In which blah the Prussian blind reacts to FE Fates: Conquest

[B.Leu]

I'm not laughing; I'm sad because I spent 60$ on the blandest game in existence. The literal one-minute epilogue was better than anything in the story. Other than that I have to really struggle to remember anything from that game.

And now the fourth game will take place in Tevinter, my favorite human nation...sigh. Dare I hope again? I've been hurt so many times.

Don't buy it. It will be bad, bad writing, bad characters, bad NPCs, bad retcon, bad everything. And there will be ton of money grab.

We both know it's true. You don't need hope my friend, it will only brings you despair.

Or try to grab it for cheap. Seriously, 60 dollars ? I'm not sure what it is in euros, but I think that's too much for a bioware game, and too much to DAI itself.

Edited April 8, 2016 by B.Leu

[Emperor Petitt]

Don't buy it. It will be bad, bad writing, bad characters, bad NPCs, bad retcon, bad everything. And there will be ton of money grab.

We both know it's true. You don't need hope my friend, it will only brings you despair.

Or try to grab it for cheap. Seriously, 60 dollars ? I'm not sure what it is in euros, but I think that's too much for a bioware game, and too much to DAI itself.

Roughly 52 euros and rising now, the EU is boned economic wise

[saisymbolic]

Honestly, pre-ordering anything is bad at this age from what I can see.

If I spend $60+ on a game, it damn well better work and it better be good. If a company has to constantly create patches for things that should have already been in the game at release, they are releasing unfinished games for full retail value and I cannot agree to that. Same with DLC that consists solely of useless crap like costumes and simple crap. That's the reason I have yet to buy Naruto Storm 4 and, honestly, I'm probably not going to get it at all.

The only unfinished game I can honestly say I enjoyed and continue to enjoy is Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines and that came out over a decade ago. I got that a couple years ago on Steam for like $25.

Edited April 8, 2016 by SaiSymbolic

[Locke087]

The only thing it has is it's coherent, anything else like every path in fates is lacking. Not the worst story I've had the displeasure of seeing though, that goes to the bioware game ME2

Then you my good sir have not seen many bad stories. ME2 at least has well-written characters (whether or not you like them they are well-written), But I am willing to forgive a lot if a story has good characters.... Bioware's worst work is by Far and Away is Dragon Age 2 and holy crap is that game a train wreck. Though worst game story I ever seen was Shadow the Hegdehog (yes I played that trainwreak).

[blah the Prussian]

Oh god, Thane is now going off topic to attack stories! Hide your children!

[Emperor Petitt]

Then you my good sir have not seen many bad stories. ME2 at least has well-written characters (whether or not you like them they are well-written), But I am willing to forgive a lot if a story has good characters.... Bioware's worst work is by Far and Away is Dragon Age 2 and holy crap is that game a train wreck. Though worst game story I ever seen was Shadow the Hegdehog (yes I played that trainwreak).

They're characters that would fit better in a story unrelated to the main story of the game. None of the why's of the game make any sense, why do you need ground personal when what we have at best about the collectors is, they have a ship. There's no reason to get an assassin when logic dictates you are fighting a fleet in an unknown area, what you want are more ships, which we only have one of in the game. No don't give me the "there is the collector base" nonsense, there was no evidence to prove that before arriving at the target. We only got every character because TIM said to.

[RedRob]

Speculation and alternative interpretations are fine but the game is pretty clear on how we are supposed to feel about the rebellions. Kamui spares every Hoshidan and rebel that he can but he DOESN'T make much an effort to spare regular Nohrian soldiers. The game doesn't show us why Cheve rebelled but it's implied they did it for good reasons. I think it would be pretty reaching to say they had malevolent intentions because if they did, the game would have told us.

The game also wanted us to sympathize with Nohrrin, but almost no here as SF does due to how stupid he is. Plus him sparing Hoshidians and not Nohrians seems more like a double standard and bad writing more than anything. Just because the writer wanted me to think a certain way won't mean I will. Like how Stephenie Meyers wanted EdwardxBella to be seen as a good couple while it actually seems more like a unhealthy relationship.

[secondworld]

Yeah, it's not exactly a good thing when the only positive thing I can say about Corrin in Conquest is that I've seen worse protagonists.

[Water Mage]

Then you my good sir have not seen many bad stories. ME2 at least has well-written characters (whether or not you like them they are well-written), But I am willing to forgive a lot if a story has good characters.... Bioware's worst work is by Far and Away is Dragon Age 2 and holy crap is that game a train wreck. Though worst game story I ever seen was Shadow the Hegdehog (yes I played that trainwreak).

Y-You played Shadow the Hedgehog?

As someone who played it blind, I know the pain, I offer you my condolences.

