Antihero Anonydraft Mafia (Game Over)

[No Elimination]

Toshio Ozaki doesn't look scummy to me. More likely an innocent who thinks they're onto something.

If we're exchanging information, an explanation of your current Rick read would help.

[Kamina]

8 minutes ago, Toshio Ozaki said:

You came into the thread, didn't commit to a vote and thought about it a bit before voting the scummiest person on the wagon.

Endeavor comes into the thread, doesn't commit to a vote on the wagon and asks a question to one of the wagon's greatest proponents: Rick. Comes back after the response and votes the scummiest person on the wagon and explains why they left their original vote.

Why is what Endeavor did scummy, but what you did normal.

My problem with your Endeavor response is that you didn't really comment on what was scummy about it. You didn't say if his Batter vote was bad. You didn't critique his reason for jumping off the Kokichi wagon or anything like that. You just explained why what he did on page 2 was scummy then nothing else. <-- This is what I take issue with.

WRT the first part I would say in my opinion it was simply because Endeavor at that time, whether he liked it or not was already on a wagon.  One of my first reactions if I come into a thread and see that I'm voting someone who is suddenly at L-3 if I'm not confident in that vote I will unvote and then after thinking over it more I can revote that same target.

WRT the final part of your post I can understand that I even stated myself that I hadn't actually spoke about why I didn't like Endeavors post on page 3 and that's my error.  Sorry about the mis-understandings, at least now I understand a bit more of where you're coming from.

[Shiki Ryougi]

Dang it, couldn't you have all picked anti-heroes I'm familiar with?

I hate forming reads ED1. There's so much fussing about nothing and nobody ever finds actual scum. So please don't take this seriously, I'm terrible at forming assumptions based off of the minimal material out there so far.

##Vote: Mercenary Kratos

Nothing much to base this on except your attitude. After a quick readthrough, you stand out to me as being too defensive, especially over the past hour or so. I want to see you firm up your cases on others without relying so much on how they have interacted with you in particular.

[Olivier]

5 minutes ago, The Batter said:

Komaeda, I thought Titania had no conviction to catch scum because she left her vote down on a very early and weak case despite talking about other people. After her new post where she "forgot to change her vote" I'm thinking I jumped the gun on that and she's just foolish. Titania, use your vote better.

Titania had more reason to vote you because she was pressing you on something post-RVS whereas the Kokichi vote was absolute nothing.

Shiki is Toshio.

My impression of the slot at the moment is that Titania sticking to her Kokichi vote (despite it not being the best play at the time) makes sense from the narrative that she is struggling to come up with good scumreads, which she herself said in her last post.  This doesn't make her town, but I'm giving the slot the benefit of the doubt for now.

[Sham]

19 minutes ago, The Batter said:

Komaeda, I thought Titania had no conviction to catch scum because she left her vote down on a very early and weak case despite talking about other people. After her new post where she "forgot to change her vote" I'm thinking I jumped the gun on that and she's just foolish. Titania, use your vote better.

The forgot to change my vote was about the first post in that trio of three. When Kokichi claimed I went back and read through the thread to see if it made sense and read up on anything else interesting, so maybe I should have unvoted there but whatever

I didn't really come across anything noteworthy though. I probably would've voted you if your content continued to suck but it doesn't. Well, the case on me sucks, but in a non-scummy way. 

19 minutes ago, Mercenary Kratos said:

The amount of stuff that happened in the 2 hours I was gone practically amounted to a mayor claim.  Outside of that not much happened except for the fact that 2 people were voting me so I decided to counter the points and defend myself.  I guess I could have just said nothing if that was what you would have preferred?  Had I not defended myself there really wasn't too much that I felt demanded a response from me at that point in time.  Most of it was Nagito and Kokichi talking to each other and some other endeavor votes being dropped.

I like how you are actually forcing yourself to post.  You three posts in quick succession in which you stated you have no actual reads and just want people to talk yet imply at the same time you felt I shouldn't have responded to the votes on me when there wasn't too much, IN MY OPINION, that was great to respond to.  That slightly frustrates me and I'm sure I'm mis-reading your or misunderstanding you because otherwise it looks like you want me to do the impossible.  So if you could clarify a bit that would be appreciative.

I didn't say that, I said it was weird that you suddenly reappeared to defend yourself and only gave opinions with Toshio prodded you (and now at me when I spoke about you).

