Spoiler Free Discussion Thread

[Soledge]

Gunther is a Jagen, I'm pretty sure. Don't know about the rest, but you can check characters/growth rates on the main site if you don't care about that stuff being spoiled.

Well I don't want to find out which ones will return, I want to see if people want them to return at all.

I personally want an Est character since I enjoy training them but I don't want Cain and Abel duos to return.

[Sylphid]

Out of curiosity, Do you guys think that the traditional archetypes (Cain and Abel, Jeigen, Est) will return and which ones do you personally don't want to return?

I don't believe in most archetypes, but:

Saizou and Suzukaze seem to be the Cain and Abel duo of this game. Interestingly enough we actually get Cain and Abel being enemies if you go to Nohr.

Gunter's growth make him the epitome of Jagen imo. Heck, his growth are almost as low as the very first Jagen himself...

None of the late-game characters seem to fitthe Est though. Well, I remember seeing some discussion on wether or not Donnel is an Est, so if he is I suppose so would be Mozume...

EDIT: I just checked the other FE wiki's archetype article, they've already added some FE14 character there.

Aside from what I listed above (minus Mozume) I spotted Sakura as Lena, Tsukuyomi as Merric and Elise as Ethlyn

Also, the two nations themselves fit the Arran and Samson archetype =P

OH ok. I do like that there seems to be a set cap rather than the really high cap of Awakening, although I only grinded post-game to get supports so I wasn't annoyed by grinding as other people.

Yea, and about Revenant Knight. I just realized (since I never paid much attention to differences between classes in each game) that overbearing is basically special made for fighting Hoshido since there are only 3 mounted classes (maybe 4 if puppeteer counts). It's a nice little touch.

Have you seen Herb Merchant's skills? Skills allowing boosted healing and acting after healing would great skills to pass on to any kids. Totally redeems the face it's called Herb Merchant.

The only class whose skill I was disappointed by was Bow Knight. It feels like Rally Skill and KunaiBreaker make it's role to situational but maybe that was their point.

I probably wouldn't have minded the stat inflation otherwise, but I bought DLC I haven't to this day finished because I didn't want to grind... =/

Yeah, that's a nice touch. Didn't think of that before. Maybe Golden-Kite Warrior is Hoshido's counter to this class since they are basically an anti-air flyer? They lose in weapon triangle though...

About Herb merchant, I don't know if I'll want to use two skill slots for item boosts... They're definitely interesting though. Acting after using an item seems really nice though, but boosted healing might become obsolete if healing items already heal a huge bunch. And if they heal only little, the 50% boost might not be worth it. I would guess the localization changes it to just Merchant tbh.

Agreed on Bow Knight, although Kunaibreaker would be good if there were more kunai users... Not that I actually know how many there are, we could face hordes and hordes of maids and ninja for all I know. Doesn't seem like a class I want to keep my units in for long though...

On personal skills side there're a couple I find dissapointing, but won't go into detail here.

Edited June 29, 2015 by Sylphid

[Soledge]

I don't believe in most archetypes, but:

Saizou and Suzukaze seem to be the Cain and Abel duo of this game. Interestingly enough we actually get Cain and Abel being enemies if you go to Nohr.

Gunter's growth make him the epitome of Jagen imo. Heck, his growth are almost as low as the very first Jagen himself...

None of the late-game characters seem to fitthe Est though. Well, I remember seeing some discussion on wether or not Donnel is an Est, so if he is I suppose so would be Mozume...

EDIT: I just checked the other FE wiki's archetype article, they've already added some FE14 character there.

Aside from what I listed above (minus Mozume) I spotted Sakura as Lena, Tsukuyomi as Merric and Elise as Ethlyn

Also, the two nations themselves fit the Arran and Samson archetype =P .

Gunter does look as old as Jaegan, fe6 Marcus is the only other Jaegan to be as old if not older.

I personally hope that the fewiki is just making very broad assumptions with the archetypes, I hope they're just Gameplay archetypes not the characters personalities...

[Sylphid]

I personally hope that the fewiki is just making very broad assumptions with the archetypes, I hope they're just Gameplay archetypes not the characters personalities...

At this point I like to think it's still at guessing point, but with the whole game + unreleased content hacked... No idea.

Funny, I prefer most story/personality archetypes to gameplay ones myself. I especially hate "first character of class X" ones with passion

[BlueL]

I probably wouldn't have minded the stat inflation otherwise, but I bought DLC I haven't to this day finished because I didn't want to grind... =/

Yeah, that's a nice touch. Didn't think of that before. Maybe Golden-Kite Warrior is Hoshido's counter to this class since they are basically an anti-air flyer? They lose in weapon triangle though...

About Herb merchant, I don't know if I'll want to use two skill slots for item boosts... They're definitely interesting though. Acting after using an item seems really nice though, but boosted healing might become obsolete if healing items already heal a huge bunch. And if they heal only little, the 50% boost might not be worth it. I would guess the localization changes it to just Merchant tbh.

