PAIRINGS The Pairing Thread

[Emerald Ink]

Huh, I didn't realize Berserker was so good. I'll have to give them more of a shot. So I'd basically be looking at Berserker Fred!Yarne with Luna, Swordbreaker, Axefaire, Dual Guard +, and Quick Burn in the support position? With Vaike!Gerome as a Berserker as well? And they would go in the support position, not the lead.

I'm not dedicated to using Virion as a dad, I was mostly just curious to see if he was actually a decent dad for anyone while I played around with some ideas for other characters (mostly to see if I could still viably use one of Gaius' kids not named Noire or Kjelle, since I don't care for his supports convos with their moms, but such is life). I also didn't realize Sumia was better than Stahl!Severa on her own - I've seen some impressive stat calcs for that Severa (admittedly, they were pure physical sets, so probably not as suited to postgame stuff), and was pretty curious. But if Sumia's just all around better, I'd rather use her.

Thank you guys for being so patient. I'm sorry if I'm getting annoying, but you've been a lot of help :)

[Airship Canon]

Virion is good for people who don't care at all about their fathers, or Severa [who sorta does].

Basically Brady, Nah, Yarne and Severa.

Brady is completely unscrewable, using only mods.

Nah is nigh-unscrewable for magic hard support, and can potentially run physical. [in fact actually, I'm partially up there to say that Nah's best father for support, may in fact, be Virion. LB/TF/MAG+2/All+2/SKL+2. (67 MAG, 59 SKL; With Rallies/tonic, that's 90 ATK, 71 SKL, granting 9 MAG/7 SKL/7 RES pair up.)]

Yarne is unscrewable for physical support.

Severa... is a special case. Basically, Virion!Severa can roll Dark Flier pretty damn well, gaining Tomefaire. She already has Vengeance, which can be used as a normal proc. [You don't actually need Vantage to work with it- that just works really well. Just stage some incoming damage and use it as a 100% reliable beatstick on Player Phase.] She can also run Sage, if that's a more suitable forte.

And she can breaker the heck out of things.

[Emerald Ink]

Hm...that's actually really interesting. I thought that Kellam!Nah was the best when it came to support. Is that as a Manakete?

[HeoandReo]

Been a while since I've posted. Might as well jump in.

Hm...that's actually really interesting. I thought that Kellam!Nah was the best when it came to support. Is that as a Manakete?

The main appeal of Kellam!Nah is mostly for the high defensive mods, but if we're talking support, the main stuff she gets is Great Knight for Dual Guard. (She already gets Sage so Kellam's other main draw is kinda squandered) Kellam also doesn't hurt magic, which is good if you want to do magic support.

As for Thief, it actually has pretty good synergy with Wyvern Rider, with things like Movement +1/Deliverer and Lucky 7/Quick Burn to increase your options a bit. Manakete isn't really that great as a support class imo, but she does get a variety of options to work with anyway.

[BANRYU]

Right, I got my copy of Awakening back and started a new (hard mode) playthrough with the intent of going through the challenge maps and such (maybe not Apotheosis, but I'm trying to plan like I am). Also, I have basically no knowledge of FEA's 'competitive' metagame beyond a loose idea of what classes and abilities are good, if that tells you anything useful… Though I've been trying to read through the older pages of this thread when I have time to get a better grasp on it.

Right now I basically have no plans for pairs at the moment beyond Chrom (Olivia) and Sumia (Henry), and am looking to optimize as much as possible (in terms of Galeforce, and anything else that might be relevant).

Here's what I was thinking for the other kids: (all of these are subject to change, though, so new suggestions are welcome)

- Gaius!Noire

- Donny!Kjelle ^{(< ^ these sound pretty universally like good choices for those two from what I hear)}

- Gregor!Brady Dreadfighter / Ricken!Brady Sage / Virion!Brady

- Ricken!Owain Sage / Libra!Owain

- Vaike!Severa / Stahl!Severa / Lon'qu!Severa

- Stahl!Gerome / Virion!Gerome / Gregor!Gerome

- Kellam!Yarne / Frederick!Yarne

- Lon'qu!Laurent / Gregor!Laurent / Stahl!Laurent / pretty much any other Laurent

- Vaike!Nah / Kellam!Nah / ???

