NFL 2013-2014 Season!

[Anacybele]

Yes, Raven, go Panthers! For once we agree. lol

Also, I learned that the Steelers fired their o-line coordinator. I like this, now we'll hopefully see even more improvement here with a better coordinator next season. Haley is staying though, but I actually don't mind because of how he and Ben finally sorted out their problems.

Unfortunately, Sanders and Cotchery are free agents now. I wanted them to stay, these guys alongside Antonio Brown ripped defenses to shreds. :(

[ClevelandSteve]

I'd like to see the 49ers win because, as I said earlier, Phil Dawson put in fourteen years on the Browns, many of them as the only good player we had, only to get shafted. He deserves a ring. I'd also like to see the Seahawks win, since, as I also said earlier, I don't like the Saints. I hope the Chargers pull the upset on the Broncos, mainly because of all the times the Broncos beat the Browns in the playoffs in the 80s (Yes, I hold grudges based on things that happened before I was born).

The Colts vs. Patriots game is a tough one. Obviously, the Colts losing would help the Browns due to us holding their first round pick. However, I don't like the Patriots and want to see them fail (I was in middle & high school throughout most of the prime years of the Patriots last decade, and there were a bunch of bandwagon fans in my school who got on my nerves. Also, Tom Brady went to Michigan).

Edit: Also, I was reading some Browns news and saw that the Vikings were planning on interviewing our defensive coordinator Ray Horton for their head coaching job. Losing either of our coordinators would be terrible for the Browns, so I think Banner needs to offer Horton a promotion to head coach ASAP. The only problem then will be finding someone to fill Horton's old job as defensive coordinator (or if someone starts trying to recruit Norv Turner, although his less-than-stellar head coaching record might dissuade teams from doing that).

Edited January 7, 2014 by ClevelandSteve

[Anacybele]

Oh yeah, I just now saw this on the Steeler website. I apologize for bringing this up again, but proof that Antonio Brown is a wicked receiver:

The only player in NFL history to catch at least five passes for at least 50 yards in each game of a 16-game season is Antonio Brown. Being a player opposing defense cannot take out of a game is the definition of a No. 1 receiver.

SO true. Not even one of the guys that shut down AJ Green could take this guy out of the equation. And Calvin Johnson was practically nonexistent in the second half of Steelers vs Lions. But Brown wasn't. He runs circles around defenders. It's not so much the number of receiving yards or receptions he's gotten, it's more about why he got them in the first place. Because he got himself open enough times to catch the ball and run!

Edited January 7, 2014 by Anacybele

[Lord Raven]

He was also able to get those receptions early on in garbage time and later on cause there were others to throw to in order to spread the field. I also have no idea why but Corey Graham was covering Antonio Brown a lot so that explains that... And Corey Graham leads our team in interceptions cause he's targeted pretty heavily because he's really not that great (but I love him for the two picks in the playoffs last year, if you ever need a random pick you go for Corey Graham).

Calvin was nonexistent in the second half of the Steelers game cause the Lions were on the verge of a 6 game losing streak at that point due to poor coaching, playcalling, and everything in general from the QB position. AJ Green also has a very shoddy QB throwing to him if you haven't seen the Bengals all season.

I personally believe Ben makes Brown look better than he is, to some extent. Megatron and Stafford (and Bush) almost have to carry their teams and Brown doesn't have this burden. The Bengals receivers make Dalton look above average at times. Remember that Wallace looked really good for a while then shit the bed in Miami. Brown doesn't have Wallace to split receptions with anymore which is a key difference from last year too.

(Yes, I hold grudges based on things that happened before I was born).

I still don't see the point. I don't hate the Colts, and their leaving Baltimore was much much much worse than Cleveland no matter what excuse you try to make to counter that. You guys saw it coming a while before, you guys got your history back, and you guys got a team 3 years later. The Ravens aren't officially credited with winning the 1958/1959 NFL Championships nor Super Bowl 5 nor the Super Bowl 3 appearance, we don't have Johnny Unitas and Raymond Berry and Bubba Smith and all of their achievements in our history, and Baltimore had no football team for 11 years. And Baltimore football for the 70s, 80s, and the 90s were all terrible. And Baltimore had to deal with scumbag Bob fucking Irsay as an owner for 15 years, which is nowhere near as bad as Art Modell as much as the Browns love to say otherwise. And Baltimore had to see the Colts get wrecked to such a state that the #1 overall pick almost played baseball because he didn't want to be drafted by the Colts. Cleveland has absolutely nothing on the crap Baltimore had to go through before being rewarded with an actually well run and great franchise. On top of that, when we talk of the Browns coming into the league for the first time, it's pretty much as the team sending a middle finger to the NFL and then joining them, and becoming more or less a dynasty - pretty badass. The way the Colts left Baltimore and the way the Ravens entered Baltimore were all terrible, terrible stories. The way the Browns left and were promised a team 3 years later is nothing on that.

