This 3/10 Gamefaqs review for FE13 actually made some valid points.

[Vashiane]

People played this game for plot? :B

When I first got it... yeah. My author tendencies searched out the plot. xP

[Tamanoir]

I have ton of funs withy this game, and that's all that counts for me. It have great replay value too.

My previous favorite game was FE4, which have these two aspects too.

Also, Imagine what Cordelia X Sumia would have been like, if Weight was still in the game... Will it be with a Con stat, or by using the Strength stat...

[arvilino]

I miss the defend objectives as well.

Strange because I really can't understand someone seriously claiming Chapter 6 isn't actually defend map, Paralogue 17 as well.

But I have some problems with peoples description of the quality of the maps in this game in general. This includes using the fact there's only two objectives in order try and gloss over the fact chapters don't actually all play out the same at all. The little box with the chapter completion goal doesn't have to say something different for a chapter to play differently.

Other than that the review has something you could accept as their opinion on weapon weight, class design and story. But they aren't valid points(not every one will agree), weapon weight isn't inherently good(and personally I felt since FE12 no weight was an improvement, previously it wasn't very strategic, weapon weight was a feature that existed for around 2 decades yet was never really balanced properly).

Also calling the knights/generals nonsensical given the previous designs in the series is a bit funny.

Edited June 9, 2013 by arvilino

[Vapo]

Chapter 6 is a defend map, and a pretty hard on at that. There's lots of ways the enemies can get into Emm's room, since you have to watch out for thieves and enemies heading towards the chokepoint. Added with the fact that you have to rout and save Emm since it's Game Over if she dies, it's probably one of the funnest chapters in the game~

Defend+rout is better than just defend, since it needs you to focus on not just the NPC you're protecting, but the enemies as well. Paralogue 17 is good for that as well, since if you pair up all your units, you can't entirely defend Tiki, which means you have to think a lot more.

[Da Bear]

The problem with Chapter 6 is that it can be easily accomplished without any real thought, I'm not going to deny that maps can play out differently because that would be stupid but Chapter 6 is far from challenging on any mode (except possibly LM+).

Edited June 9, 2013 by bearclaw13

[RJWalker]

3/10 is going overboard. The game has only a few flaws but those flaws are quite massive. At worst, I'd say 7/10 even though I'd rate it higher.

[pinkbubblegum]

3/10...? I'm not sure if this person played the same game as me xD;

In all honesty though, all those supposed points in the first post to justify that score are just being nitpicky (because it's cool to be different from popular opinion...?) FE13's story was pretty weak, admittedly. But a really fun and addicting gameplay's more than enough to save it from that in my opinion.

[arvilino]

The problem with Chapter 6 is that it can be easily accomplished without any real thought, I'm not going to deny that maps can play out differently because that would be stupid but Chapter 6 is far from challenging on any mode (except possibly LM+).

So can most defense maps in the series. In the entirety of Fire Emblem there's only really that protect Zephiel chapter in FE7 or Paralogue 17 in FE13 where the enemies have a realistic shot at actually defeating their target. Anywhere else the tile, throne or NPC aren't realistically going to be threatened unless you purposely allow it to be.

[BrightBow]

I find myself agreeing with most points in the review.

Well, I have no issue with the art, except for... well, any single female character. And the villains.

And objectives aren't that big of an issue, seeing how it alway comes down to the same thing anyway.

And of course, his observation about pair-up is obviously flawed.

And his statement that the characters are "fairly well developed and have fun personalities" just makes my rolling on the floor with laughter.

...Okay, let's just skip to the points that I actually agree with.

I especially liked him noting that the spoken lines don't match what's said in the dialogue

Sometimes it's just a little moan to get some emotion across, which is good.

But then other times, they shout entire lines that have nothing to do with anything, while you are trying to read.

It makes it so painful to read the text. The game became so much better when I turned them off.

Of course, this also disabled the voices during combat. But that is also for the better.

Maybe they would have worked in the other games but with the current music direction, they simply don't.

The goofy lines of the characters make them come across as if they treat the whole "kill or be killed" thing with the same seriousness as a Star Craft match.

They destroy the atmosphere that the music is so hard trying to build.

And it does take ages to build supports. I didn't get a single paralegal besides Morgan's. In the second to last map I finally got Frederick and Sumia to S-Rank.

The two of them were effectively glued together for the whole game.

And yeah, the kids are useless. Why bother raising this amateurs into decent units when you could use the same time to turn your regular units into demi gods?

The whole mechanic is such a waste.

And the point can the maps have no variety is spot on. This is what absolutely buries this game. The options menu can't fix that one.

The maps are just a wide open field. Well except for a few random tiles that offer absolutely insignificant defense boasts.