2 minutes ago, Kokichi Ouma said:

I disagree with this though. I think that he's super organic! He might even be a vegan! Okay, that might be exaggerating, but I think their posting is more like someone who put down their initial thoughts and then left updated them as more came to their mind. Maybe this is scum motivated, now that I think about the fact that he was being pressured, but I dunno. I think more of their recent posts would be present in their first if they cared about how they looked (because I don't think they're digging deep for bullshit).

I'm not Batter, but my problem with Mello's posts are the reads are so "initial" to use your word, that they feel like scum who couldn't dig deep for bullshit so they just posted something surface level to post something and then fucked off.

[Shiki Ryougi]

Apparently someone called "Brexit" used this account last.

[Sham]

2 minutes ago, Beast said:

Dang it, couldn't you have all picked anti-heroes I'm familiar with?

I hate forming reads ED1. There's so much fussing about nothing and nobody ever finds actual scum. So please don't take this seriously, I'm terrible at forming assumptions based off of the minimal material out there so far.

##Vote: Mercenary Kratos

Nothing much to base this on except your attitude. After a quick readthrough, you stand out to me as being too defensive, especially over the past hour or so. I want to see you firm up your cases on others without relying so much on how they have interacted with you in particular.

Ken???

[Kamina]

3 minutes ago, Beast said:

Dang it, couldn't you have all picked anti-heroes I'm familiar with?

I hate forming reads ED1. There's so much fussing about nothing and nobody ever finds actual scum. So please don't take this seriously, I'm terrible at forming assumptions based off of the minimal material out there so far.

##Vote: Mercenary Kratos

Nothing much to base this on except your attitude. After a quick readthrough, you stand out to me as being too defensive, especially over the past hour or so. I want to see you firm up your cases on others without relying so much on how they have interacted with you in particular.

Pot meet kettle.

I hope you have some other things to comment on.

 

Also Kokichi, I'm hungry. I thought you would keep me well fed. :|

[Olivier]

I'm going to sleep for now.  This may be hypocritical of me to say, but please don't clog the thread up with posts when I wake up.  Someone of my inferior ability will be unable to analyze a large amount of posts in a short amount of time, which would be problematic.

[Cú Chulainn]

5 minutes ago, The Batter said:

Toshio Ozaki doesn't look scummy to me. More likely an innocent who thinks they're onto something.

If we're exchanging information, an explanation of your current Rick read would help.

What post made you think that? I see the conviction but not the townie part.

Sure! Sounds fun!

I townread them for their initial misreading (I'm still sticking to that logic, no matter how much you hate it) and also because I don't think they care much about peer pressure. I think they would feel like they had to change their vote at mafia and instead asking you a question but without voting there felt more natural. It was actually something I thought of but I wasn't bothered enough by the rest of your post as a whole.

[Marisa Kirisame]

Beep, beep, mofos! Seems like almost everyone's arrived to the party, which is making it a teeny bit harder for old me to keep up. Also, the high volume of these wall posts decrease my already high reading comprehension, unfortunately, so I'm not completely caught up. Hopefully will be soon.

@The Batter I thought all baseball players were heroes, but this one has a sharp tongue! You are right that in some sense it was a RVS holdover because it was a vote that originated from RVS and then I was not a fan of his thereafter reaction. I'm pretty sure I've already stated my reasoning for voting Kokichi because I didn't see a better use of my vote at that time.

Honestly I'm kind of surprised you voted Titania over me; I marked their slot for town (and not just because I can understand and validate their thought process). While I think the vote is the strongest scumhunting tool, I don't see the problem with the way I am using my vote. Some people just utilize tools differently. I think you're too hung up on how people are using their votes because you can still push without using it.

@Mello Currently, I wouldn't say I scumread him, so in light of current events, your question is outdated in that regard. I don't town read him though (his actions-or is it his roleplaying-- confuse the hell out of me), but his prior actions make sense to me; (he knew he was mayor and was reaction testing). If you want me to go into detail about why I was voting him, the self vote was a very minor reason, it was really his subsequent reactions -OMGUS, then a strange out of the blue vote for Kratos, and then he contradicted himself (which turns out he was just setting up for his reveal, I guess).

I feel like your question is just you piggybacking off things other players have said in an attempt to force content. If you had read my last post, I think even the most oblivious person could tell I was reevaluating the game at that point. Your Batter vote felt weird. I can see why people are pushing on you, and I find some of your actions scummy but I can also see that as scum looking for an easier vote.

That being said, I feel like your wagon actually feels a lot quicker than other bandwagons this whole day (see, @Mercenary Kratos these are the wagons I get vibes of; the 3 votes in succession (or close to) rubs be the wrong way).

More to come, suckers!

