BBM Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Alec has Pursuit though. Also does Briggid get Ichival or not? Not sure it makes a difference tbh, I'd probably put her in Lower Mid somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Unless we're going so fast we're not getting the Hero Axe I don't see how Lex is worse than Noish and Alec, or for that matter why Alec is that high when he can't do anything other than keep up. If you're taking about Diadora being ~mid for Warp/Return in one chapter and Silencing a few enemies, Lachesis definitely jumps up to above Alec, who doesn't do anything other than chip enemies all game. Azel is not promoting in Chapter 3; he'd be lucky to promote ever. Also yeah Ethlin leaves earlier but when she's around she's really good so I really don't see the point of Lex getting his own tier. Actually I think I would drop Levin and down to High and have Sylvia alone in Top. Yeah, I figured the Hero Axe would be skipped. Lex would be way higher with it (although I'd still have him a tier below Ethlin/Cuan). Alec is that high because basically you can just positive feedback the fuck out of him super early on and get him promoted in Chapter 3, but admittedly that's based on Horace's RIG HEAVY planned LTC run so could be wrong there. Lachesis might be better than Alec? I wasn't too sure where to rank her. I don't get why Levin is so good, he's just a combat oriented foot unit. There's never a time where you need Levin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moishe Oofnik Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) Alec has Pursuit though. Also does Briggid get Ichival or not? Not sure it makes a difference tbh, I'd probably put her in Lower Mid somewhere. 270 turns Getting The Ichival will cost you 0 turns overall too so yea Id put briggid in Mid she has godly PP but lack EP and not being mounted makes her mid Azel in the arena gets you levels azel probably leveled up twice in the prolouge (killing 4 axe mooks isnt hard) he can backline kills mooks in chapter 1 and 2 while your are trying to finish the chapter with a reasnoble turn count chapter 3 arena+killing some mooks(Like 6)=Promo already (and Im speaking reaching until arena 6 each arena) Azel isnt a good unit but he is better then diadora Diadoras silence can be used by other characters with B rank She exists for 1 and a half chapters hypotheticly and only heal bots and silences some units in those (ethlin healbots better aideen can do the same) so why diadora in anywhere but bottom? Yeah, I figured the Hero Axe would be skipped. Lex would be way higher with it (although I'd still have him a tier below Ethlin/Cuan). Alec is that high because basically you can just positive feedback the fuck out of him super early on and get him promoted in Chapter 3, but admittedly that's based on Horace's RIG HEAVY planned LTC run so could be wrong there. Lachesis might be better than Alec? I wasn't too sure where to rank her. I don't get why Levin is so good, he's just a combat oriented foot unit. There's never a time where you need Levin. Sigurd can solo the game to the point where what you are saying is Irelevent its like saying Why use Kieran He is just another cav Titania is better Levin is the best at what he does and is the best unit in chapter 5 his offence is better then any other character not on foot and on foot to gurrentee that spot but I consider him being in high If levin was backlining and not fronting you lose 0 turns from getting lolsety Lex gets prf hero axe basicly why shouldnt he equip it (It costs 2 turns but saves more then enough to be redeemable in its own right) thats why its hero axe tier Edited March 10, 2015 by TTPK_Tal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) Azel can't beat the myrmidons in the arenas at average stats. Sigurd can solo the game to the point where what you are saying is Irelevent its like saying Why use Kieran He is just another cav Titania is better Levin is the best at what he does and is the best unit in chapter 5 his offence is better then any other character not on foot and on foot to gurrentee that spot but I consider him being in high If levin was backlining and not fronting you lose 0 turns from getting lolsety Lex gets prf hero axe basicly why shouldnt he equip it (It costs 2 turns but saves more then enough to be redeemable in its own right) thats why its hero axe tier Sigurd soloing the game is inefficient. Kieran is better with BEXP dumps. Levin isn't the best unit in Chapter 5 by a long shot. You actually do lose turns from getting Holsety, but I assumed Levin had it when I tiered him (yeah, yeah, double standards with Lex lol). It doesn't save turns but you're right that it was unfair to say that he doesn't get it, since this is efficiency and not LTC. However he's not good enough to have his own tier. Edited March 10, 2015 by Refa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartyTheDemonSlayer Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 If he procs Magic twice (I believe? Maybe it's three times.) hw can two shot the myrmidon in chapter 1, but I don't know what is considered reliable for the purposes of this tier list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moishe