Book of Ereshkigal Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 In the bottom 2 spoilers, units are NOT paired up. Furthermore, why would pair up REDUCE a unit's stats? You may need to slow down to allow your armor knight buddy to keep up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomSwordmaster Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 You may need to slow down to allow your armor knight buddy to keep up. Then it would debuff Mov. Not Res. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bovinian Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 ^ About Suzukaze not being able to dual strike while adjacent to Kamui, I wonder if they finally fixed it so that dual strikes are only possible if the supporting unit can normally attack from that range? Have there been any screenshots that disprove this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 I actually quite like 3-P; it's relatively short and gets its cinematic intend across really well. I liked the feel of you being a small strike force helping the actual lord of the map (Skrimir) accomplish the victory condition. 3-E is also cinematic, but I do agree it drags on too long. You don't feel like you're helping do anything, you're just watching a clock move steadily forward until a key event can happen. I enjoyed it well enough the first time because of the feel of dread (I liked the comments of various characters interspersed throughout the fight at various kill thresholds) and wondering what was going to happen, but it certainly drags on replays.The problem is that most people don't play games for the "cinematic experience", they play games to play games. Even on Hard Mode you don't actually need to do anything in 3-E because Skrimir and Tibarn's forces will get you to 80 kills eventually, and the only reason you have to do anything in 3-P is because Skrimir's forces won't attack the boss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cysx Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) In the bottom 2 spoilers, units are NOT paired up. Furthermore, why would pair up REDUCE a unit's stats? I'm quite sure for the bottom 2 spoilers, the stat changes are caused by the weapons (except for Aqua's Luck +4), as some weapons say that they are harder to double with (-spd?) but are stronger, some reduce chance of enemy critting (+luck?). No, they're not paired up. What I was saying is that possibly, since dual attacking is now activated through having allies on adjacent spaces, maybe having allies on adjacent spaces gives you stat modifiers as well. A knight giving a big boost to defense and a slight malus to resistance doesn't seem impossible either. As for the speed, it just doesn't make sense. It may be from one of Kamui's skills, that's all I've got. Otherwise, indeed, the weapon, although + def and res(in Aqua's case) from a bronze weapon is a bit... weird. Basically the point was, nothing can really be confirmed through what I've observed, but it's still food for thought nevertheless. Also, there are no instances of speed being visibly lowered on these shots. ^ About Suzukaze not being able to dual strike while adjacent to Kamui, I wonder if they finally fixed it so that dual strikes are only possible if the supporting unit can normally attack from that range? Have there been any screenshots that disprove this? I think I can help a bit right there. Both Kamuis are attacking from 1 range, and both of the supporting units are using different lances. How likely it is for both to have 1-2 range is for you to decide. Not 100% proof, unsure there's anything else though. Edit: Here's something else actually, in that shot, Kazahana is using the same weapon from when she was alone, an iron katana, and Kamui is, again, attacking from 1 range: ... so unless iron katanas have 1-2 range... Actually, looking through the old material with the knowledge that they can't be paired-up, I can see a few other examples, but I think that's enough...? Edited May 17, 2015 by Cysx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 Looking at the difficulty selection menu again, I think it's possible that Lunatic is the highest difficulty. Unlike Awakening, it doesn't say it's for "expert players" or something along that line, this time it just simply describes Lunatic as "for people seeking the hardest level" (最難関を求める方に). This somewhat makes sense since I don't think a Lunatic+ system similar to Awakening would work really well with this game (imagine having to break through a wall of dual-striking enemies with Luna+, Vantage+, Hawkeye etc. in 5 turns). However, it seems the menu has perfectly enough space for another extra mode though, so I don't know... For reference, this is what the Lunatic+ menu for Japanese Awakening is: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neoleo21 Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 Make FE12 H4 0% growths look attractive, and I'll be on board. Awakening's Lunatic can be beaten by funneling enough experience into Robin such that he/she becomes so far ahead of the level/stat curve that he/she can realistically take on all enemies, and live. I'd like to see if this was "solved" in this game. This is close to being fixed, as Kamui himself doesn't have the veteran skill which created the balance issue that Awakening had and I don't think he'll be able to reclass to whatever he wants like Robin could either (so no super OP early game tomes and even then the Dark magic tomes will probably get balanced out). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bovinian Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) Well for the screenshots that don't show the map, they could be actually paired up in which case they'd be standing on the same square. But looking at the one where Elphy is dual striking from adjacent to Kamui, it's probably more likely than not that dual strikes work regardless of range. Looking at this screenshot again, is it just me, or is the enemy's WTD hit rate with that steel axe-equivalent kanabo really freaking high? Edited May 17, 2015 by Bovinian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Holy Elf Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 The problem is that most people don't play games for the "cinematic experience", they play games to play games. Even on Hard Mode you don't actually need to do anything in 3-E because Skrimir and Tibarn's forces will get you to 80 kills eventually, and the only reason you have to do anything in 3-P is because Skrimir's forces won't attack the boss. People play games for many reasons, and in the case of a (strategy) RPG like Fire Emblem that's going to include story (and story presentation) for a lot of people. I'll take a few maps like these over an endless array of "and then Marth's forces stomped another forgettable enemy army into dirt", myself. And, honestly, the worst map in FE10 for "you don't have to do anything" is 3-7 (the river crossing map as Ike), since there isn't even a cinematic excuse there. You can literally hit end turn and kill a few stragglers and win, and the battle serves minimal story purpose. You don't have to do much