[Sham]

3 minutes ago, Nagito Komaeda said:

Shiki is Toshio.

My impression of the slot at the moment is that Titania sticking to her Kokichi vote (despite it not being the best play at the time) makes sense from the narrative that she is struggling to come up with good scumreads, which she herself said in her last post.  This doesn't make her town, but I'm giving the slot the benefit of the doubt for now.

The problem is most of my scumleans I guess are people who aren't posting much (Endeavor, Mello, Kratos sort of I'm trying to get something from him) are people not really doing much, but the main reason I scumread them is most of the people actively posting seem fairly town to me, so I want to see more from those people but I don't like dropping a vote on a guy who isn't doing much and going "post more or die" since that feels super bad.

Speaking of talking to people, Toshio, do you have more opinions? What do you think of the other stuff going on since you've shown up?

[Kamina]

Could you elaborate on your scum reads a bit more titania?  What about your opinions on Beast who just recently made a post, albeit only one.

Why are your only real 'scum reads' only the people who are inactive?  I don't really have any scum reads but I'm not going to use artificial ones by just listing people who are potentially inactive.

I take it back I do have one scum read to a lesser extent and that would be you but that's mainly because at the moment I get this bad vibe from you that consists of you forcing yourself to make posts and to post content.  You've stated multiple times how you don't really have any  town or scum reads, which is poor, and then that changed to you reading most people posting as town and only having scum reads on inactive players which I feel is terribly weak.  I know currently I'm being kind of hypocritical here to an extent but I also am not forcing myself to seemingly post fake reads, and if you aren't posting fake reads then I would like you to elaborate on those reads.  Because that's the opinion I'm getting from you and the vibe I feel from you.  

##Unvote:

##Vote: Titania

[Cú Chulainn]

10 minutes ago, Mercenary Kratos said:

Also Kokichi, I'm hungry. I thought you would keep me well fed. :|

If you vote with me I'll give you your favourite food tonight! ...Uh, what is it that giraffes eat again? 

You better tell me what you want, or I'll just have to trust Wikipedia! 

On another note I like The Bitch's point on Toshio. I think that's a better summary of why I'm uncomfortable the slot. Nice! I agree that it's focused but it's to the point that it makes me uncomfortable, and I've been in some preeeeeeetty weird situations. Don't ask.

Rick, I don't really get your town!Bitch logic. I know you want to get it on with her, but I don't really see what you've posted as a great explanation. Are you sure you're not just a little bit desperate, old man?

[Rain Nijika]

look who didn't realize this game started.

[All Might]

25 minutes ago, Kokichi Ouma said:

Don't worry. Now that Kratos is the giraffe, you can have the most ridiculous hair award.

Thanks, I worked hard on it. Thought it might irritate my parents.

Rick, why did you mark Titania down as town?

@Titania AndersenI thought Faye valentine's vote was kinda bad and like and agree with Kokichi's case.

I don't really agree with the Mello comments, I think his content is good, albeit sparse, and don't really get the sudden suspicion of him. I don't really want to spend too much time defending him, but I don't really see why the Batter is scumreading him. I don't agree that his reads are uncommittal: having 3 scumreads at this point in time is actually pretty committal. I can understand that dismissing Endeavor seems silly but the way Endeavor posts left a lot less food for thought than the Batter's. I didn't see where he tried to dissuade people from changing their minds on Kokichi and I don't think getting confused about why Nagito changed their vote is scummy. It seems we share a lot of the same thought processes so I can''t really think the slot is scum for now. Hope to see more though, he didn't engage with people very much which is very worrisome long-term. I look forward to seeing his responses.

For the record, again, The batter and Nagito aren't scummy for making cases I disagree with. I just hope their time is spent chasing better, more valuable targets. The Batter has kinda forgotten about Kratos though it seems, I would like to know his thoughts on their latest defence considering he had a good case on them.

[Marisa Kirisame]

@Nagito Komaeda You should know that I'm a nihilist and therefore hope is just a construct. But I'm certainty not a warrior of despair. Maybe try warrior of getting high and having a good time?

@Kokichi Ouma Aww, damn, you caught me... I'm white knighting her because I'm hoping she'll go on a date with me after this is all over.... PSYCH! I think it's against the spirit of anonymous to talk about player identities (even in a loose sense), and while I'm generally not the greatest with guessing character identities, I think I have an idea of who Titania is. Like a 95% sure idea. I could be reaching, but from memory, this isn't their scum meta; I would expect them to be less helpful and more avoidant overall with the thread. Apparently she's attracted the ire of a nontrivial amount which should probably indicate to me that I should reread her at some point.