Agreed on Bow Knight, although Kunaibreaker would be good if there were more kunai users... Not that I actually know how many there are, we could face hordes and hordes of maids and ninja for all I know. Doesn't seem like a class I want to keep my units in for long though...

On personal skills side there're a couple I find dissapointing, but won't go into detail here.

Well the DLC is exactly how I grinded. Isn't EXPonential Growth how everyone grinded?

Hmmm that's an interesting question. I hadn't even recognized having access to tomes buffs one a traditional weakness of the wyvern class (still memorizing the new WTA). But bow's advantage over fliers might be enough to make it effectively neutral hit and might-wise against Revenant Knights despite having a weapon type disadvantage.

On a similar note, Fox Spirit might be the slightly inferior version of Revenant Knight (if horse-riding classes still count as beasts) since 9 of Hoshido's classes involve beasts. Not that I didn't already plan to use foxy boy since Fox Spirit and it's evolution look so cool.

And yea the skill allowing moving after healing is definitely better (Household cure), although the other one could be useful with items like holy water that raise resistance. Although it would likely be for niche uses only.

Yea I agree on Bowknight, it will definitely be my last reclassing option so that way I can spend the minimal amount of time in it.

And yea I'm avoiding personal skills since I don't want to know any characters not named pre-release.

[Ayra]

I just finished Hoshido Hard with basically no grind... It's harder than Awakening on Hard, especially near the end. Much harder. Just an advanced warning!

[Mister Cold]

I just finished Hoshido Hard with basically no grind... It's harder than Awakening on Hard, especially near the end. Much harder. Just an advanced warning!

That's good to hear.

Awakening Hard was a joke.

[eclipse]

I just finished Hoshido Hard with basically no grind... It's harder than Awakening on Hard, especially near the end. Much harder. Just an advanced warning!

As time goes on, I'm sure there will be various strategies in regards to weapons/pairings/other stuff that'll make some of the first-time difficulty ease off. I remember when Awakening's Lunatic was hailed as one of the hardest modes, but thanks to knowledge of how everything works, only the first bit is ridiculous.

I have my own thoughts as to what I wish would've happened, in terms of choices, but it toes the line as to what's acceptable in this thread, IMO. I'll gladly discuss it via PM with whoever doesn't mind a bit of plot spoilers (which were revealed before the spoiler cutoff).

[Sylphid]

Well the DLC is exactly how I grinded. Isn't EXPonential Growth how everyone grinded?

Hmmm that's an interesting question. I hadn't even recognized having access to tomes buffs one a traditional weakness of the wyvern class (still memorizing the new WTA). But bow's advantage over fliers might be enough to make it effectively neutral hit and might-wise against Revenant Knights despite having a weapon type disadvantage.

On a similar note, Fox Spirit might be the slightly inferior version of Revenant Knight (if horse-riding classes still count as beasts) since 9 of Hoshido's classes involve beasts. Not that I didn't already plan to use foxy boy since Fox Spirit and it's evolution look so cool.

And yea the skill allowing moving after healing is definitely better (Household cure), although the other one could be useful with items like holy water that raise resistance. Although it would likely be for niche uses only.

Yea I agree on Bowknight, it will definitely be my last reclassing option so that way I can spend the minimal amount of time in it.

And yea I'm avoiding personal skills since I don't want to know any characters not named pre-release.

I did use it, yes, but that got tedious pretty fast. Yeah, I just don't like grinding most of the time.

Don't bows only get damage multiplier against flyers? Not that any added avoid Revenant Knight gets from WTA is likely to help them avoid bows anyways. Hopefully. Anyways, I was more just commenting how interesting comparing some of the counterpart classes of each nation can get, not really complaining about the class themselves. Though aside from the flyers I mostly see the trend of Hoshido having speedier but weaker or less durable classes. So Hoshido is female and Nohr is male if older FEs are anything to go by

Also yeah, Beastbane seems much more useful for Hoshido than Nohr, though it's not bad for either.

... If I want someone to end up as Bow Knight, I'll get enough skills so I won't have to use Bow Knight ones first =P

That's seriously the only way I can see myself using Bow Knights right now. Unless of course lots of strong enemy ninjas appear regularly on Nohr route, in which case that Kunaibreaker will come in handy.

[Frelia]

Thank you for making this thread op. It is nice to see a FE14 related forum that talks about the game without spoilers. I have begun to plan my avatar's assets and flaws and for Nohr especially I am thinking of going +mag -luck to help Kamui be able to use black magic/healing rods decently. And since I really don't want to restart an entire chapter over and over again especially with Nohr I might try casual mode for the first time.