Oofnik Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) If he procs Magic twice (I believe? Maybe it's three times.) hw can two shot the myrmidon in chapter 1, but I don't know what is considered reliable for the purposes of this tier list. azel has 11 mag by lvl3 3 arenas cleared level him up to 12.0 mag so 20 attack on fire (swordfighter is level4 arena) 19 might he can 3 ohko with fire that arena 4 fighter then its the fighter who is a joke and then its the elwind mage that azel has WTA over but only might win against him Ill give azel lvl 6 or 7 in arena chapter 2 (if he cant beat part 4 myrm) arena 1 steel axe lol arena 2 mahtama is weighed down way to heavily arena 3 lance knight has negative avoid azel is at 8.5~ with 13 mag again he needs 3 hits to kill the fighter so will give him that loss killing around 5~4 mooks level 10 chapter 3 arena 1 joke arena 2 joke arena 3 swordfighter but with roughly the same stats as chapter 2 one but actually this time he might win again so will give him lose lvl13 killed 4-5 mooks again chapter 4 uber raped so yea azel is going to low Edited March 10, 2015 by TTPK_Tal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yojinbo Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) With 270 turns neither the Hero Axe nor the Ichival will have to be skipped. Alec has Pursuit though. Once the Hero Sword is around it honestly isn't even a competition anymore. Charge, Critical and Hero Sword is a pretty badass combination that allows Noish to ORKO enemies at a time where Alec has grown straight up superfluous. Alec isn't really good at anything at any point of the game, his early-game chip is OK but after Ch.2 he's pretty worthless. Noish actually starts to become a good combat unit, he can play pseudo-sigurd pretty nicely and can actually fuck up late game bosses. Edit: Azel can pick up some kills between Evans and Marpha castle to gain level ups in case he hasn't procced Mag twice and try to clear the arena later. IIRC it's +2 or +3 mag to 2 shot the swordfighter. Edited March 10, 2015 by Yojinbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Once the Hero Sword is around it honestly isn't even a competition anymore. Charge, Critical and Hero Sword is a pretty badass combination that allows Noish to ORKO enemies at a time where Alec has grown straight up superfluous. Alec isn't really good at anything at any point of the game, his early-game chip is OK but after Ch.2 he's pretty worthless. Noish actually starts to become a good combat unit, he can play pseudo-sigurd pretty nicely and can actually fuck up late game bosses. Alec can ORKO with the Hero Sword. It's also easier for him to get the EXP because he can 2RKO enemies with the Steel Sword as opposed to Noish who 3RKOes them (without a Critical/two Charge procs). Noish also doesn't ORKO guaranteed with the Hero Sword while Alec does. Although this discussion might be moot since you'd probably give Sigurd the Hero Sword anyways (although you could give either of them the Hero Lance if Finn didn't take it). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) Yeah, I figured the Hero Axe would be skipped. Lex would be way higher with it (although I'd still have him a tier below Ethlin/Cuan). Alec is that high because basically you can just positive feedback the fuck out of him super early on and get him promoted in Chapter 3, but admittedly that's based on Horace's RIG HEAVY planned LTC run so could be wrong there. Lachesis might be better than Alec? I wasn't too sure where to rank her. I don't get why Levin is so good, he's just a combat oriented foot unit. There's never a time where you need Levin. Levin has the best 1-2 range in Gen 1 and can Silence stuff too after promotion (like Reptor), and if we're giving Deirde props for that we might as well give it to Levin. I might have been too enthusiastic about Levin at the beginning because of recently watching Marty's 0% growths videos but I think he's better than chumps like Noish and Alec Alec has like 30% STR and SPD growths so I don't see the positive feedback without rigging; his stats are mediocre and the best weapon he's ever going to get is a Steel Sword. You're basically counting on Pursuit to take him that far by itself. Since when does Noish get access to the Hero Sword??? That thing is Sigurd's. And besides if you give the Hero Sword to Alec he can also ORKO most things with 4 hits, more than Noish because Noish needs a skill activation. I guess if we give him the Pursuit Ring but lol. I think Fury makes much better use of the Hero Lance in Chapters 4 and 5 than Noish or Alec; there's a lot of forest in 4 and 5 has the desert so she can use it to pick off mages and stuff. Speaking of Fury I forgot about her; she can probably be in Upper Mid above Beo. Edited March 10, 2015 by BBM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Levin has the best 1-2 range in Gen 1 and can Silence stuff too after promotion (like Reptor), and if we're giving Deirde props for that we might as well give it to Levin. I might have been too enthusiastic about Levin at the beginning because of recently watching Marty's 0% growths videos but I think he's better than chumps