From my last post, I don't feel that Kokichi is the best place for my vote right now.

If I vote with you, will you give me my favorite food?!?

Just kidding. I'm not really convinced on your Faye case; her one post didn't read like scum, so I don't really think that's something I would pursue right now.

##Unvote

##Vote: Toshio Ozaki

Bet you didn't see that coming, huh?

@Toshio Ozaki My dear doctor and well educated friend, it seems your tunnel vision is a little strong! Pray tell me why you're so convicted on the idea Kratos is scum; while I think your case is applaudable (despite my high reading comprehension abilities, I had to reread a few times, the level of detail is high with this one), I don't like the fact that you're essentially not interacting with the rest of this party. Whilst you were pushing on Kratos, there's been counter cases on Mello, Titania, and yours truly, so I find it weird that you've ignored 2/3 of us thus far.

[Marisa Kirisame]

Oh, this is what I get for not refreshing before I post. Toshio has managed to render me and my point to simple idiocy because of those couple minutes!

You seem like a good, educated man. Let's have a talk. I think if you feel strongly about Mello, I suggest you speak up. I don't like his wagon not because of his content (I am on the side that it feels off to me; he seems to be stating some obvious things and leading off some people's ideas), but because of the sheer quickness of his wagon, and that it seems like he's an easy target. I actually don't begrudge any and all hard defending if people have a strong read on someone, but it's these kinds of posts that if, let's say, Mello does somehow get lynched, and regardless of alignment, I find weaker defense posts scummier than scummy ones.

That being said, I'd like to hear what you think about Kokichi. He's a bit of a loose cannon (more so than Komaeda); there's just something off, and I can't put my mind behind it.

[Sham]

Sure, I can post reads

Mello: I've made a couple remarks about this so I feel like I'm just repeating myself here: His initial vote felt weak and his second post with reads felt very surface level like he was just putting something out there to have stuff. 

Rick: This is mostly an emotional/gut read because we really bonded in the first hour or two of the game. I felt like his early game was good and he was one of the main driving forces in doing so, which I also tend to see as townie. 

The Batter: My initial scumread was because he wasn't really doing much and his first content post rubbed me the wrong way. His content since he came back was a lot better so he was probably just being lazy in RVS. Active in discussion and his logic is easy to follow and makes sense even if I don't always agree with it

Titania Andersen: me

Kokichi Ouma: It's hard for me to imagine everything leading up to their Mayor claim happening with them as mafia, it's just weird and draws a ton of weird attention to him for no reason. They would have to be very cocky to pull something like that, I think.

Mercenary Kratos: Your original reaction to the wagon was a little uppity but I let it pass because this is something town do a lot. However, your re-entrance to the thread was overdefensive and your hostility towards me since is really grating. It muddles my reads because I'm annoyed at you, so it becomes harder to gauge. Are you scumreading me because I'm scumreading you and you're mad? Are you scumreading me because you're scum and Toshio brought up your prior read, so you're doing it to be consistent? Are you doing it because you're town and following up? It all makes me mad.

Nagito Komaeda: Nagito is probably my strongest town read based on content/posts. 

Endeavor: Endeavor has 3 posts. One is an RVS vote, one has nothing content related, and the third is his Battler vote.

Faye Valentine: One post and it was not great. Like Mello, she had some surface level stuff but is pretty forgettable.

Beast: I hate him. He could be mafia being a lazy asshole but I think that every time I've ever seen someone do this they're town, which I hate because they are completely unhelpful

Toshio Ozaki: His needling of Kratos is solid so far. I want more from him though

Omar Little: no posts but I have seen them lurking the thread. I was gonna keep quiet on this til they posted to see what they said but since you're making me do this I'll call them out now. 

Lapis Lazuli: no postsone post, commenting that the game started

Dr. Crowler: no post

[Shiki Ryougi]

I still have no good reads. ED1 sucks. The Batter seems a little off-kilter to me, but that's probably just RP (I have no idea what OFF is). For some reason, his first few cases seemed a little heavy-handed, but maybe I'm just taking him too seriously.

@Batter: can you elaborate on why you switched from Titania? You are still suspicious of her, correct?

I don't know where the Mello wagon is coming from. Granted, a few lackluster reads and actions are notable, but IMO, that's to be expected this early.

@Kratos: what's your opinion of the Mello wagon at this point? Do you agree with any of the underlying reasoning?

I've got work early tomorrow, so I need to call it quits for the night. Hopefully I'll be able to contribute more tomorrow. I'd like to do a lot more reading.