- Lucina!Morgan / Tiki!Morgan / ??? (MU Skill+/Luck-)

_{((I'm partial to Tiki, but if she has nothing to offer Morgan as I suspect then I'm willing to forgo her for practically anyone else))}

I also have no clear ideas on lead VS support roles for anyone save probably Lucina (TBH not sure I understand what constitutes the roles), so I'm open to suggestions there as well.

PS, Are there any dads that are just straight-up better avoid pairing if you have a better option? (Sounds like Virion might be one of them?)

Edited March 13, 2014 by BANRYU

[Airship Canon]

Right, I got my copy of Awakening back and started a new (hard mode) playthrough with the intent of going through the challenge maps and such (maybe not Apotheosis, but I'm trying to plan like I am). Also, I have basically no knowledge of FEA's 'competitive' metagame beyond a loose idea of what classes and abilities are good, if that tells you anything useful… Though I've been trying to read through the older pages of this thread when I have time to get a better grasp on it.

Right now I basically have no plans for pairs at the moment beyond Chrom (Olivia) and Sumia (Henry), and am looking to optimize as much as possible (in terms of Galeforce, and anything else that might be relevant).

Here's what I was thinking for the other kids: (all of these are subject to change, though, so new suggestions are welcome)

- Gaius!Noire

- Donny!Kjelle ^{(< ^ these sound pretty universally like good choices for those two from what I hear)}

- Gregor!Brady Dreadfighter / Ricken!Brady Sage / Virion!Brady

- Ricken!Owain Sage / Libra!Owain

- Vaike!Severa / Stahl!Severa / Lon'qu!Severa

- Stahl!Gerome / Virion!Gerome / Gregor!Gerome

- Kellam!Yarne / Frederick!Yarne

- Lon'qu!Laurent / Gregor!Laurent / Stahl!Laurent / pretty much any other Laurent

- Vaike!Nah / Kellam!Nah / ???

- Lucina!Morgan / Tiki!Morgan / ??? (MU Skill+/Luck-)

_{((I'm partial to Tiki, but if she has nothing to offer Morgan as I suspect then I'm willing to forgo her for practically anyone else))}

I also have no clear ideas on lead VS support roles for anyone save probably Lucina (TBH not sure I understand what constitutes the roles), so I'm open to suggestions there as well.

PS, Are there any dads that are just straight-up better avoid pairing if you have a better option? (Sounds like Virion might be one of them?)

A Lead Unit is a unit that is upfront in a Pair Up.

A Support is a unit that is in the back.

Relatively simple.

A Hard or Pure Support is a unit that does not ever change its position from the back.

As such, units in this role don't use Active Skills. They typically run Auras, or simple Stat+2 skills.

If a unit lacks either Galeforce or BOTH Vengeance and Vantage, it is pretty much best off in this role.

Examples:

Gerome, Yarne, many Nahs, a load of the first Gen.

Guys perform better here than girls thanks to Aggressor. [10x4 > 10x2]

A common misconception is that Hard Supports are useless. This is completely incorrect, as they are a source of a LOT of damage- especially off the Berserkers.

Beyond that the Lead Types:

Sniper: Exactly what it says on the tin- a Sniper. Pretty much needs Actives. They attack from Range 3 to negate any enemy offense potential. Chrom does well in this role rather than that of a Hard Support, despite lacking Galeforce.

Striker/Standard Lead: They are offensively tilted and are the most common combat unit type. Girls run two procs/faire, Guys run proc/agg/faire. Galeforce lets them do their thing and either retreat, bring in another unit, or bring down another foe.

Tank: Runs Vengeance/Vantage mostly. [The other type of tank: Hard or Pure tanks are fairly bad at full build since they offer nothing that pure offense doesn't already in most cases.] They fight on EP. Most any unit can perform the role of tank in terms of pulling a group as a note.

-- Sweeper: A specialized Tank that runs Vengeance/Vantage to sweep the enemy. Sweepers need Negative DEF modifiers, Vengeance, Vantage, and need to be married to either Lucina or Chrom, and must be 100% reliable for what they do.

Then Field Support:

-Staffbot: A Unit that specializes in using Staves and doesn't participate in combat.

-Rallybot: A Unit that specializes in using Rally skills and doesn't participate in combat.

-Dancer: Olivia. Refreshes units.