Edit: Also, I was reading some Browns news and saw that the Vikings were planning on interviewing our defensive coordinator Ray Horton for their head coaching job. Losing either of our coordinators would be terrible for the Browns, so I think Banner needs to offer Horton a promotion to head coach ASAP. The only problem then will be finding someone to fill Horton's old job as defensive coordinator (or if someone starts trying to recruit Norv Turner, although his less-than-stellar head coaching record might dissuade teams from doing that).

From what I understand both coordinators are leaving due to disillusionment with the front office. I also get the feeling that the FO and Chud didn't see eye-to-eye much, which is why the HC got the axe. It doesn't help that the FO didn't choose the HC; the HC was chosen before the GM. Haslam and Lombardi are turning the franchise around, and in all fairness the Browns lost quite a few close games (and had other games where they could not deliver anywhere near as much as they should've with Jason Campbell basically being a dink-and-dunk game manager).

As for Norv, he's definitely not getting an HC gig for a while. But he also better not come to Baltimore, because he'll basically implement the same Air Coryell system as Caldwell and our o-line is in shambles right now unless we find a good center. We also need to make sure Eugene Monroe wants to come back to Baltimore, we can find a serviceable Right Tackle, and Kelechi Osemele's back heals. Can't afford long developing plays if our oline isn't working, and Caldwell was awful at changing the gameplan up as a result of our oline being made of that wax paper shit that breaks when you tap it.

Edited January 7, 2014 by Lord Raven

[Jiac]

Everyone wants to see Manning vs Brady for AFC Championship. I wouldn't mind it,to see who is truly the better quarterback. Rivers vs Brady who is the better passer. But honestly,for Super Bowl 48 I really REALLY want to see these match-ups:

Chargers vs Saints:

Newer Chargers Quarterback vs Former Chargers Quarterback

Broncos vs Seahawks:

Wilson vs Manning,the clash of the no.1 seeds.

Chargers vs 49ers:

Will history repeat itself?Super Bowl 29,Chargers 26,49ers 49, or will Chargers trail this game and win their first official Super Bowl.

Saints vs Colts:

Another history repeats itself type feeling. 4 years ago,Saints dominating the Colts 31-17.Will it be different with the loss of Peyton Manning? Or does Andrew Luck's last name speak for itself.

Colts vs Saints:

2 teams that barely won their Wild Card games,how they'd perform is unknown to me,making it a very unusual match-up.

Super Bowl Match-ups I wished or would wish to see:

Bengals vs Cowboys

Romo vs Dalton would be the best and funniest Super Bowl game that you'll probably ever see. I would expect 10 INT minimum and 5 fumbles maximum from both teams. The clumsiest Super Bowl in history.

Giants vs Broncos

I want to see true brotherly rivalry,either way Peyton will leave Eli in a ditch somewhere when the game ends.

Steelers vs Eagles

Two teams who were eliminated from the play offs,the latter being a runner up,were teams that are highly expected to win the Super Bowl.This would be a fun match up to watch.

Anyways this is my way to steam off Super Bowl excitement so sorry for the huge amount of postings that have 0 point in them

[Anacybele]

Lol Steelers vs Eagles would also be known as the Pennsylvania Bowl.

[ClevelandSteve]

I still don't see the point. I don't hate the Colts, and their leaving Baltimore was much much much worse than Cleveland no matter what excuse you try to make to counter that. You guys saw it coming a while before, you guys got your history back, and you guys got a team 3 years later. The Ravens aren't officially credited with winning the 1958/1959 NFL Championships nor Super Bowl 5 nor the Super Bowl 3 appearance, we don't have Johnny Unitas and Raymond Berry and Bubba Smith and all of their achievements in our history, and Baltimore had no football team for 11 years. And Baltimore football for the 70s, 80s, and the 90s were all terrible. And Baltimore had to deal with scumbag Bob fucking Irsay as an owner for 15 years, which is nowhere near as bad as Art Modell as much as the Browns love to say otherwise. And Baltimore had to see the Colts get wrecked to such a state that the #1 overall pick almost played baseball because he didn't want to be drafted by the Colts. Cleveland has absolutely nothing on the crap Baltimore had to go through before being rewarded with an actually well run and great franchise. On top of that, when we talk of the Browns coming into the league for the first time, it's pretty much as the team sending a middle finger to the NFL and then joining them, and becoming more or less a dynasty - pretty badass. The way the Colts left Baltimore and the way the Ravens entered Baltimore were all terrible, terrible stories. The way the Browns left and were promised a team 3 years later is nothing on that.

