Metal Gear Solid

[ArtoriasAbyss]

kojima says he feels like he grew up with solid snake (or whatever he really said). i "actually" grew up with solid snake. i was like 6 when i played mgs1. naked snake is fucking awesome, but i gotta say, solid snake is my favorite.

He may have said that but he's made it clear in more recent interviews that he prefers Big Boss over Solid. BB has more emotion and backstory to bring into the games, with all the tragic shit that happened to him. He just wanted to operate operationally forever ;_;

And people's biggest gripe with MGS4 was the overall story and the LOLNANOMACHINES stuff that basically ruined all the interesting aspects of MGS by giving it one single retarded explanation. I'm not one to place story over gameplay, but in this case it was a disappointing continuation of an already established lore. One undeniably good thing were how its gameplay mechanics were basically an upgrade from 3, but the levels didn't make you feel nearly as sneaky and predatory as MGS3 did.

[Phoenix Wright]

i won't get into an argument over story--not worth it, as we're all in love with the series here. some bits i agree with, some bits i don't. as with any story, i think. mgs3 definitely is the best in terms of a story entry, though.

the only faulty act is act iii, imo. especially on the boss extreme, where it's completely up to chance whether or not you can get through the bike scene. the precise strategies only increase your chances of survival, they don't guarantee it--it was very frustrating.

act i wasn't too sneaky, but eh, i didn't mind. acts ii and iv (especially iv) were stealth heavy and were extremely fun. the initial boarding of outer haven is also one of my favorite sequences. so yeah, it's not 100% sneaking, but most of the game is. i liked it a lot.

the setting was expertly chosen for mgs3--not so for some parts of mgs4. i disagree that it wasn't as "nearly as sneaky," (for acts mentioned above) but i think being "predatory" is more of a characteristic to naked snake than solid snake, especially in that jungle setting.

now that i think harder on it, i think i find mgs4 to be my favorite for two reasons:

1) i invested a lot of time in it. for a game you can complete in under 4 hours, i've probably spent around 120-200 hours alone on this game.

2) i really, really loved the conclusion and final scene. i sort of see acts iv and v as the grander "conclusion," since act v is rather short.

otherwise i find mgs3 to be better.

on the linear point, i agree, i can understand why some might not be into it. personally, even when it comes to rpgs, i don't really mind a linear game at all. as long as it doesn't literally hold my hand throughout. exploration is great, linearity is cool with me, too.

[Nightmare]

I don't really mind the linearity. Good game's a good game, linear or not. I just thought 4 was cripplingly boring. Act I is probably actually the best and most varied the game gets, and it still didn't really cut it for me. I'm kind of scared to go into the rest of the game because I have this sinking feeling it's going to be sinking. Real fast.

[NICKT™]

4 probably is my opinion for the worst of the series.

Doesn't surprise me considering even Kojima didn't want to do it, and was constantly getting his far-out ideas vetoed by his team.

Last I read, he actually wanted Otacon and Snake to hand themselves in as terrorists in MGS4 when he was tunneled into making the game, and the two of them would end up getting executed but either his team or the big-wigs wouldn't have it.

Then again, internet's not really known for being true, but from what I saw the game I'm willing to bet it's got more than a grain to the theory, as it had nothing that the others had that made them special.

My favorite MG game is 3, with Rising coming up right behind it.

[Knight]

Well, it's about to make a post.

I got into Metal Gear a while ago and played as many games in the series as I could. Snake Eater would be my favourite, though one thing ruins it for me, the medical system, god that's annoying. I guess MGS1 is my favourite, I like the story and villains, though there could be more gameplay.

My least favourite is MGS4, while it has fun gameplay, it has so little of it. The bosses aren't that fun, it's rather easy and those cutscenes. MGS4 has the worst writing in the series IMO and it doesn't help that you have to listen to it for 6 hours. MGS2 is fun, though there's some bad writing and a few bad design choices. Peace Walker is a game I like a lot, I just wish there were some human bosses.

EDIT: I forgot about Metal Gear Rising: Spelling Mistake, that game is really fun, nothing really wrong in this game, fun as hell bosses.

