Schoolteacher Mafia

[scorri]

Manix: Note I'm not the only one who's finding SB scummy or the first vote on him.

[Shinori]

I have multiple reasons to not think he's scum. Albeit the biggest reason is his paper target.

At the moment only you and Baldrick are on him I think. Elie dropped his vote off of him.

If it was between kaoz or helios who would you lynch scorri?

[scorri]

Hm. Let me real quick go read an ISO of Helios. I'll be honest I haven't been paying a ton of attention to him this game since his play hasn't appeared like the scum meta I have for him in my head, but I'll look and compare his stuff to my view on Kaoz. Split second instinct says Kaoz, but that's at least partially because I'm annoyed about his attitude towards the game, I'll be honest.

[Grace]

party time

What's interesting to note is scorri's early Bal vote. Watch and learn.

Post where she voted Bal.

Bal's first post of the game

Bal's second post

Bal's third post

all I'm really seeing now is RVS stuff, but leaving my vote on Bal for now since his last post didn't really do anything.

was her eventual response. timestamps considered, I'm assuming she meant from his first post? tbh I'm not quite sure what to make of it because if not the follow up makes very little sense:

Bal post the fourth

Bal's been talking some more and so I'm going to wait a bit before putting another vote down. Wanna see some people say stuff before I do.

>talking more after one more post (and now with timestamps noted, it was about 10 minutes apart which is ???)

also the comment about waiting for people to talk is kinda iffy considering there was enough content at the time to comment on

Gonna take this post and break it apart a little.

Honestly, both Paper's and Kay's votes were kinda horrible. They're both just sheeping someone who's probably town and giving no reasoning for it.

##Vote:Kaoz

Okay. This makes no sense. It's like "hey so I'm finding these two people scummy but I'm going to votepark on an inactive." Like seriously that's not great. You then disappear for like a bit under 48 hours but apparently you were busy so shrug

Then we get to the fun stuff.

First, while I see your point Shinori, I'd prefer to take out the confirmed member of the cult and then we can have Elie scan Paper tonight or something like that. So, I'd prefer a Prims lynch.

How to deal with cult 101: Hit the leader. If you decide to lynch a cultist instead of the CL, you make it so town!PR's can get culted. You seemed very insistent on letting Paper live and it took a fair amount of convincing to get your vote on him.

Tip: Letting CL cult town!PR's is antitown at it's finest. Scum wants the PR's to be culted so that they can then kill off the CL to give them a huge advantage.

Also in the same post:

That being said, I don't like how Paper's been acting this phase. He's gone from being all "Why are we lynching Helios, can someone explain that to me?" to being "Helios was bad D1" but not saying anything more. Seems kinda opportunistic to me.

??????? I'm sorry but ?????????

It was fairly apparent that Paper was CL from Eliescan and his claim, and combined with this implies that you probably knew that Paper was CL but you didn't want him lynched for reasons above.

Look here

This is the next instance of scorri actually pushing Kay at all (read: early D2 to mid D3) and I'm wondering why scorri didn't push it earlier given her earlier suspicions.

This is also great.

So, lessee, I have two votes on me and Kaoz claims tracker. Due to ~reasons~ (aka hostmeta from Schoolgirl), I'm willing to buy that town has full cop, watcher, and tracker, so I'm ok with leaving Kaoz be for now.

SB claims watcher, you have a vote on him and you think he's scummy. Uh huh. ???????????

I'm okay with this lynch.

##Vote: scorri

[Helios]

Gonna respond to all of this because 1) These arguments have some holes in them 2) I think SB is possible scum

SB is known to do some stupid/poor decisions sometimes. He's also been known to be not all that active as town or scum.

Explain why you think he's scum please, don't base everything around night actions, your vote isn't that good. Base it on content combined with night actions.

Seem's like you are sheeping a pretty cleared townie.

This is meta and not a very strong argument. More importantly you seem to forget that targeting Paper N1 as scum = 1 easy night to fakeclaim an action with something like a watcher fakeclaim. Not to mention his second night action was "I watched Elieson and the only person who targeted him was Shinori" AFTER Shinori claimed he was redirected onto Elieson. This is really easy to fake. Also kinda wondering why doc!Rocker didn't target Elieson...unless he actually did and SB is faking his watcher report?

