Magical Glace Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Because the internet is full of sick minded people. Because a LOT of SSB fans have never played Fire Emblem and don't know about the settings of the series and how unconnected they tend to be. Because it's the internet. That simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axie Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Nobody challenges straight pairings? Have you ever witnessed a canon war? Ever? In all the years you've been alive? A "straight" cnon war can get every bit as ugly. The generalizations are strong in this post.This is a good point, but let me clarify.People challenge straight pairings like this: Person 1: omg Ike/Lethe is like totally canon! Person 2: of course not! they are just friends! Ike/Elincia is way more canon than Ike/Lethe!!! Now, if you replaced Lethe with Soren and it happened exactly like this I would be fine with it. However, many people challenge gay pairings like this: Person 1: omg Ike/Soren is like totally canon! Person 2: of course not! they are just friends! Ike is not gay! There is a slight but meaningful difference going on here. (PS: I could even open the can of worms that is the fact people always challenge the idea of Ike being gay but only rarely the idea of Soren being gay, but that's neither here nor there) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buttocksinator Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 (edited) Only homosexual? Not bisexual/pansexual etc? Or do the men have no compassion for women and vice versa in your church? Nobody challenges straight pairings the way they challenge gay pairings. Like it or not, you are displaying a double standard for orientations. This post has nothing to do with the subject at hand. As Ownagepuffs already pointed out, I only brought up homosexuals because that is the topic we are currently discussing. This thread is not about bisexuals or pansexuals so i'm puzzled as to what relevance you think it has here. Also, you cannot accuse me of having a bias in the way I challenge certain pairings when I have done no such thing as of yet. You say "nobody challenges straight pairings the way they challenge gay pairings." Then accuse me of having a double standard, where, exactly did I put this double standard? All I have said up to this point was that being sensitive doesn't necessarily make you gay. How is that in any way, shape or form, offensive or demeaning? Thank you so much for this. YOU win a million internets. Sorry if I was harsh, Buttocksinator, but you did come off as ignorant with your church argument because it oversimplifies a complex relationship only because it's between two guys. Sensitivity and compassion isn't the only thing about Ike and Soren that makes them look like a couple. This is the point I was making people, it's ridiculous so say that sensitivity and compassion always implies romantic interest, because it doesn't. Can it? Absolutely. Can you use that information alone to determine sexual orientation? Abosultely not. I am fully aware that the example I gave was ignorant because it was sarcastically calling out this sensitivity = homosexuality mentality that I am so against. I would like to clarify at this moment just in case this wasn't already clear, I am not talking about Ike and Sorens entire game(s) wide, relationship. I have never played the games in question, I am only talking about this one particular conversation between the two. Now if I'm ignorant because I think it's okay for Ike to show compassion and sympathy to his dear friend without being labeled a gay, so be it. Edited November 23, 2014 by Buttocksinator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cymbalina's Revenge Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Because the internet is full of sick minded people. Because a LOT of SSB fans have never played Fire Emblem and don't know about the settings of the series and how unconnected they tend to be. Because it's the internet. That simple. Just curious-- do you also consider the Marth/Zelda and Ike/Samus shippers out there to be "sick-minded people"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axie Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 This is the point I was making people, it's ridiculous so say that sensitivity and compassion always implies romantic interest, because it doesn't. Can it? Absolutely. Can you use that information alone to determine sexual orientation? Abosultely not. I am fully aware that the example I gave was ignorant because it was sarcastically calling out this sensitivity = homosexuality mentality that I am so against. I would like to clarify at this moment just in case this wasn't already clear, I am not talking about Ike and Sorens entire game(s) wide, relationship. I have never played the games in question, I am only talking about this one particular conversation between the two. Now if I'm ignorant because I think it's okay for Ike to show compassion and sympathy to his dear friend without being labeled a gay, so be it. Well, obviously people use two entire games to justify their belief in Ike and Soren being a couple and not just that conversation, so your point isn't really relevant to the context, but if that's what you meant then I once again apologize for being harsh. To be clear, I am also against equating sensitivity with being gay or less manly, because I think it's a harmful real life problem; but I don't like when people use this to deslegitimize the portrayal of same sex relationships (which I now understand was not your intention but it happens often enough for me to immediatelly address it). Just curious-- do you also consider the Marth/Zelda and Ike/Samus shippers out there to be "sick-minded people"?I do! Samus is a strong independent woman who don't need no man!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Ike x Samus is kinda cute, imo... And this is coming from a hardcore shipper of Ike x Elincia that has written the pairing in several stories. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buttocksinator Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Well, obviously people use two entire games to justify their belief in Ike and Soren being a couple and not just that conversation, so your point isn't really relevant to the context, but if that's what you meant then I once again apologize for being harsh. To be clear, I am also against equating sensitivity with being gay or less manly, because I think it's a harmful real life problem; but I don't like when people use this to deslegitimize the portrayal of same sex relationships (which I now understand was not your intention but it happens often enough for me to immediatelly address it). This is a simple failure in communication, no harm done. Now gather round everyone, for a great, big, completely heterosexual hug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 I believe you mean a Gay-Straight-Alliance-approved hug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jave Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 I came to this thread expecting fan art. I leave disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasori Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 (edited) Before Priam I always thought that it was certainly possible that Soren/Ike was a thing, but that it still wasn't the absolute canon many people claimed that it was. I personally never saw them as a couple, but I could understand how people could see it differently. Priam kind of messes that up though. Being a descendent of Mist is possible, but I don't exactly see the point of Priam if that was the case. His ties with Ike, a previous main character was what made Priam stand out. I never actually seen or heard anything about Ike/Marth being a thing though. I know about Marth/Roy, but Marth being shipped with Ike is new to me. Edited November 23, 2014 by Sasori Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 People only say Priam is from Mist's line because Marth isn't directly from Anri, but Anri's brother instead. But the thing is, why must the same thing be repeated? It's equally