Seriously, I have never been so disapointed...and I even wasn't a big fan of Shadow, but even I think he deserved better.

[Locke087]

They're characters that would fit better in a story unrelated to the main story of the game. None of the why's of the game make any sense, why do you need ground personal when what we have at best about the collectors is, they have a ship. There's no reason to get an assassin when logic dictates you are fighting a fleet in an unknown area, what you want are more ships, which we only have one of in the game. No don't give me the "there is the collector base" nonsense, there was no evidence to prove that before arriving at the target. We only got every character because TIM said to.

There is your problem mate you tired to put real world logic to a video game... Not to say that ME 2 has a really good driving plot, the whole fight the collectors thing is more of a weak framing device to have the personal character stories go around. This partly where DA:I fails it seem to think I really care it's about story, I don't (though it was mostly the forced grinding and boring gameplay that made me stop playing it). ME 2 doesn't care overarching plot (as show by the fact that about 70% of the game consists of things very unrelated it boring overarching plot), and I neither do I. I when think about the good writing in ME 2 I think of Jack's, Legion's and Garrus's story arc's, I really could care less about whole this whole collector nonsense. To me it is a game about the characters, or in other words it is about the journey not the destination. Anyways that is my point of view.

Y-You played Shadow the Hedgehog?

As someone who played it blind, I know the pain, I offer you my condolences.

Seriously, I have never been so disapointed...and I even wasn't a big fan of Shadow, but even I think he deserved better.

I also played it blind and as kid I liked shadow, it looked so awesome to my little kid brain... Boy was I wrong... Good thing I wasn't a long time sonic fan (I started playing them on the gamecube never owned a Sega Console).

Edited April 8, 2016 by Locke087

[blah the Prussian]

Okay, Whoah, let's not bring Twilight into this. This story is bad, but Trilight is practically the writer's version of Godwin's Law.

[saisymbolic]

Okay, Whoah, let's not bring Twilight into this. This story is bad, but Trilight is practically the writer's version of Godwin's Law.

LOL.

[RedRob]

Okay, Whoah, let's not bring Twilight into this. This story is bad, but Trilight is practically the writer's version of Godwin's Law.

Eh, it was the only example of a situation where the writer wants us to feel a certain way about something, but comes off as something else due to how poorly it's written, that I thought everyone would recognize.

[saisymbolic]

I also played it blind and as kid I liked shadow, it looked so awesome to my little kid brain... Boy was I wrong... Good thing I wasn't a long time sonic fan (I started playing them on the gamecube never owned a Sega Console).

As a player of Sonic since the Genesis, I was physically injured when I played Shadow the Hedgehog.

Sega absolutely refuses to leave the Sonic series and work on one of its other series, like Jet Set Radio.

Give me back Jet Set Radio, Sega! Give it back NOW!

Edited April 8, 2016 by SaiSymbolic

[Emperor Petitt]

There is your problem mate you tired to put real world logic to a video game... Not to say that ME 2 has a really good driving plot, the whole fight the collectors thing is more of a weak framing device to have the personal character stories go around. This partly where DA:I fails it seem to think I really care it's about story, I don't (though it was mostly the forced grinding and boring gameplay that made me stop playing it). ME 2 doesn't care overarching plot (as show by the fact that about 70% of the game consists of things very unrelated it boring overarching plot), and I neither do I. I when think about the good writing in ME 2 I think of Jack's, Legion's and Garrus's story arc's, I really could care less about whole this whole collector nonsense. To me it is a game about the characters, or in other words it is about the journey not the destination. Anyways that is my point of view.

And wouldn't those personal stories be, I don't know, better without the weak frame to be on. It would have been better to have those stories, be their own game, rather than be a side plot for the main plot. All it does by associating with the story of ME2 is weaken the personal stories. SO to sum it up and end the topic here, those characters have nothing to do with the story, character motives are meant to be the core of a story, which the core story of Mass Effect 2 lacks, and the character side stories would have been better served elsewhere, instead of making it associate with something that is shit.

[joshcja]

Eh, it was the only example of a situation where the writer wants us to feel a certain way about something, but comes off as something else due to how poorly it's written, that I thought everyone would recognize.

Sir,

The abyss looks also.

[saisymbolic]

Battle not with monsters lest ye become a monster...

[RedRob]

TvTropes ruins your life, so your warnings mean little to a troper like me. I can't get any more f-up than I already am.

[NekoKnight]

The game also wanted us to sympathize with Nohrrin, but almost no here as SF does due to how stupid he is. Plus him sparing Hoshidians and not Nohrians seems more like a double standard and bad writing more than anything. Just because the writer wanted me to think a certain way won't mean I will. Like how Stephenie Meyers wanted EdwardxBella to be seen as a good couple while it actually seems more like a unhealthy relationship.