Edited September 5, 2014 by Knight

[Phoenix Wright]

i never though i'd see the day where mgs4 gets shit on this hard. :(

ah man, the med. sys. is so cool. you can make snake and eva puke. it also makes the fear's fight even shittier! (it's fun, but at the same time i hate that fucking boss fight.)

[Magical CC]

I played Metal Gear Solid and Sons of Liberty. I failed to see any good point in the first. Characters are boring, childish politic theme, stupid stealth system. The second is better but not much. They are not bad, after all, but arent good either.

[Alertcircuit]

If I wanted to get into the series where should I start?

[Knight]

If I wanted to get into the series where should I start?

Either MGS1 or MGS3. Make sure you play 2 after 1 and 4 after 2 for story reasons, make sure you play 3 before 4, Peace Walker and 5. The story is really complex in these games so I strongly recommend this. 1 and 3 are really the only games where you don't need any backstory to understand, just remember 3 is a prequel.

[Esau of Isaac]

If I wanted to get into the series where should I start?

MGS 1 => MGS2 => MGS3 => Portable Ops => MGS4 => Peace Walker

[Raven]

I got all the dogtags on all difficulty levels in MGS2 (including European Extreme).

Nearly 100%'d all the VR missions on Substance, but for the life of me couldn't finish that Tuxedo Snake's sniping mission.

I only completed MGS3 a handful of times though, so I didn't go too deep into trying to 100% that.

I played MGS1 a hell of a lot back in the day, but I don't remember any particulars regarding how well I did.

Haven't played MGS4 or Revengeance yet, but I will in due time.

[Esau of Isaac]

4's really cinematic, I like a lot of the game mechanics a lot. I just wish the levels were longer so I had more time to get acquainted with them before they were discarded when moving into an area where they are not suited well.

Revengeance is really nothing like any of the MGS games, it's a spin-off that has no bearing on the plot and for all intents and purposes should be mostly ignored, or at least focused on by itself without relation to the others.

[Phoenix Wright]

If I wanted to get into the series where should I start?

mgs1 on the ps1 is probably tough to get into these days. if you can get your hands on twin snakes, i'd do that.

your choices are: chronologically by production year or by in-game year, though. i recommend going by in-game chronological order, so mgs3. also, you can skip port. ops and just read about it.

the entire series is a blur to me at this point, ie i can't remember which game's minutia comes from precisely, but i'm pretty sure mgs3 requires no knowledge from any previous mgs games.

so, mgs3 --> peace walker --> (mgs5 potentially) --> mgs1 --> mgs2 --> mgs4 or if you're really awesome mgs3--pw--(mgs5)--mg--mg2--mgs1--mgs2--mgs4

but really, it doesn't matter. my roommate started with mgs4, then went to mgs1--mgs2--mgs3 and loved it. of course, i was there to answer questions so mgs4 wasn't confusing for him, but still.

[That Person's Name]

Yeah I know tons of MGS fans here on SF including myself, it was actually my favorite series at one point. Started with 2 and played 3 and 4 when they came out, Snake Eater is by far my favorite. I practically have all the best codec calls memorized from that game. 2 was good even though I wished there was more of Snake, however the gameplay is great and there's a ton of fun stuff, 4 was alright, brought new mechanics but kinda lacked in gameplay due to its short story, 1 is good too if you can handle an older game. If I get a chance I'll play 5 sometime but I already bought a PS3 just to play 4, I don't think I'll do that again this time around lol. Let me know how awesome it is.

As for where to start, I got hooked by starting on 2 myself but I'd recommend 3, that's just a great standalone game without any backstory required and takes place in an amazing era and environment with awesome gameplay. The story is whatever like with all MGS games, just gets confusing and fantastical and stuff but the gameplay is top notch. Plus there's lots of funny moments in the codec calls.

As for getting MGS1, I'm pretty sure if you have a PS4 you can find it in the store there. Barring that you can definitely just play it on PC by downloading and emulator, that's how I played it.

Edited September 9, 2014 by That Person's Name

[Nightmare]

mgs1 on the ps1 is probably tough to get into these days. if you can get your hands on twin snakes, i'd do that.

