How should a crossover between Paper Mario and Fire Emblem be handled?

[Paper Mario]

Given that both games are developed by Intelligent Systems

[vanguard333]

Paper Emblem, or Emblem Story:

It should be a party-based RPG in the style of the old Paper Mario games, with 2D characters in a 3D interconnected storybook-like world. The characters should be original Fire Emblem characters specifically made for the game. The main protagonist will of course be a lord/tactician character while the allies that are added to the party cover every weapon type (sword, lance, axe, bow, magic) and unit type (infantry, cavalry, flying).

EDIT: Also, this topic should probably be in General Gaming or General Fire Emblem, not General.

Edited August 23, 2023 by vanguard333

[Etrurian emperor]

Storywise you could easily have a Gharnef, or princess Veronica use a spell to seal the lords away into a story book. A very important storybook about a red plumber even.

[lenticular]

My first instinct is to say that this probably shouldn't ever be a thing. The series are very different from each other, and I'm not sure that a crossover would really do either one of them any favours.

But that said, if it were a done deal that this crossover absolutely was going to happen and I was put in charge with figuring out how to make it work, this is what I'd do. I'd basically build it as a Paper Mario game, except with Fire Emblem combat.  Paper Mario has changed up its combat so many times at this point that nobody would be surprised if it gets changed up again and oh hey, suddenly it has Fire Emblem combat now? Sure! Why not? It's not like it's any more weird and out there than lining things up on a turning wheel puzzle. The maps would be far smaller than traditional Fire Emblem maps, though. Probably comparable in size to a Heroes map. The aim would be to be able to duck in and out of them quickly so they never distract for too long from the Paper Mario style story/exploration/character interaction stuff.

For the story, I'd just go with something basic. Some random evil villain has created a rift between dimensions that is threatening to destroy all worlds, and now some of the heros of those worlds have fallen through into this world and are here to help Mario out as partner characters. Say hello to Paper Marth, Paper Ike, Paper Lucina, and Paper Edelgard. (Or whoever.) These would be very cartoony and light-hearted versions of the characters who would fit into the Paper Mario mood and aesthetic, because I think it would be easier to create silly and lighthearted versions of Fire Emblem characters than to have Paper Mario suddenly pivot to being about the horrors of war. Yeah, this is a super basic and uninspiring plot, but when you're already trying to mash together two things that don't particularly belong, overcomplicating things is just a recipe for disaster. Deliberately simple has a better chance of working out here, I think.

[AnonymousSpeed]

While I hate to put the cart before the horse, there really is something fitting about fantasy heroes being in a literal storybook. I'd probably go for something with more of a medieval manuscript flair. Parchment Emblem, if you will.

[Fabulously Olivier]

Take the Valkyria Chronicles storybook aesthetic, make the characters paper. Make the game a turn-based JRPG. Done.

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

1 hour ago, AnonymousSpeed said:

While I hate to put the cart before the horse, there really is something fitting about fantasy heroes being in a literal storybook. I'd probably go for something with more of a medieval manuscript flair. Parchment Emblem, if you will.

Perhaps the same aesthetic they gave to the Engage Tarot Cards? Very colorful, and impressively stylized. Wouldn't look out of place in a cathedral.

Wild idea, but perhaps the threat in that game can be... actual flames, tearing through the world they inhabit. Wiping away existence itself. With the actual "Fire Emblem" being a literal fire extinguisher. I dunno, maybe having "real stuff" is too "Sticker Star and beyond" for fans' tastes.

[AnonymousSpeed]

Just now, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Perhaps the same aesthetic they gave to the Engage Tarot Cards? Very colorful, and impressively stylized. Wouldn't look out of place in a cathedral.

My disdain for tarot cards aside, it's more inspired by amphora art than medieval manuscripts. I was thinking more of the snail knight kinda stuff.

Just now, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

I dunno, maybe having "real stuff" is too "Sticker Star and beyond" for fans' tastes.

Hm, true.

They should definitely do it.

[Paper Mario]

12 hours ago, lenticular said:

My first instinct is to say that this probably shouldn't ever be a thing. The series are very different from each other, and I'm not sure that a crossover would really do either one of them any favours

Wouldn’t it be something Intelligent Systems could do given they develop both series?

[lenticular]

20 minutes ago, Paper Mario said:

Wouldn’t it be something Intelligent Systems could do given they develop both series?

They could, sure. At least possibly. Nintendo still has the rights to the Mario characters, so IS can only make Mario games that Nintendo approves. But even assuming that they could, I don't really see why they would. They aren't going to spend vast amounts of time, energy and money just because they can. There has to be some underlying reason for it, either artistic or commercial. And I don't really see them having any such compelling reason.

[Perkilator]

Maybe a tone similar to Engage? Plus, Heroes and Paper Mario both have some pretty similar art styles.