Glad you're starting to see the light since you've been doing that as well this game. Now if you go and take a look at his content you'll see he's not very townie in any way. I'll post my case on why I think he's scum in a bit.

Also if you are gonna lynch sb because his N1 action wasn't townie then what about Rocker? Who obviously didn't target the cop. What's the townie reasoning there for not targeting the cop?

Like by your standards, if we didn't know rocker was cleared you could just be voting rocker instead of SB.

You forget that Elieson didn't claim until D2, so how would he know he should have targeted Elieson?

You act like Rocker's play isn't super townie and that if he hadn't been cleared through BBM's role then no one would want to lynch him. Right lol.

Though I agree with some of your points (mainly lack of content, scumhunting, possibly buddying up with me for towniecred, active lurking through some parts of the game (especially earlier) and the fact that she seems to have voted a lot of cleared townies so far), Shinori, I'm gonna answer some of these bold parts since you asked and pull out some (what I believe) may be holes in your argument.

Then she says she is gonna reread to post reads. Were you skimming up until this point? I don't think a reread would have been required for you to at least post one scumread.

Only voted kaoz and prims the entire day. Why?

I thought this safeguard stuff was hypothetical, why do you sound like you know for sure there is a safeguard?

Saying you're gonna reread the thread /= skimming/not paying attention to things going on. It's a lot safer to reread the thread to make sure you know what you're talking about before you post a case on a player being scum don't you think? Hell you just did it now by rereading the thread to post a coherent case as to why is scorri scum. It's not like you haven't been skimming the whole time or didn't pay attention, but you did it to make sure your case is legit. I don't think this reasoning makes her scum.

Well Kaoz looks pretty scummy, and I believe she wanted him to at least post something content (which he never did) so I don't think that vote is bad. The prims vote I don't really understand though so she'll have to explain that to you (which I think she did already).

This is dumb because since D1 EVERYONE thought there was a possible safeguard in this game (remember when Neko claimed vig and people said theoretical safeguard should be on him? add that with clipsey mod meta and the setup of the game and that's not really unlikely...but then again I forgot for some reason you actually think the safeguard is scum).

SB CASE (with reasons not in any particular order of importance) (I gave it impact font for extra impact):

• His latest post with the theory as to why BBM may have died could be a possible scumslip since there's no reason a townie could know any of that.
• The suggestion of a no-lynch when there's this many PRs claimed so far isn't beneficial to town in any way.
• I agree that Baldrick's role spec was dumb, but his argument with Kay wasn't, since it helps give us a better read on those two players. In that vote post he also talks about how inactives are bad and how Kaoz is scummy...but votes Baldrick for lesser reasons? Possible buddying here.
• He misrepped my Rocker vote and said I was waffling (If there's one thing I haven't done this game, it's waffle) to try and push a lynch back on me. Also thought Rocker was a good lynch for decent reasoning (I actually find this a null-tell because Rocker really wasn't playing obvtown so I can understand this, but the fact that he was trying to get the town!doc lynch when he also said later that "scum may know a ton of roles already" makes me wonder if he knew Rocker was a town!doc and wanted to possibly force a mislynch on him).
• He also voted Prims over Paperblade, Shinori, so if you're going to find this scummy on Scorri than you need to do the same thing with SB in that case.
• The memorable Mancer vote with "Mancer's fake is horribad, vote" which speaks for itself really. Jumped the bandwagon on an easy townie mislynch, especially when he thought Shinori/Mancer were intown fighting (which is also weird because Shinori was acting pretty scummy at that point in the game, so why would he find him town?)
• He's been inactive and coasting through most of the game, and I've caught him lurking without saying anything multiple times this game
• I also think he may be possibly bussing Kaoz with all the "Kaoz isn't even trying anymore" comments and things like that (though it's weird that he never ends up voting him?) so if Kaoz flips scum he'll try and get townie cred for having him as scumspec

##Unvote (Kaoz)

##Vote SB

Also I've worked on this post for 30 minutes so I'm probably gonna get ninja'd like crazy

I'd still like to lynch Kaoz and will switch to him if that is more likely to happen

[Shinori]

##Vote: Scorri

I'm just gonna go back to this.

