So, how do you guys feel about Fire Emblem surviving extinction?

[Irysa]

^ most of them aren't related my ass.

Roy, Wolt, Lilina, Lugh, Ray, Clarine, Klein, Sue, Fir, Igrene and Hugh are all direct descendants, Marcus, Bartre and Karel (Hector and Eliwood lol) appear in both, and Niime, Dieck, Chad and Geese are either related or very closely connected to FE7 chars. There are a variety of pairings that also lead to those characters meaning that nearly all the FE7 cast can have some stake in FE6's members, and it's not even counting people who tangentially influence reappearing characters like Guy or Harken.

Edited September 29, 2013 by Irysa

[Robert Stewart]

^ most of them aren't related my ass.

Characters in FE7

Characters in FE6

Characters in both that are related

You'll notice there isn't much overlap between the two.

Niime, Dieck, Chad and Geese are either related or very closely connected to FE7 chars.

um

Look, i'll give you Dieck, since he did know Pent and Louise and all

But I can't find any connection between Chad and anyone from FE7.

The 12 characters you mentioned are hardly enough to make implementing an inheritance system worthwhile. Honestly while I think that combining FE7+6 isn't a half bad idea, an inheritance system probably wouldn't be a worthwhile addition.

[Refa]

Have you tried it without pair up? It's really fun.

Full disclosure, I haven't even tried pair up. :(

I'm not going to say it's flawless of course - nothing is and Awakening is FAR from flawless - but it shows that there lies potential to make something even better than before.

Nothing is flawless though, better to rate Awakening relatively to other FE games (not that I'm one to talk, lol, having not played it) than compare it to the hypothetical game of God.

EDIT Wait you said tha-I MADE MYSELF LOOK DUMB...AGAIN.

The best part about Fire Emblem: Awakening is you can play however you want. You can play in the easier mode, on casual, and watch all the animations. Or you can play with no pair ups on hard mode with no animations. You can change how you view the cutscenes.

FE Awakening is the Subway of Fire Emblem games confirmed.

Just remake FE6 and 7 bundled with the generations gimmick and with more depth, and have Mark show up in both. And no pair up, have rescue instead. People already headcanon the fuck out of what pairings lead into FE6 anyway, and maybe Roy might actually not suck if he officially gets a halfdragon skill or something.

Marcus could degrade in stats from 7 to 6 based on his stats in the first. ALL OF THE STATBOOSTERS.

Yes please.

Edited September 29, 2013 by Refa

[VincentASM]

Kind of late to the party, but I think it's fantastic that FE's future is fairly safe.

I imagine if FE13 had flopped, Nintendo would probably have put the series on ice and maybe brought it back in 5 or 10 years time, but I enjoy my semi-regular FE installments ^^

FE13 itself wasn't perfect, but it was very enjoyable and brought it many new features (or evolved older ones) and I personally am confident that IS know where to take the series next.

That said, I'm still unsure if SMT X FE was a good idea, but we'll see...

[1% critted]

After playing on Hard no Pair Up and other restrictions, I can say that those that say pair up has no downsides aren't completely right. It does give a good buff, but after playing extensively without it I noticed something, that I'm not sure if other people notice (it's fairly obvious). You buff one unit at the cost of not having two at the same time. I mean just think about it. Here are three different situations.

For example, you are fighting a unit that will only die with the addition of the stats from a pair up. Two units attacking it won't cut it. Pair up is really beneficial here.

But, let's say you are fighting a unit that dies from the stat additions of pair up, but also dies from two separate attacks from the same unpaired units. Now they are about equal.

But the third situation, you are fighting two units, and each unpaired unit can kill one. If you would be paired, you would only be able to kill one.

To get it straight, pair up is better defensively, while no pair up is better offensively. Of course some chapters benefit more from defensive play while others from offensive play (more defensive than offensive). No pair up is also better, when your units are fairly strong, and can do almost the same job while unpaired, in comparison to when paired.

To those that haven't tried no pair up, give it a try, it will be worth your while.

[Irysa]

Characters in FE7

Characters in FE6

Characters in both that are related

You'll notice there isn't much overlap between the two.

um

Look, i'll give you Dieck, since he did know Pent and Louise and all

But I can't find any connection between Chad and anyone from FE7.