Virion is notably one of the worst fathers in the game, but has applications in certain areas, like say, Nah, who'd be rolling Sage for Hard Support [Magical]- and as such runs a solid candidate for best father for her in that role. [Ricken and Stahl would be the others- with Virion leading in SKL, which is why she wants Archer, having natural Mage.]

[euklyd]

gogogo summer meta!

- Gaius!Noire
- Donny!Kjelle ^{(< ^ these sound pretty universally like good choices for those two from what I hear)}

These are good.
All Bradys are good, so I'll skip that for now.

- Ricken!Owain Sage / Libra!Owain

Going by Airship Canon's Ricken!Owain is a striker, Libra!Owain a sweeper. Go with whichever you'd rather have.

- Vaike!Severa / Stahl!Severa / Lon'qu!Severa

Stahl!Severa is the standard suggestion (last I checked, which was a while ago), but I prefer Lon'qu!Severa, as Stahl!Severa is basically just a worse version of either Cynthia or Lon'qu!Severa, depending on if you're going for Luna or VV. Also this means you get to use Stahl elsewhere, if needed.

- Stahl!Gerome / Virion!Gerome / Gregor!Gerome

Not Virion definitely. His main draw is the Wyvern tree, and Gerome already has that. I would go with Gregor, since that nets Gerome access to Berserker for Axefaire and MASSIVE STR (also a nice Str mod of +6 or so). (I also like this pairing due to ~bias~ , since it lets me abuse forges and whatnot). Vaike is another solid option, but I'd rather save him for...

- Vaike!Nah / Kellam!Nah / ???

This gets Nah nice Str, which'll be useful for Dual Strikes, and it also lets her oldstyle-tank OKAY with Armsthrift and Sol. Her mods aren't bad either. Kellam!Nah is 2slowIMO.

- Kellam!Yarne / Frederick!Yarne

Go with Fred. Yarne's job is to whack things with an Axe, HARD, and he gets everything he needs this way (a solid Str mod, Axefaire, and Swordbreaker). Your choice for Berserker or Wyvern Lord/Griffon Rider, btw (same for Gerome; the two are very similar).

- Lon'qu!Laurent / Gregor!Laurent / Stahl!Laurent / pretty much any other Laurent

Stahl imhotep. VV is basically Laurent's mission, and Stahl lets him do it. Alternatively, a dad with a nice Mag mod (Ricken, followed by Henry or Libra) will let him serve as a massive magical beatstick.

- Gregor!Brady Dreadfighter / Ricken!Brady Sage / Virion!Brady [/ Libra!Brady]

First off, go with Sage no matter what, imo. Ricken is nice if you're going with Libra!Owain, Libra is nice if you're doing Ricken!Owain. Virion is an okay option for Deliverer.

For Morgan, go with a partner who complements your Avatar. If you marry first-gen, marry someone whose "natural" kid could get Galeforce, imhotep, aka anyone but Miriel, Panne, or Cherche (as cool as she is). There are lots of choices for 2nd-gen; personally, I'd say...
- Noire for Mag and nice Spd;
- Severa for lots of Spd, and pretty good Str, or
- Lucina for some Str, nice Spd, and generally being well-rounded (+Dual Strike).
Of these Lucina has the best hair, followed by Gaius!Noire, imo
Tiki is another okay choice if you really want a Manakete (and cool hair), but Manakete is really niche.
I'd say Lucina > Cordelia > otherchoices, just based on hair color - seriously Morgan is always good, so you can go with whoever you like most. It'd free up a husband if you went 1st-gen, so your pairings might want a bit of revising if you go that route.

I think this has filled up my FE13 Boards quota for the month...

Edited March 13, 2014 by Euklyd

[Airship Canon]

I will point out that Aether is absolutely insane.

On Miiverse, I wound up comparing +MAG/-LCK Olivia!Lucina!Morgan vs +MAG/-LCK Emmeryn!Morgan.

Between them, 77.335 average output by O!L!M vs Emm!M's 69.0246, and Emm's got +4 MAG in her favor [4 for OLM, 8 for Emm!M]

Tiki is another okay choice if you really want a Manakete (and cool hair), but Manakete is really niche.

...Although if Manakete is what you'd want, Nowi is basically exclusively better than Tiki.

Tiki legitimately has an argument for producing one of the worst Morgans.