Don't like the SB lynch unless

A few points in regards to what you said about SB, Prims v paper case you also voted prims if I remember correctly. So that's a point against you as well.

However I, for the life of me, cannot find a logical reason for scum to target paper.

And if you want to talk about small bussing kaoz stuff like what you just said, Scorri also mentioned things like that a few times, mentioned kaoz was scummy then didn't vote him, and stuff. And also day 2.

Also this whole, HELIOS AND SCORRI DO EVERYTHING TOGETHER THING is really irking me.

[Shinori]

Unless you can give me definite reasons to not lynch you two.

Also bolding is hard.

##Vote: Scorri

[scorri]

Manix: It wasn't really clear to me that Paper was cult until later on. Like, actually. It wasn't. Like I've said, I got targeted by the cult's faction ability and to me it sounded like Prims, not Paper. I specifically mentioned a plan that would prevent people from getting culted and let us know for sure if Paper was cult. Scum and town both want cult gone. I was voting for the confirmed cult member. I've never played against a cult before. I figured that with my plan (roleblocking Paper and scanning him) we could confirm that he was cult and not accidentally mislynch a townie.

I didn't push Kay earlier because of fiasco of D2cult reveal. Which I've explained before.

I have a vote on SB because his play hasn't been great and others were presenting arguments for him being scum that I found myself agreeing with. I want us to lynch today, not waste a day period with a no lynch.

[scorri]

And Shinori: To answer your question, after rereading a Helios ISO, I'd be ok with either his lynch or Kaoz I suppose.

Also, if you guys want my claim it's in my first post of the game. Enjoy.

[Shinori]

CANNOT DECODE CODE.

[Helios]

Don't like the SB lynch unless

A few points in regards to what you said about SB, Prims v paper case you also voted prims if I remember correctly. So that's a point against you as well.

However I, for the life of me, cannot find a logical reason for scum to target paper.

And if you want to talk about small bussing kaoz stuff like what you just said, Scorri also mentioned things like that a few times, mentioned kaoz was scummy then didn't vote him, and stuff. And also day 2.

Also this whole, HELIOS AND SCORRI DO EVERYTHING TOGETHER THING is really irking me.

Read my last post. SB has way more reasons to be voted right now than Scorri, though like I said I actually think you and Manix have some good points and I'm starting to see this better. Still prefer SB and Kaoz over Scorri though.

Dude idk how many times I'm going to say this but you do realize that people scum can say this as an easy fakeclaim right? Instead of outing who they actually targeted they can say their action failed for some reason.

Again, SB has more reasons to deserve a lynch than Scorri does right now.

This is a huge exaggeration seeing as we really haven't done many things together at all, just both find SB scummy and a couple other things.

[Shinori]

Titanium?

BP?

II DONT KNOW.

[scorri]

Uh... listen to the video I linked.

[scorri]

Passive role, linked a video that says bulletproof multiple times....

[Shinori]

yeah like i said bp

[scorri]

(oops, missed that post)

[Grace]

Manix: It wasn't really clear to me that Paper was cult until later on. Like, actually. It wasn't. Like I've said, I got targeted by the cult's faction ability and to me it sounded like Prims, not Paper.

What factional ability? Check the flip again.

If it's not there, then you should be OUTING IMMEDIATELY what the heck happened to you and I don't know why you didn't in the first place

(also bp is iffy claim but ehhhhhh)

[Grace]

also in other news bp is a claim we can't prove any more because our vig is ded

and scum!bp can exist so it isn't confirmed town on being proven anyway

[scorri]

a) Prims claimed they targeted me with an ability but it failed.

b) I did claim it the next day once cult had flipped because the message did not indicate if that it was from a cult (and in fact stated the opposite)

c) It would have given me a 1-shot cop scan, but it failed for an unknown reason.

[scorri]

Aka nothing happened to me and thus I saw no need to out it at first since I wasn't sure where it came from and didn't want to hurt a potential town role. After Prims stated that they had targeted me, I saw no need to out it because no one mentioned it and nothing had happened to me. I then *did* mention it and no one talked about it, so once again I saw no need to go further with it.