Edited June 30, 2015 by Eevonee

[Mister Cold]

Thank you for making this thread op. It is nice to see a FE14 related forum that talks about the game without spoilers. I have begun to plan my avatar's assets and flaws and for Nohr especially I am thinking of going +mag -luck to help Kamui be able to use black magic/healing rods decently. And since I really don't want to restart an entire chapter over and over again especially with Nohr I might try casual mode for the first time.

+ dragonstones use magic now.

Always usefull.

[Frelia]

+ dragonstones use magic now.

Always usefull.

+dragonstones use magic in this game? Thanks for telling me that. I will most definitely go +mag -luck for all of my avatars. I was thinking of +speed at first, but with kamui's good speed growth it doesn't really seem necessary. Magic most certainly does not look like a stat you can dump out in this game unless you really want to.

Edited June 30, 2015 by Eevonee

[Soen]

I did use it, yes, but that got tedious pretty fast. Yeah, I just don't like grinding most of the time.

Don't bows only get damage multiplier against flyers? Not that any added avoid Revenant Knight gets from WTA is likely to help them avoid bows anyways. Hopefully. Anyways, I was more just commenting how interesting comparing some of the counterpart classes of each nation can get, not really complaining about the class themselves. Though aside from the flyers I mostly see the trend of Hoshido having speedier but weaker or less durable classes. So Hoshido is female and Nohr is male if older FEs are anything to go by

Also yeah, Beastbane seems much more useful for Hoshido than Nohr, though it's not bad for either.

... If I want someone to end up as Bow Knight, I'll get enough skills so I won't have to use Bow Knight ones first =P

That's seriously the only way I can see myself using Bow Knights right now. Unless of course lots of strong enemy ninjas appear regularly on Nohr route, in which case that Kunaibreaker will come in handy.

EXPonetial Growth is useful in the earlygame, but after that it's better to go with Lost Bloodlines 3. There are 50 enemies and a fort right near your starting point. Just fly Chrom away from action(I bring him on the mountains in the north-west with a Deliverer Cherche, the only enemy who might bother you is Catria). And when you've completed the map you get a Paragon scroll. But overall the process is still really teadious and boring.

In Fates the calculations for damaging an opponent with an effective weapon have changed a little bit. Here's how it changed:

Damage in FE1/13 = Str/Mag + (Weapon Might * 3) - Enemy's Def/Res

Damage in FE14 = (Str/Mag + Weapon Might) * 3 - Enemy's Def/Res

Now it's much more powerful. It's true that a Revenant Knight always has an advantage over a Bow user, but if the Bow hits, the RK is most surely dead.

Yeah, Bow Knight's skills are still disappointing. But the class overall seems better IMHO when compared to Awakening's one. BK are now Outlaws' promotion, a a Thief on a horse is really a useful unit, with Locktouch and Mov+1 really helping the class. Plus, BK's caps aren't bad at all. Str is a little low, but Spd and Skl are great, and Res is above average.

[CocoaGalaxy]

Wait a minute, are you sure about that? I don't recall Takumi having 50s in the numbers, it seems a bit too good to be true

I also recall the wyrmslayer guys still doing about 10 damage, if they had those calculations, either they have rubbish str to go with the equation, or they were specced to do 30 damage?

Edited June 30, 2015 by CocoaGalaxy

[Soen]

Takumi? He can't reclass into a Bow Knight. What I said about the class was based on the Maximum Stats page on the site.

About the calculation for effective weapons, it was written on a Famitsu issue some weeks ago. But I haven't played nor seen the game, so I'm not 100% sure. Sorry, I should have specified that.

[CocoaGalaxy]

I'll put it on my list of things to check when I rewatch the streams (not that I have that much time to watch the stream boo hoo, on the plus/bad side, it seems progress is still going along steadily).

As it stands, it sounds too good to be true (and horrifying as well for...reasons you'll know)

I've yet to see effective damage break the 40 mark (a Silver bow, strength = def equals about 40+ damage, if it were the so called new formula it'd be dealing what, ..at least 50 or 60), so I don't think that's true.

Edited June 30, 2015 by CocoaGalaxy

[Sylphid]

EXPonetial Growth is useful in the earlygame, but after that it's better to go with Lost Bloodlines 3. There are 50 enemies and a fort right near your starting point. Just fly Chrom away from action(I bring him on the mountains in the north-west with a Deliverer Cherche, the only enemy who might bother you is Catria). And when you've completed the map you get a Paragon scroll. But overall the process is still really teadious and boring.

In Fates the calculations for damaging an opponent with an effective weapon have changed a little bit. Here's how it changed:

Damage in FE1/13 = Str/Mag + (Weapon Might * 3) - Enemy's Def/Res

Damage in FE14 = (Str/Mag + Weapon Might) * 3 - Enemy's Def/Res

Now it's much more powerful. It's true that a Revenant Knight always has an advantage over a Bow user, but if the Bow hits, the RK is most surely dead.