First of all, I was referring to wanting the Broncos to lose due to them beating the Browns various times in the playoffs during the 80s. My comment had nothing to do with the Ravens. I was already born (albeit four years old) when the Browns moved to Baltimore.

Secondly, one of the first things Art Modell did as owner of the Browns was fire Paul Brown, possibly the greatest coach in NFL history and the guy the fucking team was named after. Following the firing, we won just one more championship in 1964 and then never again.

Super Bowl Match-ups I wished or would wish to see:

Bengals vs Cowboys

Romo vs Dalton would be the best and funniest Super Bowl game that you'll probably ever see. I would expect 10 INT minimum and 5 fumbles maximum from both teams. The clumsiest Super Bowl in history.

Giants vs Broncos

I want to see true brotherly rivalry,either way Peyton will leave Eli in a ditch somewhere when the game ends.

Steelers vs Eagles

Two teams who were eliminated from the play offs,the latter being a runner up,were teams that are highly expected to win the Super Bowl.This would be a fun match up to watch.

Anyways this is my way to steam off Super Bowl excitement so sorry for the huge amount of postings that have 0 point in them

I agree on the Peyton vs. Eli Bowl. The matchup I'd really like to see, though, is Browns vs. Lions.

Or Browns vs. Anyone (Except maybe Browns vs. Packers. I don't think my sister's marriage could survive that )

[Da Bear]

Fun fact; the three teams still in the AFC playoffs are also the three teams that beat the Broncos in the regular season.

[Lord Raven]

I can't be the only one that doesn't care for Peyton vs Eli. Eli's a pick machine year in and year out and the defense has carried the Giants to the Super Bowls (but Eli has played out of his mind), whereas Peyton's fun to watch.

[Anacybele]

He was also able to get those receptions early on in garbage time and later on cause there were others to throw to in order to spread the field. I also have no idea why but Corey Graham was covering Antonio Brown a lot so that explains that... And Corey Graham leads our team in interceptions cause he's targeted pretty heavily because he's really not that great (but I love him for the two picks in the playoffs last year, if you ever need a random pick you go for Corey Graham).

Calvin was nonexistent in the second half of the Steelers game cause the Lions were on the verge of a 6 game losing streak at that point due to poor coaching, playcalling, and everything in general from the QB position. AJ Green also has a very shoddy QB throwing to him if you haven't seen the Bengals all season.

I personally believe Ben makes Brown look better than he is, to some extent. Megatron and Stafford (and Bush) almost have to carry their teams and Brown doesn't have this burden. The Bengals receivers make Dalton look above average at times. Remember that Wallace looked really good for a while then shit the bed in Miami. Brown doesn't have Wallace to split receptions with anymore which is a key difference from last year too.

Sorry for not responding sooner, I didn't have time to type up a long post. xP

Anyway, you're right, Ben did help Brown. But the thing is, a receiver can't shine unless a good quarterback is there to put the ball in his hands in the first place. And Ben is the best the Steelers have had since Terry Bradshaw in the 70s. And then there's being able to get open as well as run and break tackles. Brown can do all of this and more.

Calvin Johnson was easily taken out of the picture in Steelers vs Lions. He can probably carry his team as you say, but not if he can't get open and he's got a defender all over him. Brown can move around quickly and get away from defenders trying to cover him, as he's shown many times over, even earlier in the season. Brown was the only good thing happening on offense during the 0-4 period. He would have carried the team if the o-line didn't shit the fan so many times. Ben just never had enough time to properly get rid of the ball, he and Haley kept disagreeing, and he didn't have Miller or Bell to use yet (because they were hurt). Sanders and Cotchery also weren't producing yet.

But after the team got their crap together, Brown DID have Sanders and Cotchery to compete with. Cotchery is a redzone guy like you said earlier and Sanders has speed on his side. Yet Brown still got most of the carries. He even got more than Miller, who is actually Ben's favorite target, they say.