Manakete's draw is hard tanking, and Nowi yields better stats for that.

Otherwise it's a curse: other classes do things better, and outside of Manakete, Morgan would be getting saddled with a Dragonweakness, while Tiki doesn't perform any better as a wife than Nowi. Not to mention, other characters offer better stats for other purposes.

[euklyd]

...Although if Manakete is what you'd want, Nowi is basically exclusively better than Tiki.

Tiki legitimately has an argument for producing one of the worst Morgans.

Manakete's draw is hard tanking, and Nowi yields better stats for that.

Otherwise it's a curse: other classes do things better, and outside of Manakete, Morgan would be getting saddled with a Dragonweakness, while Tiki doesn't perform any better as a wife than Nowi. Not to mention, other characters offer better stats for other purposes.

Banryu has a preference for Tiki, and Tiki allows him to change his mind to something slightly more useful (imo) when he realizes that Manakete is not actually very good.

If it wasn't clear Tiki is not high on my list.

[BANRYU]

To be fair, I DID ask for optimized/ideal choices, so it's reasonable to dismiss Tiki as an option under those grounds. (I appreciate keeping her in mind all the same Euk, haha. BTW thanks for the initial reply, AC, was very informative.)

Gotta be honest, Lucina WAS the main waifu I was considering for optimization purposes. (Besides, I'm interested to see how the story plays out with a familial bond to her anyway, so that'll just be an opportunity to try that.) Noire also sounds interesting. I got plenty of time to decide, though. Thanks, gents.

[Emerald Ink]

Is Ricken!Laurent just redundant if I want him as a lead Sage or Sorcerer, or is he better off with another dad for that role/as a support unit?

Also, how does Libra!Brady support Sorcerer fare?

[CoolCoolCool]

Sage is a slightly better support class than sorc (sage has 2 more damage, 2.25% higher dual strike and gives 1 more damage to the lead unit for example), but Brady is better off not as a support as he has galeforce (galeforce units will frontline at least once per player phase so always build them as leads, having 2 leads in a pairing is fine).

Better just to give Laurent a vantage-passer (Gregor, Lon'qu, Stahl) and give Ricken to a galeforcer (Owain, Inigo, Severa, Brady can all use him). Unless you really want Ricken!Laurent to father superoptimal Morgan.

[MelonGx]

Another question: How to set up Vantagers in Apo?

I tried eating counterback damage from Secret Wave 1's Warriors, but just got my full rallied Libra!Inigo(Sorc)/Maiden!Lucina(Bride) 13/80.

Edited March 13, 2014 by MelonGx

[Airship Canon]

Another question: How to set up Vantagers in Apo?

I tried eating counterback damage from Secret Wave 1's Warriors, but just got my full rallied Libra!Inigo(Sorc)/Maiden!Lucina(Bride) 13/80.

Libra!Inigo has 0 mod, so as a sorc that's 41+3 [51+3] on the opening:

Boss has 98 ATK, so he'd do 54 [44] damage, that's bad- he has to die.

Mooks do 78-44 is 34 [24], so 2 mooks is 68 [48].

[This is why you want NEGATIVE Def if you're setting up a sweep, and you use Sage, not Sorc.]

[toppa016]

hi.. newbie here.. these are my tentative pairings.. just want to ask what skills should i pass down from the parents.. thanks :)

ChromXOlivia

Toppar(my unit)XLucina

LissaXLibra

SullyXKellam (married)

CordeliaXLonqu

SumiaXFredrick (married)

NowiX Donnell or Gaius not sure yet

MirielXRicken (married)

ChercheXVaike

Tharja (no idea so far, any suggestions would be appreciated :)

Maribelle (same as Tharja)

[Gaia]

Chrom x Olivia=RfK/GF for Inigo, Aether/GF for Lucy

MU x Lucina=Axefaire/Edit: Aether

Lissa x Libra=GF/Vengeance

Sully x Kellam=Luna/(?)

Cordelia x Lon'qu=GF/Vantage or Swordfaire (?)

Sumia x Frederick=GF/Luna

Nowi x Donnel/Gaius=(?)/Counter

Miriel x Ricken=DS+/Tomefaire or Luna

Cherche x Vaike=DS+/Axefaire

Note that these are all my opinion.