 

 

 

 

[Sham]

@Toshio Ozaki Mello's reads are pretty uncommittal. "Faye and Nagito might be scum because their votes are pretty sketchy," emphasis mine, is a wishiwashi statement all things considered.

[Kamina]

1 minute ago, Titania Andersen said:

Mercenary Kratos: Your original reaction to the wagon was a little uppity but I let it pass because this is something town do a lot. However, your re-entrance to the thread was overdefensive and your hostility towards me since is really grating. It muddles my reads because I'm annoyed at you, so it becomes harder to gauge. Are you scumreading me because I'm scumreading you and you're mad? Are you scumreading me because you're scum and Toshio brought up your prior read, so you're doing it to be consistent? Are you doing it because you're town and following up? It all makes me mad.

WRT the bolded, I have made, what 1 and a half post regarding you?  Period.  I wouldn't say I have been overly hostile with you either.

I'm scum reading you because there was an inconsistency in my eyes in your last few posts. You previously forced yourself to post stating you had no actual reads then came back and suddenly you said everyone was fairly townie except for 3 people who aren't posting that much, which is funny considering I've been posting a fair amount.

[Rain Nijika]

I didn't get trapped in a mirror for 3,000 years just to face another "only scum self-votes" argument. I thought I was done with this. I thought I'd seen the last one on Homeworld. fuck this planet

in all seriousness, I've seen it done as a way for scum to make it seem like they're unafraid to be lynched, and I've seen it be effective in RVS. however I am not entirely sure it's the case here since he'd already had a wagon on him. that takes balls, especially knowing voting yourself tends to catch attention. Rick voting him in RVS for this I did find weird in an opportunistic way.  Titania voting right after him is worse though. I think it might be the worst Ouma vote on the earlywagon. it REEKS of earlysheep and searching for a quick way to seem useful super fast. the only thing I can't put my finger on is if Titania were scum why would she--oh it looks like Rick ninja'd her. Well, I was GOING to say I don't see scum jumping on a 5-vote earlywagon so easily but I guess that point is a little weaker now. 

Batter keeping his vote on Ouma is weird too what the fuck. this whole early wagon is weird. did Ouma really think counting votes was scummy or is this another giant mess of RVS I'm gonna have to overhaul completely.

Quote

When I see 5 votes pile onto someone by the start of page 2 the first thing that occurred to me was that this would be a great place for scum to put a vote on someone just to fake content.  Sure it won't be quick hammered but I feel that it shouldn't be ignored.  Placing down scummy votes is still scummy.  I feel from a scum point of view placing that vote is probably strangely safe for your reasoning exactly.

this is exactly why I don't want to dismiss this wagon because I think opportunistic scum might be on it and using the "only scum self-votes" as an easy way to earlyD1content and look town.

hold on I'm still reading the thread.

[All Might]

I don't think that the quickness of his wagon is anything particularly indicative. He is an easy target because of a lack of posts and interactions, no one looked really likely to come in and defend someone with, what, 3 posts of content? That said I'm not really reading a very opportunistic vibe from either Nagito or The Batter (who else voted Mello? Can't seem to find it) at the moment even though my brain is telling me that their cases are weak and poorly justified. I would rather hear more from the two about it/other people.

You might be finding that Kokichi's posting style is grating moreso than the actual content. They seem invested in updating their reads and scumhunting. They also post good reasons for townreading people IIRC they talk about mistakes being more likely to come from town than scum, for instance. I liked their reasoning for liking you but then got confused about the whole mayor thing. I thought Rick was softing mayor for a second.

@Titania Andersen Hmmm I guess but it's ED1 it's rare for people to just declare other people as scum.

[Sham]

1 minute ago, Mercenary Kratos said:

WRT the bolded, I have made, what 1 and a half post regarding you?  Period.  I wouldn't say I have been overly hostile with you either.

I'm scum reading you because there was an inconsistency in my eyes in your last few posts. You previously forced yourself to post stating you had no actual reads then came back and suddenly you said everyone was fairly townie except for 3 people who aren't posting that much, which is funny considering I've been posting a fair amount.

That's not what I said, though. I said I had no good or strong scumreads, and I don't. I didn't say anything about the quality or quantity of my townreads. My reads are on people who made 3 or fewer questionable posts then disappeared and you, and my read on you is clouded a lot because I'm annoyed/frustrated with you. Those aren't good or strong reads. They exist, but they're not something I'm going to fight to the death over.

I probably also displaced some my annoyance from Batter's case onto you, going back and reading your post, since they happened at the same time, which is 100% my fault