The enemies are so randomly scattered, that they seem to be placed by the same scripts that places street pass teams, who have to be random by their very nature.

And doing the same thing over and over again, just with higher states on both sides, doesn't keep the game fresh for very long.

In fact, for that reason I would say that just by playing the demo, you have seen anything that the game has to offer.

Edited June 9, 2013 by BrightBow

[Rewjeo]

And it does take ages to build supports. I didn't get a single paralegal besides Morgan's. In the second to last map I finally got Frederick and Sumia to S-Rank.

The two of them were effectively glued together for the whole game.

And yeah, the kids are useless. Why bother raising this amateurs into decent units when you could use the same time to turn your regular units into demi gods?

The whole mechanic is such a waste.

Wat. Avatar can be married by like chapter 8 or earlier, and pairs between early joining characters are stupidly easy to get done before the time skip while playing efficiently. Heck, on my first run I did Fred/Panne because of how my team was working out, and I had that done shortly after the time skip. That's a support rank roughly every other chapter, although I of course dawdled some and tried out spotpass/skirmishes and such as it was my first time through the game. As for the kids, they are hardly "decent" once trained up while your regular units are "demigods." I agree that the children typically aren't worth using, but that's because of their start, not their finish. The kids should end up better than their parents. The problem is the whole "I'm 20 levels behind the rest of your team!" thing.

Edited June 9, 2013 by Rewjeo

[Nobody]

And it does take ages to build supports. I didn't get a single paralegal besides Morgan's. In the second to last map I finally got Frederick and Sumia to S-Rank.

The two of them were effectively glued together for the whole game.

And yeah, the kids are useless. Why bother raising this amateurs into decent units when you could use the same time to turn your regular units into demi gods?

The whole mechanic is such a waste.

No it doesn't. Compared to the GBA fire emblems the supports in this game are built REALLY fast. By chapter 13, when children become recruitable you can easily have at least 4 couples married, including Chrom. I just beat the game without grinding at all. and by chapter 13 I had chrom, MU, sumia, cordelia and Sully married.

Edited June 9, 2013 by Nobody

[BrightBow]

No it doesn't. Compared to the GBA fire emblems the supports in this game are built REALLY fast. By chapter 13, when children become recruitable you can easily have at least 4 couples married, including Chrom. I just beat the game without grinding at all. and by chapter 13 I had chrom, MU, sumia, cordelia and Sully married.

But in the GBA games, you don't need supports to recruit like a third (admittedly useless third) of the cast.

A more valid comparison would be the FE4 marriage system. And I had never any trouble getting everyone married there.

[Nobody]

But in the GBA games, you don't need supports to recruit like a third (admittedly useless third) of the cast.

A more valid comparison would be the FE4 marriage system. And I had never any trouble getting everyone married there.

Do you use pair up? If you don't, maybe that's the reason they grow slower for you. I use pair up all the time and they build really fast.

Edited June 9, 2013 by Nobody

[BrightBow]

Do you use pair up? If you don't, maybe that's the reason they grow slower for you. I use pair up all the time and they build really fast.

I probably wouldn't have made it through hard mode if I didn't. Enemies seem to be able to double PC units of the same level unless they have outstanding speed.

Like I said above, Frederick and Sumia were glued together all the time, which allowed Sumia to grow so quickly that I never even considered using Crodelia. And they still didn't get an S-Rank until the very end.

Edited June 9, 2013 by BrightBow

[Nobody]

That's odd... I did the same thing and by chapter 10 fred and sumia were married.

[arvilino]

The kids are useless. Why bother raising this amateurs into decent units when you could use the same time to turn your regular units into demi gods?

The whole mechanic is such a waste.

Because you can have the children do stuff like inherit 2 Rally Skills and instantly have a unit that can boost your already strong parent units without using up two of their turns?I think it's pretty good because through this games skill system it can potentially break the tradition that within just the main story line a units worth isn't almost entirely based on their stats.

I'd argue that for the inheritance of skills alone the children characters are more useful than similar low level later joining characters(e.g. Est,Marisa,Miranda,Wendy and a great deal of FE12 characters) in other Fire Emblem games. Would you disagree?

Additionally due the childrens base stats being based on the parents, if some of the parents are your above average units based on everyone you're using, The children can potentially join up with similar stats to the average units you're using but with the lower level and faster leveling of being a 10 unpromoted unit.

Edited June 9, 2013 by arvilino

[mai]

Well, I have no issue with the art, except for... well, any single female character.

I assume you're talking about fanservice (just ignore me if you're not), in which case, what's wrong with Lissa, Maribelle, the pegasus knights (since skirt+thigh high is a standard for pegasus knights, except in FE5/9/10), Miriel, Anna, Say'ri, Flavia, Female!Robin and literally every Second Gen female character (okay, Noire's cleavage is dumb, but at least she's wearing pants)?