The 12 characters you mentioned are hardly enough to make implementing an inheritance system worthwhile. Honestly while I think that combining FE7+6 isn't a half bad idea, an inheritance system probably wouldn't be a worthwhile addition.

You're explictly forgetting that there are multiple pairings that can result in most of those kids...

Also the father at Chad's orphanage is heavily implied to be Lucius (who also looked after Lugh and Ray)

Between the kids and recurring characters it seems pretty reasonable to be able to influence the second gen a bit.

Edited September 29, 2013 by Irysa

[OrangeCrush980]

Mixed

On one hand, I love it for obvious reason

On the other hand, there is a bunch of misinformation beetwen blaming Shadow Dragon for the whole mess, and glorifying FE9 and FE10, despite the fact that the later two struggles to match up to SD sales, or fanboys glorifying FE13 to such a massive extent, it become annoying

Yes, I blame FE9 and FE10 to incite flame wars. Come at me brotha

I agree with this. If Awakening is going to be praised as the end-all, be-all of Fire Emblem, then perhaps the series would've been better off dead...

[Scarlet]

What's with all the FE13 hate in this thread? I don't even.

Sure, FE13 wasn't without its flaws. Nothing ever is. It certainly has a different feel to it than the previous games in the series, but it was nonetheless a great game. Being different doesn't automatically make it bad.

Anyway, I look forward to seeing more great FEs in the future. Whether they build on Awakening or the older games in the series I don't really care about - as long as they feel like Fire Emblem, I'm fine with them.

[Refa]

What's with all the FE13 hate in this thread? I don't even.

It's the new age retro hipster movement, man, get with the times. Whatever the masses love, we must HATE on impulse for they don't really get what makes FE good, only we get what makes FE good.

[RJWalker]

^I'm not going to even bother. People who don't like what's popular are always accused of being hipsters and such. It's insulting to both and only harms your position.

[Refa]

I haven't even played FE13, how can it be my position?

[RJWalker]

'Your' did not necessairly refer to you and only you.

[Refa]

Fair enough.

I'm sorry, I was snarky from the day I was born, I sware.

[RJWalker]

Fair enough.

I'm sorry, I was snarky from the day I was born, I sware.

No problem. English is not my first language and sometimes I fail to make these things clear.

Back on topic. I'm obvioulsy glad that FE isn't dead. I dislike everything about Awakening's plot after chapter 7 and hate a lot of the characters but I don't hate the whole game. It's unbalanced but unbalanced in a fun way. At the end of the day, I have fun messing around with it and that's what counts. I'll admit that I'm disappointed that FE13 is seen as the pinnacle of the series but from what I've seen, most of the reviewers and regular folk only seem to have a passing familiarity with the series.

[Robert Stewart]

You're explictly forgetting that there are multiple pairings that can result in most of those kids...

Okay. That still only leaves ~13 or so characters in FE6 that would benefit from an inheritance system(~15 if we include characters who appear in both games)

Also the father at Chad's orphanage is heavily implied to be Lucius (who also looked after Lugh and Ray)

Implied, but never confirmed.

Between the kids and recurring characters it seems pretty reasonable to be able to influence the second gen a bit.

But only a bit. Unlike in FE4, where the majority 2nd generation is children who benefit from inheritance.

[Refa]

But only a bit. Unlike in FE4, where the majority 2nd generation is children who benefit from inheritance.

Not necessarily. There are more potential 2nd gen characters who don't have inheritance than those who do.

[amadeuscho]

On FE11: I don't see how it was a cash grab. They had to design the engine and graphic system from scratch. There was a reasonable expectation that there was an audience who hadn't played FE1 and would like to, especially internationally. The fact FE12 wasn't released internationally suggests it did not meet international sales expectations, at least to me.

On FE7 to 6 Inheritance: Works for me. If characters can't inherit something I don't think it will hurt them too much. Those characters should just start of with strong skills, or could inherit skills from characters they are connected to, like Chad and Lucius. Remember, that this game could effectively canonize anything that was left unclear in the originals. They also could easily add a few characters to FE6 or FE7, like how FE11 did for FE1's character roster.

On Extinction and FE13: I think the new fans outweigh any hate that FE13 might generate. I think FE fans who didn't like FE13 will probably continue to buy the series anyway. I do think FE13 hate is magnified on SF forums, as SF seems to be the really hardcore fans of the series. I do think and agree that FE13 is the first FE out of all the ones I've played to really be game of the year material, either 3DS game of the year or even game of the year in general.