like Noish and Alec Alec has like 30% STR and SPD growths so I don't see the positive feedback without rigging; his stats are mediocre and the best weapon he's ever going to get is a Steel Sword. You're basically counting on Pursuit to take him that far by itself. That's why Levin is above Deirdre! Well, like I said before, I might have been overrating Alec, but I'm pretty sure he still does more than Levin the grand scheme of things. I'd probably put him closer to Noish if I wasn't supremely lazy, and move Lachesis up. I guess I'll do that now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moishe Oofnik Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) That's why Levin is above Deirdre! Well, like I said before, I might have been overrating Alec, but I'm pretty sure he still does more than Levin the grand scheme of things. I'd probably put him closer to Noish if I wasn't supremely lazy, and move Lachesis up. I guess I'll do that now. alec is laughable he has speed that doesnt matter because this is fe4 your gonna double everything with a sword and pursuit he is worse then noish growth wise cant tank do anything but chip so yea noish isnt getting that hero sword beowulf does what he does just better at that point (forrest knight has hillarious boosts too) but his critical skill might make him a small but a candiate for it levin>noish>alec not even a competition levin has no competition from mages around for a while and has godly endgame offence so Im moving him down to top high so guys Aideen she inferior to ethlin her entire existence and once ethlin is out of the picture she is female claude where to rank her im thinking mid Edited March 10, 2015 by TTPK_Tal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) I pretty much agree with Refa's list. Levin doesn't really do anything of note, considering that he has his amazing offense for all of one chapter and even then he's only really useful against Reptor... and it's not like Sigurd can't take him on. Alec and Noish are kinda on par with Finn until he gets the Hero Lance. Lex is probably above them because Hero Axe. The gen 2 tier list needs to start with some combination of Celice, Leaf and Aless, followed by the dancers. Levin!Arthur's overrated, whilst he can fight he needs a lot of resources to promote early which are better spent getting Celice ready. I mean, he's up there, but stuffing resources into him early is kinda a detriment. [spoiler=El list] Top: Sigurd Nearly top: Sylvia Cuan Ethlin Fin Kinda good: Lex Lachesis Dew Levin Aideen We have horses: Midir Fury Alec Beowulf Noish We have feets: Holyn Ayra Jamka Deirdre We kinda exist tier: Azel Claude Ardan Tiltyu Edited March 10, 2015 by Shin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moishe Oofnik Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 I pretty much agree with Refa's list. Levin doesn't really do anything of note, considering that he has his amazing offense for all of one chapter and even then he's only really useful against Reptor... and it's not like Sigurd can't take him on. Alec and Noish are kinda on par with Finn until he gets the Hero Lance. Lex is probably above them because Hero Axe. The gen 2 tier list needs to start with some combination of Celice, Leaf and Aless, followed by the dancers. Levin!Arthur's overrated, whilst he can fight he needs a lot of resources to promote early which are better spent getting Celice ready. I mean, he's up there, but stuffing resources into him early is kinda a detriment. [spoiler=El list] Top: Sigurd Nearly top: Sylvia Cuan Ethlin Fin Kinda good: Lex Lachesis Dew Levin Aideen We have horses: Midir Fury Alec Beowulf Noish We have feets: Holyn Ayra Jamka Deirdre We kinda exist tier: Azel Claude Ardan Tiltyu Briggid doesnt exist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Yeah, that's probably better than my list lol. I mean, way to show me up, jerk! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Briggid doesnt exist She has feets, she could probably go there. It's kinda hard to gauge gen 1 characters because they tend to only be useful at various times. I'd argue that Alec and Noish could do more in the prologue than Lex, but by the time chapter 2 comes around they're kinda pointless. Although the same can be said for most people after chapter 3. Yeah, that's probably better than my list lol. I mean, way to show me up, jerk! No problem, bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moishe Oofnik Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 She has feets, she could probably go there. It's kinda hard to gauge gen 1 characters because they tend to only be useful at various times. I'd argue that Alec and Noish could do more in the prologue than Lex, but by the time chapter 2 comes around they're kinda pointless. Although the same can be said for most people after chapter 3. No problem, bro. Gen 2 is easier you have combat gods healbots charm bots and everything else so its easy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Gen 2 is easier you have combat gods healbots charm bots and everything else so its easy I think you missed what I said just a little bit, although perhaps entirely. In gen 2, people don't really