in 3-P, no, but it is short and there is a BExp reward for doing more. 3-E I've already conceded isn't much fun after the first playthrough, but I don't think you should poo-poo the effect it has for a first-time player. If it didn't work for you, I'm sorry, but at least you should be able to see and respect what they were going for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cysx Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 Well for the screenshots that don't show the map, they could be actually paired up in which case they'd be standing on the same square. But looking at the one where Elphy is dual striking from adjacent to Kamui, it's probably more likely than not that dual strikes work regardless of range. Looking at this screenshot again, is it just me, or is the enemy's WTD hit rate with that steel axe-equivalent kanabo really freaking high? It is apparently now impossible to dual attack from pair up, which is why these examples were relevant. Otherwise, Elphie could be using some kind of javelin, so it wouldn't prove anything. Also, 66% accuracy doesn't seem that low for an axe-user in that situation... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryo Posted May 17, 2015 Author Share Posted May 17, 2015 Could the reason why Suzukaze cannot dual strike was because he's not equipping any weapon? I don't think that's the case but certainly possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bovinian Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) Also, 66% accuracy doesn't seem that low for an axe-user in that situation... Idk, I was assuming that the screenshots would showcase gameplay on Normal difficulty, so it seemed a little high to me. We're talking Kamui getting 2HKOed by a generic enemy after all... Maybe I'm just too used to enemies being scrubs lol (been playing a lot of FE7 lately) Edited May 17, 2015 by Bovinian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cysx Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) Could the reason why Suzukaze cannot dual strike was because he's not equipping any weapon? I don't think that's the case but certainly possible. You're right, it is. Idk, I was assuming that the screenshots would showcase gameplay on Normal difficulty, so it seemed a little high to me. We're talking Kamui getting 2HKOed by a generic enemy after all... Maybe I'm just too used to enemies being scrubs lol (been playing a lot of FE7 lately) Yes, if that's normal mode I agree, the damage is a bit surprising. Both have 4% critical too. Edited May 17, 2015 by Cysx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryo Posted May 17, 2015 Author Share Posted May 17, 2015 In fact, in all of the 2 vs. 2 battles we've seen so far, the protagonist is always close to death just trying to beat a single damn mook (and none of them actually dies in one round either, thanks to the now nerfed damage). I'm tempted to select Phoenix mode now... ಠ_ಠ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodperson707 Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 ^ do we have the stats if Kaimui for this battle? Kaimui could be underleveled or low stated, it is a demo. Also the damage dosent surprise me that much awakening units tend to have lower defences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryo Posted May 17, 2015 Author Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) I don't think Kamui's underleveled since he has 24 HP (most enemies on that map and Elfie also have 20~29 HP), he could definitively be Def-screwed though. Edited May 17, 2015 by Ryo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bovinian Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) ^ do we have the stats if Kaimui for this battle? Kaimui could be underleveled or low stated, it is a demo. Also the damage dosent surprise me that much awakening units tend to have lower defences. One of the first impressions I got from the very first screenshot of the status screen we saw, was that Kamui had a pretty amazing (unbuffed) 16 Str at level 11. EDIT: also 14 Def that includes some sort of buff. And he has 25 HP at that level Edited May 17, 2015 by Bovinian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) People play games for many reasons, and in the case of a (strategy) RPG like Fire Emblem that's going to include story (and story presentation) for a lot of people. I'll take a few maps like these over an endless array of "and then Marth's forces stomped another forgettable enemy army into dirt", myself. And, honestly, the worst map in FE10 for "you don't have to do anything" is 3-7 (the river crossing map as Ike), since there isn't even a cinematic excuse there. You can literally hit end turn and kill a few stragglers and win, and the battle serves minimal story purpose. You don't have to do much in 3-P, no, but it is short and there is a BExp reward for doing more. 3-E I've already conceded isn't much fun after the first playthrough, but I don't think you should poo-poo the effect it has for a first-time player. If it didn't work for you, I'm sorry, but at least you should be able to see and respect what they were going for. This has little to do with my original point that people complain about FE10 being slow because you spent large amounts of time watching NPCs fight other NPCs Edited May 17, 2015 by Paperblade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arvilino Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 Well for the screenshots that don't show the map, they could be actually paired up in which case they'd be standing on the same square. But looking at the one where Elphy is dual striking from adjacent to Kamui, it's probably more likely than not that dual strikes work regardless of range. Looking at this screenshot again, is it just me, or is the enemy's WTD hit rate with that steel axe-equivalent kanabo really freaking high? I'm guessing his actual hit rate is 56% and probably getting an extra 10 hit rate from the adjacent enemy given they're the same class with probably the same level(due to the critical rate and the 5 points of difference in hit). if the dual attack damage is half then the other guy might be wielding the iron equivalent which might have 5 more hit and 4 less might. It's hard to guess whether the hit is unexpectedly high because we don't know how fast Kamui is and their critical rate could either Kamui's low luck, them having high skill(and therefore hit) or both of them having Zeal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NinjaMonkey Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) This has little to do with my original point that people complain about FE10 being slow because you spent large amounts of time watching NPCs fight other NPCs Pro Tip: If you press the A button, it speeds them up. Edited May 17, 2015 by NinjaMonkey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aura Of Twilight Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 Pro Tip: If you press the A button, it speeds them up. Where's that like button when you need it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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