Edited September 29, 2013 by Viewtiful_J

[Robert Stewart]

They also could easily add a few characters to FE6, like how FE11 did for FE1's character roster.

If there's one thing FE6 DOESN'T need, it's more characters.

[amadeuscho]

If there's one thing FE6 DOESN'T need, it's more characters.

Or you could add character to FE7 as well. I think FE7 could use more characters.

I agree with this. If Awakening is going to be praised as the end-all, be-all of Fire Emblem, then perhaps the series would've been better off dead...

I disagree completely with this. Even you don't like FE13, I don't think the series would have been better off dead. FE13 allows the next entry to be improved upon if you didn't like it.

[Robert Stewart]

Or you could add character to FE7 as well. I think FE7 could use more characters.

Meh....I don't really think so. The only things that "need" to be done to FE7 IMO are:

1)Merge Eliwood/Hector Mode

2) Change ch19xx's requirements

3) Move Renault's, Karla's, and Rath's recruitment earlier.

And that's about it IMO.

[eclipse]

They also could easily add a few characters to FE6 or FE7, like how FE11 did for FE1's character roster.

Or, they could retcon certain FE6 characters to be kids of the FE7 cast (how this'll work, I don't know, as I'm not familiar enough with FE6 characters to say).

[amadeuscho]

Meh....I don't really think so. The only things that "need" to be done to FE7 IMO are:

1)Merge Eliwood/Hector Mode

2) Change ch19xx's requirements

3) Move Renault's, Karla's, and Rath's recruitment earlier.

And that's about it IMO.

Any changes to a remake would not be needed. But I'm just saying if it's enhanced remake like FE11 or FE12, they can add characters like they did in these versions.

Or, they could retcon certain FE6 characters to be kids of the FE7 cast (how this'll work, I don't know, as I'm not familiar enough with FE6 characters to say).

As long as they don't change the designs, I'm cool with whatever they do. Combining to the game's through an inheritance system seems like a huge win to me. That way, you could keep any new FE fans happy with additions like this. The tactician from FE7 can be available both generations to be your avatar in one, and a shadow hero in FE6 akin to the avatar character in FE12. Thus, the title could be more successful and keep the series on the right track, away from extinction.

[Irysa]

If they do update FE7 they need to make Lyn not pointless.

Also, it's worth considering that Roy hasn't actually had a game in the west yet and people still are intruiged by him because of Smash. Frankly I see the familiarity of Eliwood's story and interest in Roy, the fact that an avatar/tactician existed there first AND the potential for a inheritance makes an Elibe saga remake seem really obvious as a good decision as where to go next. You can satisfy the old guard and the new guard!

Okay. That still only leaves ~13 or so characters in FE6 that would benefit from an inheritance system(~15 if we include characters who appear in both games)

Implied, but never confirmed.

But only a bit. Unlike in FE4, where the majority 2nd generation is children who benefit from inheritance.

1. That's a sizable amount considering most units who are kids in 6 need help to not be mediocre to bad most of the time anyway.

2. I only see one orphanage in Araphen on the map...Lucius opens an orphanage in Araphen in his non paired ending...it's not 100% confirmed but it's pretty obvious that they retroactively intended him to be their guardian.

3. What Refa said.

Edited September 29, 2013 by Irysa

[Paper Jam]

Or, they could retcon certain FE6 characters to be kids of the FE7 cast (how this'll work, I don't know, as I'm not familiar enough with FE6 characters to say).

Yeah, they could probably retcon Lance and Allen to be... Sain's son and Kent's son, respectively, I guess.

Or they could just throw out the whole parent-child thing and replace it with a sort of... teacher-student thing, so that pretty much anybody from FE7 could theoretically influence the stats of pretty much anybody from FE6. Granted, there is no reason why Roy should have learned anything from... say, Vaida, but you could easily have Lance and Allen be former students of Sain and Kent; you could also have Dieck be a former student of Raven, although he would then have an (additional) advantage over O.J. if you didn't do anything else to compensate. (e.g. have Harken's stats influence O.J's?)

In short, you'd have to have a flowchart explaining who learned what from whom, but it could work.

Edited October 16, 2013 by Paper Jam

[RJWalker]

If you pair Eliwood with Ninian then Roy should be able to use Dragonstones as well as Swords. Unfair advantage over the others? Maybe.