MGS1 should be fine. I wouldn't think the mechanics are outdated or anything, just a lot simpler than what you're used to these days I suppose. It's also a great looking PSX 3D game. On the other hand, I wouldn't recommend Twin Snakes purely because it has additional mechanics, because it butchers MGS1 so much I have extreme hatred for it. I wouldn't recommend it at all, in fact.

Edited September 9, 2014 by Nightmare

[Phoenix Wright]

it doesn't really butcher it, imo. someone from /r/metalgearsolid put it perfectly: "twin snakes is how otacon remembers it, mgs1 is how it really happened." since the game came out, i've always felt people who didn't like twin snakes were way overreacting. still feel that way, actually. now, of course i love mgs1 way more, but i highly doubt any newcomers are going to give much care to it at all. that's pretty much the only reason why i recommended it at all. (every person i've gotten to play the series like twin snakes just fine and didn't really care about the changes i told them were made. and well, they might have cared more if i had them play mgs first but eh.)

also, first person mode for actual shooting is way fucking helpful, particularly in the part where you have to shoot those stupid gun cameras on the wall is more difficult than it needed to be.

on another note, i think fans and newcomers alike would absolutely love to have mg 1 and 2 remade. although, i guess they won't have david hayter voice acting for snake anymore... :'(

Edited September 9, 2014 by Phoenix Wright

[Lord Raven]

I've heard that Twin Snakes was also more like the VR that Raiden went through.

Also to the perosn that asked - I recommend the MGS Legacy Collection (I believe it contains the HD MGS2/3/Peace Walker as well) because it contains everything. MGS1 is also available on PSN.

Edited September 9, 2014 by Lord Raven

[Nightmare]

it doesn't really butcher it, imo. someone from /r/metalgearsolid put it perfectly: "twin snakes is how otacon remembers it, mgs1 is how it really happened." since the game came out, i've always felt people who didn't like twin snakes were way overreacting. still feel that way, actually. now, of course i love mgs1 way more, but i highly doubt any newcomers are going to give much care to it at all. that's pretty much the only reason why i recommended it at all. (every person i've gotten to play the series like twin snakes just fine and didn't really care about the changes i told them were made. and well, they might have cared more if i had them play mgs first but eh.)

I think it's butchered because...

- The script was re-translated and voice acting redone. Several changes were made because the higher ups at Konami felt the original wasn't good enough. As a result, we have a less interesting script because this new translation opts to be more literal and less creative, and we also got more bored sounding voice actors. A great example of how bad the script has gotten is, I think, the character flaw line. In MGS1, Otacon said that the exposed radar on REX is because things need a character flaw, which implies Otacon's naive worldview. In contrast, we have it changed to "design flaw" in Twin Snakes, which is just...couldn't you have corrected that design flaw? Why is it there in the first place? etc. etc.

- The music was reworked into typical and boring, orchestral nonsense. While I don't think the original game had a super great soundtrack, the new soundtrack is definitely inferior and much less exciting.

- Reworked cutscenes which are ridiculous not in the MGS sense, but in the "why the fuck" sense.

- Ugly, plastic people replace the gritty and grainy original graphics, which are among the best in PSX 3D games (as I have mentioned before).

- New additions to the game mechanics (which ties into your next point), rather than making the game a better experience, make it laughably convenient, more often than not, because they do not take into account the original design and just added away.

- Probably a lot more stuff.

To put it in the least creative literary manner (aka bullet points). Of course, I don't think it would make that much of a difference to newcomers like you said, but since we're recommending things here, I feel like MGS1 is the better choice and a quality game (unlike Twin Snakes). The objectively better game, in other words.

on another note, i think fans and newcomers alike would absolutely love to have mg 1 and 2 remade. although, i guess they won't have david hayter voice acting for snake anymore... :'(

That would be cool, though MGS1 is already kinda both MG1 and 2 in one game, except way better than both.