possible that IS decided to actually go with direct descendant this time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jave Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Priam could be of Ike's line or Mist's line. It doesn't matter because his inclusion changes nothing. Soren and Ike could be totally gay for each other and Priam could still exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMT4ever Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Soren and Ike could be totally gay for each other and Priam could still exist. If Priam is descended directly from Ike, then the odds of Ike being gay are practically zero. Bi, maybe. But definitely not gay. Some people have suggested that Ike did have a kid, but that he and Soren took it away from the mother to raise on their own. This obviously does not hold up given Ike's personality. He would never willingly deprive a child of getting to know his/her mother and deprive a mother of getting to know her child given his own experience living without Elena. Soren wouldn't condone this behavior either given how he grew up alone. He would not want to subject a kid to growing up without either parent. He is a jerk, but he's not cruel by any means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentacotus Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 I think its pretty safe to say that Priam is a direct decendant of Ike. There are way too many similarities. First shares his love of meat based food, obsessed with training, blue hair (Mist has brown and Boyd has green), and the biggest killer is that he has Ragnell the sword Ike brought with him when he left on his journey after Radiant Dawn. So unless Mist somehow found Ike, took Ragnell, and had a blue haired kid with Boyd I don't see how he's not a direct descendant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 (edited) I agree, that doesn't seem within either Ike's or Soren's character. I know some people, including myself, also think it was out of character for Ike to leave behind the only family he ever knew (the mercenaries) and cared about forever, but this is just even MORE out of character, imo. EDIT: Yeah, Priam is pretty similar to Ike, but people also argue that because at least a thousand years passed since Ike's time, Priam's similarities could've come from just about anywhere. Someone with blue hair and a love for meat could've married into the family down the line before Priam, or Priam's non-Ike line parent might've had blue hair, etc. But I do think that he's a direct descendant anyway because of all the throwbacks to Ike. I don't think there would be much of a point to this if he was actually from Mist's line. And there's the Ragnell thing like you said. Edited November 23, 2014 by Anacybele Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jave Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 (edited) If Priam is descended directly from Ike, then the odds of Ike being gay are practically zero. Bi, maybe. But definitely not gay. Some people have suggested that Ike did have a kid, but that he and Soren took it away from the mother to raise on their own. This obviously does not hold up given Ike's personality. He would never willingly deprive a child of getting to know his/her mother and deprive a mother of getting to know her child given his own experience living without Elena. Soren wouldn't condone this behavior either given how he grew up alone. He would not want to subject a kid to growing up without either parent. He is a jerk, but he's not cruel by any means. Tons of factors can play into a gay man having a child. That scenario you describe is an isolated situation but far from the only possible outcome. Ike could be gay and still have a direct descendant. I'm not sure why this is up to debate. Edited November 23, 2014 by Jave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Then can you name these so-called factors? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esme Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 They are shipped because they are attractive to fujoshis and are from the same series. It's as simple as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jave Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Then can you name these so-called factors? The mother could die, for starters. But if you want more details, well... Ike could have a relation with a woman, have a child, then the mother could die and Ike could take his child with him and eventually realize how he really feels regarding his sexuality (that he's gay) and raise the child along with Soren. Then there's the possible scenario of Ike having a child without him knowing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 (edited) If Ike was at all willing to have a sexual relationship with a woman, which he would have to in order to produce a child, and then leave her for Soren, then he's bi, not gay. How does a person unknowingly have sex and conceive a child? Yeah, you could say he got raped, but how does a woman overpower a man who's probably like 6'2" and has muscles the size of melons as well as a giant sword? Edited November 23, 2014 by Anacybele Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jave Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 If Ike was at all willing to have a sexual relationship with a woman, which he would have to in order to produce a child, and then leave her for Soren, then he's bi, not gay. How does a person unknowingly have sex and conceive a child? Yeah, you could say he got raped, but how does a woman overpower a man who's probably like 6'2" and has muscles the size of melons as well as a giant sword? Plenty of gay men have had relationships with women because they either don't realize how they feel or they refuse to accept it. Some eventually end their relationship and accept it, but others live their whole lives hiding it. It's something that happens in real life, and it's not uncommon. The second question... I really can't believe you're asking me this. I could give you details, but I doubt anyone here can't picture a possible situation. It's like I'm being baited for an infraction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 (edited) I'm not trying to bait anyone. I'm just legitimately confused at what you're saying. And this was supposed to stay civil, but it looks like in order to keep it that way, we'll just have to stop right here and move onto some other discussion relating to the topic. Edited November 23, 2014 by Anacybele Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jave Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 I see nothing uncivil on the discussion. No insults, nobody has said anything offensive. I'm just not going to go into details regarding your second question because I don't feel it's proper for the forum. But I will say this: "Drunken nights" is something that happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMT4ever Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Plenty of gay men have had relationships with women because they either don't realize how they feel or they refuse to accept it. Some eventually end their relationship and accept it, but others live their whole lives hiding it. It's something that happens in real life, and it's not uncommon. Given Ike's complete lack of romantic interest in anyone as so far shown, the odds are that he's not going to be suppressing his gayness in favor of straightness. Whatever conclusion he comes to, whether it be gay or straight or asexual or whatever, is probably the "correct" one. He's not the sort of person to hide who he is. As for the "drunken night", that also seems out of character for Ike, not to mention that Soren would probably be around to put a stop to it. Even if he did have a drunken night he probably would have moved on to new places by the time the woman realized she was pregnant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axie Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 Priam can't descend from Ike he doesn't have Aether Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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