I mean, I agree that the females in FE13 are terrible compared to the rest of the series (especially the amazing designs in FE9/FE10), but people act like every single female character is a walking pile of fanservice, when it's actually just a few of them. Honestly... I'd say only Nowi's and Cherche's outfits are inexcusable. Olivia is half naked, but almost every dancer in the series is, and at least she's not a little girl unlike Sylvia, Feena, Leen and Lalam; Panne is half naked too, but so is Yarne; Tharja wears a see-through outfit, but that's the default outfit for dark mages, both male and female (then again, Henry is wearing a shirt...). I mean, the fanservice is still dumb, but at least it's equal opportunity in most cases.

Of course, this is just talking about official designs; when it comes to the actual game, most females look freaking ridiculous. Why the hell would you wear nothing over your damn panties when riding on a horse (it's really outrageous when you compare Cherche to Gerome)? Why do female assassins show massive cleavage? Why is every female design so damn fanservicey when compared to their male counterparts?

I mean, I'll take FE9/10 designs over FE13 designs any day, and I wish there weren't any fanservicey outfits at all, but come on, the official designs aren't as terrible as some people make them out to be. The in-game models are a complete different story though, unfortunately...

[BrightBow]

Because you can have the children do stuff like inherit 2 Rally Skills and instantly have a unit that can boost your already strong parent units without using up two of their turns?I think it's pretty good because through this games skill system it can potentially break the tradition that within just the main story line a units worth isn't almost entirely based on their stats.

I'd argue that for the inheritance of skills alone the children characters are more useful than similar low level later joining characters(e.g. Est,Marisa,Miranda,Wendy and a great deal of FE12 characters) in other Fire Emblem games. Would you disagree?

Additionally due the childrens base stats being based on the parents, if some of the parents are your above average units based on everyone you're using, The children can potentially join up with similar stats to the average units you're using but with the lower level and faster leveling of being a 10 unpromoted unit.

Being potential rally bots in a few very specific builds is a bit meager for me to justify their existence.

But yeah, I probably underestimate them because I didn't get anyone but Morgan in a a decent amount of time. Not to mention that normal mode exists.

But personally I would guess that they are less useful then late joiners in other games because enemy stats in this game are just so much higher.

For a weak unit in this game, it's difficult to even damage an enemy. And it's difficult not to die in one blow because everything doubles you.

And even if they can, having allies weaken enemies for them, rarely works because double attacks and skills keep kicking in to screw over your calculations.

Edited June 9, 2013 by BrightBow

[The Void]

I mean, I agree that the females in FE13 are terrible compared to the rest of the series (especially the amazing designs in FE9/FE10)

Not sure if you're serious.

[BrightBow]

Not sure if you're serious.

Even those two cherry picked examples don't compare much to the majority of the Awakening art.

Speaking off FE9/10, while they had it's fair share of mini skirts and stuff, I remember that the camera there at least didn't align itself in such a fashion that you could see the color of their panties every time they charged forward to snuff out the live of some poor schmuck, unlike a certain other game.

[arvilino]

Being potential rally bots in a few very specific builds is a bit meager for me to justify their existence.

But yeah, I probably underestimate them because I didn't get anyone but Morgan in a a decent amount of time. Not to mention that normal mode exists.

But personally I would guess that they are less useful then late joiners in other games because enemy stats in this game are just so much higher.

For a weak unit in this game, it's difficult to even damage an enemy. And it's difficult not to die in one blow because everything doubles you.

And even if they can, having allies weaken enemies for them, rarely works because double attacks and skills keep kicking in to screw over your calculations.

It's not impossible to be useful even if a character dies in one hit. I had 10/1 Morgan as a Sage who'd die in one hit, but C-rank Staves(Physic, Rescue, Ward) and Rally Spectrum and Rally Magic made her pretty useful. Even if there are very specific builds these characters can still be used without favoritism to better use via pair up even if it's for skills like Anathema or movement as a flying unit and pair up stat bonuses.

Being able to make significant contributions and especially things other units are likely not to replicate easily(two Rallies) like that regardless of stats makes them better than some of the mid/late joiners in the other games who for the most part do what another unit can but much,much worse to the point there's no unique reason to field them.

Also personally it's something I wanted IS to do in Fire Emblem for a long time. Make it so that a units usefulness isn't almost entirely centered around their stats.