Pretty much this. They want us to understand the morality of characters but rather than let the narrative reflect that, they practically shout it through the screen. The double-standard of which lives Kamui spares is the biggest indication of how black and white the conflict is. Revelation even has Garon and Marx say (paraphrasing) "I'm so evil! Evil feels gooooooood!" "Uh, Dad, are you okay?" "Shut up, can't you see I'm doing my Evil Monologue™?"

What I find odd about Conquest is how easy it would have been to write the conquest as having a sympathetic motive to really challenge the protagonists morals and make him sympathetic the natural way. As is, the suffering he endures and the supposed lofty morals he has aren't coherent with he plot. There is probably a trope for that.

[Locke087]

And wouldn't those personal stories be, I don't know, better without the weak frame to be on. It would have been better to have those stories, be their own game, rather than be a side plot for the main plot. All it does by associating with the story of ME2 is weaken the personal stories. SO to sum it up and end the topic here, those characters have nothing to do with the story, character motives are meant to be the core of a story, which the core story of Mass Effect 2 lacks, and the character side stories would have been better served elsewhere, instead of making it associate with something that is shit.

Fair enough, can't say I entirely disagree a better framing device would be nice. I am just a sucker for good character development...

[RedRob]

Not to mention the idea of genuinely good people rebelling because they were lied with another country's propaganda could have been an interesting plot concept. You could have Corrin struggle with killing people, who while were truely good people, had no actual reason to rebel and refused to believe they been lied to, and were a threat to innocent folks. Then once they do, the horror of what they done would set in, and I don't know after that. This would make Hoshido actually grayer, though this idea would require Garon be an actual human, not some stereotype.

Though, it could still be reworked to fit in with the current plot. Use it to show that, while you know Garon's evil, he still has the entire country behind his back, supporting him, forcing Corrin to bear it, lest he viewed as a lying traitor by his nation and hanged.

I actually once wrote a character, a prince, who while despising the current state of the government led by his father, works for the military, as his country was at war, and after witnessing a village get destroyed due to rebels inspired by his ideas fighting against the soldiers stationed there to protect it, which made them too busy with the infighting to defend against the enemy's attack, decided that the safety of his nation came before his ideas, and decided a revolution would only end up hurting it with the war going on.

That could easily be a basis for Corrin's character. Someone who wants to fix the nation, but fears it would only lead to more strife while it's at war with another.

In short, IS could have actual politics force Corrin to obey Garon, as well as a desire to make sure his people are safe, instead of him just being a wimp.

[Alazen]

I suggest we rename Conquest to Corrindunuffin.

[joshcja]

Not to mention the idea of genuinely good people rebelling because they were lied with another country's propaganda could have been an interesting plot concept. You could have Corrin struggle with killing people, who while were truely good people, had no actual reason to rebel and refused to believe they been lied to, and were a threat to innocent folks. Then once they do, the horror of what they done would set in, and I don't know after that. This would make Hoshido actually grayer, though this idea would require Garon be an actual human, not some stereotype.

Though, it could still be reworked to fit in with the current plot. Use it to show that, while you know Garon's evil, he still has the entire country behind his back, supporting him, forcing Corrin to bear it, lest he viewed as a lying traitor by his nation and hanged.

I actually once wrote a character, a prince, who while despising the current state of the government led by his father, works for the military, as his country was at war, and after witnessing a village get destroyed due to rebels inspired by his ideas fighting against the soldiers stationed there to protect it, which made them too busy with the infighting to defend against the enemy's attack, decided that the safety of his nation came before his ideas, and decided a revolution would only end up hurting it with the war going on.

That could easily be a basis for Corrin's character. Someone who wants to fix the nation, but fears it would only lead to more strife while it's at war with another.

In short, IS could have actual politics force Corrin to obey Garon, as well as a desire to make sure his people are safe, instead of him just being a wimp.

Hey, can you please not cut my head off?

Gonna do what I say?

Yes?

Ok.

(It's kinda politics?)

[blah the Prussian]

I heard somewhere that Garon's motivation for invading was a Genghis Gambit, but apparently that's not the case. Sigh. (I'm doing that a lot in this thread)

[eclipse]

I heard somewhere that Garon's motivation for invading was a Genghis Gambit, but apparently that's not the case. Sigh. (I'm doing that a lot in this thread)

You're going to do a lot more than sigh as you progress through Nohr. Much as I like it, it's hardly a perfect work!

And on the off chance you get Revelations. . .I am not responsible for any self-inflicted damage you take due to the plot (even if having every last weapon at my disposal is amazing).