[That Person's Name]

Didn't they just use Kiefer because his voice has to transition from Naked Snake's voice into Big Boss's voice? Can't have him sounding the same and then suddenly sound like Big Boss. I feel like Hayter would come back if they ever remake MG or make more with Solid Snake or something.

Edited September 10, 2014 by That Person's Name

[Knight]

Didn't they just use Kiefer because his voice has to transition from Naked Snake's voice into Big Boss's voice? Can't have him sounding the same and then suddenly sound like Big Boss. I feel like Hayter would come back if they ever remake MG or make more with Solid Snake or something.

I always thought it would be because Hayter is secretly playing Solid Snake in the game and it would be to differentiate him, just a theory of mine though.

[Lord Raven]

Didn't they just use Kiefer because his voice has to transition from Naked Snake's voice into Big Boss's voice? Can't have him sounding the same and then suddenly sound like Big Boss. I feel like Hayter would come back if they ever remake MG or make more with Solid Snake or something.

I'm actually confused about why John Cygan wasn't voicing Big Boss or MGSV Naked Snake or something, or at least Richard Doyle.

[Phoenix Wright]

I think it's butchered because...

- The script was re-translated and voice acting redone. Several changes were made because the higher ups at Konami felt the original wasn't good enough. As a result, we have a less interesting script because this new translation opts to be more literal and less creative, and we also got more bored sounding voice actors. A great example of how bad the script has gotten is, I think, the character flaw line. In MGS1, Otacon said that the exposed radar on REX is because things need a character flaw, which implies Otacon's naive worldview. In contrast, we have it changed to "design flaw" in Twin Snakes, which is just...couldn't you have corrected that design flaw? Why is it there in the first place? etc. etc.

- The music was reworked into typical and boring, orchestral nonsense. While I don't think the original game had a super great soundtrack, the new soundtrack is definitely inferior and much less exciting.

- Reworked cutscenes which are ridiculous not in the MGS sense, but in the "why the fuck" sense.

- Ugly, plastic people replace the gritty and grainy original graphics, which are among the best in PSX 3D games (as I have mentioned before).

- New additions to the game mechanics (which ties into your next point), rather than making the game a better experience, make it laughably convenient, more often than not, because they do not take into account the original design and just added away.

- Probably a lot more stuff.

To put it in the least creative literary manner (aka bullet points). Of course, I don't think it would make that much of a difference to newcomers like you said, but since we're recommending things here, I feel like MGS1 is the better choice and a quality game (unlike Twin Snakes). The objectively better game, in other words.

That would be cool, though MGS1 is already kinda both MG1 and 2 in one game, except way better than both.

i agree with you on everything, pretty much. in fact, i went and played mgs1 that night and loved it just as much as before. though the game does have a couple quirks that annoy the shit out of me, i still love it to death. it's just that for twin snakes i wouldn't personally use the words, "butcher," or "ruin," because i think they're too harsh. i genuinely enjoyed twin snakes and am very glad i own it, but it is definitely not as good.

kinda, but i want to experience those stories in a better way than what we presently have. i find them interesting, and the setting for each extremely fun to play around in.

Didn't they just use Kiefer because his voice has to transition from Naked Snake's voice into Big Boss's voice? Can't have him sounding the same and then suddenly sound like Big Boss. I feel like Hayter would come back if they ever remake MG or make more with Solid Snake or something.

from what i read, they wanted the motion-capturing to be extremely natural, so they let go of hayter. sutherland's has the "weathered face" they were looking for for the emitional expressions. i guess hayter didn't. (http://www.metalgearinformer.com/?p=8231)

same reasons for john cygan and richard doyle, i guess. i don't know, because i definitely don't agree with the reasoning.

Edited September 11, 2014 by Phoenix Wright

[Junkhead]

Also is dat sum Lottie you have there?

Yah, but...you better watch yourself. Hmhmhmhm She mai you know

[Ike-Mike]

MGS4 being so cinematic is because Sony pressured them because it was supposedly the best way to show the PS3's new graphical capabilities.

The best version of MGS1 might be the PC release. Too bad you can only get it by paying obscene prices or through piracy nowadays...

[Raven]

Wolf buddies confirmed for MGSV.