On another topic, guys, am I the only person here that's a Panthers fan and wants to see them in the SB? D: I want to see Pey-Pey vs Cam Newton so bad now. They're my two favorite QBs besides Ben!

Edited January 7, 2014 by Anacybele

[Mr. Haar]

Yeah because Green Bay's foundation sucks. If losing Rodgers and having the team almost selfdestruct didn't teach the front office (or whatever the fuck they do) and the coaching staff anything it's that they may very well be looking at another 2011 Colts if he goes down for any reason.

In this case foundation = defense. They were just abysmal. I think that should be priority #1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 and 11 this offseason, starting with the scheme.

[Jedi]

I believe with my Cardinals having one of their best seasons. We should keep our team as is and focus on drafting linesmen for our QBs. Palmer got hit hard this season. Even some minor injuries. Yet we managed to beat the Seahawks so I don't think our front line is bad by any means. They just need a little adjusting.

[Lord Raven]

Anyway, you're right, Ben did help Brown. But the thing is, a receiver can't shine unless a good quarterback is there to put the ball in his hands in the first place.

Unless you're Josh Gordon lmao (this wasn't a slight at you or a counterargument, this is just sad but true, I think Josh Gordon has the most receiving yards in the league because he's far and above the best WR on the Browns).

Calvin Johnson was easily taken out of the picture in Steelers vs Lions. He can probably carry his team as you say, but not if he can't get open and he's got a defender all over him. Brown can move around quickly and get away from defenders trying to cover him, as he's shown many times over, even earlier in the season. Brown was the only good thing happening on offense during the 0-4 period. He would have carried the team if the o-line didn't shit the fan so many times. Ben just never had enough time to properly get rid of the ball, he and Haley kept disagreeing, and he didn't have Miller or Bell to use yet (because they were hurt). Sanders and Cotchery also weren't producing yet.

Once again,

- Calvin Johnson is never easily taken out of the picture, it was probably closer to Stafford being taken out of the picture and trying to spread the ball around more, but the other receivers on that team are head and shoulders below what most teams have to deal with. I don't know where you're going with that either, because there's no way Brown is anywhere near as great as Megatron, and Megatron's been able to make leaping catches in triple coverage before. If there's a single receiver who is fit to take a Hail Mary pass, it's Calvin Johnson. You can google tons of pictures of him triple covered and making a catch. He is never easily taken out of the picture but he is also not the only person that is targeted on the Lions. He also played this year with a ton of injuries.

- Calvin Johnson has also survived the onslaught of 3 Bengals defenders covering him. There are many instances where he just had to jump and bring it down to catch it, while three Bengals DBs weren't able to stop him despite being right in his face.

- Brown was just about the only receiver healthy for all 16 games. Cotchery was also used for more goalline stuff and it seemed like third downs, and then Emmanuel Sanders is kind of mediocre. Brown isn't great because he got so many receptions early, he got a lot of production because he was generally the only quality receiver early on. Think Calvin Johnson, except without Reggie Bush to do anything with early on (which is comparable to Le'Veon Bell not being there).

- Receivers don't tend to move around quickly and get open, they tend to run routes and depending on either the speed or the quality of the route running (meaning say they're trying to run a fade, if they can sell the fact that they're running a slant through the middle instead of a fade by the point where a slant and fade diverge, then they can successfully beat coverage). Improvisation tends to happen when the play busts, but he's open because he can beat coverage because that's what all #1 receivers exist to do. It just so happens that the Z and slot receivers are mediocre and the tight end was out for a while, with an unreliable running back, so once again he was generally the only guy to throw to early on.

- The secondaries the Steelers faced were pretty bad. Early on Brown got like 450-500 receiving yards in 4 games by virtue of garbage time, meaning the opponent was playing a prevent defense which allows receptions but blocks off all deep zones and the edges so the team wastes clock (and the receiver situation). He put up 55 yards on average against the Ravens despite being covered by Corey Graham, who is our nickel corner. He torched Buffalo, Green Bay, Detroit, Cleveland, Oakland and Miami - who have terrible secondaries (well the browns have Joe Haden but he's one man).

Sanders is known as a jack-of-all trades type who is decent at a lot of things but looks better cause of quarterback and lack of competition for receptions.

