slaughtered.

In terms of growth rate though, that depends on what you set your best and worst stats to when you first created MU. For the above class path, if you created MU as a magic leaning unit, it'd be pretty deadly.

I like the mage classes, so my Mark is rather squishy, but he has Holy Shield (took forever @_@ out of all the characters, Mark has gone through the most reclasses XD) and coupled with Royal Weapon (from Krom), Lightning Speed (from FeMU), and Rainbow Cry he and everyone around him with high support levels MURDERS EVERYTHING. I get Holy Shield to activate often enough that it's worth it and MU has +Mag originally anyways. I was debating whether or not to put Magnificent Flame and have him level through some STR heavy classes or something :\ Actually, at this point he's support most of the time so I might as well get Crimson Curse and really watch everything nearby die.

Edited May 15, 2012 by Skyrius

[Silith]

Have a character with 99/100 exp at the end of a chapter so he cna level in the first turn over and over again by resetting.

That's how I gathered the Blossom data in RD.

[Saethori]

Cataloging level-ups and such for characters (in given classes), and cross-referencing them with the same character in a different class or different characters in the same class is easy.

The hard part is the 'modular' characters. That is, MU (determining just how much 'best stat' and 'worst stat' influence growth rates) and the second-generation characters (how much of their growth rates are affected by the father... or in Fe!Mark/Lucina's case, the mother. Even the nameless village girl needs mother data!).

But if people just catalog how their level-ups go, then we'll have some data that we can combine from plenty of different games. (Though we might not get enough information until it releases in NA/EU.)

Edited May 15, 2012 by Saethori

[Othin]

Oh I mean from previous games. I don't think the developers will change the algorithms by that much, so I was thinking that they might still be relative to this experiment.

But still, I know the thief class has high speed growth, but for most unpromoted classes, you don't see that many +2's normally right? Out of 20-30 tries, I've seen +2 to his speed 2 times. And then I just kept going for fun while I was multitasking and the weird part is, I think he's gaining STR points more often than the thief class normally does. Does anyone have him as just a Taguel still? Maybe he just leans towards strength by default or something.

You have to realize, I've clocked like 80+ hours on this game already so most of my units are pretty high leveled. Chambray's underleveled since I didn't use Velvet that much and only recently got her up to a level S support with Gaia.

....Well, his dad's a thief so many that's why his speed even in Berserker class is high? Wait, is that even how inheritance works for children? In hindsight, pairing Velvet with Gaia wasn't the best idea gameplaywise since I've got a lot of repeated skills (I think Gaia and Chambray have a lot of overlapping possible class changes) and I could've gotten a unique skill off someone else...

.....

....

herp derp, oh well. XD I never really plan these things ahead of time. I just go with whoever has the most d'aaw worth support *bricked*

Well that does mean he has over a 100% Spd growth, although not much over 100%. I've seen him gain +2 HP more often than that as a Berserker, but that's HP.

And you went with Gaia x Velvet as well? Interesting.

Have a character with 99/100 exp at the end of a chapter so he cna level in the first turn over and over again by resetting.

That's how I gathered the Blossom data in RD.

That's what I did, although it took a kill. Not a fast process in this case, and we can't generalize much of this info.

[I don't play for turns]

We actually have the data now on the guidebook forum, (link to chinafe) so this is useless. Yaaaaaaaaaay!