nocturnal YL Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 (edited) Did Leon really "settle on" anyone? Because I don't recally having read anything like that. Just fan speculation of what goes between the lines, I guess? And I still don't get the "oh no, incest!" thing, personally. Fire Emblem is the least surprising place for this. Edited November 30, 2015 by nocturnal YL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Book of Ereshkigal Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 I don't really care about incest, my problem with Fates is how casually everyone doesn't care when Kamui does his weird pseudo-incest stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ebony Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Don't know what to say about the thing with Leo... still doesn't wreck my ships though it does make him even more interesting. And I kind of feel bad for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abvora Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 (edited) Leo never explicitly states he settles, but I can kinda see where some people are coming from since most of his S-supports lack a certain...spark. He doesn't really have chemistry with most of his partners. That in and of itself doesn't necessarily mean he's settling--it could mean he's just asexual or bad at emotional stuff--but combine it with the forbidden love for his sister and I can understand why people would jump to that conclusion. I'm kind of torn on how to feel on this. On the one hand, I think it would legitimately interesting if this were a major part of his character in the game, exploring his struggles with a taboo feeling and his fears over it getting out. On the other hand, sibling incest is still pretty gross, and I feel like including it in this game undermines the theme of family it was aiming for. Edited November 30, 2015 by Abvora Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ebony Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 I'm kind of torn on how to feel on this. On the one hand I think it would legitimately interesting if this were a major part of his character in the game, exploring his struggles with a taboo feeling and his fears over it getting out. On the other hand, sibling incest is still pretty gross, even if it is Fire Emblem and even if it is just a game. I honestly don't get the shock of people and them dropping their fondness of Leo just for it. I'm not big on Camilla but I wasn't big on her only after this. Plus, I mean, like others have said... it's neither the first time this has happened or the "worst." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Or maybe Leon seems to lack a spark with his female S-supports because there doesn't really seem to be any woman he could marry who seems to "fit" with him as nicely. Ryouma and Crimson have some nice on-screen chemistry (they should have had supports). Takumi and Oboro are lord and subordinate, they have a mutual crush on each other and their supports have a lot of chemistry. There are some lord-subordinate or subordinate-subordinate pairs with non-forced S-supports, because they'd have to interact with one another quite often. Leon only has male retainers, and he's not particularly close to any of his siblings' female retainers. All of the women he has a close relationship with are his sisters, and Kamui is female only 50% of the time and Kamui is "special" anyway. It's possible that Leon lacks a spark because the marriage system is kind of forced in this game anyway and romance isn't his character's main priority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyanko Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 I don't understand why people would stop liking Leo for this either. My irritation lies fully with IS or whoever's idea it was in the first place. It's not really prevalent in-game, thank goodness, other than maybe being hinted at in his and Camilla's supports. I've found with this game I'll have to overlook a lot of things I'm disappointed in or dislike to actually enjoy it and the characters. This will just be one more thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pretty_Handsome Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 What is with this incest stuff? Bad enough you can romance the Royal Siblings and marry your cousin Azura but c'mon... Even the Royals wanna sleep with each other? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoboKD001 Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 (edited) I don't understand why leon's fangirls would get mad at this. I mean, Leon is like my no 1 husbando and Joker is second but when i learn about this last night, I'm just shocked xDEDIT: nvm i got it thank god they changed the suzukaze thing Edited November 30, 2015 by LoboKD001 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pretty_Handsome Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Eh, I would have preferred that Kaze not be saveable on Hoshido route. Heck, Hoshido could have used a bit higher death tolls with all things considered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoboKD001 Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Eh, maybe.and that rubbing thing: ...wow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thane Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Alright, I'm convinced: the writers of Intelligent Systems either don't have any siblings at all so they have no idea how utterly creepy this is, or they DO have siblings, in which case I'd advise them to seek out a therapist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanima Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 While I certainly could have done without that revelation, it's not going to change the fact that Leon is one of my favourite characters. I think most of those abandoning ship are just angry that their husbando loves someone besides them Kamui. This makes me interested how the poll would have turned out if they had released this book earlier. Also I would have preferred Kaze's death to unavoidable. It adds more drama and it would have given them the opportunity to work it better into the story, outside of that one cutscene. Does Saizou even say anything if Suzukaze