But after the team got their crap together, Brown DID have Sanders and Cotchery to compete with. Cotchery is a redzone guy like you said earlier and Sanders has speed on his side. Yet Brown still got most of the carries. He even got more than Miller, who is actually Ben's favorite target, they say.

WRs will mostly get more receptions, targets, yards, and TDs than Tight Ends. I think the only TEs that have ever really gotten more than their fellow WRs were the all time greats, like Tony Gonzalez, Shannon Sharpe, Ozzie Newsome, etc. TEs are also a QBs best friend because they're a matchup nightmare, and Miller also didn't seem like he played every snap in a lot of games.

For the record, Dennis Pitta was one of Flacco's favorite targets last year yet he got around 650 yards, whereas the other receivers eclipsed that by far. Same with Todd Heap and Flacco. Most above average TEs only tend to get 600-700 on the season and not as many targets as WRs, so that doesn't say anything about Brown aside from the fact that Miller is a TE and Brown is their X receiver.

Also yeah Im excited to see Cam play DB against Manning too, same with Rivers/Manning/Brady playing DB against Rivers/Manning/Brady (oh you get the joke)

In this case foundation = defense. They were just abysmal. I think that should be priority #1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 and 11 this offseason, starting with the scheme.

And I don't think the backups fit the scheme in any way, shape, or form either (once again - 2011 Colts had a really complex offense too, and the backups were Curtis Painter, and Dan Orlovsky/Kerry Collins signed off the streets). They definitely need a mini-Rodgers as a backup, because that offensive line does not fit any of the backup QBs except for Rodgers. Edited January 7, 2014 by Lord Raven

[Anacybele]

Unless you're Josh Gordon lmao (this wasn't a slight at you or a counterargument, this is just sad but true, I think Josh Gordon has the most receiving yards in the league because he's far and above the best WR on the Browns).

Once again,

- Calvin Johnson is never easily taken out of the picture, it was probably closer to Stafford being taken out of the picture and trying to spread the ball around more, but the other receivers on that team are head and shoulders below what most teams have to deal with. I don't know where you're going with that either, because there's no way Brown is anywhere near as great as Megatron, and Megatron's been able to make leaping catches in triple coverage before. If there's a single receiver who is fit to take a Hail Mary pass, it's Calvin Johnson. You can google tons of pictures of him triple covered and making a catch. He is never easily taken out of the picture but he is also not the only person that is targeted on the Lions. He also played this year with a ton of injuries.

- Calvin Johnson has also survived the onslaught of 3 Bengals defenders covering him. There are many instances where he just had to jump and bring it down to catch it, while three Bengals DBs weren't able to stop him despite being right in his face.

- Brown was just about the only receiver healthy for all 16 games. Cotchery was also used for more goalline stuff and it seemed like third downs, and then Emmanuel Sanders is kind of mediocre. Brown isn't great because he got so many receptions early, he got a lot of production because he was generally the only quality receiver early on. Think Calvin Johnson, except without Reggie Bush to do anything with early on (which is comparable to Le'Veon Bell not being there).

- Receivers don't tend to move around quickly and get open, they tend to run routes and depending on either the speed or the quality of the route running (meaning say they're trying to run a fade, if they can sell the fact that they're running a slant through the middle instead of a fade by the point where a slant and fade diverge, then they can successfully beat coverage). Improvisation tends to happen when the play busts, but he's open because he can beat coverage because that's what all #1 receivers exist to do. It just so happens that the Z and slot receivers are mediocre and the tight end was out for a while, with an unreliable running back, so once again he was generally the only guy to throw to early on.

- The secondaries the Steelers faced were pretty bad. Early on Brown got like 450-500 receiving yards in 4 games by virtue of garbage time, meaning the opponent was playing a prevent defense which allows receptions but blocks off all deep zones and the edges so the team wastes clock (and the receiver situation). He put up 55 yards on average against the Ravens despite being covered by Corey Graham, who is our nickel corner. He torched Buffalo, Green Bay, Detroit, Cleveland, Oakland and Miami - who have terrible secondaries (well the browns have Joe Haden but he's one man).

Did you forget that Brown can make sick one-handed catches in the corners of endzones while being covered at the same time? He can definitely catch a ball as well as Johnson can. I feel that Brown could get a Hail Mary pass too. I also think Brown is much faster. Johnson is a huge guy, it should be easy for him to make high-jumping catches while defenders are nearby, but his bulk would slow him down. Brown isn't that big, Ben towers over him. So being able to catch balls the way he does is real talent and then he has great speed to tack on the end of that.