fall off like in gen 1 since they're just about as relevant when they join as they are at endgame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yojinbo Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) I think the gen 1 tier list in the OP looks pretty good so far. Fin vs Midir vs Beowulf is something to look into though. Fury is also on a similar level so we'll probably have to take a closer look at how all the high-mid tier units should be ordered. Aira, Holyn and Jamka are probably all somewhere in mid tier, Claude and Briggid in low mid tier. Aideen could be mid tier because she has monopoly on the Warp Staff for a while and that's a turn-saver for sure. At least mid tier imo. Edit: Probably something like this: The GOAT: Sigurd Top Tier: Sylvia, Lex High Tier: Levin, Ethlin, Cuan, Lachesis, Dew High Mid Tier: Midir, Fin, Fury, Beowulf Mid Tier: Noish, Holyn, Aira, Aideen, Jamka Low Mid Tier: Briggid, Alec, Claude Low Tier: Azel, Tiltyu Bottom Tier: Ardan, Deidre Not necessarily in order. Edited March 10, 2015 by Yojinbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliban of Sycorax Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Ethlin above Levin. Mounted healing is better than lategame Holsety. Plus, Ethlin can get the Pursuit/Elite Rings, Magic Swords, and Silver Sword/Blade for Leaf to start wrecking from the crib. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Horace Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) i have no idea why Celice isn't at the top of his gen, he's far and away the best unit. Lex is only slightly better than Alec/Noish, he's really only good in chapter 2. He's pretty terrible in chapter 4 (along with most units but you have Lachesis and Sigurd so...) and chapter 5 as well. Levin really isn't good for much other than sniping random mooks and clearing arena's before he promotes, and he doesn't even do anything spectacular until he gets holsety, which is essentially chapter 5. Ethlin, Cuan, and Fin are all easily better than Lex and Levin, Lex isn't good when they aren't around, and Levin has roughly the same avalibility and is very very mediocre during most of the time. I'm also not a huge fan of Levin!Arthur, and I'd argue Leaf (and Celice) are better units than him. As good as Holsety is, overkilling something is the same as just killing something normally. Edited March 10, 2015 by General Horace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartyTheDemonSlayer Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) @TTPK_Tal on the tier list it says (IMO Best unit really Promotes at ch8 to become god) about Levin!Arthur. It's been a long time since I've used that pairing, but getting him promoted that fast seems a bit difficult without the elite ring (which is Celice's). I'm just curious on how you would do this, unless by promotes at Ch8 you mean the end of the chapter, which is reasonable. Edit: I also support moving Levin down a bit. His pre-holsety offense can still be really good (wind magic and high bases), but it's a bit unreliable without the pursuit ring. Edited March 10, 2015 by MartyTheDemonSlayer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moishe Oofnik Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 @TTPK_Tal on the tier list it says (IMO Best unit really Promotes at ch8 to become god) about Levin!Arthur. It's been a long time since I've used that pairing, but getting him promoted that fast seems a bit difficult without the elite ring (which is Celice's). I'm just curious on how you would do this, unless by promotes at Ch8 you mean the end of the chapter, which is reasonable. Edit: I also support moving Levin down a bit. His pre-holsety offense can still be really good (wind magic and high bases), but it's a bit unreliable without the pursuit ring. He is ready to promote at mid C8 basicly not start of C8 Ill let you continue talking about it and then update me on list changes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartyTheDemonSlayer Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Hmm I'd say that Celice is better then. He will do much more in chapter 6, probably contribute in chapter 7 as well, still be able to massacre everything in 8,9, and 10 (overkill is still kill), and have an advantage in the end game because Levn!Arthur is at a risk of being put to sleep. He does take lots of resources, but there's no better candidate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omglmaowtf Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Levn!Arthur will need lots of resources i.e. rings to be on equal level with Levn!Sety. Remember Levn!Arthur has no Pursuit, without Pursuit Ring no way he survives against final chapter Ishtar or peg trio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yojinbo Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) I'm not sold on Levin!Arthur being top tier either. I think somewhere near the top of high tier would be more appropriate. Edit: The only units that can rival Celice as the best unit of generation 2 are Leaf and Laylea because of Rescuedancehax. Edited March 10, 2015 by Yojinbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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