Edited March 14, 2014 by Gaius217

[Czar_Yoshi]

Chrom x Olivia=RfK/GF for Inigo, Aether/GF for Lucy

MU x Lucina=Axefaire/Galeforce

Lissa x Libra=GF/Vengeance

Sully x Kellam=Luna/(?)

Cordelia x Lon'qu=GF/Vantage or Swordfaire (?)

Sumia x Frederick=GF/Luna

Nowi x Donnel/Gaius=(?)/Counter

Miriel x Ricken=DS+/Tomefaire or Luna

Cherche x Vaike=DS+/Axefaire

Note that these are all my opinion.

Why GF? Lucina can get that on her own, if you're concerned about minmaxing pass down Lck+4 instead. It's not very helpful for ingame, but you're doing some form of grinding if you can get Galeforce on Olivia by Cht.13 so it shouldn't matter.

Just a note, Chrom's passdowns are fixed so don't fret about those.

Edited March 14, 2014 by Czar_Yoshi

[toppa016]

Why GF? Lucina can get that on her own, if you're concerned about minmaxing pass down Lck+4 instead. It's not very helpful for ingame, but you're doing some form of grinding if you can get Galeforce on Olivia by Cht.13 so it shouldn't matter.

Just a note, Chrom's passdowns are fixed so don't fret about those.

how about lucina's skill? shouldn't i pass down aether instead of galeforce?

[Gaia]

how about lucina's skill? shouldn't i pass down aether instead of galeforce?

Oh, derp. I completely forgot about Aether. Don't worry about it; Aether is automatically passed down regardless.

[Airship Canon]

how about lucina's skill? shouldn't i pass down aether instead of galeforce?

Aether's a forced pass.

[MRDRHAWK]

how about lucina's skill? shouldn't i pass down aether instead of galeforce?

Why not both?

Why not Zoidberg- *shot*

Also, is there any Lucina apart from FeMU that stands out to you guys?

Edited March 14, 2014 by Mango Sentinel

[Gaia]

Maribelle!Lucina makes a great Sage. She can also pass a +7 mag mod to Morgan, and is the only way to pull off the MATT5ER method, IIRC.

[Airship Canon]

Also, is there any Lucina apart from FeMU that stands out to you guys?

TBQH: Any Lucina who isn't Sully!Lucina or Maiden!Lucina is basically the same.

If you're looking for "stand out" those two suck.

But, FeMU!Lucina isn't any better really than a Sumia/Maribelle/Olivia Lucina.

Maribelle!Lucina is one of the most underrated things out there since she: runs the same build as the others, is best at magic...

And Brady don't care who his father is.

[However, while M!L!M is so strong, she passes Ricken!Noire!Morgan in terms of output because +7mod/Aether > +10mod... she's also the most redundant morgan ever.]

[Czar_Yoshi]

how about lucina's skill? shouldn't i pass down aether instead of galeforce?

I meant pass Luck+4 from Olivia instead of Galeforce, though it doesn't really matter. Chrom's passdowns are fixed.

Maribelle!Lucina is one of the most underrated things out there since she: runs the same build as the others, is best at magic...

And Brady don't care who his father is.

[However, while M!L!M is so strong, she passes Ricken!Noire!Morgan in terms of output because +7mod/Aether > +10mod... she's also the most redundant morgan ever.]

Fortunately, being a redundant Aether unit with exceptional mods isn't a bad thing...

I'll also point out that you can get Chrom x Maribelle (Sniper and Staffbot), Avatar x Lucina (VV Sage combo) and Morgan x Brady (Dark Flier/Sage combo or more Staffbots or Rallybots) with only three marriages (two if Chrom's is automatic) and that combo along with Olivia can somewhat reliably clear every map in the game, DLC or otherwise, and get the best ending on all of them, so it's also a good efficiency setup.

Edited March 14, 2014 by Czar_Yoshi

[MelonGx]

FeMU!Lucina(Dark Flier, AT, LB, DS+, TF, Gale/All+2) can do the double-AT sweeping thing with either Libra!Inigo or Gregor!Laurent (Sage, AT, LB, VV, Gale/TF/All+2)

It cost 0 Gold if the VV Sage equips All+2, 150G for a Speed Tonic if equips another.

Edited March 14, 2014 by MelonGx