Sanders was only out for like one game. I don't remember Cotchery being hurt.

The Steelers did face some pretty bad defenses, but Brown seemed to torch defenders no matter who they played. They beat the Bengals and Packers, two teams that are in the playoffs right now. And the Bengals are supposed to have a pretty good defense right now, yet they were totally stomped by Pittsburgh in their most recent game.

WRs will mostly get more receptions, targets, yards, and TDs than Tight Ends. I think the only TEs that have ever really gotten more than their fellow WRs were the all time greats, like Tony Gonzalez, Shannon Sharpe, Ozzie Newsome, etc. TEs are also a QBs best friend because they're a matchup nightmare, and Miller also didn't seem like he played every snap in a lot of games.

True, but Miller didn't get as many carries as he normally does. Ben gave more of them to Brown instead.

[Lord Raven]

Did you forget that Brown can make sick one-handed catches in the corners of endzones while being covered at the same time? He can definitely catch a ball as well as Johnson can. I feel that Brown could get a Hail Mary pass too. I also think Brown is much faster. Johnson is a huge guy, it should be easy for him to make high-jumping catches while defenders are nearby, but his bulk would slow him down. Brown isn't that big, Ben towers over him. So being able to catch balls the way he does is real talent and then he has great speed to tack on the end of that.

There are about 10-20 receivers that can do exactly that, and they do it almost weekly. Torrey Smith did it a few times this season and in last year's postseason and he's a merely above average WR.

I didn't want to get it but

Calvin Johnson does shit like that almost every game.

Whole ton of images exist where Calvin Johnson is much much bigger than any other receiver in the league. That's AJ Green, who is much better than Brown. first one is Brown, who you can see is shorter and smaller.

Megatron runs a 4.35 40 and has a vertical leap of 42.5 inches, Antonio Brown runs a 4.56 40 and a vertical jump of 33.5 inches. I don't think you've really seen Megatron play if you're saying that Brown is faster and jumps higher. Brown's measurables are distinctly average for a #1 receiver (Torrey Smith runs faster than him and has just about the same jump distance, for reference). You'd be surprised how little Megatron's bulk slows him down. There's a reason people label him as a freak athlete.

Here's a gif of him taking a slant in triple coverage and taking it to the house:

The DBs can't come anywhere close to catching him, he comes to full stride very quickly, and most importantly he's triple covered and catches more or less an almost impossible catch in heavy traffic.

Brown's measurables are also comparable to the DBs that would be covering him in a Hail Mary scenario. Johnson could jump around another foot HIGHER than them. Given a Hail Mary scenario, I would take Megatron ALONE over literally every single receiver in NFL history. His one handed catches aren't even that impressive. Randy Moss has caught a ball with his fingers, most receivers tend to take it into their body but moss just caught it one handed with his fingers and he did that almost every other game (and Moss also ran a 4.24 40 and had a high vertical leap - almost impossible to cover but he wasn't a monster like Calvin Johnson).

Sanders was only out for like one game. I don't remember Cotchery being hurt.

Then I think a lot of it was defense being in the nickel and Brown having the best YAC ability of the three receivers so it would be easier to get him the ball and have him get yards in garbage time. When Le'Veon Bell emerged it opened up the game about as much as Reggie Bush did to the Lions (which is huge).

The Steelers did face some pretty bad defenses, but Brown seemed to torch defenders no matter who they played. They beat the Bengals and Packers, two teams that are in the playoffs right now. And the Bengals are supposed to have a pretty good defense right now, yet they were totally stomped by Pittsburgh in their most recent game.

That Bengals offense and special teams got pounded to oblivion. The Steelers offense had maybe one or two long drives. Brown also didn't have more than like 80 receiving yards against the Bengals either, and I don't think Ben even threw it that much. To say the Bengals were torched is severely underestimating the defense.

True, but Miller didn't get as many carries as he normally does. Ben gave more of them to Brown instead.

Miller got close to his career average. Last year was an anomaly due to backup QBs loving to check down to TEs a lot due to the fact that a TE is almost always a guaranteed reception, but he tends to average around 600 a year which is what Miller roughly got.