Yeah, Bow Knight's skills are still disappointing. But the class overall seems better IMHO when compared to Awakening's one. BK are now Outlaws' promotion, a a Thief on a horse is really a useful unit, with Locktouch and Mov+1 really helping the class. Plus, BK's caps aren't bad at all. Str is a little low, but Spd and Skl are great, and Res is above average.

Hmm, I'll try that out if I decide to replay Awakening while waiting for Fates.

I'm kind of hesitant to believe those numbers too... But if that's correct, ouch.

I actually forgot to factor in the Thief skills for Bow Knight. that Mov+1 seems nice, and thieves riding horses sounds fun. caps certainly look smarter than what Awakening's Bow Knight had even if their hats were more awesome

[Soen]

I noticed one thing while looking in the Maximum Stats... I'll put it under spoiler but I really don't think it is. After all, it's about gameplay and it's a minor thing.

It seems that Weapon Level caps are changed. S is back, but only Trueblades, Holy Lancers, Holy Bowmen, Elite Ninjas, Berserkers and Sorcerers can obtain it with the weapon they use. Nine-tailed Fox and Managarmr can obtain S Stones, but the Avatar can't. The other classes can use two or more weapons, but they can only get A rank in one weapon. The weapon is already determined, so it's a different system, compared to the GBA one. The only exceptions to this are White and Black Blood, who can get A Swords/Stones and Paladin, who can get A Swords/Lances.

Edited June 30, 2015 by Soen

[Bovinian]

Yeah, it was established that classes specializing in a single type of weapon are the ones to get S ranks, presumably to make them stand out more from classes that can use multiple weapon types. Elite Ninjas/Maids/Butlers are the exception because there is no promoted class that specializes in only hidden weapons or staves.

[Taka-kun]

Who is the moderator for this topic? Is it okay to discuss revealed gameplay elements as long they are not story-related?

I like how Robin got retconned in his Grandmaster class where he only has an A rank in magic and B rank in swords, making him more of a good mage instead of an average swordsman (which is kinda how I pictured him to be).

[Blaze The Great]

Who is the moderator for this topic? Is it okay to discuss revealed gameplay elements as long they are not story-related?

I like how Robin got retconned in his Grandmaster class where he only has an A rank in magic and B rank in swords, making him more of a good mage instead of an average swordsman (which is kinda how I pictured him to be).

Well I've seen eclipse on this topic earlier, but she hasn't been here in a few days. As far as I know, non-story spoilers are fair game, but keep them in spoiler tags just in case.

[Soen]

I put the info under spoiler for that exact reason. But again, I feel that it's such a minor thing that it shouldn't be consiedered a spoiler.

Shadowofchaos has started a translation of the game. That will make avoiding spoilers much more difficult, IMO. But damn does he have a lot of patience and will.

[eclipse]

Well I've seen eclipse on this topic earlier, but she hasn't been here in a few days. As far as I know, non-story spoilers are fair game, but keep them in spoiler tags just in case.

Good to know that I'm appreciated.

I let classes/growths slide, and since weapon ranks are part of classes, I'll let that slide, too. If TC says otherwise, he can either announce it here, or let me know!

[BravuraLevi]

I noticed one thing while looking in the Maximum Stats... I'll put it under spoiler but I really don't think it is. After all, it's about gameplay and it's a minor thing.

It seems that Weapon Level caps are changed. S is back, but only Trueblades, Holy Lancers, Holy Bowmen, Elite Ninjas, Berserkers and Sorcerers can obtain it with the weapon they use. Nine-tailed Fox and Managarmr can obtain S Stones, but the Avatar can't. The other classes can use two or more weapons, but they can only get A rank in one weapon. The weapon is already determined, so it's a different system, compared to the GBA one. The only exceptions to this are White and Black Blood, who can get A Swords/Stones and Paladin, who can get A Swords/Lances.

Thats... actually pretty awesome(As long as it isn't like awakening, where literally only the mani katti, amatsu, the long and double bows were exclusive to specialist classes), except for paladins, getting double A's. As much as I love them, they've been (Along with Wyvern Lords and Heroes) The most consistently. good class in the series, no need to give them a buff.

Edited June 30, 2015 by BravuraLevi

[Taka-kun]

Good to know that I'm appreciated.

I let classes/growths slide, and since weapon ranks are part of classes, I'll let that slide, too. If TC says otherwise, he can either announce it here, or let me know!

Very well, good to know, thanks.

Since we got this rolling, and the people in this topic are really polite and I kinda like it here, what does people plan for Avatar's second class? I am thinking of having Samurai, so that my Avatar can further evolve his swordstyle and be a wannabe-Ryoma :)

As a side note, let's not discuss personal skills of characters not revealed in the Famitsu (or the characters at all), I believe that would count as spoilers.