Edited June 9, 2013 by arvilino

[BrightBow]

I assume you're talking about fanservice (just ignore me if you're not), in which case, what's wrong with Lissa, Maribelle, the pegasus knights (since skirt+thigh high is a standard for pegasus knights, except in FE5/9/10), Miriel, Anna, Say'ri, Flavia, Female!Robin and literally every Second Gen female character (okay, Noire's cleavage is dumb, but at least she's wearing pants)?

I mean, I agree that the females in FE13 are terrible compared to the rest of the series (especially the amazing designs in FE9/FE10), but people act like every single female character is a walking pile of fanservice, when it's actually just a few of them. Honestly... I'd say only Nowi's and Cherche's outfits are inexcusable. Olivia is half naked, but almost every dancer in the series is, and at least she's not a little girl unlike Sylvia, Feena, Leen and Lalam; Panne is half naked too, but so is Yarne; Tharja wears a see-through outfit, but that's the default outfit for dark mages, both male and female (then again, Henry is wearing a shirt...). I mean, the fanservice is still dumb, but at least it's equal opportunity in most cases.

Of course, this is just talking about official designs; when it comes to the actual game, most females look freaking ridiculous. Why the hell would you wear nothing over your damn panties when riding on a horse (it's really outrageous when you compare Cherche to Gerome)? Why do female assassins show massive cleavage? Why is every female design so damn fanservicey when compared to their male counterparts?

I mean, I'll take FE9/10 designs over FE13 designs any day, and I wish there weren't any fanservicey outfits at all, but come on, the official designs aren't as terrible as some people make them out to be. The in-game models are a complete different story though, unfortunately...

Well, it's partly my issue.

What I think is more important, is that their design is often at odds with their character.

Sully for example, is all macho. She has to be responsible for like 75% of curse words in the game, wants to be better then her male counterparts, constantly goes on how she is not interested in "lady stuff", etc...

Yet for some reason, she is wearing a revealing custom uniform. One that just so happens to make her look like she is wearing knee length stockings and lady gloves.

I don't see how it fits with her character, that she would risk her life just to come across as more feminine.

And because of that, I actually have more issues with Olivia then I have with Sylvia.

Because being an entertainer and not being able to endure people's looks don't go well together at all.

While on the other hand, Sylvia is always enthusiastic about dancing in her underwear and seems to enjoy expressing herself that way.

Of course, if she was in a cast were every woman was running around in their underwear, I wouldn't let that excuse slide.

But more then anything, when I made that statement, I actually had the promotional art in mind. And not all things that apply to them are relevant to the art that's actually in the game.

The art between the male and female characters is fundamentally different. The male characters have universally very expressive poses and facial expressions.

The female characters can be lucky if they get even one of those things.

A lot of those faces can be described as dull surprise. But even if they do have an actual face, it doesn't necessary express their character.

For example in Cordelia's art, I don't see any expression in her body language. Her body bends in the most nonsensical way possible and at the risk of tripping or penetrating herself on her own lance.

On her face, she has an absolutely maniacal grin. That is an expression but not one that matches her portrayal in the game.

I was surprised to see her crying when she was first seen and that she was mostly defined around being skilled, professional and having a crush on Chrom, rather then something like, let's say a female Ashnard.

Edited June 9, 2013 by BrightBow

[Chiki]

I agree with the review. The designs are pretty lame. This game doesn't deserve to be called a Fire Emblem game, but at least it's fun to play.

Edited June 9, 2013 by Chiki

[The Void]

Even those two cherry picked examples don't compare much to the majority of the Awakening art.

I'm sure you can explain that in enough detail. Cuz' I'm not sure how a miniskirt is better than what the Pegasus Knights wear.

Disregarding the SpotPass characters, the playable women in this game who don't wear pants or at least fully cover themselves enough that there isn't any visible skin from the waste down in Awakening are the Pegasus Knights (and other PKs like the ones in Elibe weren't much better even if you pretend otherwise), Nowi, Nah, Sully, Panne (and Lethe fought in short shorts so meh), Olivia (who is a dancer), Say'ri (Lyn was just as bad), Flavia, and Tiki.

Lissa (wears more than Mist), Maribelle (ditto), Miriel (actually wears pants unlike Ilyana), Tharja, Anna, Cherche, Lucina, Kjelle, Severa, and Noire actually dress as such. That would be 10 women out of 21.

Speaking off FE9/10, while they had it's fair share of mini skirts and stuff, I remember that the camera there at least didn't align itself in such a fashion that you could see the color of their panties every time they charged forward to snuff out the live of some poor schmuck, unlike a certain other game.

No instead you could you see what's under Ilyana's skirt when she casts spells in PoR.

Edited June 9, 2013 by The Void

[Constable Reggie]

Even as a dancer, Olivia's outfit is ridiculous, especially if you add her "personality" (hahahaha if you can call it that) to the mix.