Packers were an incredibly shitty team that limped into the playoffs, which is something we have been talking about in this thread which you would see if you didn't hype every Steelers player who produced at the level they were expected. The Packers were 8-7-1 and the Steelers beat the Packers while they were a crappy team - by only 7 points too. They didn't have Aaron Rodgers, only the WRs and Lacy. Aaron Rodgers is the reason they went 8-7-1 instead of 7-8-1 because he came back for the regular season finale and managed to play incredible. But because the team was so bad and the defense was terrible they lost a playoff game just recently.

The Bengals offense was god awful in the recent playoff game and the game against the Steelers, and if there's any one reason the Bengals sucked it was because of Andy Dalton (and in the Steelers game the Special Teams). I don't normally blame QBs on losses but Andy Dalton laid a huge turd for everyone to see on primetime many times in his career, especially on primetime, by throwing incredibly boneheaded picks, scrambling and fumbling, and making absolutely horrible throws. (Makes me sad he broke Palmer's franchise record of TDs thrown, because Palmer was on fire when he broke that record, and he recorded half the interceptions).

The Steelers, Panthers, Dolphins, and Pey-pey aren't the only teams in the NFL Ana, and they are not even in the playoffs so they are largely irrelevant. They were never in the playoffs either, and it's much more relevant to talk about this past weekend's playoff games than the Steelers. I haven't even talked much about the Ravens except to rebut your points.

Edited January 7, 2014 by Lord Raven

[Randa]

Did you forget that Brown can make sick one-handed catches in the corners of endzones while being covered at the same time? He can definitely catch a ball as well as Johnson can. I feel that Brown could get a Hail Mary pass too. I also think Brown is much faster. Johnson is a huge guy, it should be easy for him to make high-jumping catches while defenders are nearby, but his bulk would slow him down. Brown isn't that big, Ben towers over him. So being able to catch balls the way he does is real talent and then he has great speed to tack on the end of that.

The Steelers did face some pretty bad defenses, but Brown seemed to torch defenders no matter who they played. They beat the Bengals and Packers, two teams that are in the playoffs right now. And the Bengals are supposed to have a pretty good defense right now, yet they were totally stomped by Pittsburgh in their most recent game.

.

For the not bolded stuff: making fancy and acrobatic catches is what all pro recievers should be capable of. And you can't compare brown on any level to Johnson. Megaton is one of the biggest recievers and also happens to be extremely fast. Have you watched any lions games. He is under double or triple coverage all game and still post better numbers than anybody else.

And at the bolded: neither team is in the playoffs right now. They both got knocked. Cincy got crushed the second half with holes everywhere. Their secondary and line backing core are very inconsistent.

[Anacybele]

Well, they WERE in the playoffs, my bad.

[Lord Raven]

Crappy teams have made (and even won in) the playoffs before

[Anacybele]

I doubt it happens often. And I wouldn't say either the Packers or Bengals were crappy this season. The Bengals did get a pretty good record. The Packers wouldn't have been as bad if they hadn't lost Rodgers.

[Lord Raven]

Packers defense was horrible after the midpoint of the season. A receiver torching them is nothing out of the ordinary.

[Anacybele]

Oh yeah, and Pey-Pey IS still in the playoffs. :/

Look, I'd love to debate with you, but I don't feel like responding to multiple insanely long posts and I can't do gifs (I don't have the programming for it) or anything, so I'm just going to stop here.

Edited January 7, 2014 by Anacybele

[Jiac]

Oh yeah, and Pey-Pey IS still in the playoffs. :/

Look, I'd love to debate with you, but I don't feel like responding to multiple insanely long posts and I can't do gifs (I don't have the programming for it) or anything, so I'm just going to stop here.

Pey-Pey will be covered and be intercepted by Ingram or Weddle,sacked by T'eo.

[Lord Raven]

Oh yeah, and Pey-Pey IS still in the playoffs. :/

Look, I'd love to debate with you, but I don't feel like responding to multiple insanely long posts and I can't do gifs (I don't have the programming for it) or anything, so I'm just going to stop here.

My .gifs are all from google and through my (actually pretty good) recall memory of plays I've seen. But at any rate, I think you understand what tier of receiver Brown is in compared to the top 10-15 of today let alone all time. I'd say that Brown is like a slightly lesser Jordy Nelson; same measurables, but Jordy has a better time beating coverage and catching throws in traffic.

[Anacybele]

Yes, he's a top tier receiver. I'm not saying he's the best ever or the best currently. Only that he's better than a majority of the NFL's starting receviers, generally.

[Lord Raven]

He's not a Top tier receiver, he's a Tier 2 receiver (above average, but not elite)