[Helios]

also the comment about waiting for people to talk is kinda iffy considering there was enough content at the time to comment on

Okay. This makes no sense. It's like "hey so I'm finding these two people scummy but I'm going to votepark on an inactive." Like seriously that's not great. You then disappear for like a bit under 48 hours but apparently you were busy so shrug

Then we get to the fun stuff.

How to deal with cult 101: Hit the leader. If you decide to lynch a cultist instead of the CL, you make it so town!PR's can get culted. You seemed very insistent on letting Paper live and it took a fair amount of convincing to get your vote on him.

Tip: Letting CL cult town!PR's is antitown at it's finest. Scum wants the PR's to be culted so that they can then kill off the CL to give them a huge advantage.

Also in the same post:

??????? I'm sorry but ?????????

It was fairly apparent that Paper was CL from Eliescan and his claim, and combined with this implies that you probably knew that Paper was CL but you didn't want him lynched for reasons above.

Look here

This is the next instance of scorri actually pushing Kay at all (read: early D2 to mid D3) and I'm wondering why scorri didn't push it earlier given her earlier suspicions.

SB claims watcher, you have a vote on him and you think he's scummy. Uh huh. ???????????

I'm okay with this lynch.

##Vote: scorri

I actually think this post has some good points. My only concerns here are:

1. Early D1 votes are tough to read between the lines on since there isn't a whole lot going on and hindsight always gets in the way when you look back at it. I don't think you can really read much out of the Bal vote because of this. Not to mention a lot of people at the time thought Bal may be scummy since he hadn't done much but roleplay.
2. I think her actual response to Prims v. Paper vote makes sense, and I don't think Scum could have any way to know there's a cult leader in a way the town couldn't. Not to mention how she thought her invitation message or whatever sounded like Prims and not Paper. Besides, I dont see how scum benefit from cult and town doesn't, since cult can just target scum members as well who tend to have strong roles as well. It's not reliable to rely on a wildcard.
3. I don't see how SSB is a cleared watcher off a claim. If it was that easy we should all just claim when a little pressure is put on us and then post twice more in a phase and call it good.

[Grace]

a) Prims claimed they targeted me with an ability but it failed.

b) I did claim it the next day once cult had flipped because the message did not indicate if that it was from a cult (and in fact stated the opposite)

c) It would have given me a 1-shot cop scan, but it failed for an unknown reason.

a) And what about everything else Prims said? Most of that was WIFOM anyway. He was probably lying.

b) Then it wasn't because of the cult then. Easy answer.

c) Failed as in you didn't get it or as in you used it and it didn't work?

[scorri]

Also scorri is probably town; we used a factional ability on her D1 and it didn't work for some reason but the way she handled it makes me think she's not scum. She could probably explain this herself.

Like Prims said' date=' I was the target of some cult ability (not a recruitment ability, don't start jumping on that) and it read more like Prims than it did Paper. So, I was more interested in lynching Prims because it was an assured lynch and I honestly didn't find Paper to be that suspicious.[/quote']

[Helios]

Doesn't BP usually mean SK guys?

[Grace]

Early D1 votes are tough to read between the lines on since there isn't a whole lot going on and hindsight always gets in the way when you look back at it. I don't think you can really read much out of the Bal vote because of this. Not to mention a lot of people at the time thought Bal may be scummy since he hadn't done much but roleplay.

Which is fair, but yet it still looks weird to me.

I think her actual response to Prims v. Paper vote makes sense, and I don't think Scum could have any way to know there's a cult leader in a way the town couldn't. Not to mention how she thought her invitation message or whatever sounded like Prims and not Paper. Besides, I dont see how scum benefit from cult and town doesn't, since cult can just target scum members as well who tend to have strong roles as well. It's not reliable to rely on a wildcard.

Getting the claimed PR's culted maybe (eg: ELIE THE COP) which helps scum because they would know who the CL is by that point and can then either kill/lynch the CL. Because if town doesn't nip cult in the bud early it spirals out of control. Town would probably want CL dead ASAP so they wouldn't worry about scum which gives scum more time and a numbers advantage.

I don't see how SSB is a cleared watcher off a claim. If it was that easy we should all just claim when a little pressure is put on us and then post twice more in a phase and call it good.

I'm not saying he's clear, I'm saying that scorri said she'd believe there's a town fullcop/tracker/watcher and then said a claimed watcher is scummy (ie: two contradictory statements)