Edited August 26, 2023 by Perkilator

[Lord_Brand]

I could see a "Setting A with Gameplay B" kind of crossover, much like my idea for "Zelda Emblem", where you take the Paper Mario cast, expand on it, and build a Fire Emblem-style game out of it.

The gameplay would be a tactical RPG with quicktime actions in battle. For example, imagine moving Mario up to an enemy to attack with either hammer or jump. You can increase the damage dealt using a quicktime action (in pvp, the player can of course mitigate the damage by guarding; superguards can also be available, but there has to be some kind of limitation).

Mario is one of several possible leaders for a growing party (army) of heroes that engage enemy forces in battle. Other leaders include Luigi, Peach, Daisy, Rosalina, and Captain Toad. Standard units include Toads, Goombas, Koopa Troopas, Bob-ombs, Boos,

The game has its own equivalent of a class/job system that alters the character's outfit, and the resulting skillset is unqiue for different combinations. A Toad chef will have different skills from a Goomba chef, for example. Basic and Advanced classes are available.

Characters can equip a weapon and a number of badges based on their BP, and can also carry a number of items with them such as Mushrooms, Flowers, and Syrups.

Each character has one or more skills they can use to attack enemies or support allies, some of which cost FP to use. Your party's leader also has access to Star Powers.

Stats include:

• HP: How much damage the character can take before they fall.
• FP: Many character skills run on FP.
• BP: Determines how many badges the unit can equip.
• Power: The base value for damage dealt by characters.
• Defense: The value that reduces damage dealt to a character.
• Luck: Used for chance-based effects.
• Move: How far the character can move in a single turn.

Many maps have hazards that can impede or prevent unit movement. Water slows movement for units without flight or swimming. Spikes cause damage to units without flight or armor.

Like many Fire Emblem games, "Paper Mario Emblem" has a relationship system. Many of the non-leader units can marry other units by attaining an S rank relationship, while the leaders themselves can attain A+ relationships.

[vanguard333]

5 hours ago, Lord_Brand said:

I could see a "Setting A with Gameplay B" kind of crossover, much like my idea for "Zelda Emblem", where you take the Paper Mario cast, expand on it, and build a Fire Emblem-style game out of it.

I was thinking something similar, but the other way around: make an FE continent specifically for the crossover and build a Paper Mario-style game around it. I was thinking this because I thought it would be a good way to get an FE spinoff that's a party-based RPG like that one that was intended for the Wii, and also because the Thousand-Year Door remake hadn't been announced when I thought of it.

[henrymidfields]

My answer: none. Just don't. The less I see the stupid Princess with the stupid old story, the better.

[Lord_Brand]

On 9/24/2023 at 8:18 AM, vanguard333 said:

I was thinking something similar, but the other way around: make an FE continent specifically for the crossover and build a Paper Mario-style game around it. I was thinking this because I thought it would be a good way to get an FE spinoff that's a party-based RPG like that one that was intended for the Wii, and also because the Thousand-Year Door remake hadn't been announced when I thought of it.

Reminds me of that "Paper Zelda" video I saw a while back. Would be interesting to see other IPs get the Paper treatment, like Zelda, Kirby, and heck, why not Fire Emblem.

[vanguard333]

1 hour ago, Lord_Brand said:

Reminds me of that "Paper Zelda" video I saw a while back. Would be interesting to see other IPs get the Paper treatment, like Zelda, Kirby, and heck, why not Fire Emblem.

I've seen that video as well; it was pretty good.

Seeing other IPs get their own Paper RPG spinoffs would be neat, especially if they're more like the earlier Paper Mario games.

[Jotari]

On 8/23/2023 at 11:53 PM, vanguard333 said:

Paper Emblem, or Emblem Story:

It should be a party-based RPG in the style of the old Paper Mario games, with 2D characters in a 3D interconnected storybook-like world. The characters should be original Fire Emblem characters specifically made for the game. The main protagonist will of course be a lord/tactician character while the allies that are added to the party cover every weapon type (sword, lance, axe, bow, magic) and unit type (infantry, cavalry, flying).

EDIT: Also, this topic should probably be in General Gaming or General Fire Emblem, not General.

If it was a new story with new original characters, that would lead to some rather funny incongruous situations when they want to later use that protagonist for stuff like Heroes. Are they going to just show up as a cut out piece of paper alongside Marth and Ike or would they have a non paper design to be utilized in non paper crossover settings?

[vanguard333]

19 hours ago, Jotari said:

If it was a new story with new original characters, that would lead to some rather funny incongruous situations when they want to later use that protagonist for stuff like Heroes. Are they going to just show up as a cut out piece of paper alongside Marth and Ike or would they have a non paper design to be utilized in non paper crossover settings?

Part of me would hope that they'd still look like paper in other spinoffs like Heroes, as it would be both distinct and hilarious. I don't think it would be too incongruous though; everyone in Heroes is a 2D sprite outside of CG cutscenes. It would only really be incongruous for something 3D like a Warriors spinoff or a revisit of the Emblem Ring concept in the mainline game.