dies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The DanMan Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Alright, I'm convinced: the writers of Intelligent Systems either don't have any siblings at all so they have no idea how utterly creepy this is, or they DO have siblings, in which case I'd advise them to seek out a therapist. The thing is, it kind of makes sense... the concubine wars curbed the Westermark effect, and it falls in line with some of his interactions and supports in-game. It's just on top of everything else that things get really stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryo Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 (edited) Also I would have preferred Kaze's death to unavoidable. It adds more drama and it would have given them the opportunity to work it better into the story, outside of that one cutscene. Does Saizou even say anything if Suzukaze dies? No. And considering that Saizou doesn't really have much of a reaction towards Kaze's defection in Conquest, I highly doubt they would add anything major here either, regardless of whether his death is canon or not. Edited November 30, 2015 by Ryo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Alright, I'm convinced: the writers of Intelligent Systems either don't have any siblings at all so they have no idea how utterly creepy this is, or they DO have siblings, in which case I'd advise them to seek out a therapist. According to an impromptu (and likely inaccurate) google research, the fertility rate of Japan is 1.4 children per women. Which means that I'm sure there are lots of only children in Japan. Therapists are always a good investment, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Time the Crestfallen Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 To be honest, I'm not as bothered by Leo's feeling for Camilla than I am by some other things in the game. If nothing else, it's an interesting twist to his character that might've actually been interesting to explore. The problem is that I'm just so tired of the constant incest/incestuous implications in this game! Like, this is actually starting to make real-life medieval royalty look tame by comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thane Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 The thing is, it kind of makes sense... the concubine wars curbed the Westermark effect, and it falls in line with some of his interactions and supports in-game. It's just on top of everything else that things get really stupid. And I'm sure that's exactly what the writers were going for, along with the rest of the potential incest: a deep, hidden meaning and not a cheap way to exploit a popular fetish in Japan. I already considered this the worst video game story of all time, but it just KEEPS GOING! According to an impromptu (and likely inaccurate) google research, the fertility rate of Japan is 1.4 children per women. Which means that I'm sure there are lots of only children in Japan. Therapists are always a good investment, too. It is a very real problem for the entire country, and it looms over them every day. Couple that with a very conservative and unhealthy working mentality at a lot of companies, and you get people who live within their own little bubble. That said, if you can't even understand or stand basic human interaction, then you will most likely never write a very good story, just like Mr. Miyazaki said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Pretty much, yeah. Leon can't S-support Camilla, no matter what, and he wouldn't be the first person in Fire Emblem (even if we exclude the rest of Fates) to have incestual undertones with a sibling. Leon's crush on Camilla is probably the least scandalous and/or creepy incest-related thing in this game. It's just that there's so much incest and pseudo-incest here already that you have to wonder WTF anyone who worked on this game was even on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thane Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Pretty much, yeah. Leon can't S-support Camilla, no matter what, and he wouldn't be the first person in Fire Emblem (even if we exclude the rest of Fates) to have incestual undertones with a sibling. Leon's crush on Camilla is probably the least scandalous and/or creepy incest-related thing in this game. It's just that there's so much incest and pseudo-incest here already that you have to wonder WTF anyone who worked on this game was even on. I'll tell you what they were NOT on. Writing classes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryo Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 I would love to see how FE15 turns out :p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 I'll tell you what they were NOT on. Writing classes. I thought writing classes were something you were IN, not ON But yeah, at this point I'm just too tired to be disappointed or to even care anymore. All in all, FE14 is looking to be very likely my last FE game ;/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exizel Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Does someone know how Leon's japanese fanbase is reacting to this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Does someone know how Leon's japanese fanbase is reacting to this? They exploded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thane Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 I would love to see how FE15 turns out :p Honestly, I'm morbidly curious as well. I wonder how the West will react once it's released over here. At this point they might as well stop with the fake conflicts and just give us a high school dating sim with Amie interaction and be done with it and get it out of their system. I thought writing classes were something you were IN, not ON But yeah, at this point I'm just too tired to be disappointed or to even care anymore. All in all, FE14 is looking to be very likely my last FE game ;/ I won't buy the game day one again; I'll check out a walkthrough and make sure it won't physically pain me to read the dialogue. Like, I've never enjoyed a Fire Emblem story that much, but this is just...an abomination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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